Beware Intuit/Quickbooks

I recently applied for a merchant account (credit card processing) for my new gun store with Intuit...the makers of Quickbooks accounting software and many other business products.

My merchant account was denied. Here is the email I received in explaining the denial of my merchant account:

http://i625.photobucket.com/albums/tt337/baileyguns/Intuitsignup-banner.gif
Thank you for applying for Intuit QuickBooks Merchant Service. After careful review, we regret to inform you that your application for a merchant account has been declined because we do not support the services or products you offer.

If you have further questions, please contact Underwriting, Intuit Payment Solutions, 21215 Burbank Boulevard, Suite 100, Woodland Hills, CA 91367.

They don't support the "products and services" I offer? I sell guns. I sell gun stuff...and ammunition. The people I sell to subject themselves to state and federal background checks to pursue a hobby that is protected by the Constitution. My business is licensed by the federal government. But Intuit doesn't support my products and services.

Now, I thought for a moment they meant they somehow couldn't physically support the activity I was trying to conduct. But that can't be it because when a credit card is swiped for a gun purchase it's no different than the credit card transaction that's conducted when one buys a pair of shoes.

No...Intuit doesn't support guns and gun stuff. It's very clear because they asked in the application what products I would be offering for sale.

I hope you consider this the next time you think about buying an Intuit/QuickBooks product.

Intuit/QuickBooks is an anti-gun, anti-freedom, anti-Constitution and anti-American company. And that's ironic because I've been in the gun business for 10 years and they've never had a problem accepting my money for other products and services I've purchased that supported that gun business.

I have heard this said of a couple different companies.
Intuit is on my NO-GO list.
I wish you great luck finding a card company.
I shouldn't be too difficult.

Hmmm, thats what I use for my accounting program as well ... but wasn't planning on using them for merchant services.
GunPal has a merchant service program, "virtual terminal", that I thought looked very interesting.

I don't sell assault rifles, AK47's, AR15's or Glocks.:what::eek::what::eek:

I sell SPORTING GOODS because it don't scare the wimenfolk.:D

***not to hijack your thread....but the Dallas Morning News refuses to run ads for "gun shows". They have no problem with "outdoor & hunting shows".
They also have no problem with selling ads to Bachman Pawn with real pics of guns in the ad. Go figure.

Intuit also makes the popular TurboTax line of income tax software.

Because of this thread I won't be using it anymore. :fire:

Those that feel the same way should consider H&R Block as an alternative.

That's strange- Intuit accepted our application for a merchant account over two years ago, which included disclosing that we sell NFA items.

When I was shopping around at that time, every merchant service would freak out if the phrase "sell guns on the internet" was uttered. As an FFL, you're only selling guns to people in person at the shop, or business-to-business billing interstate, remember?

The NRA Business Alliance http://www.nraba.org/benefits.aspx has lined up a credit card processing service specifically for gun businesses. If that had been in existence when I set ours up, I would have gone that route then.

Intuit/QuickBooks is an anti-gun, anti-freedom, anti-Constitution and anti-American company.

I think you have a terrible understanding of freedom, the Constitution and America. Nowhere in the 2nd Amendment does it say they have to do business with gun related businesses. They are exercising their freedom by not doing business with you.

You can not like them and I don't want to support them due their point of view, but drop the Fox News style argument about them being anti-American.

Oh...yessir, Ninja.

I'll get right on that. Thanks for the lesson. Yawn.

You're making an assumption that it's because you sell firearms or firearms related products. You should ask them in writing and get a written response.

They are exercising their freedom by not doing business with you.

And advertising their opposition to the 2nd amendment (if that was the reasoning).

but drop the Fox News style argument about them being anti-American.

I guess he was exercising his freedom.

I think you have a terrible understanding of freedom, the Constitution and America.

I don't believe anywhere the OP stated that the merchant in this Business to Business service is legally bound to serve him, he simply stated that they declined to serve him based on his chosen product line.

From that information we can presume that the general consensus of the Board of Directors, voting shareholders, or Policy Making CEO's are against ownership of firearms by the general populace based on their decision not to deal with individuals involved in the business of firearm sales.

So in the end I think the OP is saying "look this company is anti-gun, maybe we shouldn't support them. Let's use the capitalist American economy to our advantage and take our dollars elsewhere."

Thank you for trolling, try again.

Hang in there Bailey. Look at it this way; you don't want to do business with guys like that anyway. Now that they've tipped their hand, now that you know, and now that we know, they will not be making some of the money they would have, had they not taken up that position. No TurboTax, no Quickbooks, nothing that says Intuit will ever earn my money if I know about it.

Sometime back there was a big go-around when a card processing outfit that was part of the Citi Bank empire dropped CDNN Sports in Texas because this New York based company didn't like the idea of selling guns through catalog or Internet advertising. Both the NSSF and NRA ended up tieing a tin can on their tail.

Anyway the email they sent seems clear enough, so I won't be buying any of Intuit's software until I know - one way or the other.

Of course they have a right to reject any potential client over what the kind of business they do. But as a consumer I have the same right.

Bailey Guns is licensed by the United States Government to sell firearms. His business is a legal one. That should be enough to satisfy any credit card processor.

Plenty of fish in the sea. Hope this gets around, if it hit's them in the pocket, "hard enough" they will change their policy. Bad business decisions in a poor economic climate, are looked down upon by the board of directors, who are only interested in the bottom line. If it affected me, I would write a letter to the board.

Bailey Guns,

If I were you I'd contact Intuit headquarters and make sure that this is actually in line with their corporate policy. You could have simply come in contact with an overzealous employee who felt a need to interject his or her personal/political feelings into your situation.

http://about.intuit.com/contact/

What, exactly, did you tell them?

Have you asked what their policy is?

I'm perfectly happy to make sure I don't support them, but only if I have better information.

I recently read that Chase will not establish merchant accounts with those in the gun business and if anyone has more information on that please share it. I have a Chase checking account with Visa chech card (I WILL NOT use the trem debit!!) which I use only for internet purchases 90% of which are for guns, gun parts and accessories, reloading components and other firearm related stuff. I plan on contacting them to find out if this is true and if it is I will need to close my account because they surely would not want to deal with a scum bag like me! I respect the right of a merchant to chose whom they do business with but I also have the same right. Everyday we vote with dollars and I want my dollars to go to businesses who support the second ammendment when ever possible. I also wish to deny money to those who don't.

I use a World's Foremost Bank credit card for all transactions that will take a credit card, and pay it off at the end of the month... A while ago, they upgraded us to "Signature" cards.:D One can arm him/herself, with the "points".

You're making an assumption that it's because you sell firearms or firearms related products. You should ask them in writing and get a written response.

Ditto.

In addition I have a buddy that works for them. I have forwarded him the link to this thread. I don't actually think he's high enough up the totem pole to force a change, but who knows?

We use First National Bank Omaha for merchant services. They are gun-friendly and handle both Brownell's and the NRA provider mentioned above.

The GunPal option also looks interesting, will have to look at how the monthly fees break down between the two.

Intuit uses Chase to process payments. They do not support gun sales, and if they find out, will close your account.

just an FYI.

Intuit uses Chase to process payments. They do not support gun sales, and if they find out, will close your account.

Can anyone shed light on this besides Internet rumors?

Corporate policy link, perhaps? Anything substantive?

If it's true, I will act accordingly. However, before I do something like tell a phone solicitor to do something painful and obscene, I want to make sure I have accurate information.

Try Imax Bankcard Network.

Hi, I work at QuickBooks Merchant Service as the Director of Marketing. We actually do accept gun stores that are processing transactions face to face. We do not accept gun stores that are transacting business over the web. If you have any questions please contact QuickBooks Merchant Services and apply, but make sure you note that your processing will be face to face.

We do not accept gun stores that are transacting business over the web.

Why? What concerns does your company have, if all applicable laws are being followed? Inquiring minds (who are responsible for a lot of currency transactions) want to know.

You're making an assumption that it's because you sell firearms or firearms related products. You should ask them in writing and get a written response.

They clearly stated they don't support the products or services I offer. I don't think it's much of an assumption to conclude they don't support guns and gun stuff. That's what I sell. That's what I told them I sell ("Firearms and shooting sports related products" is how I worded it on the application).

And bigalexe is correct. I understand they can choose to open an account or not based on their company policies. Apparently their company policy is not to support businesses engaged in sales of firearms.

I, too, have the freedom to support or not support companies that don't support those things in which I believe. So contrary to the woefully wrong and ignorant statements of another poster that I don't understand freedom, the Constitution or America, the opposite is actually true. I do understand. That's why I've chosen to exercise my freedom to have an opinion and voice that opinion. I've done nothing more than they've done. We each, apparently, are exercising our rights.

I want people to know, especially gun-loving people, that Intuit has an openly anti-gun policy. They don't support the "products and services" I sell. Products which, by the way, are protected by the 2nd Amendment to the Constitution. Is it much of a stretch to conclude they are anti-2nd Amendment? I think not. In my opinion, not supporting constitutionally protected rights is anti-American. Whether others share that opinion is up to them.

And I have sent a letter to the company asking for clarification on the policy. However it's lengthy. If I get a response I will post it here.

Hi, I work at QuickBooks Merchant Service as the Director of Marketing. We actually do accept gun stores that are processing transactions face to face. We do not accept gun stores that are transacting business over the web. If you have any questions please contact QuickBooks Merchant Services and apply, but make sure you note that your processing will be face to face.

Uummm...I stated on the application that 90% of transactions would be FTF, over the counter. I estimated 10% would be phone orders or internet orders. That's because people often buy small parts and accessories and want them shipped to them.

And what is the rational behind not accepting phone or internet payments for firearms? That's a ridiculous policy and serves no purpose. The gun must be shipped by the seller to a dealer. The buyer then goes through the entire process of presenting valid, state-issued identification and subjecting themselves to a state and/or federal background check.

Does someone who buys flowers over the phone/internet have to do that? Of course not.

If you work for QuickBooks you might want to bring this thread up to your managers. And I'm getting the same response from other forums where this has been posted. It's not limited to this forum. Apparently there are a lot of people unhappy with your company's policies and obvious anti-gun stance. Why would I receive an email from your company stating the company does not support the "products and services" I sell? From where I sit, there's only one reason.

My next question: Can I return my copy of QB2010 to Intuit for a refund since they really don't support the products and services I sell? I'd hate for Intuit to know they've got a copy of QB2010 floating around out there that's facilitating gun sales.

Thought so! This is the Ctit / CDNN Sports thing all over again, and for the same reason. These #%!! credit card processors cannot get it through their heads that Internet Sales are dealer> dealer> buyer, not dealer to buyer direct through the Internet - and the process is fully approved by the BATF&E.

A simple request for information sent either to the BATF&E or NSSF would quickly straighten them out.

Until they do Intuit deserves zero business from us.

We use Payment Alliance (http://www.paymentallianceintl.com/) and they are very gun friendly, being the NRA endorsed folks. They set us up through HSBC and EprocessingNetwork.

We use Chase for our actual banking, they handle everything else.

I work in the processing industry. I have helped several gun shops get processing.

2 months ago I had to help out my local gun shop. Their old processor was going to shut them down if they did any more internet sales.

I hooked them up with a gun sale friendly processor. All is well now.

PM me or call me at 330-507-2687 & I will help out anyone having these problems or wants lower processing rates.

Finding a card company for your gun business shouldn't be a major issue. Finding a card company that doesn't want a pound of flesh for each transaction will be the trick, especially after the financial debacle over the past 18 months. Some card companies want to see your business volume before cutting you any slack. I went to cash, or personal checks only for my business. I've lost very few jobs as a result of avoiding the plastic vampires. :what: Good luck. I still use QuickBook Pro for my business. The software works.

These days I don't know of any gun stores that don't transact business over the web in some fashion.

Hi, I work at QuickBooks Merchant Service as the Director of Marketing. We actually do accept gun stores that are processing transactions face to face. We do not accept gun stores that are transacting business over the web. If you have any questions please contact QuickBooks Merchant Services and apply, but make sure you note that your processing will be face to face.

Are you aware that online firearms transactions have to be completed face-to-face with a federally licensed firearms dealer? The seller who accepts and processes the credit card ships the firearms to said dealer, who will verify the buyer's identity in person and conduct the background check before releasing the gun to him/her.

If you were aware of this, what then is your rationale for not accepting such businesses? Is it your company's position that the federal laws regulating commerce in firearms are too lax? If so, please say so, so that potential customers may make an informed decision about whether they intend to continue to do business with your company.

And if you were not aware of it, when might we expect that your policy will change?

UPDATE: I just received a phone call from Intuit.

I requested I be able to return the QB 2010 product I purchased a few months ago. To my surprise, and to Intuit's credit, the gentleman who called said pack it up and return it and Intuit would refund my purchase price.

It'll be in the mail today.

And contrary to what sblum100 wrote in post #24, the person I spoke with today confirmed Intuit doesn't knowingly accept merchant applications from gun stores. He said that is the underwriter's policy.

I suppose I could've been dishonest on my merchant account application and said I was in the sporting goods business...but that's not the way I operate.

I'm sure there's a credit card processor who'd like my business - I'm applying with the NRA endorsed processor today. I just liked the convenience of the Intuit product despite their somewhat higher fees. But I don't like them enough to support their openly anti-gun policies.

I'll be looking for another accounting software product as well. I'll do the research beforehand in an attempt to avoid this sort of situation the second time around.

Bailey Guns:...I suppose I could've been dishonest on my merchant account application and said I was in the sporting goods business...but that's not the way I operate.

Let me get this straight.... Academy, WalMart, Dick's, Sports Authority, Cabela's, Gander Mountain and thousands of "mom & pop" sporting goods stores- like ME, are being dishonest?

Your statement offends me and every other FFL who chooses to sell guns AND other sporting goods. Shame on you.

Guns, by the way, ARE sporting goods. You should know that.




.

Don't get your panties in a twist, tom. If you'd read my other posts in this thread you'd understand (or maybe you wouldn't) I meant I didn't want to deliberately deceive anyone on the application as to what I sell. No need for the lecture. I've been in the business for years and guns/ammo accounts for 99% of my sales. I don't sell anything - in terms of sporting goods - that's not related to guns. If I sell guns I shouldn't have to sugar coat it by calling it something else.

Get over yourself, dude.

Bailey Guns Don't get your panties in a twist, tom. I meant I didn't want to deliberately deceive anyone on the application. No need for the lecture. I've been in the business for years and guns/ammo accounts for 99% of my sales. I don't sell anything - in terms of sporting goods - that's not related to guns.

Get over yourself, dude.

You just don't get it. And now you repeat the lunacy.

Guns ARE sporting goods. Period. You aren't deceiving, being dishonest or lying by calling your business a sporting goods business.

Get over myself? Please. You made a statement that calls me and others out as dishonest, and in the last post, as being deliberately deceptive on credit processing applications.

That sir, is offensive.

Okay, well if he used the terms 'sporting goods', he'd probably not have been denied. But he told them that he sold guns, and he was denied because of that. IMHO, using the terms that are less offensive to the processing company IS a manner of sugar coating, and I'm not trying to call anyone dishonest.
Sure, guns = sporting goods, but obviously the processing company doesn't seem to agree with that. They would prefer to do business with sporting goods dealers, but they will not do business with gun dealers.

I shouldn't have to sugar coat it by calling it something else.
Bingo^^^

Lets all be friends now lol yes guns are a sporting goods, But if I sold 99% guns and ammo Id WANT to call my store Coltons Guns and ammo! The fact that I might have to skew the name into something its not just to appease some corporation makes me sick to my stomach. Academy sells guns and ammo..... and baseball cleats, BBQ grills, boat anchors, ladies underwear, eco friendly water bottles, golf clubs, back to school back packs, oh and chewing gum.

They cannot call Academy a gun store it be a bold face lie. And somebody selling guns and ammo shouldn't have to call there gun store (if i may) Baileys sports and outdoors

Some poor lady might come in and ask where the running bras were??? LOL

using the terms that are less offensive to the processing company IS a manner of sugar coating

All in the interest of not violating someone's constitutional right to not be offended (I think it's in there somewhere towards the back).

My Grandfather once told me, "Son, you have choose to be offended."

:banghead::banghead::banghead:

But if I sold 99% guns and ammo Id WANT to call my store Coltons Guns and ammo!

No one asked him to change the name of his store.

using the terms that are less offensive to the processing company IS a manner of sugar coating,

Which is why even large volume dealers such as Bud's Gun Shop.com use Bud's or Bud's Police Supply to run their transactions.

Feel free to stand your ground while you continue to get turned down for credit servicing, be it loans or processing. If you want competitive rates you need to have as many options as possible. Nothing in the Second Amendment requires a bank to extend you credit or cc processing. That's their business decision.

MANY businesses run cc processing through a different name than their actual storefront. They do it NOT to be dishonest, but because they may have several businesses owned or operated by the same corporation. Use a cc at a bar, restaurant, or gas station you may not see "Bob's Bar & Grill" or "Stop & Rob #7" on the receipt, but something innocuous like ATF Enterprises, Inc. :)

Yes, it is a game. You can either be stubborn and lose or you can have a business structure that allows you to win.

It's unclear how a thread informing us of a gun business opposed supplier has turned into a flame the original poster thread, but I'm thinking that's not very high road. And, my standards aren't nearly what the mods seem to have so why don't we back off, and focus on Intuit lest we wind up locked?

Just a thought.

OK...you're offended and your feelings are hurt. So what?

dogtown tom, I think you're the one that doesn't get it.

Let's get something straight. I've never been denied by a processor before. I've always had very competitive merchant rates. I recently started a new gun business. Initially I was using GunPal for gun transactions because due to the low volume, the higher rate averaged out since I didn't have to pay monthly fees of various sorts. Especially, since many transactions were from online sales the higher GunPal rate wasn't much higher than most other processors when you consider they don't diferentiate between "Qualified, mid-qualified", etc....

The only reason I applied for the Intuit merchant account is because of convenience and certain incentives they were offering. I know there are cheaper/better processing companies out there. But the Intuit account would've been a good fit for me at this particular time.

But here's the point that seems to be lost on you:

If I sell soccer balls, why should I have to put on the merchant application that I sell "sporting goods"? Why shouldn't I put down, "I sell soccer balls,"?

And if I sell guns, why should I have to put on the merchant application that I sell "sporting goods"? Why not just put down on the app that I sell "guns"?

Because I don't sell anything else other than guns/ammo/gun stuff. Mostly guns. Some ammo. Very, very little of anything else.

Anyone who walks into my shop or visits my website is going to conclude I own a GUN STORE. Very few are going to conclude I own a SPORTING GOODS store.

Furthermore, this isn't about YOU. I never called you or anyone else dishonest. I said I didn't want to be dishonest on MY application...not yours. I don't feel that describing my shop as a sporting goods store accurately depicts what it is. Regardless of whether or not guns are classified as sporting goods. And why do you have a problem with how I describe my store?

I'm sure I can find many other processors with competitive rates that will be more than happy to service my GUN business. Your ridiculous comments about being turned down for credit processing notwithstanding. At my previous gun store, "Bailey Guns, Inc.", I averaged about $30k per month in CC transactions. Not nearly as much per month as some, more than some others. No credit card processor I ever used gave a rat's a$$ that I was selling guns or that my company name had the word "guns" in it or that my receipts said "Bailey Guns". So I think your assertion that it's better to have some innocuous sounding name exists only in your fantasy world.

In my opinion, calling my business something it isn't in order to appease an anti-gun corporation is a slap in the face to gun owners. You apparently don't share that sentiment.

Bailey Guns:.. I never called you or anyone else dishonest.


Bailey Guns:...I suppose I could've been dishonest on my merchant account application and said I was in the sporting goods business...but that's not the way I operate.

You state using "sporting goods business" on a merchant account application is dishonest for a gun dealer.

Bailey Guns:...In my opinion, calling my business something it isn't in order to appease an anti-gun corporation is a slap in the face to gun owners. You apparently don't share that sentiment.

"Slap in the face to gun owners"? Dramatic, but not accurate. You came on here and cried about evil Intuit denying your processing application because you are a gun store. I gave you a simple answer to avoid getting denied. Instead you call it dishonest and deceptive to use "sporting goods" instead of "gun store". While you may think it is to "appease" them, it's not. It is so gun dealers can get merchant accounts. Simple as that.

Like it or not you ARE in the sporting goods business. Hunting and fishing equipment make up a huge percentage of sporting goods sales.
If all you sold was fishing rods, you are in the sporting goods business.
If all you sold were soccer balls, you are in the sporting goods business.

Good luck with your business.

I am temporarily locking this thread so the two antagonistic parties can cool down.

If there is more information forthcoming on Intuit's policy, a mod can re-open this thread.