Help make Iowa Shall Issue this year!


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IAJack
March 17, 2010, 10:41 AM
HF-2528 and SF-2379 we introduced today in the Iowa House & Senate.

This is the same NRA language originally introduced in HF-2255, resurrected at the request of Senator Gronstal and Representative McCarthy. If these two pieces of legislation make it through committee, they will get a straight up or down vote, and if passed, head to the Governor's desk for a signature (that has also been promised).

If passed, this legislation will make an immediate impact on all Iowans right now. All citizens will find themselves playing from the same sheet of music, and all 99 Sheriffs will find themselves forced to do the right thing. Once that happens, there will no longer be any excuse for a Sheriff to deny a Permit to Carry Weapons to any law-abiding citizen in Iowa.


I urge you to visit the Iowa Carry Legislative Action Center RIGHT NOW

http://www.capwiz.com/iowacarry/home/

Send a note to your Senator and Representative, asking them to support this legislation. It will take you five minutes. Time is short, and we need as many of you to do this as quickly as possible. Even if you arent from Iowa this Bill would help establish reciprocity.


Let's make Shall Issue a reality in 2010!

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Nick5182
March 17, 2010, 12:45 PM
Even though my county issues carry permits pretty easily, my Dad's county doesn't and he's ex-LEO and a former BATFE firearms instructor, and they still won't issue him a CCW. You got my support!

mallc
March 17, 2010, 05:11 PM
Iowa did a good thing when they added the shooting skill test and I believe there should be some measure of reserve (not self-determined) given to local law enforcement about who is qualified to carry firearms.

I know this is always a tricky question, but just having a clean record doesn't mean a person is qualified or competent to own, let alone carry a firearm.

I went through NPCCW training with a guy who asked if he could shoot someone who entered his store with a concealed weapon. The deputy providing the training replied "No you idiot! it might be me".

The crazy guy shot the qualifier with a 38 snubby. He blasted the ground in front of himself while on the firing line and was told to sit down until he could be given one-on-one guidance by the instructor. Luckily for all of us, he couldn't get minimum score given 3 tries and his permit was denied.

PS - I don't go in his shop when I'm carrying!

Scott

Vern Humphrey
March 17, 2010, 06:14 PM
I know this is always a tricky question, but just having a clean record doesn't mean a person is qualified or competent to own, let alone carry a firearm.
There are states where no firearms qualification is required for a CCW. And nothing bad happens because of that.

mallc
March 17, 2010, 07:27 PM
States where crazies massacre fellow soldiers and students with legally acquired firearms.

I'm an FFL with the responsibility, right, and obligation to decline selling firearms to people who in my opinion represent a threat to themselves or other citizens.

I'm pretty sure you would not want the crackheads and speeders I've turned away legally carrying concealed Five Sevens in your neighborhoods. I'm also pretty sure you don't want them shilling firearms for their dealers who already been popped.

Like I said, clean record does not equal responsible citizen.

Scott

IAJack
March 17, 2010, 08:31 PM
mallc you must be one of the Sheriffs buddies over in your county? Try living in an Iowa county where the Sheriff simply denies you because he doesn't like the shirt you are wearing. Are you to close to Illinois or do you not realize that 36 other states already have Shall Issue and it seems to be working just fine

This proposed Bill would still allow a Sheriff to deny an applicant BUT the applicant could then appeal to a court of law (currently there is no appeal process).

This Bill would also standardize training state wide that you seem to be so hip on. Again right now there are 99 different standards -one for each Iowa county and many of the classes are severely lacking on content.

mallc
March 17, 2010, 09:21 PM
Takes me about 3 minutes to get to Illinois. I shoot there on a weekly basis and have LE customers there as well.

Most of the LE in both states that I know would take your "shirt" comment as an insult and blow you off as a malcontent. It makes me wonder why your sheriff won't issue YOU a NPCCW permit??

I agree with point #2. If you are willing to try to convince a court that you need to carry a weapon after the Chief LE for your county has said no; I'm okay.

Yes, I am "hip" on training. I understand that the basic requirements were set by the Iowa Legislature. If that's not correct then PM me the text and I"ll call my Rep and Senator - they are my "buddies".

Thanks,
Scott

KBintheSLC
March 17, 2010, 10:21 PM
Iowa did a good thing when they added the shooting skill test and I believe there should be some measure of reserve (not self-determined) given to local law enforcement about who is qualified to carry firearms.

I know this is always a tricky question, but just having a clean record doesn't mean a person is qualified or competent to own, let alone carry a firearm.

Yeah... lets take it a step further and say that you have to take a literacy and ethics exam before you are allowed to publish anything to a website/blog/magazine/newspaper/etc. After all, the media destroys peoples lives too.

Sound ridiculous? So does the proposition that people should have to take some sort of government-approved test in order to exercise their other constitutional rights. People don't have to take a test to buy a gun, and they shouldn't have to take one to carry it either. If they choose to be irresponsible and fail to train properly, they should be held liable for any damages that may occur as a result of their actions. It's called personal accountability... some of us remember that relic of a notion.

I'm an FFL with the responsibility, right, and obligation to decline selling firearms to people who in my opinion represent a threat to themselves or other citizens.

Your job as an FFL is to run a background check, and accept payment for the product... not to pass personal judgments on your customers. I would be very curious to know the name of your gun dealership if you care to share it.


...

KBintheSLC
March 17, 2010, 10:29 PM
Back on topic... my prayers are with the people of Iowa to have this legislation passed. I can only dream of such a thing here in CA.

IAJack
March 17, 2010, 11:44 PM
wow, mallc you couldn't be more outa touch with Iowa. Here is a link to the map showing the counties where Sheriffs do arbitrarily deny persons permits.

http://www.iowacarry.org/county.php

Yes, my sheriff finally issued me a valid permit and just started issuing valid permits to applicants in my county. For nearly 10 years though he either denied or restricted permits to uselessness. He would place the restrictions "invalid in vehicle and incorporated city limit" on the restrictions portion of the permit. Just after the last election he finally spoke with the neighboring counties sheriff and now fairly issues permits. Oh and before the last election I audited the permit list in my county -most all were issued to the sheriffs buddies and county officials -imagine that!

Also I dont care what the Iowa law or code says -Iowa Sheriffs under "May Issue" pretty much have free will to do anything they please in the issuance of a permit. even though the Iowa code says 4 hours of training that training can be pretty much anything and IS not specific in content. Some CCW classes in Iowa are simply a Deputy or LEO telling 4 hours of cop stories having nothing to do with NPCCW. I am now giving persons in my county the shooting portion of the test. Nearly all I have asked do not even know where CCW is and is not allowed after taking the classroom portion of the class. (taught by someone else the sheriff "approved") I have to give them a "mini" course before I sign them off.

Lets see what other shenanigans some Iowa sheriffs pull. Oh yeah, some of them just refuse to ever give the class and put people on an infinite waiting list. Others only issue permits for carrying large sums of money (Since when is money more important than life?) Many restrict the permits for use when hunting & fishing (WTH -you need a CCW to fish)

Talk with some people in Johnson County and ask how permits used to be issued there. Or ask persons from Louisa or Des Moines County how their permits are issued.

JEB
March 18, 2010, 12:10 AM
i have heard of people being restricted to ccw only when trapping, or while transporting sums of money in excess of $5,000. some of these restrictions are just stupid. i even had one guy in the class i attended that was restricted to using only centerfire ammunition during the shooting portion of the class. this was during the time when you were LUCK to even find .22s and when you did you were paying $10 a box. want 9mm or .40?....forget about it!

the so called "class" i went to was more like 1 hour worth of breaks and 3 hours of "this is a gun and this is how it works..."

shall issue would be such a blessing and would be made even better if we could get some instructors who knew what to teach.

Vern Humphrey
March 18, 2010, 07:18 AM
Then there are... States where crazies massacre fellow soldiers and students with legally acquired firearms.
I'm not sure I understand you. Are you claiming the terrorist shooting at Fort Hood, or the mass murder at Virginia Tech was caused because the killers weren't properly trained and therefore weren't proficient enough with their weapons?

budiceman
March 18, 2010, 09:18 AM
IAJack! Hope you get it neighbor! Be nice if we could reciprocate too! Has not been a blood bath here since we went to shall issue. Our county sheriff never issued when it was a may issue state. His words were "it's going to be blood flowin down the streets if it the law passes."

razorback2003
March 18, 2010, 01:41 PM
I hope this bill passes so many of us can legally carry in Iowa without trying to go through the hoops of getting a non resident Iowa permit.

kk0g
March 18, 2010, 03:29 PM
"I hope this bill passes so many of us can legally carry in Iowa without trying to go through the hoops of getting a non resident Iowa permit."

While there is no garaunteed reciprocity included in the bill it does include a provision that the Iowa Attorney General is to attempt to gain reciprocity with other states. Of coarse that hinges on how well the differing states Attorney Generals play together but it's definitely a step in the right direction.

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