Me and the schools Here we go again


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gdcpony
March 19, 2010, 04:54 PM
My younger daughter just got home from school and informed me that they were to draw a picture of their favorite things. She says she was going to draw me and her out hunting, but another kids got yelled at for drawing a gun (something similar I gather).

So I am going to be on the phone tomorrow to ask about this. Probably to tell them that if my daughter (or any child) wishes to choose a shooting sport as their favorite thing to do, and get in trouble for expressing it, I will be happy to pull my kids out.

This is not the first time this kind off a problem has come up. Here is a good list.
1- My oldest drew a picture of me with my rifle when asked what I do for a job. I am a Marine Reservist (just selected SSgt too!!!! Yeah!!!) and was on military duty at the time. I went to the principal and got her detentions reversed, an apology, and a promise it won't happen again.
2- My oldest bragged about getting out squirrel hunting and I got a call saying I needed to interest her in different hobbies. It was apparently not an "appropriate hobby for a little girl" I took her out early the next morning got 4 more tree rats and we gutted them just before the bus arrived. She got on after handing me the shotgun and with me holding up her prizes to show hem off. "She didn't have time to clean up her hands, or to change clothes," I explained when they called and said that deer season was coming and asked how much gore do they want next time they complain? They hate it when she shows up in hunting clothes too.
3-My younger was pulled into the office to receive a long lecture on not using the word kill to describe her first deer hunt, which was successful. I told them that they needed to go back to school themselves and learn about the word context.
4- When my oldest was declaring her preference of a bow over a shotgun for deer hunting she was pulled in for discussing deadly weapons. I asked if I could go through the school and look for any deadly weapons I could find and ban the discussion of those things too (go back to the Marine part). A broom was handy and a pen was on the desk.

My stance with them has always been one that accepts that threatening is wrong. It should be dealt with sternly. I wish they could spank again and have no problem with strict discipline. I would agree if my kids so much as threatened an @$$whooping. But they are more likely to receive one and not fight back.

It hurts and confuses them that something they enjoy and Daddy says is a good thing can get them into trouble at school. It seems to them that video games are more acceptable, which I argue against vehemently.

Sorry just had to vent. We are going out to cut some firewood and do some work which is probably child abuse. Be back at sunset.

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Officers'Wife
March 19, 2010, 05:01 PM
Hi gdcpony,

The more I hear of this particular sort of idiocy the more I see the wisdom of my Dad deciding I should be home schooled.

erichtmobile
March 19, 2010, 05:06 PM
The schools are out of control. Earlier this year my sons kindergarten class was asked draw something that makes them happy, he drew a picture of the family in front of church. On the church he drew a Christian Cross. The teacher admonished him, explaining to my very confused 6 year old that we can't draw a cross because it might hurt someones feelings

HGUNHNTR
March 19, 2010, 05:07 PM
As idiotic as it is, they are following the rules. Focus you energies on policy change. You may just provide another valuable life lesson for your children.

gdcpony
March 19, 2010, 05:10 PM
As idiotic as it is, they are following the rules. Focus you energies on policy change. You may just provide another valuable life lesson for your children.
I think that the number of letters WE have wrote should have had some effect by now.

HGUNHNTR
March 19, 2010, 05:18 PM
As idiotic as it is, they are following the rules. Focus you energies on policy change. You may just provide another valuable life lesson for your children.

Golden_006
March 19, 2010, 05:28 PM
What part of the country are we talking about?

mljdeckard
March 19, 2010, 05:29 PM
I love Utah.

I took hunter's safety from faculty members of my local schools, in the school building. My father was faculty, and they made it an annual event to have a 'fire drill' the day before deer season to let everyone out early. My principal was a gunsmith, and when we brought guns in as shop projects, he insisted that we take them into his office for inspection upon completion.

That last item probably wouldn't fly anymore, but I can still carry to schools. I'm about to go get my kids now. I am seriously considering starting a shooting club in the high schools my kids attend.

ForumSurfer
March 19, 2010, 05:36 PM
GDCPony,

I feel your pain, brother. But those are the least of your concerns. Public schools can be a nightmare. My ex girlfriend worked with juvenile delinquents. I got to see the worst of what society has to offer. People who are lousy excuses for human beings do not teach their children respect, manners or anything for that matter. They let the TV, video-game system or internet babysit day and night.

That is why our court system has 9-year-olds up on rape charges. That is why our youth, starting in elementary school have criminal records that resemble violent, habitual felons.

Many of society's parents, regardless of financial, life or whatever status, are still not active in their childrens' lives and do not instill discipline. Then your kindergartner comes home asking what the four to six letter word of the day means or why do those mean kids keep picking on little Billy? These parental weenies tick me off to no end. :cuss:They are the ones who put their spoiled little brats in timeout 5 hours after the child slips up, then the child doesn't fully grasp why they are being punished...or time out simply doesn't work. Discipline, discipline, discipline...I can't preach it enough! :banghead:

Every child acts out, but some do it often because they get zero discipline at home. I'm sorry, but a soft spoken no and the occasional timeout doesn't cut it for every child. Sometimes punishment has to be swift and stern.

Good luck and God bless...

wishin
March 19, 2010, 05:39 PM
gdpony , it looks to me like you're raising your kids correctly and just the way I raised mine. Unfortunately, our government run school systems are suffering from the same strain of idiocy that's afflicting our leaders. Keep them on their toes............

Manco
March 19, 2010, 05:45 PM
One aspect of this pathetic state of affairs is that school officials and faculty are allowing fear to dictate their behavior, which of course translates to ridiculous rules for pupils to follow. When I was in elementary school, kids wrote stories involving murder, gore, guns, and even bombs, and there was never a school shooting, nor did anybody fear that there would be. It's all those large-scale, highly-publicized school shootings that have people cowering behind new rules that make absolutely zero difference in whether there is going to be another such tragedy. As usual, they've abstracted their fear toward things they believe they can control, such as the presence of firearms (i.e. gun-free zones) and even harmless references to firearms, because they can't deal with or figure out the real causes of the problem. That's bureaucracy--or rather bureaucrazy--at its finest. If foreign terrorists were so successful, the whole country would already be on its knees by now.

cassandrasdaddy
March 19, 2010, 05:47 PM
my kids principle is a koolaid drinker. shrine to obama . unions are the best thing that ever happened to america etc.she leaves me alone after i helped my kid do a paper on lincoln and slavery. it was a painful experience for her. other than that she runs a decent school. she does get a lil strained smile when i whistle dixie while i wait to get the kids.

Shung
March 19, 2010, 05:49 PM
gdcpony.. I kinda love your way to deal with them !

ming
March 19, 2010, 06:02 PM
Congrats on making E-6. Semper Fi!

rswartsell
March 19, 2010, 06:37 PM
I'm no fan of over the top teachers and school administrators that cannot seem to handle common sense. I had my troubles with them when my kids were young.

I do however see a problem with sending a kid to school with bloody hands and clothes. Maybe you should start your pre-school hunting a bit earlier and finish sooner so the kid can clean up. A school asking that you not send a student with bloody hands and clothes seems reasonable to me. You might also see this as a message that school is important, rather than a PITA interruption to hunting. Not a big fan of the how much gore do you want next time approach either. When as a parent you decide to stop reasoning and go hostile don't expect much good to come from it, including the example your kids take from it.

DCR
March 19, 2010, 07:23 PM
Addressing the teacher alone only keeps the truth from escaping the classroom. Similarly, addressing only the principal only keeps it in the building.

If your school district is like most in this country, you need to take your complaints over their heads to the real policy-making body - the popularly elected school board / board of trustees. Write whichever trustee(s) represent your area, with cc's to all the other trustees. Request to be placed on the school board's public meeting agenda so you can address your concerns to the board and ask that they review the district's policies on these matters, because in your opinion the policies are being misconstrued and applied in an over-broad manner.

You'll find out in a hurry if it's the teachers and principals who are taking things overboard, or if they're only doing what the elected board has told them to do. If the board is complicit in the problem, you can gather support in your community and initiate recall proceedings or vote in new board members/trustees who reflect your community's values and opinions and put an end to the nonsense.

If that fails, well, I guess you'll have to keep doing the right thing with your children, find a private school, start a charter school, home school, or move.

Best wishes to you.

chutestrate
March 19, 2010, 07:33 PM
I wish you were in my district in Pa. I am on the schoolboard, and I haven't encountered one of these problems yet, but am waiting. I believe in common sense which is largely missing these days. I would suggest that you approach your school board and push for policy change. I am laughing at the way you handle it because I think it is great.

Good luck.

Jumping Frog
March 19, 2010, 07:40 PM
People need to recognize that public school systems are not run for the benefit of students, they are run for the benefit of teacher unions. The students are just a cog in the public gravy train.

Every child acts out, but some do it often because they get zero discipline at home. I'm sorry, but a soft spoken no and the occasional timeout doesn't cut it for every child. Sometimes punishment has to be swift and stern.
It makes it difficult when we have to worry about having our idea of appropriate physical punishment getting construed as domestic violence. Potentially losing your gun rights for the rest of your life is a big club to worry about.

2000Yards
March 19, 2010, 07:49 PM
She didn't have time to clean up her hands, or to change clothes," I explained when they called and said that deer season was coming and asked how much gore do they want next time they complain? They hate it when she shows up in hunting clothes too.


Seriously? Would you show up at work unshaven, with body odor and out of uniform? I sure wouldn't, nor would I show up with gore on my hands and bloody clothing. She's your child and I guess you have a particular message to send, but I wonder what's coming across when you probably spend some measure of time making sure your grooming and dress standards are up to snuff before work.

Aside from the above comment, sounds like you're doing a great job raising your daughters.

ChaoSS
March 19, 2010, 08:39 PM
I have to agree about sending her to school bloody. This seems to me like a good way to get CPS called in to investigate.

It doesn't matter what your hobbies are, guns and killing animals shouldn't be special. If your hobby was 4 wheeling, would you feel it appropriate to send her to school after some offroading without washing up, all muddy and scraped up? If your hobby was painting, would you feel it appropriate to send her to school covered in paint, without giving her the chance to clean up first?

This isn't about you. Have you even thought about the teasing that she might endure going through a day of school soaked in blood and smelling like dead animals?


The school needs to relax about guns, but don't let your daughter be the casualty of your own personal war against them, even if you feel that it is to protect her.

danprkr
March 19, 2010, 08:47 PM
As idiotic as it is, they are following the rules. Focus you energies on policy change. You may just provide another valuable life lesson for your children.

Seems to be that's what he's doing. By not accepting stupid policies he's putting pressure on them to adopt more intelligent policies. Maybe not the way I'd attempt to apply that pressure, but certainly one way to go about it. After all Rosa Parks didn't just whine that bus seat segregation was wrong. She REFUSED to accept it.

And now that I think about it, I'd like to think that would be EXACTLY the way I'd start. Of course I'd follow it up by running for school board and/or campaigning for candidates that would officially change those policies, but the first step is NOT ACCEPTING idiocy!

brucey44
March 19, 2010, 08:52 PM
Unreal, its almost as bad as the police these days. I was reading this morning about a guy that had been to a range, and he road his motorcycle there, he had his rifle (with trigger lock in place) in a case around his back. He gets home and there are cruisers and about 8 cops surrounding his house 10 minutes later. They told him 'concerned' motorists called to say there was an armed man driving around the streets.

They wanted to search his house and everything. Soo unfair this day an age.

wrs840
March 19, 2010, 08:59 PM
Homeschooling is way easier than you think, and very effective... you'll know it when you see your kids' test scores when you satisfy the State's end-of-year requirements with their Woodcott-Johnson (or whatever you choose that is accepted) results.

Best part is, you get your kids back. Mentally, not just physically. Mommy and daddy's values are no longer secondary and too often represented as "wrong".

Public and even private schools today are a social wolfpack, and there's very few adults left there who have their heads screwed-on straight either. The "good" kids are beaten down, not encouraged.

Les

Zack
March 19, 2010, 09:54 PM
We are going out to cut some firewood and do some work which is probably child abuse. Be back at sunset.


I am telling on you...

No really, I know this kind of junk they do not want to talk about guns but other things are ok. Never mind guns are part of history too....... Its like you can not say bomb or gun at government places. Never mind the fact they talk about video games with killing in them, but you can not draw a picture of a gun :/

twofifty
March 19, 2010, 10:04 PM
What follows has to do with the attitudes that schools have toward hunting and the responsibility we have for our personal safety.

A few weeks ago I twice accompanied a friend's 6yo kid to his taekwondo, and watched with other parents while the practice went on. The classes take place in the local grade school gym, but are taught by a private instructor. Kids range in age from 5yo to 12yo.

The instructor used language and concepts that I found very refreshing in these PC times:

- he told the kids that if someone hits them, to hit them back twice as hard.
- he told the kids that at the upcoming competition,
he wanted them to fight hard and be aggressive.

btw, this took place in a rural area where hunting plays a significant role in many peoples' lives, and where one of the biggest clubs is the R&G.

To my surprise, there were a number of let's say 'liberal' parents in attendance...I later asked a parent about the hitting thing and he said that it is important his kids know how to take care of themselves.

The school not only allows taekwondo, it also allows kids to draw pictures that have hunting themes.

You guys need to take control of your school boards...shooting sports and hunting will carry on or disappear through the kids. Mis-educating kids is the Anti lobby's most powerful way of permanently doing away with our sport.

oneounceload
March 19, 2010, 10:05 PM
Instead of pulling your kids out, SUE THEM. Find a lawyer who will work pro bono and sue them silly. As someone who changed careers briefly to become a teacher and try to make a difference, I left when it got so bad they were passing mentally handicapped kids because it would hurt their feelings to be left back AGAIN, even though, in the third grade they were lower than pre-K.

Sue them over and over again and make them bear the costs and demonstrate how ludicrous their ideals are on the record, reminding the School Board that they are elected.

It is the only way to really get their attention and make them back down

gdcpony
March 20, 2010, 02:08 AM
Allot of your replies strike home. I do take it to our public officials who hide behind some other "concerned parent" who dictates policy. My younger daughter is not aloud peanut butter and jelly sandwiches because it MIGHT get passed on to an allergic child. The same for chocolate chip cookies as the chips are made in the same factory. Ludicrous, but true.

Sending my child top school bloody, was extreme, but the entire "girls shouldn't learn to shoot", "she's too young", and "you're are raising your kids to be violent" got old real fast. I wanted to send a message that they couldn't miss. When they called my first response was "Don't you think a restroom (where I instructed her to go first off upon arriving) would be a better place to wash her hands (the only part with a trace of anything)?"

My kids are not perfect. For all my oldest's booksmarts she lacks common sense, and my other is the reverse. We have since preschool wanted the younger held back and they refuse saying it is demeaning. Sorry, but it's better done now (or then) than later or letting her discover that the rest of the world doesn't care to baby her through.

My kids love to shoot, and I let them. I dole out the ammo, and they treat it like something precious to be well spent. My oldest just got a box of .410 shells of her own to keep in her room in her rack locked up with a key she had a copy of. She was so proud to graduate to that point. The younger one will be in the same boat probably by the time I return from Afghanistan. It is a reward for showing responsibility that no other thing can equal. I love it when she comes in "daddy there's a groundhog out back, can I have a bullet?"

What bothers me is how much interference I get when my kids learn more from me than the schools about life. My older one can ID most any type of rock and say how it came to be. My younger knows more local plants than her teachers. They can both be counted on to help another child when others ignore them. Sometimes to extremes.

Now they are sleeping after rolling 2 cords of unsplit firewood out of the woods (down hill). We worked hard, but with my AR out there waiting for the first groundhog of the year they spent as much time watching the far end of the fields as rolling. I get to shoot it if they slack and the better behaved one gets to take the shot if they are good. We are all sore, but got time outside together that the school thinks is too much effort for young children. With my younger daughter having broke her arm I can't wait till she shows off how she can roll things with her foot. She just refused to be left out of some of it though mostly she kept me in gas and oil and all of us supplied with drinks. Child abuse I am sure.

If this is bad, imagine in two years when my boy hits the school system. He is too young to shot right now, but it won't be long. He has his own earmuffs and loves to watch and has been out bow hunting with me and his biggest sister.

Oh and this caused a huge fuss when my oldest brought it in to show her friends. Her first deer, Stalked while feeding and shot from 20yds. It went another 20yds slammed into a tree and died. She is unfortunately quite honest in describing the experience, "It looked like a red spray-paint can spraying out" to describe the blood as it ran, and "I shot a dog" referring to its size
http://c1.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/113/l_a76c94de6ba84ee69de33c8de5c237e0.jpg

warnerwh
March 20, 2010, 03:05 AM
I like how you have been handling things. I don't even want to get started because it is so disturbing to me. Common sense is gone in my daughter's school district also.
The person above recommending lawsuits has the best idea. I wish we had some attorneys here that would have an idea how to approach a lawsuit under these circumstances. Even if one person couldn't afford it maybe if everybody donated a little money it could be done. Or am I dreaming?

sonick808
March 20, 2010, 03:41 AM
Keep up the pressure guys. I honestly feel there is a gun/hunting renaissance and awareness occuring in the US. Gun rights are actually on the rise, rather than decline. People are fed up with PC, and this is starting to show in the schools and elsewhere. Just keep fighting, i tihnk it will get better! And i agree with the gentleman who suggested hitting them in the pocket book if this abuse persists. Sorry it has to be this way but they have to learn.

FROGO207
March 20, 2010, 06:05 AM
For those of us on this board the need to provide the know how to protect and provide for ourselves and our loved ones will never go out of style. It also appears that the schools and the government are out of control of the average citizen these days.:banghead: I will agree that the way to affect change is to hit the them in the pocket book. This tactic has proved a powerful tool to the antis as far as gun control thus far. Let us use their own tools to defeat them and change their warped policies. Sounds like the OP has the best interests of his kids in mind. Do however teach them that the unpopular choice however correct will often have negative consequences by those "in charge". Lead by example and help to change the idiotic policies that are presently enforced.:) As the old Dylan song goes "The times they are a-changin" and we have to aim them in the correct direction with the next generation and what they learn.

Zoidberg523
March 20, 2010, 06:20 AM
If your hobby was 4 wheeling, would you feel it appropriate to send her to school after some offroading without washing up, all muddy and scraped up? If your hobby was painting, would you feel it appropriate to send her to school covered in paint, without giving her the chance to clean up first?

I sure would if the school system (or any of it's employees) stepped outside it's boundaries and told myself or my child that offroading or painting was unsafe and irresponsible, and implied that I was a bad parent for allowing/condoning those individual freedoms. I assume that the OP's daughter was not opposed to this - it isn't like he made her do it, even though she wanted to wash up first: It was a conscious decision on her part to help make a point.

Officers'Wife
March 20, 2010, 06:48 AM
I've always been told there is no disgrace in getting dirty, only staying that way.

I've also been told, by the same person, two wrongs don't make a right.

Ragnar Danneskjold
March 20, 2010, 08:08 AM
I too take issue with the idea of going hunting right before school and not being able to clean up. A lot can be said about a person and their attitude by how they visually present themselves. Just as one who does not shave should be looked down upon at a job interview, one who does not clean up before school gives the impression they don't take it seriously.

I'm sorry, but hunting is a leisure activity. School is a serious life requirement. There is no doubt where anyone's priorities should be. I take the same attitude towards kids who are allowed to skip school to go hunting. It tells me they care more about having fun themselves than preparing for the future.

I'm sure your school has a bad attitude towards shooting, and that is inexcusable. But you disrespect yourself, your children, and education in general by planning a hunting trip on a school morning, and not giving her the chance to be fully prepared for what is truly important; school, not hunting.

inclinebench
March 20, 2010, 08:23 AM
Ragner, I take issue with your comment that hunting is a leisure activity. For some maybe, but for many of us, hunting is a primary food source. Yes, I enjoy hunting, but it is of great importance to my family for food. Further more, it is a way of life that goes way beyong being a leisure activity. Hunting with my kids is about teaching them important skills, such as feeding your family, it is also handing down traditions that have been so important for the human race since the dawn of man.

School, especially of the public variety, has much less importance on the proper developement of a child, than does the family.

Ragnar Danneskjold
March 20, 2010, 08:25 AM
I'm fairly confident the type of people who bus their kids to public schools are not the same kind of people who need to hunt to survive. And that would indeed place hunting into the leisure activity category.

Manco
March 20, 2010, 08:55 AM
For those of us on this board the need to provide the know how to protect and provide for ourselves and our loved ones will never go out of style.

This is part of the growing schism between dependence and independence at the level of the individual. Sure, we're social creatures who generally need mutual support in many ways, but the typical American has become increasingly dependent on vast social structures that could potentially collapse at any time during natural disasters, for example, as well as a "gubmint" increasingly based on "We the incumbent elite who know what's best for you." :banghead:

I will agree that the way to affect change is to hit the them in the pocket book. This tactic has proved a powerful tool to the antis as far as gun control thus far. Let us use their own tools to defeat them and change their warped policies.

That should help, but unfortunately we don't get to use the most powerful tool of the antis and other socialists--the one that has allowed such people to take control of entire institutions and preach to a captive, usually receptive (being children in this case) audience: emotional arguments that play on the inherent compassion of decent human beings. We've had to use mostly reason, which has a weak effect on most people, at best.

danprkr
March 20, 2010, 09:04 AM
I too like the lawsuit idea. Heck if you can't find an attorney to take it on contingency go into the local court house, and file on them your self if nothing else. Then they have to fire up the lawyers etc. Sure you'll lose, but odds are they'll get real tired of you real quick, and start leaving you and yours alone. Then spread the word of what you've done, and pretty soon the lawsuit allergic school board will be bending over backward to make you happy.

nitforfun
March 20, 2010, 09:26 AM
My little girl just turned 3 and she has been collecting bullet casings since she was 2. She loves asking a millions question about the out doors and it makes me proud that she wants to be outside learning about stuff that she can touch and feel and not just seeing it on a tv screen. Her grandmother is from cincinnati and she really has no understanding of kentucky and the outdoors we (my wife and daughter and I) live back a long driveway (2200ft)
and my MIL told my wife she doesn't see how we can live back here with there being so many stray bullets flying around in kentucky

hhhhmmmm I bet that the university of cinci. sees alot more gunshot victims per year than little ole henderson ky......but my thing is, education is the key you have to educate those people ......once she saw a bunch of brass laying on the ground and asked me don't you worry about all the lead laying there

I told her that isn't lead its brass ......she thought all of the cartridge was made out of lead......


Thats whats leading our country now .......people that were raised in the inner cities and don't have a clue to the reall world ........and i'm not talking about this supposedly tv reality show crap either

gdcpony
March 20, 2010, 10:02 AM
Our freezers contain 8 deer, 12 groundhog, 20 or so squirrel, and 15# of pork and poultry. We do not eat beef. So hunting is more than a hobby. Just like heating our house with wood and the multitude of garden canned goods we have in our pantry it is a way we provide for ourselves.

We ask little from our government unless we actually need it. An unbiased education is one of those. My children need the social interaction it brings or they would be home schooled.

Again the sending of my daughter to school "bloody" was a reaction to her treatment for no other reason than that she likes to participate in filling our freezer. How would you react when your kids comes up and tells you that something she loved and you had taught her to do, something you spent time together doing, was wrong and she shouldn't be doing it?

I didn't send her covered in blood and guts. I was careful about that. It was probably less then they get than the mud they get playing in that sinkhole they call a playground. Not blood warpaint on the face and all that. And her clothes were simple Walmart camo coveralls and a camo shirt. In fact, here is the outfit:
http://c3.ac-images.myspacecdn.com/images02/36/l_81efc9945f3345758581a3531db6ac72.jpg

She wanted to pack a groundhog lunch that day too and so guess what kind of sandwich she had?

As far as the violence the schools seem to expect, I have taught them to fight, but they have yet to use the lessons. Once I had my younger daughter come home and tell me she got hit, but did not fight back and I told her that she would probably get hit again, but let the school handle the other kids that time. Next time she knows better. Start a fight- I spank you. Defend yourself- I will defend you. Keep hitting after the fight (beating down the other kid if you know what I mean)- I spank you again.

I do my best as a father and raise my kids to do things for themselves. In a world over run with video games, TV, and computers, it is hard at times to keep them interested in activities that actually require effort and failure is common. Now I am leaving for a year and coming back to a teenager (or shortly there after) and a preteen, that will have been influenced by the school and that scares me more than the deployment.

Gouranga
March 20, 2010, 10:36 AM
Wow. That is some pretty good learning there. Your kids will be fine. My buddy just sent his oldest to public school for the first time in middle school. He was terrified she would pick up lessons of this world and that the liberal school system, media, and such would change her. However, you will likely find what he did. You have spent the time with them, taught them life lessons and those are so ingrained to who they are that they will weather the storm and be stronger for it.

I cannot fathom leaving my kids for a year or more as you have to and I cannot fully express the gratitude and respect I have for those such as yourself who are the reason we have the rights we do still have. Your kids will survive the year and you will find the lessons you gave them will stand the test your absence will give them.

That being said, I like the legal route. Things got where they are by liberals suing the system into this PC pile of garbage it has become today. They are so scared of being sued that it is all they respond to. So suing them back is about the only recourse we have. Pulling your kids will pretty much just remove the problem for them. Of course, the flip side is keeping them there exposes them to more of this garbage. My wife is a state certified teacher and we have been REALLY considering the home school option. In NC they push "character education" which to me was always called "parenting" and was my job. Especially considering the folks in government who design the "character education" content are not qualified to define character for anyone.

I have 4 girls and our schools are fun to say the least. In kindergarten they had a boy who was trying to kiss all the girls. They asked us, actually asked us if we wanted the police involved. On a kindergartner! I told them we might want to be a bit less insane, tell his parents about what happened and let them handle it. Guess what, they tried that radical approach and we managed to fix the problem without needing to slap cuffs on the boy.

Not sure if anyone here has seen the movie Gattica but I can see us rapidly slipping into that type of society. It is really enough for me to buy a few hundred acres build a shack and drop out of the rat race.

wishin
March 20, 2010, 10:48 AM
I'm fairly confident the type of people who bus their kids to public schools are not the same kind of people who need to hunt to survive. And that would indeed place hunting into the leisure activity category.
I live in a rural area where hunting is commonplace and the school bus makes its rounds daily. That's not unusual in Georgia. I regret to admit that hunting is the only way some of these families eat meat in this economy. For some, the kids would not attend school but for busing.

Let's call it a leisure activity of necessity.:rolleyes:

robmkivseries70
March 20, 2010, 11:01 AM
What I want to know is where the H*!! the school gets off telling you what is "appropriate behavior" for your child!:fire:
Best,
Rob

Omaha-BeenGlockin
March 20, 2010, 11:02 AM
A "school" that's only interested in turning mind numbed serfs and commies will get no respect and should be treated with as much distain needed to get the point across.

A School seeking to turn out whip smart critical thinkers will get my respect and 100% backing and support.

Big difference.

Guns and more
March 20, 2010, 11:11 AM
The teacher admonished him, explaining to my very confused 6 year old that we can't draw a cross because it might hurt someones feelings
And we know who they might be, don't we?
Of course, a drawing of a minaret would be just fine, I'll bet.
I would have been at the next school board meeting.
What if we had taken a picture if front of church. Are we to remove the cross in the picture before we could show it to anyone?

Fight back, they won't stop at this.

Taurus 617 CCW
March 20, 2010, 11:13 AM
gdcpony,

First of all, God bless you for serving our country! Second, our public school system has become the product of the socialistic agenda that the left has been pushing since the 60's and 70's. Slowly they have been taking over institutions such as public schools and it's gotten way out of hand. The only thing we can do is fight it and try to change it from the top. Your vote counts!

Joe Demko
March 20, 2010, 11:24 AM
Sending the kid to school bloody was a self-marginalizing act on your part. Basically, you labeled yourself as a crank.
Education is controlled at the local level. Start attending board meetings. Get on the agenda and present your concerns politely and sanely. Do not show up for the meeting in hunting clothes or with bloody hands.
Consider running for school board.
Remember that the people at THR have no influence on any of this. Convincing us of anything is pointless. Spend your time and energy where it will get results.

CelticArmory
March 20, 2010, 02:53 PM
We home school precisely because of the communist ideals taught in the public schools around here.

SharpsDressedMan
March 20, 2010, 04:08 PM
Hurray for you! Back pressure over these simple minded rules IS policy reform. We (this country) were/was BORN with a rebel mentality, and the questioning and resistance to authority. Keep on them, for the sake of every other person, to keep our society and school free of narrow, yet foolish, minds.

Gouranga
March 20, 2010, 05:00 PM
BTW, fF you do go to the local board meetings. Try showing up in your dress uniform. Make darn sure everyone in there knows who they are talking to. Before they go assuming you are a redneck and dismiss you, let them get an idea of who you are and what you do for this country.

I would bet you would turn some heads pretty quickly.

Officers'Wife
March 20, 2010, 05:15 PM
Hi Gouranga,

Try showing up in your dress uniform.

Don't forget the decorations! My last year at public school the 'teacher' told us the Vietnam era soldiers where trained to kill without thought or morality. I came home and told my Dad the lesson nearly in tears. He told me not to worry he would take care of it.

The next day, nine men marched into my classroom in Vietnam era uniforms representing the Army, Marines and Navy and all with Vietnam service ribbons. My father ordered them to parade rest then walked up the teacher and asked- (respectfully request was the term he used) for equal time on description of their training.

The teacher had no objections.

Zoidberg523
March 20, 2010, 08:05 PM
I'm fairly confident the type of people who bus their kids to public schools are not the same kind of people who need to hunt to survive. And that would indeed place hunting into the leisure activity category.

Did you think about that before you typed it? As far as I know, nearly all rural students are picked up by bus, even if the nearest school is in the city (Keep in mind that I, like you, live in Michigan). I personally know many families that live outside of the city, who hunt for food, and who send their children to school via public busing.

Owen Sparks
March 21, 2010, 07:14 PM
I will be happy to pull my kids out./quote]

[quote]I will be happy to pull my kids out.

You should, but the problem is that you will still be forced to pay taxes that support the government schools. The answer is the separation of school and state. Until that happens you must stand up for your rights as a parent.

Deltaboy
March 21, 2010, 07:39 PM
As a school district employee in TX I know if you start calling and writting the School Board members or Trustees you will get action or you get to vote them out.

SharpsDressedMan
March 21, 2010, 08:06 PM
Some day, really intelligent people will consider how smart it is, or isn't, to provoke citizens known to be armed, who daily have to defend their rights to engage in lawful pursuits with firearms, like self defense, defense of others, hunting, marksmanship disciplines, etc. Why do people have to antagonize others? To antagonize armed people in our stressed out society is not INTELLIGENT to me. I believe these antagonists (in this case, school officials) will someday create the very situation they fear. So far, we have all pretty much acted with restraint when "attacked" by the antigunners. Can we expect this restraint from ALL gun owners forever?

Officers'Wife
March 21, 2010, 08:22 PM
Hi Sharps,

Unfortunately, the majority of teachers and admin I've dealt with seem to believe the power of the state makes them above all other concerns including basic decency. To call them on their rudeness or stupidity is not a slight against them but against the state.

Joe Demko
March 21, 2010, 08:29 PM
Speak about "the majority of teachers" when you actually know them.

Radagast
March 21, 2010, 08:45 PM
SharpsDressedMan:
I point you to Niven's laws by Larry Niven, one of the greatest science fiction writers of our time. Just to give you an idea of how great, the Strategic Defence Initiative (Star Wars project) was put together on his kitchen table one labor day weekend and now exists in a working form.

Many people don't realise how awesome this is, but I grew up under the fear of nuclear war fought with weapons that could not be defended against. The fact that we don't have to threaten to murder the innocents on the other side of the political fence to prevent them from murdering us us awsome beyond belief. Self defence is moral, mass murder is not.

So, on to Nivens Laws:
---------
1a) Never throw **** at an armed man.
1b) Never stand next to someone who is throwing **** at an armed man.

You wouldn't think anyone would need to be told this. It dates from the Democratic National Convention of 1968.

2) Never fire a laser at a mirror.
3) Mother Nature doesn't care if you're having fun.

You will not be stopped! There are things you can't do because you burn sugar with oxygen, or your bones aren't strong enough, or you're a mammal, or human. Funny chemicals may kill you slow or quick, or ruin your brain ... or prolong your life. You can't fly like an eagle, nor yet like Daedalus, but you can fly. You're the only earthly life-form that can even begin to deal with jet lag. You can cheat. Nature doesn't care, but don't get caught.

4) Giving up freedom for security has begun to look naive.

Even to me. Many of you were ahead of me on this. Three out of four hijacked airplanes destroyed the World Trade Center and a piece of the Pentagon in 2001. How is it possible that those planes were taken using only five perps armed with knives? It was possible because all those hundreds of passengers had been carefully stripped of every possible weapon. We may want to reconsider this approach. It doesn't work in high schools either.
---------------
more here: http://www.larryniven.org/stories/nivens_laws_2002.shtml

I included rule three because I breached it on the weekend. Ouch!

GDCPony: Good luck with your ongoing battle.

Nicodemus38
March 22, 2010, 12:32 AM
everyone forgets that in order to perpetuate the total domination by the state and its organizations and manifestations, they must indoctrinate the next generatation as soon as possibly. Every historian can tell you how well the Hitler Youth indoctrinated 5-10 year old children into complete obedience to the state.

jbkebert
March 22, 2010, 12:48 AM
I am sorry your kids go to such a crappy school district. I was surprised as heck when my sons teacher asked Keigan to bring a picture of his deer. The teacher hung the picture up on the wall in the class room under student acheivments. Two years ago in the same school district Keigan was called a liar because he told his teacher that he shot competive archery. Guess each teacher has there priorites.

cchris
March 22, 2010, 01:39 AM
You ought to tell your kids to plead the fifth, they certainly can't get in trouble for saying nothing at all. Which is probably the only way you'll be able to not get in trouble if things keep going the way they are.

wankerjake
March 22, 2010, 02:39 AM
I too take issue with the idea of going hunting right before school and not being able to clean up. A lot can be said about a person and their attitude by how they visually present themselves. Just as one who does not shave should be looked down upon at a job interview, one who does not clean up before school gives the impression they don't take it seriously.

I'm sorry, but hunting is a leisure activity. School is a serious life requirement. There is no doubt where anyone's priorities should be. I take the same attitude towards kids who are allowed to skip school to go hunting. It tells me they care more about having fun themselves than preparing for the future.

I'm sure your school has a bad attitude towards shooting, and that is inexcusable. But you disrespect yourself, your children, and education in general by planning a hunting trip on a school morning, and not giving her the chance to be fully prepared for what is truly important; school, not hunting.
This is a typical way of thought amongst non-hunters, and it's garbage. Sir, I bet I'm what you would call "successful" and I couldn't disagree any more with this load of BS if I tried. I'm in my 8th year of post high school education and will be working a "white-collar" job in less than two years. But that isn't what makes me successful. I'm successful in my career because of my attitude towards life, not because I've sat my arse in a classroom for most of my 27 years. I go to school to learn about my job, I hunt to learn about life. There's more to be learned about life than what you get in middle school. There's a time for studying and diligence, but when elk season rolls around, hell yes I'm skipping school until I get one down and butchered. Been doing it since I was 12 and I've made the grades year after year after year. And FYI, dragging an elk carcass out of a canyon and into your truck isn't leisure, it's work! Butchering it and living off of it all year long isn't leisure either, it's self-sufficiency, it's sustinence, and it's every bit as important to me as getting a good education and being "successful".

It's posts like yours that makes me proud that I can see past the end of my nose to what's important. Y'all should get out into the coutry once in awhile, out of the city, and get some fresh air. It'll do you good. Get out with the critters and see how things really work, there's more to life than the city and your computer.

P.S. To the OP, I love the picture of your little girl skinning that deer. She understands how things really work, and that is getting more and more rare these days. You're doing things right and I have no doubt your children will turn into fine people. Keep up the good work and thank you for your service.

MarineOne
March 22, 2010, 04:21 AM
Some day, really intelligent people will consider how smart it is, or isn't, to provoke citizens known to be armed, who daily have to defend their rights to engage in lawful pursuits with firearms, like self defense, defense of others, hunting, marksmanship disciplines, etc. Why do people have to antagonize others? To antagonize armed people in our stressed out society is not INTELLIGENT to me. I believe these antagonists (in this case, school officials) will someday create the very situation they fear. So far, we have all pretty much acted with restraint when "attacked" by the antigunners. Can we expect this restraint from ALL gun owners forever?

My own insights on these questions:

Why do people have to antagonize/intimidate each other?

Two reasons: petty jealousy (if I can't have what you have, you can't have it / don't need it either) and fear. Human beings fear what they don't understand, and automatically associate bad things with what they fear. A great example is snakes; generally considered bad, snakes help control the mice and rat populations by eating them, but if you look at human history snakes are considered "bad" because we fear them.


Can we expect this restraint from ALL gun owners forever?

IMHO, I expect that as more people lose their "fear" of firearms they will slowly convert to a true "Pro-2A" viewpoint versus the "Pro-2A when I need to be" attitude that new gun owners have. All this does is bolster our numbers and makes a loud voice even louder when it comes to railing against future legislation that tries to limit what we collectively enjoy doing.

Manco
March 22, 2010, 09:31 AM
To antagonize armed people in our stressed out society is not INTELLIGENT to me. I believe these antagonists (in this case, school officials) will someday create the very situation they fear. So far, we have all pretty much acted with restraint when "attacked" by the antigunners. Can we expect this restraint from ALL gun owners forever?

Are you talking about antagonizing with arguments using words? Do you think any sane person who believes in the First Amendment as well as the Second Amendment would actually shoot somebody because of an argument? If that were to ever become a common case, then maybe the anti-gunners are right after all, and we're too "stressed-out" a society for even law-abiding citizens to be trusted with firearms. :rolleyes: Of course, there is always the occasional insane person toting guns. I guess that's what you meant, but there's something about your argument that doesn't seem right, as stated.

And by the way, what makes people so stressed out in these days of relatively easy living in comparison to the past? (not this decade compared to the last but the last two compared to the rest) Perhaps information technology is proving to be far more dangerous than weapon technology could ever be.

Unfortunately, the majority of teachers and admin I've dealt with seem to believe the power of the state makes them above all other concerns including basic decency. To call them on their rudeness or stupidity is not a slight against them but against the state.

Many teachers definitely have a symbiotic relationship with the state: the state gives them the power to indoctrinate captive, mostly defenseless children, and their indoctrination in turn gives power to the state.

My own insights on these questions:

Why do people have to antagonize/intimidate each other?

Two reasons: petty jealousy (if I can't have what you have, you can't have it / don't need it either) and fear. Human beings fear what they don't understand, and automatically associate bad things with what they fear. A great example is snakes; generally considered bad, snakes help control the mice and rat populations by eating them, but if you look at human history snakes are considered "bad" because we fear them.

I've always said that one of the main differences between pro-gunners and true anti-gunners--not ones who merely fear the unknown and then love shooting after you take them to the range--is how they view and fear other people. As a pro-gunner, obviously, I have a fear of certain types of people who may, as individuals, decide to attack my family for no legitimate reason that we provided. Being able to defend my family using the most effective means is not only a comfort but a responsibility that I cannot, in good conscience, simply shirk. Anti-gunners, on the other hand, view people in a collective sense, and fear what they believe everybody to be capable of, including themselves, if allowed the means. In their view, only the state can prevent gun violence by outlawing guns altogether, save for the police. As for knife attacks and strangling, I guess they don't consider knives and bare hands as inspirational as guns when it comes to murder--I'm not talking about people who let thinking and reason get in the way of their beliefs here.

sonick808
March 22, 2010, 10:02 AM
I take serious issue with the gentleman who said anyone who is busing their children to school is living a life luxurious enough to not hunt for food.

That sir, is bull****!

Both sides of my family have long, long history of being dirt poor to the point that they would have to eat.... well, dirt; if they had not hunted and fished for fresh, "organic" meat. I'm talking a wood stove, a rickety one room shack and a hole in the ground out back poor. Yet, a bus still came through even back in fifties in impossibly rural Missouri.

So please, don't calculate another man's wealth based on the school system's bus routes.

sargas23
March 22, 2010, 10:03 AM
Yeah, I'm armed and antagonized so much that the next time someone makes me angry about the 2nd Ammendment, I'm going to VOTE. Politicians need to fear me for that.

Hillbillyz
March 22, 2010, 10:55 AM
Many people in our world today are forgetting how children have been raised in this country since its founding. Parents teach their children values, morals, and attitudes of right and wrong at home. Then chldren are sent to school to finish what was started at home. Now days you see parents who want the schools to do everything, and we see the results. As a middle school history teacher my students do hear about firearms and the importance they have played in history.

Working in an urban area I deal with many students who look at firearms through the eyes of the latest action movie or music video. I have had students ask who I planned on killing when they saw a firearms catalog sitting on my desk. I have had to explain to them firearms have many uses, not just the killing of people.

Let other people raise your children and you won't know what your results will be. It sounds like you are doing a fine job, and congratulations on the promotion.

Zip7
March 22, 2010, 02:22 PM
I'm sorry, but hunting is a leisure activity. School is a serious life requirement.

No it's not. Learning to read is a serious life requirement, but school is not necessary for that.

Formal schooling is important for the same reason that rent in Manhattan is astronomically high - because enough people buy into the idea that it should be so.

Schooling != education. Real education is readily available outside of schools to anyone who seeks it.

cleardiddion
March 22, 2010, 02:32 PM
Hey OP, I think you're doing a damned fine job of things. Your daughters sound like a group of kids that just about anyone could be proud of.

3:00hold
March 22, 2010, 03:17 PM
I agree with you up to the bloody hands - for 2 reasons.

1 - Blood COULD be dangerous, and the school would be justfied in their actions based on that. They need to protect other students. It's biohazard.

2 - It weakens the rest of your argument.

Just my 2 cents. Good luck with this.

Kevin77
March 22, 2010, 03:46 PM
First, she gutted a squirrel not a bison. It is very possible to gut a squirrel without getting more than maybe a spot of blood on you.

I am also a proud resident of the first F- for gun control. My middle son loves everything hunting and talks constantly about it. He has used the words slaughter, harvest and butcher in his kindergarten class. His teacher thinks he is a hoot. She was reading a story about a rabbit and a fox and he commented that the fox would deffinately harvest that rabbit. She loves to hear his hunting stories. If his future teachers have a problem with his hobbies then we will become very well aquainted and they will not enjoy the experience, but so far so good.

I also like the fact that I can carry when I pick my kids up or go to a school play or parent/teacher conference. Teachers can also carry or at least I know of a few that DO carry.

biohazurd
March 22, 2010, 04:07 PM
Honestly if i had kids (I dont) and that many incidents like that were happening at their school I would start looking for different academic settings... Dont take any crap from the man, or a teacher!!!

Officers'Wife
March 22, 2010, 05:48 PM
Formal schooling is important for the same reason that rent in Manhattan is astronomically high - because enough people buy into the idea that it should be so.

++1!

Zundfolge
March 22, 2010, 06:15 PM
My children need the social interaction it brings or they would be home schooled.

That's one of the biggest of the big lies told by the government/union education/indoctrination establishment.

Public schools like ours (based on the Prussian model (http://www.quantumshift.tv/v/1198046178)) are artificial social environments that retard, not develop children's social skills (done on purpose to create compliant, obedient citizens, not independent, critical thinkers that don't write in run on sentences :neener: ).

Most home-schooled kids develop better social schools than public educated ones.

Ergoman
March 22, 2010, 06:34 PM
Why is it about hunting for substinance? Are we not allowed to pursue activities that are legal and part of our families culture? Or does cultural importance only apply to certain groups?

FIVETWOSEVEN
March 22, 2010, 06:43 PM
I can't say it enough of how lucky I am for being able to attend a private Christian school. We have a rifle team which I ressurected, and a possible achery team starting. Plus me and my history teacher talk about guns alot. This school is pretty much the opposite of public school.

Officers'Wife
March 22, 2010, 07:37 PM
Why is it about hunting for substinance? Are we not allowed to pursue activities that are legal and part of our families culture? Or does cultural importance only apply to certain groups?

Our present culture only gives lip service to self sufficiency, the reality is they are at best critical of it.

Manco
March 22, 2010, 08:33 PM
Public schools like ours (based on the Prussian model (http://www.quantumshift.tv/v/1198046178)) are artificial social environments that retard, not develop children's social skills (done on purpose to create compliant, obedient citizens, not independent, critical thinkers that don't write in run on sentences :neener: ).

Interesting link there, although the writer obviously doesn't know the correct meaning of "beg the question." :) And rather than leading the country into neo-Nazism specifically, the intent seems to be to gradually erode American culture and transform us into a nation of multicultural socialists who will one day pledge allegiance to global authorities. Maybe I'm paranoid, but such scary scenarios are all I can come up with to match my observations. What else could explain the type of indoctrination that goes on in American public schools?

By the way, I happen to be an immigrant, so my point of view is perhaps still a little bit from the outside looking in, even now, and I don't like what I've been seeing of late. I love the United States and accept its founding principles, traditions, culture (not as defined by the media), and even history as my own in spirit, and I don't quite yet comprehend the true nature of the sinister forces trying to destroy the country from within. Something definitely isn't right about the present US government, and I'm not just talking about the communist who is currently occupying the White House. While it's bad enough that the government doesn't represent and serve its own people, in the larger worldwide view it also doesn't seem to serve the interests of the country as a whole. This is what has led me to believe that if we ever only have one right left to defend, it's clearly spelled out in the Second Amendment. Once our voices have been silenced by law, there is only one other sound we'll need to make.

Why is it about hunting for substinance? Are we not allowed to pursue activities that are legal and part of our families culture? Or does cultural importance only apply to certain groups?

If you consider yourself American, then in the view of some people, by definition you have no valid culture and may not celebrate or practice it openly--only those who consider themselves resident foreigners have culture that everybody in this country must acknowledge and appreciate. :rolleyes:

danprkr
March 23, 2010, 05:11 PM
Please keep us informed. Inquiring minds want to know what happens next.

SSN Vet
March 23, 2010, 05:41 PM
The schools are out of control.

the schools have been the front line of the culture wars for years...

they lean so far left (thanks to the NEA) that they can't think straight

Joe Demko
March 23, 2010, 09:00 PM
The NEA exerts no control over individual teachers, union locals, local school boards, state-level unions, or state boards of education. It is a lobby at the federal level. The Feds have control over certain types of funding, primarily special ed and lunches, as well as some grants. Education is, as it always has been, controlled at the local and state levels. The things you would like to blame on the NEA are the fault of the school board members and state legislators you elected. Or failed to unseat. Or didn't care enough about to vote. Or run for the office yourself.
There's nothing stopping you guys from changing the course of public education, or even abolishing it entirely, since you find it so unsatisfactory. Nothing except that you aren't committed enough to do much of anything except carp it about on a board that isn't even devoted to the topic.
The things you are complaining about are things you could be changing.

ol' scratch
March 23, 2010, 10:50 PM
Unfortunately, kids don't have the right to uncensored freedom of speech and expression in schools. It is up to the school administrators. Check this out http://caselaw.lp.findlaw.com/scripts/getcase.pl?court=US&vol=484&invol=260

Teach your child to be a free thinker. You will be able to thwart any attempt to chain her mind. It sounds to me like she is on the right track.

Zoidberg523
March 24, 2010, 01:38 AM
transform us into a nation of multicultural socialists who will one day pledge allegiance to global authorities

At the risk of running into dangerous political waters.... *cough* Obama *cough* socialist *cough* ;)

At any rate, there certainly is cause for concern as far as our educational system is concerned - and great need for a resurgence in the importance of individuality and free thought.

Voimakas
March 24, 2010, 03:18 AM
Stories like this make me glad I take an active part in educating youth (through a firearms 4H camp.)

+1 to parents relying on video games, TV and the internet to raise their kids. School should supplement, not replace, any lessons learned at home.

As the eldest child of a primary ed teacher, I get to hear the teacher's point of view quite a bit. Mom isn't very pro-RKBA (but she's gotten better! Only a decade in the making...:D) but she does a firearm safety day in her classroom. She also complains constantly about idiotic administrators who override her decisions in her own classroom. For example: passing someone who shouldn't.

Obviously, I'm biased. I love my mom. But when I hear her and her colleagues complain about certain issues, it seems like it's the school administration and local school board policies that seem to cause most of the problems.

Then again, taken with a grain of salt, it could just be they're blaming someone else for an issue they have. Not all teachers were created equal in skill or temperament either so you'll run into idiots along with the excellent educators.

This whole thread just makes me really happy I had a vasectomy.

gdcpony
December 19, 2010, 01:03 PM
You ought to tell your kids to plead the fifth, they certainly can't get in trouble for saying nothing at all. Which is probably the only way you'll be able to not get in trouble if things keep going the way they are.
If they want silent kids, they will be expelling mine. I do not raise submissive children willing to give in to anything.

I have a policy of never telling my kids "because I said so." Sometimes I tell them I'll explain later, but I want them to ask, and feel they deserve to know. It is a policy I wish our government would employ more.


I agree with you up to the bloody hands - for 2 reasons.

1 - Blood COULD be dangerous, and the school would be justified in their actions based on that. They need to protect other students. It's biohazard.

2 - It weakens the rest of your argument.

Just my 2 cents. Good luck with this.

It might not have been the wisest, but as I stated before, it wasn't a deer she gutted. It was very little and she was told she was to go straight to the wash room. She just got intercepted. Funny that if hygene was their REAL concern she would have been told to wash and then go to the office, so I don't buy that reason. As I said, we did it out of pure rage that my girl was being harrassed for such a reason.

Please keep us informed. Inquiring minds want to know what happens next.

Well deer season is in. My oldest daughter is out today. One of my friends and my FIL are taking her out. I have heard nothing from the school yet about her discussing it since I have deployed.

I did have to call one time because a kid punched my younger daughter for not playing with him (boy hitting a girl!!!!!). The third time it happened she struck back with a leg sweep and walked away (witnessed by a teacher). They were going to suspend both of them despite having known of the other times he had hit her. I asked them if he was injured and they said no, but could have been. I simply said then don't let him hit her again and we won't have a problem. They backed off when told that we could see how the courts felt about it. My wife had been planning to call the police on the kid as it was since the school had done nothing. My daughter just took care of it first.

On a side note from that the boy hasn't hit her again for some reason.

writerinmo
December 19, 2010, 02:14 PM
GDCpony, first off let me tell you that you have my 100% support on what you did, are doing and are attempting to do with your children. Having raised three booger-heads of my own and two step-booger-heads, I can sympathize entirely with your concerns and day-to-day problems with the schools. I butted heads several times during my kids' school years and always won, simply because if I felt strongly enough about it to take action, I took it as far as it needed to go to take care of the problem to my satisfaction.

When I had problems with the public school system in California and saw the direction they were headed, I packed up my family and moved to a small farmtown in NE Kansas where I was born and raised. Class size ran very small, small enough that each kid got the individual attention needed. I think my son's graduating class was around 30 kids, lol!

My kids got spanked for breaking the rules, NOT BEAT... there is a big difference, and if you don't know it, you are part of the problem.

They all love shooting, we did a lot of it when they were younger, then got out of it for a number of years when their mother developed an attraction to alcohol that seemed to bring out a number of personalities that I deemed dangerous to allow firearms to be around. After selling off everything I could to pay for the divorce, I just recently started shooting again, and my youngest (daughter) 18 and middle (son) 25 are having a blast, and my daughter just asked about taking the Hunter Safety course so she could go deer hunting with me!

My kids don't do drugs, can hardly get them to have an occasional drink for the older boys, and none of them are criminal. My daughter tutored other kids in high school and earned a scholarship for the local college for doing so, where she is now studying early childhood development. I have no problems in telling them that I am proud of what they have done so far in their lives, which is another thing I think parents need to do more of. Instead of dwelling on the negative drama that goes on in kids lives today, they need to be there day and night with an impartial presence for whatever the kids need to talk to someone about. Imagine my daughter coming to me to talk about her female "problems" as she called them, or when she came to me and admitted that she had messed up and had sex with a boy who then had no more use for her? Sure, I wasn't happy about it, but at least she had the trust that she could come talk to me... something that not many kids have in their parents nowadays it seems.

It just makes her brothers mad that she is a better shot than they are is about it... so now they buy me ammo for all the holidays!

From one retired military to an active one... keep the faith, brother. While I may not support what the government is doing on many of these fronts, I back the soldiers doing their jobs 100%. You've laid the foundation in your kids and that cornerstone will stand the test of time. I'm sure you will come back to kids that are stronger and more confidant, growing in the stability and beliefs that you have instilled in them.

For those people who read this thread and haven't been there, done that... I really have to say maybe you should think a bit more before posting... but that's just one of "great benefits" of a forum, people who don't have a clue can still toss their comments into the pot.

orionengnr
December 19, 2010, 02:24 PM
Civil disobedience is part of the American fabric...used to be, anyway. I support you 110%, and I hope you continue.
I also think the advice on going to the school board (when you return, safely!) is very good.
From retired USN to active USMC, thank you for your service to our Country, against enemies foreign and domestic.
God bless you and yours.

gatopardo
December 19, 2010, 03:10 PM
I think is ridiculous the level of sensitivity the school system is imposing over our children, I know of cases about kids suspended for a year for a nail clipper, the kid just thought it a good idea to clip his nails in the bus, I mean c'mon.

Messenger Guard
December 19, 2010, 03:26 PM
A few years back my son was required to do a power point project that was themed "overcoming adversity". They wanted something MLKish I'm sure but my family has been indoctrinated with enough of that. I suggested telling the story of "Marsh" Williams, the man behind the short stroke piston system which would become the M1 Carbine. Williams did this while incarcerated. Jimmy Stewart portrays Williams in the film version. His project was picked to go to a county wide exhibit. :D

kmcintosh78
December 19, 2010, 03:36 PM
GDCPONY, Keep at it.
I too will never raise submissive children. The school is there to teach Reading, writing and arithmetic, that is it. If I wanted a teachers opinion I would ask. If they, or anyone who teaches does not like that, then find a new job.
I will teach my kids morals, ethics, right and wrong.
Schools and teachers stick to the above.

Keep at it. As my kids start school I anticipate the same kind of interactions as well and will report on them.

Old krow
December 19, 2010, 03:53 PM
At the risk of running into dangerous political waters....

This isn't something that exists on the left and not the right. Both sides are very guilty of taking away freedoms and pushing a progressive agenda. It's safe to assume that you have NO friends in politics and that the lesser of 2 evils is still, by definition, evil. If any politician is indeed THE Devil, it is likely a timeshare in Hell. Honestly, when is the last time we voted for someone because we liked them and not because they weren't as bad as the other guy?

Teach your child to be a free thinker. You will be able to thwart any attempt to chain her mind.

I am of the opinion that the entire NCLB Act teaches a child what to think instead of how to think. This opinion also covers my perception on just about anything the Government does. If they did it, it's probably breaking or broken. One could argue that the exception to that rule is war, but everything else is definitely broken.

gdcpony, I think it sucks that you have to be bothered with this, but I applaud your actions. Good luck to you and stay safe.

Joe Demko
December 19, 2010, 04:04 PM
You guys are a whole school year behind. In the time since this thread began, how many of you attended school board meetings? How many of you decided to run for the board? How many of you took the time to study the codes of conduct for your local school district? How many of you took the time to contact your state legislators about your concerns? How many of you supported campaigns for candidates who shared your vision for public education?
Now, how many of you just impotently ranted on internet boards like this one? Boards not dedicated to the topic, but where you could be assured of a lot of pats on the fanny from similarly apathetic (when it comes to meaningful action) people?

You have the educational system you want. You must, because you could change it, but you don't.

Spec ops Grunt
December 19, 2010, 04:10 PM
I think is ridiculous the level of sensitivity the school system is imposing over our children, I know of cases about kids suspended for a year for a nail clipper, the kid just thought it a good idea to clip his nails in the bus, I mean c'mon.


That sound's like a good way to cut farther down the nail than you wanted to. :uhoh:

K-Rod
December 19, 2010, 04:26 PM
"my kids principle is a koolaid drinker. shrine to obama . unions are the best thing that ever happened to america etc.she leaves me alone after i helped my kid do a paper on lincoln and slavery. it was a painful experience for her. other than that she runs a decent school. she does get a lil strained smile when i whistle dixie while i wait to get the kids.".........

I'm sorry but I don't care who you are, that's funny right there!!!

Waywatcher
December 19, 2010, 04:32 PM
My wife is a teacher at a public school, and based on her college experience with fellow soon-to-be teachers, I am not shocked or surprised.

Disappointing and sad.

Steve 48
December 19, 2010, 06:51 PM
The schools in Western Kansas sure don't try to teach that kind of crap. Why, because I am there boss.

Spec ops Grunt
December 20, 2010, 12:06 AM
The schools in Western Kansas sure don't try to teach that kind of crap. Why? Because I am their boss.


Fixed it for you. :neener:

doc2rn
December 20, 2010, 02:35 AM
rswartsell Join Date: March 4, 2008Location: Chicagoland

Nuff said

Your doin good gdcpony, keep 'em active and safe.

Varob
December 20, 2010, 07:25 AM
I remember going hunting for the first time when I was around 9 yr. old. Later that week at school, I drew a picture of the dear my dad had killed, using lots of red crayon. My picture was placed on the hallway wall right next to all the other pictures the class had drawn.

Things sure have changed a lot.

danprkr
December 20, 2010, 09:20 AM
There's nothing stopping you guys from changing the course of public education, or even abolishing it entirely, since you find it so unsatisfactory. Nothing except that you aren't committed enough to do much of anything except carp it about on a board that isn't even devoted to the topic.
The things you are complaining about are things you could be changing.

Agree. If we'd run for school board, and run the politically correct idiots out the problem would fix itself.

A.H. Fox
December 20, 2010, 09:42 AM
Folks complaining about the school system, PC BS....with poor grammar....too funny.:banghead:

Sam1911
December 20, 2010, 10:38 AM
Probably should become an Activism thread: "How to Become A Member of Your Local School Board."

Then we're really doing something.

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