Pawn shop pre-64 M70 -- price?


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ArmedBear
April 8, 2010, 12:05 PM
It's all original, with the steel buttplate and all. Rear sight is missing, has a one-piece scope mount with an old Weaver variable that has an eyepiece shaped like an old TV screen. Honest wear, much of the bluing is rubbed bare, but it's shiny and I don't recall seeing any rust.

AFAIK it was made in 1951. It's VERY smooth. .30-06.

They want 800 bucks. I've seen some pretty rough examples of pre-64 actions for close to that, in crappy modern plastic stocks.

Thoughts?

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sarduy
April 8, 2010, 12:08 PM
walk away

Carter
April 8, 2010, 12:11 PM
Unless you're a serious collector I really don't see why you'd bother.

X-Rap
April 8, 2010, 12:14 PM
Considering its a pawn shop gun I'd go $500. If they don't like it walk away.
I do like those old Micro-Trac scopes though.

ArmedBear
April 8, 2010, 12:45 PM
I have a recent 70 that I like, and most pre-64s do nothing for me, in part because they're not as nice as a new Model 70, due to wear and tear, oxidation in the action, I don't know what.

This is probably the smoothest bolt action I have ever felt, though. That's really the appeal.

So, why "walk away"? The price? Bedding issues? Something else?

RSVP2RIP
April 8, 2010, 01:04 PM
Price is a little on the high side and it's about 8-9 years before they really got nice. You could lap the raceway of your current M70 and get it just as smooth. The new ones are an improvement from a design standpoint: one piece bottom metal, anti-bind cut in lug, tighter machining specs...but they seldom have the fit and finish of a pre-64, and thats the appeal. FWIW, I've found that most pre-64's are more accurate than current examples, but I've not shot all that many.

ArmedBear
April 8, 2010, 01:07 PM
My current example shoots 3 shots into just over a 1/2" at 100 yards, so that's good enough. (It's a South Carolina gun.) My bolt is almost as smooth. The safety on the old gun is much slicker and quieter, though.

Okay, 800 bucks for the safety is probably a bit steep.:D

joed
April 8, 2010, 01:08 PM
I'd rather have a newer 70 than a pre 64 at that price. Had it been me I would have laughed at the price and then walked out.

SlamFire1
April 8, 2010, 01:09 PM
I don't see any reason to spend that much for a pre 64 when you can buy a new Super Grade M70 for the same.

There are some real limitations in owning a pre 64. Parts availability is a huge obstacle. You bust a firing pin and you will have a problem. My cocking piece nose broke on my pre 64 target rifle. I had purchased an unfitted firing pin from Wisner’s gun parts so I had a spare. But old man Wisner retired and the Son has discontinued M70 bolts, firing pins, bolt shrouds. You bust one of these and you will have to buy an old action for parts. That is not cheap. Classic bolt shrouds will not interchange with pre64. FN shrouds will not interchange. Neither will bolts. You can buy a Tubb cocking piece nose.. That part will break on all M70’s.

Incidentally, old parts were file to fit. If the part was filed small, you are going to have fun making it bigger.

The pre 64 was a great action. I really like the machined in feed lips, the clip slots on pre war actions. But the latest FN actions show better machining.

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v479/SlamFire/M70%20pics/M70boltfulllengthDSCN7712.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v479/SlamFire/M70%20pics/ReducedM70firingpinoutbesidenoseDSC.jpg.

ArmedBear
April 8, 2010, 01:12 PM
Yeah... Maybe I can smooth out the safety on my FN gun instead.:)

Thanks, all.

RSVP2RIP
April 8, 2010, 01:16 PM
I'd not pay over $500 and then thats a little rich for a gun that was likley used a lot. An unaltered action in good condition is worth $500. Unless you have to have a M70 action for a custom gun (I'd go with a Dakota action), pass it up. To have all the bluing worn off an not have rust means it either went in and out of a case a lot or he spilled Coke on it.

X-Rap
April 8, 2010, 01:38 PM
AB when I said walk away I ment that I wouldn't go over 500. That is a fair price for a pre 64 if a guy really wants one and its in decent shape.
I feel pretty good to get into a Ruger or newer Rem, Win for 350 to 450 with a decent scope and don't really get excited about the pre 64 thing since I don't collect them.
If I can't buy for my price I usually pass or wait till next time in that store.

RP88
April 8, 2010, 01:47 PM
not worth it. $600 max, and only for the sake of collecting over function. I've seen some go off gunbroker for about $600-650; so for a gun that has changed even more hands in the civilian market, it shouldn't command that much IMO

ArmedBear
April 8, 2010, 02:46 PM
Thank you again, and especially for the picture and all the detail about the action, SlamFire1. I will feel good about paying for a new Sporter or Featherweight, now.:)

RSVP2RIP, it's not all worn off; just a fair amount. It's definitely wear, maybe from a case. Like you said, though, might as well get a new action for a custom rifle, if that's what I do with it, and for any other use, a new M70 Sporter is objectively nicer, and cheaper (the old scope doesn't really even factor in, for me, since I'd replace it -- the image is clear, but from looking through it, the light transmission of a modern scope with new coating technology is better).

How do you lap the raceways, especially without rounding off anything that you don't want to round off?

X-Rap, yeah, I was thinking about the gun as a rifle to use, not to collect, though I would be willing to pay a bit for a particularly good CRF rifle. Pre-64 doesn't matter to me, but the quality of the action does. It sounds like I'd be better off with another FN Model 70.

Thanks again. Sometimes I just want to make sure I'm not passing something up...

Kman
April 8, 2010, 11:27 PM
your not missing anything, an 06 pre70 for $800?? It had better have the original box!

Gordon
April 9, 2010, 01:54 AM
The 51 thru 54 Model 70s are considered by us affectionados as the prime years. They are the later non transition safeties with the solid bolt knob. The scope and mont are worth less than $100 prolly. If the finish is worn down to 50% then $600 would not be out of line if mechanically not worn (barrel ect.) You can find a rear sight easily enough for $25.The stock on the gun if uncracked and half way good is worth $250+.
If the barrel is good the rifle could (and SHOULD) be carefully refinished and any African Pro would pay well for it. The coned breech and mauser claw extractor with the improved ejector design makes it better than any action less than $2500 made today. Pride in craftmanship comes at a high cost today!

RSVP2RIP
April 9, 2010, 09:27 AM
How do you lap the raceways, especially without rounding off anything that you don't want to round off?


Midway used to sell a tool for it #589-946 but I don't see it on their website. You can also use a piece of wood sized to fit the raceway wrapped with emery cloth.

http://www.howcast.com/videos/206978-Bolt-Raceway-Polishing

Shows you the Wheeler tool again, maybe you can find one used?

earlthegoat2
April 9, 2010, 10:40 AM
Given a choice between the two I would take the FN M70 every time. There is a lot of hype and very little real world evidence regarding the pre-'64s and comparing them to ANY post '64.

Purists (psychos) and collectors are the only ones who would prefer them over newer models. Of course there are some out there who will use them for nostalgic reasons or because it was passed down to them and that is fine but I do not see a reason to get a pre 64 unless the price is great.

Offfhand
April 10, 2010, 07:32 PM
Post from above post:

"Purists (psychos)"

That is not a way to describe someone who appreciates well made firearms. Perhaps an apology is in order?

earlthegoat2
April 10, 2010, 08:07 PM
Just take a look at a new FN M70 and tell me which one is better made.

WYcoyote
April 10, 2010, 10:35 PM
not worth it. $600 max, and only for the sake of collecting over function. I've seen some go off gunbroker for about $600-650; so for a gun that has changed even more hands in the civilian market, it shouldn't command that much IMO
Yup, me too. $600 tops. To get $800 it better not have anything missing and have most of the blueing.

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