Uberti 1885 High Wall OR Pedersoli 1874 Sharps


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Mullins81
March 12, 2010, 08:46 PM
I have been wanting a old buffalo rifle for a loooong time. I finally am in a position to buy one!! There are NONE of these guns anywhere near my local area (Nova Scotia CANADA) that being said there is a gun dealer about 10 hours away that has both repro's: Uberti 1885 High Wall AND the Pedersoli 1874 Sharps....Both are new repros and he wants the exact same price for both guns. Which should I get??....the Pedersoli stricly shoots 45/70 whereas the Uberti will take 45/70, 45/90, 45/120. I will probably never shoot more than 200 yards regardless and just be using it for whitetail hunting. Which is better quality etc? The Sharps is a "BUSINESS" model and looks a lil more authentic with the straight stock and double triggers....any suggestions or info would be greatly appreicated....Thanks in advance....!!!

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SlamFire1
March 12, 2010, 09:39 PM
Consider the Mirkou made Winchester Branded M1885 in 45-70. It has a Badger barrel, outstanding wood, and eye popping case hardening colors.

Unfortunately it does not come with front or rear sights as shown in this stolen :D Winchester image or described on their lying web page. Sights are extra, and I am building my cash reserves to buy.

But it is an alternative.
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v479/SlamFire/Rifles%20various/WinchesterM1885BPCR.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v479/SlamFire/Rifles%20various/DSCN0811tangholes.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v479/SlamFire/Rifles%20various/DSCN0808leftsideaction.jpg
http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v479/SlamFire/Rifles%20various/DSCN0820Breechblockopen.jpg

Old Time Hunter
March 12, 2010, 10:34 PM
Well here's your Uberti 1885:

http://i53.photobucket.com/albums/g48/OTH_2006/1885HighWall-1.jpg

Ridgerunner665
March 12, 2010, 10:40 PM
Thats it....that done it.

I've been trying to make up my dang mind between a Sharps and a Winchester 1885...the 1885 it is.

I'll have one soon...

conhntr
March 12, 2010, 10:59 PM
ive always wanted an 1885 as well; just sweet handling and smoth design. i was looking at one of the Mirkou in a modern caliber though...

Ridgerunner665
March 12, 2010, 11:00 PM
Modern caliber??? Why???

I know...I'm biased, I really like the 45-70.

conhntr
March 12, 2010, 11:08 PM
i already have too many 45-70s... come one someone say it

Ridgerunner665
March 12, 2010, 11:14 PM
I'll do the honors...

There is no such thing as too many 45-70's.

Or were you referring to....You can give me a few of them and then you won't have so many.

Rob Smart
March 13, 2010, 02:55 PM
I purchased a 1874 Pedersoli "Quigly" Sharps last month, with a creedmore sight. Love
the thing. For the first time I can actually shoot a tight group at 150 yds. I've also decided on a set of smokless reloads that work well with the gun. It shoots smokless and black powder equally well.

Mullins81
March 13, 2010, 03:09 PM
Thanks Rob thats the kind of response I was looking for when I posted the original question....I think I am going to get the Pedersoli, thats the way I am leaning right now anyway....Even though it is only the "business" model it should still be a nice gun im hoping

Rob Smart
March 13, 2010, 03:19 PM
Mullins,
I strongly recommend getting the creedmore sight with it. I'm old and have tri-focals. These creedmore sights allow the target and front sight to both be in focus. I also use the Hadley eye piece, which rotates to provide different peep diameters. I use the large peep in the woods and the small peep off the bench. Accuracy does not seem to change with the peep size.

TomADC
March 13, 2010, 03:30 PM
This is my Pedersoli 1874 Sharps, the fut ans finish are really nice, I just bought a Pedersoli Creedmore USA431 tang sight for it not shown is this picture.

http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL174/1021972/18168454/382624151.jpg

Gunfighter123
March 13, 2010, 03:44 PM
Consider the Mirkou made Winchester Branded M1885 in 45-70. It has a Badger barrel, outstanding wood, and eye popping case hardening colors.

This is almost a EXACT copy of the Browning BPCR ---- the Brn. BPCR came with decent tang site and nice globe front ---- also had a Badger brl. etc. ---- mine was a lot of fun to shoot put would have been VERY heavy for a stalking rifle for Deer.

Rob Smart
March 13, 2010, 04:06 PM
This is my sharps with the creedmore tang. I also agree lugging this 13 lb monster to the tree stand will take some effort. I still can't wait until November.
117614

Jim Watson
March 13, 2010, 04:06 PM
the Uberti will take 45/70, 45/90, 45/120.

NOOOO!!

This is a dirty joke. The rifle is chambered for the monster mutant .45 x 3 1/4' case commonly called .45-120 in modern advertising. Sure, you can put a shorter shell in the chamber and it will fire without hurting anything, but will it HIT anything? I have read a couple of people to say it will do OK, but I would not want to bet the price of a new rifle on it.

I really like the Browning/Winchester 1885 and the Uberti is a decent copy, but this is not something I would want to fool with. The Pedersoli is more authentic and a better deal in this case. Maybe better quality, too. I shoot a little competitive BPCR and see many more Pedersolis than Ubertis. Of course Shilohs are way up there but are much more expensive.

TomADC
March 13, 2010, 04:52 PM
These were 480.1 grs on my scale powered by 10.5grs of Unique. Going to shoot these thru my Sharps Monday.

http://pic20.picturetrail.com/VOL174/1021972/18168454/384166997.jpg

stubbicatt
March 13, 2010, 06:26 PM
It has been a long while since I messed with BPCR shooting. As I recall, I would load the rounds so that the first band on the Postell bullet engraved fully in the rifling. Two card wads sandwiching a grease wad, and only slightly compressed charge of FFg. Federal magnum primers.

Yep. It was a shooter. Keeping ahead of the fouling was a real chore. A slow rate of fire and a blow tube helped. God help you if that stuff ever got hard 'cuz of heat in the barrel. Yeesh.

Mullins81
March 13, 2010, 07:40 PM
Pedersoli seems to be "all the rage" so I have ordered the Pedersoli 1874 Sharps!! Hope it dont let me down.....now to get into loading my own cartridges...lol.....should be interesting cause I have never done it before.....anybody provide me with a COMPLETE list of loading materials i will need ?? LOL

ArmedBear
March 13, 2010, 07:47 PM
I kinda like those Winchester High Walls, especially at CDNN prices, but I can vouch for the 1874 Sharps from Pedersoli, in real-world use.:D

http://ellie.crankylabs.com/albums/familyetc/IMG_3071.sized.jpg

Jim Watson
March 13, 2010, 08:46 PM
There are whole books on the subject, called handloading manuals. They usually describe the equipment used. Lyman's is good, one of the few with ample data on the lead bullets the old guns use. There is an even more basic primer, The ABCs of Handloading; probably worth your having.

I don't know if Midway USA ships to Canada, but it would be worth asking, they carry a broad line of equipment and supplies.

Start looking, factory .45-70s are expensive.

Mullins81
March 13, 2010, 08:56 PM
Armed Bear that is an awesome pic....thats what the 1874 was intended for i guess....how far was your shot etc??

alemonkey
March 13, 2010, 09:04 PM
Good choice, you'll love the Pedersoli. Mine is very accurate.

I shoot a 540 grain cast bullet from a Brooks mould, 60 grains of Swiss 1.5 powder, and a .030 cardboard wad under the base of the bullet. I use a Lee compression die to compress the powder just enough that the bullet seats to where it will be just barely off the lands of the rifling. I lube the bullet with a 50/25/25 mix of beeswax, olive oil, and crisco.

This is only a 50 yard target, shot for an online competition on THR. It does show that the rifle is capable of some pretty good accuracy though. If I hadn't had that flyer it would be a 5 shot, one hole group.

http://i249.photobucket.com/albums/gg215/bkoenig1975/IMG_0840-1.jpg

Rob Smart
March 14, 2010, 02:45 PM
I just tried my 45-70 Sharps out at 200 yds with the creedmore tang sights.
The attached picture shows a 10 shot group, its about 6". I've shot about 300 rounds fine tuning my loads for smokeless powder. The following seem to work well with a velocity of around 1550 fps. The projected pressures are around 18000 to 19000 psi, which is well below Pedersoli's max limit of 29000 psi. The following are the loads that I'v settled on. These loads all use 405 gr
bullets either Origon Trail Flat nose(lead silver composit) or Remington Jacketed flat nose.

Powder=Accurate 2015, 42 grains, Velocity average = 1567 fps
Powder =Accurate 5744, 31 grains, Velocity average = 1565 fps
Powder = IMR 4198, 36 grains, Velocity average = 1574 fps

The Lyman Book gives values for Winchester and Marlin, which have pressure
ranges that are generally below the Pedersoli limits. If you use the book values, always start your testing with the lowest recommended values, or even lower than that. Note, for 45-70 the books usually give three sets of
values. The lowest are for the trap-door, the mid range are for the Winchester and Marlin(which I use for the sharps) and the highest values
are for the Ruger No. 1. You do not want to use the Ruger values in your
sharps. If you use black powder, you can't exceed the pressure limits. If you are new to reloading, read, read ,read and understand before you even buy your first press.
Take Care,
Rob
117671

Mullins81
March 14, 2010, 03:47 PM
I was going to invest in one of the LEE reloading kits that Cabelas has but it has mixed reviews and i didnt want to have to buy things twice....I dont want a really expensive kit more middle of the road....anybody got any suggestions? Maybe a kit worth $200 or so...

alemonkey
March 14, 2010, 09:03 PM
I use a Lee turret press and it works good enough for me. I'm not a serious competitor, but it loads accurate enough ammo for my use. The nice thing about the turret press is you can leave your dies set up in the turret and just buy a new turret ($10) for each caliber you reload.

Are you planning on shooting smokeless or the Holy Black? Black powder does require a few extra specialized items. Nothing real expensive or hard to find, though.

WC145
March 14, 2010, 09:23 PM
I have a Uberti 1885 High Wall Carbine and a Uberti 1873 Springfield Trapdoor Carbine. They are both great shooting rifles and really well put together. I would not hesitate to buy another if I was in the market.

Jim Watson
March 14, 2010, 09:41 PM
Lee Classic Cast Iron single stage press and dies will serve.
If you want to load real gunpowder, they will make you a compression die.
And if you do, there is a lot of good information on the Shiloh board.

I'd want a better scale than theirs, not necessarily digital.
A powder measure is not essential unless you load a lot more .45-70s than I expect.

Rob Smart
March 14, 2010, 11:44 PM
I also use a Lee turret press, though I only have one turret and switch my dies whenever I change. I do recommend Midway USA, they have everything you might need.
The compression die is a good idea for your black powder loads, without it you can't get more than about 60 grains into a 45-70 shell, which was originally set up to take about 70 grains.

Mullins81
March 15, 2010, 08:22 AM
I will be shooting all smokeless powder so I guess I can do without a c ompression die...Does anybody have a make and model of a "decent" scale for me to look for?? I will probably only get a single stage press because 45/70 an 30-30 will be the only ones ill be reloading for now.

pahuff1
March 16, 2010, 12:12 AM
I have a pedersoli 45-70 and am real happy with it. I purchased it because the brass for a 45-70 is readily available, cheaper by far and with modern powders vrs black powder, the 45-70 can be loaded to the same feet per second as the 45-120 and not have to put wadding in the case to take up space. With black powder if you aren't familiar is 70 grains versus 120 grains. More powder meant more power.

No gun will shoot 120 and 110 and 90 and 70. As one reader said, yes you can put a 70 in a 120 chamber but realize the bullet will have to jump quite a gap between the bullet and the rifling. Accuracy is gained by minimizing this gap. In fact when I seat a bullet I try to seat it as close to the rifling as possible.

I enjoy my gun a lot but it is 13 lbs. Not a good gun to carry for long periods or to shoot without support of some kind.

I use this scale and find it perfectly fine for general weighing of powder. From 1 to 100 grains. It is by Lee and is a $ 22.00 plus investment. http://www.midwayusa.com/browse/BrowseProducts.aspx?brandId=1262&refineSearchKeywordDisplay=scale&refineSearchKeyword=scale

Attached is a picture of mine. Hope it looks good, my first attempt at a picture attachment

ArmedBear
March 16, 2010, 12:18 AM
....how far was your shot etc??

About 80 yards as it turned out. I'd practiced out farther, but that's what presented itself.

It was a one-shot drop, with a 520 grain Lyman Postell I cast using an old mold a friend had, over a couple punchouts from a milk carton and about 68 grains of BP (Swiss or GOEX, I can't remember) through a drop tube. The bullet went straight through, and you couldn't tell the entrance from the exit.

I really don't understand the need for super-hot smokeless ".45-70 Magnum" loads, but somebody always wants something hotter, I guess.:)

button
March 17, 2010, 10:28 PM
I did not see that anyone mentioned that Cabellas now sells both rifles and they have the reloading manual for black powder loads. Not sure about there policy mail out of the states! Prices start at $999.99 (hunter sharpes) to $1799.99 for Quigley and $1899.99 for High wall. Listed in there new Reloading catalog. Just a heads if ya'll were not aware!

Maverick223
March 17, 2010, 11:07 PM
Browning/Winchester 1885 High Wall hands down if you want to load it hot. The strongest production gun chambered for .45-70Govt. in existence. Though I will admit that a Sharp's 1874 is a great gun when outfitted with a nice 32"+ bbl. One day I will have both...but this was and remains to be my first choice:
http://i642.photobucket.com/albums/uu141/Maverick223_album/IMG_4593.jpg

Watergoat
March 18, 2010, 01:03 AM
Get a Redding Big Boss press. Has a longer stroke and opening than most, makes it much easier to load long bullets in long cases. Few more bucks than the Lee, but top of the line quality, and your great-grandchildren won't wear it out.

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