Kahr CW9 vs. Taurus pt709


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Holgersen
May 5, 2010, 04:09 PM
I'm looking to get a new pistol. I've been carrying a Bersa Thunder CC .380 now since it's been getting hot in my neck of the woods, but I always feel bad leaving my .45 or 9mm at home. So I've been looking for something that packs more of a punch but is small.

I've been looking at the Kahr CW9. I'd love to get a PM9 or P9 but they are way out of my price range. I was at the gun shop today and looked at the Taurus pt709 and thought it felt pretty good. They seem about the same size. I think the CW9 is a little lighter.

Any thoughts? I'm leaning toward the Kahr. I've always looked at Taurus as an option but their bad reviews always scared me away.

(Also don't tell me to change my wardrobe. I carried my block of a .45 all last summer and sweated like a pig trying to conceal it properly. I'm determined to stay comfortable this year.)

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jfrey
May 5, 2010, 04:21 PM
The CW9 is a great pistol, especially for those of us who live in the warmer section of the country. It is light, accurate and easy to conceal. The CW9 is basically a P9 without the fancy window dressing. I actually prefer it to the P9. Go with the Kahr instead of the Taurus. You will be happier in the long run. I'm not bashing the Taurus, I have them too, but the Kahr is a better pistol in my opinion.

dp509
May 5, 2010, 04:26 PM
I agee, go with the Kahr. You will love it. I sold mine only to upgrade.

I have holsters if you are left handed IWB and Paddle.

Ben86
May 5, 2010, 05:02 PM
I say get the kahr, I wish I had. I bought the 709 before I knew the CW9 existed. The 709 is a great gun an all, but I like the look and feel of the Kahr better. I really appreciate the fact that it has a full grip, but is about the same size as the 709. Considering that they are about the same price I wish I had done better homework.

wild cat mccane
May 5, 2010, 05:43 PM
OP keep in mind Tauras has a lifetime warranty of the gun.

Kahr has a 5 year warranty to original owner.

Insert personal experience horror stories regardless of these FACTS:

oasis618
May 5, 2010, 05:57 PM
I have fairly large hands and I prefer the way the Kahr feels over the Taurus. Taurus does offer a better warranty but there are those who will argue how often that warranty will need to be used. I've personally never owned a Taurus so I won't speculate their reliablity vs. Kahr.

rygould
May 5, 2010, 06:05 PM
I don't have the CW9, but I carry the CW40. Have been nothing but THRILLED with it.

Not a single hiccup, and it's a fair price for a basic handgun from a reputable manufacture.

A couple things to be aware of with the Karhs. While the gun is a decent price, factory mags are expensive for what they are, and they aren't much. Not the nicest quality mags I have seen by a long shot. Also it will require a break in period that the manufacture suggests. Something around 200+ rounds. A lot of people have FTE, FTF problems during the break in period, but they tend to run smooth after they loosen up a bit.

Personally, even through the break in period, mine never had a single problem. It was a little uncomfortable to shoot because the checkering is a bit aggressive, and it would rub on the web of my hand between the thumb and index finger. After putting a handall Jr. from Houge on the grip, it is much easier to hold and comfortably put a couple boxes down range with, but YMMV.

The CW series is very light, very slim, and durable. Mine still looks new and it's been around the block a few times. The size has been perfect for me and it forget I'm carrying most days. It's definitely a gun I would trust my life to, and do. It's the cheapest gun I have, and the one I carry the most often. I'd say it's a winner overall!

RyanM
May 5, 2010, 06:17 PM
Kahr has a 5 year warranty to original owner.

Insert personal experience horror stories regardless of these FACTS:

Kahr sent me a free mag for a 10 year old gun that I bought used, that was having some problems (turned out to not be mag related and was easily fixed, though). A friend of mine had his gun repaired for just the cost of shipping to them (they footed the shipping back), that he bought used, though I think it was younger than 5 years.

There's sometimes a difference between a company's warranty on paper, and the real warranty.

tfields
May 5, 2010, 06:28 PM
my wife carries a cw9 she loves it!! dont know about the 709 but i'd go with the cw9!

gofastman
May 5, 2010, 06:52 PM
I think the 709 looks very appealing, except for the fact you cant shoot +p ammo out of it. That alone means the 709 isn't an option for me.
Just my .02

lions
May 5, 2010, 06:58 PM
I looked at both, went with the CW9, never looked back.

Ala Dan
May 5, 2010, 08:12 PM
I own the Kahr CW-9 [9m/m semi-auto]; (can't say that for the Tauri 709),
and its been 100% reliable from day one, with all types of ammo. Its very
easy to keep a full magazine in an 8" pie plate from 15 yards out; as this
little weapon has excellent sights~! :scrutiny: ;) :D

tackleberry45
May 5, 2010, 08:55 PM
Owned both. Sold 709. Kept Kahr CW9. EXCELLENT light casual dress carry gun.

oldgoat46
May 5, 2010, 09:11 PM
I own a couple of Taurus pistols. I have two Kahrs. I don't think you can compare the two. the Kahr is way way above the Taurus in quality, feel, and function.

mongo4567
May 5, 2010, 09:20 PM
I have a PM40 and love it. I've sold the few Taurus pistols I've owned over time...never been pleased with them.

DeepSouth
May 5, 2010, 09:23 PM
Get the KAHR

Ed4032
May 5, 2010, 10:14 PM
I have both. I still can't decide. I go back and forth when carrying. I favor the CW grip. But I LOVE the 709 trigger. The 709 is more accurate because of the trigger. Either one is a great choice.

Holgersen
May 5, 2010, 10:20 PM
I think I've made my decision. I'm going with the Kahr. I found some reviews of the 709 and they didn't look good. It's basically what has kept me away from Taurus in the past. There are always as many horror stories as there are people that are happy. Thanks for the input everyone.

MCgunner
May 5, 2010, 10:32 PM
I think I've made my decision. I'm going with the Kahr. I found some reviews of the 709 and they didn't look good. It's basically what has kept me away from Taurus in the past. There are always as many horror stories as there are people that are happy. Thanks for the input everyone.

Glad I don't scare so easily. I'd never have owned three of the best DA revolvers I've ever owned if I disregarded Taurus.

I wouldn't want a gun not rated for +P, though. I'm quite happy with my Kel Tec and carry +P. Don't need either CW9 OR PT709. I'm sure they're both good guns, though. Just that I bought my P11 14 years ago before either the CW9 or PT709 were dreamed of and my P11 ain't broke, so I won't fix it. :D Customer service is great and warranty is lifetime.

Defense Minister
May 5, 2010, 11:07 PM
Of the two, based on the mixed reviews I've read about the Taurus, I'd go with the Kahr. I do, however, think you owe it to yourself to consider the Kel-Tec PF-9. Mine has been 100% through 500+rounds, as was my P-11, and it will handle +p ammo fine if it's not a steady diet. Just make sure you keep the extractor spring screw tight.;)

Mastiff
May 7, 2010, 12:56 AM
Taurus claims all their handguns are +P rated in their catalog. http://www.taurususa.com/2009catalog/?catalog_page=2

Ben86
May 7, 2010, 01:03 AM
On the second page of their catalog (mid right hand corner) it says that all taurus handguns are rated for a "steady diet" of +P ammo. http://www.taurususa.com/2010catalog/?catalog_page=2

I'm not sure why people say otherwise. I've run some hot stuff through mine without any problems.

The Bushmaster
May 7, 2010, 10:15 AM
Let's see here...We are talking about a Kahr or a Taurus. Right? The delema is which junk gun I want to trust my life with. Right?

I really don't see the problem here. Check out other manufacturers of quality firearms first.

gofastman
May 7, 2010, 02:31 PM
Call up Taurus. they will tell you very clearly the 709 is NOT rated for +p ammo, despite what their catalog says. :banghead:

Snowdog
May 7, 2010, 03:53 PM
Let's see here...We are talking about a Kahr or a Taurus. Right? The delema is which junk gun I want to trust my life with. Right?

:rolleyes: Oh boy, there's the stuff.

Then again, over the years I've heard people refer to just about everything as "junk", so what's new.

Steve 48
May 7, 2010, 07:25 PM
Get the Kahr!! Its accurate and easy to carry concealed.

Ben86
May 7, 2010, 09:41 PM
Call up Taurus. they will tell you very clearly the 709 is NOT rated for +p ammo, despite what their catalog says.

It has been my experience that most of those general customer service reps on the phone don't know much when it comes to the technicalities of firearms.

carbine85
May 16, 2010, 11:52 AM
I think the 709 looks very appealing, except for the fact you cant shoot +p ammo out of it. That alone means the 709 isn't an option for me.
Just my .02

The Taurus website specificaly says you can shoot +P in their guns and many people have for many years without any problems.

Kahr
May 16, 2010, 05:43 PM
Let's see here...We are talking about a Kahr or a Taurus. Right? The delema is which junk gun I want to trust my life with. Right?

I really don't see the problem here. Check out other manufacturers of quality firearms first.

This seems to be a silly comment. Of course with my user name you can see I like my Kahr. I have only heard good things about them and mine has been flawless from the beginning. I was just wondering what your rational was for such a strong statement. Shot and owned other "quality" manufactures that im guessing your talking about and kahr has been on par with them in my case.

Ankeny
May 16, 2010, 08:37 PM
I put off buying a CW9 because it seemed like a "cheap" gun with a trash trigger. I bought one six months ago and I really like the pistol. Great carry gun. And yes, I have, or have had, Glocks, XDm, Les Baer, S&W, Sig, Wilson, STI, CZ, etc...I carry the Kahr daily and I have shot it a lot. It's a good tool for the intended job.

Holgersen
May 17, 2010, 02:12 AM
Let's see here...We are talking about a Kahr or a Taurus. Right? The delema is which junk gun I want to trust my life with. Right?

I really don't see the problem here. Check out other manufacturers of quality firearms first.

I'd like to hear what quality manufacturers Bushmaster is talking about that offer guns that are as light, thin and are capable of handling decent firepower?

Taurus sometimes has a bad reputation, but I've heard nothing but good things about Kahr.

I'd really like to know what companies he is talking about that carry comparable guns.
I guess he wants me to get a rohrbaugh R9 because he can't be talking about Kel-tec if he thinks Kahrs are junk.

Any suggestions?

MikePaiN
May 17, 2010, 05:55 AM
I've just sold my Kahr CW9 and currently carry a Taurus PT709 Slim. The CW was my carry gun, I did not sell it directly to get a 709, but as a ccw I like the 709 better. I sold the Kahr because (for me) is was just a little big for ItW carry, the Taurus is smaller(more like a PM9) and I like the carry fit better. One other thing about the 709 is that it fit better in my hand. That said the CW9 was a nice weapon, totally reliable with a great trigger.
here's a range report I wrote up on the PT709 after shooting it for the first time this weekend:
This is my second PT709 the first one(an early version)I sold because it didn't extract WWB ammo reliably and I didn't like that in my carry gun. I really liked everything else about the gun. Its size is excellent for carry, chambered in 9mm para, nice ergos., plenty of accuracy, a thumb safety, adjustable rear sight and DA/SA trigger. The trigger is innovative, it operates in SA for all shooting, with a long take-up and a crisp break, if a round has a dud primer and fails to fire, the trigger automatically reverts to a light DA giving a second strike capability.
I've been wanting to give one of these Taurus's another try. I picked one up the other night, NIB from a fresh production run. The upgrades to the latest 709 I know of are, a metal mag release and redesigned extractor.
Tonight it got its shake down run. I brought 200rounds of ammo consisting of 100rounds 115g WWB, 50 115g Win. Silvertip HPs and 50rounds American Eagle 124g FMJ.
I started right off with the WWB and ran 30 trouble free rounds though. Then I switched to the AE and ran through the entire box of 50 box without issue. Back to the WWB and got to about 120 rounds total through when one got stuck in the chamber and did not extract....It was cleared, I brushed the chamber quickly and continued through the 80 remaining rounds incl the HPs without any further issue.
Out of the box, it was shooting dead center about 6in low from POA, a few turns on the elevation screw and it was on. The guns seem to like the 115g stuff, there was a marked difference between the AE and Win loads. Recoil and flip are totally manageable and really much less then other guns I class with it like the Keltec PF9 and Kahr PM9. The 709 was shot with its stock grip. I do plan to add a Hogue Handal Jr. just for comfort but one is not needed to enhance control, the Slim is a pleasure to shoot as is.
Take down is supposed to be "Glock like" easy but posed a little difficulty. There's a trick to it, that requires pulling the trigger before and after moving the take down pin..takes a bit to figure out. Once apart it appears a solid, simple design and well put together, I liked that it has big metal rails. Cleaning was like any other auto and reassembly was a snap.
All in all a nice defensive concealed carry weapon and great value at $369. includes two mags, a cleaning brush and Taurus's lifetime warranty.

and some pics
http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x298/Mikepain_pics/DSC02526.jpg

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x298/Mikepain_pics/DSC02509.jpg

to the OP: hope this helps ;)

Holgersen
May 17, 2010, 07:56 AM
Ended up getting a PM9 with crimson trace laser installed on it. I got a lot more for my trade than I anticipated and decided to go with the more expensive model. Thanks for the input everyone.

I'll post a photo as soon as I figure out how to upload one.

TonyT
May 17, 2010, 08:00 AM
Personally I would opt for the Kahr. I shoot both a Kahr PM-9 and a T-9 - both have been super reliable and accurate.

GMAN26
May 17, 2010, 08:23 AM
My wife is about half way through the break in process on her CW9. No FTF or FTE's to date and she loves the weapon. I took the opportunity to send a few down range and the only thing that kind of bothered me was the longer but very smooth trigger pull. I'm just not use to it but that just means more range time. :) Like all the other posters say...this weapon CC's very well. It's one of our best purchases!

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