Holographic Sights


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Fordtractor1973
March 10, 2010, 09:31 PM
How exactly is a holographic sight installed on a shotgun. Considering trying one for skeet shooting!?

Thanks!

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2FNSLO
March 10, 2010, 10:45 PM
The Burris Speed Bead I have seen on a shot gun was on a mount that has a thin plate that went between the stock and the rear of the receiver. This allowed the dot to line up with the bead on the end of the barrel.
This is the one I've seen. Seemed to work pretty well.
http://www.burrisoptics.com/speedbead.html

arizona98tj
March 10, 2010, 11:19 PM
My EOTech is attached to the cantilever rail that came on my FNH.

http://www.stu-offroad.com/firearms/eotech/xps2-8.jpg


It's a challenge to capture a good photo while the camera looks through the EOtech. This was the best one I came up with. The camera picks up the reticle more than my eye does. The intensity wasn't that bright when I was looking at it.

http://www.stu-offroad.com/firearms/eotech/spx2-6.jpg

Fordtractor1973
March 11, 2010, 05:51 AM
Thanks!

PJR
March 11, 2010, 07:39 AM
I mounted a Bushnell Holosite on a Beretta 390 a few years ago using a saddle mount from Aimtech.

If Aimtech doesn't make a mount for it another possibility would be tapping the receiver and installing a Weaver style mount.

FYI, when I put the Holosite on the 390, it required a higher comb on the stock so I added a Beartooth comb kit to the gun.

Overall it was an interesting experiment. It worked very well for skeet however not as well for trap. The first day I had it out to the range there was a lot of interest and everyone wanted to give it a try.

Here's a link to Aimtech:

http://www.aimtech-mounts.com/saddle_style__shotgun_mounting_s.htm

oneounceload
March 11, 2010, 09:30 AM
While sights on a shotgun maybe a good idea for static hunting like deer and turkey, the LAST thing you want shooting trap, skeet, or sporting is for your eyes to NOT be focused on the target. Your eyes are your sights and they should be locked on the target as you move, mount, and shoot. Focusing on the sights = a miss.

BlisteringSilence
March 11, 2010, 10:04 AM
I hesitate to offer advice unsolicited, especially to someone that has not engaged me as a coach, but I might suggest that a gunsight of any kind is a total waste in clays.

I regularly tape over the front sight of my scout's guns with black electrical tape to keep them from looking at it instead of the target.

The key to good clays / wing shooting is a good cheek weld, moving the firearm as if it is an integral part of your body, and enough practice that you know where and how your gun shoots.

NOW, for HD, deer and turkey, I can see how a holosight would be pretty nice.

But me, personally, I don't even have the bead installed on my clays and hunting guns.

And if I don't run 25 straight 50% of the time, I'm having a bad day. I'm not great, but I'm pretty good. Grandpa started teaching me skeet when I was 8.

ArmedBear
March 11, 2010, 11:25 AM
I might suggest that a gunsight of any kind is a total waste in clays.

"a total waste" is far too positive an assessment, really.:D

If you really notice anything about the gun when you're taking a shot in skeet, you will most likely miss the target. The only exceptions might be shots that allow you to aim, like 1 high and 7 low, and even then you're just building bad habits.

gunnie
March 11, 2010, 05:25 PM
just my 0.02,

i can't even see the need for one on a hunting shotgun unless slugs are part of the equation.

gunnie

PJR
March 11, 2010, 07:34 PM
My experiments with the Bushnell Holosite did not convince me that using one is a complete waste of time. With a holographic site you still look at the target but also in your field of vision is a circle that represents where the pattern will go. For sustained lead shooting it provided a visual picture of the lead that was helpful in hitting targets. For swing through/coming from behind shooting like trap it wasn't as good.

Where I think something like the Holosite would have a place is pass shooting geese and ducks. I wouldn't use one for upland game.

I gave up my experiments with the Holosite after a few months. As helpful as it was in some circumstances I didn't want to have to depend on it.

oldgold
March 11, 2010, 07:51 PM
Funny thread. I've heard the same arguements in the 80's about red dots on handguns. If you go to the Grand you will see more and more optics showing up on the line. Trapshooters are notoriously fuddy about new things but I'll wager that dot sights will slowly make their presence know in a few years. All it will take is for someone to win the Grand with one.

Sight hight has always been a major drawback of red dots on shotguns. Burris Speed Bead is a great idea except for not having an eighteen inch circle for your pattern. As soon as they start making them this way I'll have one.

ArmedBear
March 11, 2010, 08:32 PM
Uh, the reason I use a red dot on a pistol for competition is rapid target acquisition without having to line up the sights.

If you have to line something up on a shotgun, you've got bigger problems, especially if you're shooting American Trap, or any other high-gun game where you can get yourself all ready before you call for the target.

Of course, when you're talking about a game where all the targets fly at the same height, yet people still "need" their guns set up so they don't have to account for any (slight) vertical lead, selling another gadget shouldn't be too hard. I think if you sold a robotic trapshooter so that someone could just spend his round sitting in the clubhouse instead of actually shooting the round himself, you'd find a few willing buyers.:D

Well, I'm off to go shoot an after-work pistol match with a red dot sight (seriously). When you figure out how I can get a cheek weld on my pistol, please let me know.:)

Virginian
March 11, 2010, 10:00 PM
If you haven't used a holographic sight wingshooting, I dare say you don't know what you are talking about. I have used one for various clay games and waterfowl with great success. The only reason I quit was it was a Weaver Qwik-Point and the mount was forever problematic, and it was bulky, and it restriced the field of vision, and it was heavy. But, when everything was right, I could shoot anything better. International skeet or trap and sporting clays included.
With a holographic sight you don't have to take your eyes off the target; the target and the dot are in the same focal plane. i.e., they both are in perfect focus at the same time. All you have to do is establish the flight path and desired lead and you hit the target. You do not need cheek weld or any of that. I do think good form helps, but as long as you can see the target and the dot you have all the info your brain needs to make the shot, assuming you know the lead you need. You do not have to "aim" any more than you do with a rib and a bead, but it is far more precise with no additional effort. And you don't put the bead "on the target" and hit anything flying either. I even did some occluded sight shooting, where I blocked the tube and one eye saw the target and the other eye saw the dot and I managed a 23 at skeet that way.
I have been very tempted to get a SpeedBead, but I have heard negative things about the mounts from a couple of people I trust.
If you haven't tried it, don't knock it. If you tried it and didn't like it or do well, please share your thoughts on why that was too, please.

arizona98tj
March 11, 2010, 11:42 PM
I can't comment about a conventional red dot as I don't use one. However, the EOtech holographic sight won me over after a friend loaned me his and I put it on my shotgun for a day at the range. After that, I had to get one. :D

I've not tried it for any type of clay target shooting. The shotgun mine is on is intended for shooting buckshot and slugs. The best part I like about it is the illusion it creates for the reticle.....it is floating out in front of your shotgun.....perhaps 30 feet (or so it seems). Target and sight are always in focus. When you see your target, it simply has a 65 MOA circle on (or around) it with a 1 MOA dot in the middle.....all in focus.....all the time. It is great for quick target acquisition.....and when you are on the timer, every tenth of a second helps. ;)

One of these days I'll try it on some flying targets to see how it works. I can't imagine it being a detriment.

Fred Fuller
March 12, 2010, 04:30 AM
Some of the old timers were using Nydar sights for skeet and trap back in the late 1940s- it's not a new idea by any means. The Nydar evolved from a sight used on WW2 aircraft flexible mount machine guns.

The thing is to be sure the gun is stocked properly for the added height of the sight.

lpl
===

http://v2.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.asp?Item=160399968

http://i168.photobucket.com/albums/u185/krklek/z4sale/Nydar-Gun-Sight_01.jpg

Virginian
March 12, 2010, 06:23 AM
Wow, I haven't seen one of those Nydars in forever, and I could not think of the name to save me. I once considered one of those, but could never reconcile having my shotgun drilled and tapped. Odd considering I greatly prefer a scoped rifle.
Thanks, Lee.

ArmedBear
March 12, 2010, 08:10 AM
The only reason I quit was it was a Weaver Qwik-Point and the mount was forever problematic, and it was bulky, and it restriced the field of vision, and it was heavy.

Virginian, that's 4 reasons, not an "only reason", and they all argue pretty well against putting an electronic contraption on a gun that works better without one. Even if you could reduce that to "restricted the field of vision", you're looking at a net negative for anything but regulation American Trap, which has target presentations with specific and tight artificial constraints, and no real leads.

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