Moderator or suppressor???


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bkjeffrey
May 18, 2010, 09:33 PM
I found this thing at Smith Enterprises website. They call it a moderator. On the rest of their items they clearley label their suppressors as just that, suppressors. They refer to this as a moderator. Whats the difference?

Heres a pic.
http://www.smithenterprise.com/imagesprod/moderator01.lg.jpg

Factory description

SEI 5.56mm Sound Moderator
Built for the Canadian Special Forces, reduces sound level to 15dB 20dB. Fits over Vortex Flash Eliminator, p/n 1001-G6A2-SBV with 22mm x 1mm OD threads. Reflexes over the barrel, without exposing the barrel to hot gasses. Device disassembles for cleaning.

Do NFA laws apply?

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Jorg Nysgerrig
May 18, 2010, 09:40 PM
American English = Suppressor
The Queen's English = Moderator

NFA laws would apply, yes. Since it says "USG/FMS Only", they probably won't sell it to you anyway.

bkjeffrey
May 18, 2010, 09:49 PM
Yea, it just sparked my curiosity.

Zak Smith
May 18, 2010, 11:03 PM
It's on their suppressor page
http://www.smithenterprise.com/products11.html

springwalk
May 18, 2010, 11:20 PM
moderator is also a term used by airgun companies to get around NFA laws. Theres several spring piston airguns and pneumatics that some how are being sold with the moderator/silencer attached permanently and the ATF is ok with it as long as it cant be removed. Gamo's whisper models are one example. Not sure if they have baffles in them but by definition the atf deems any device attached to the end of a firearm that reduces sound even by 1db a silencer. Even without baffles these moderators certainly reduce noise by at least a few dbs. ATF can be inconsistant and illogical on many rulings

Zak Smith
May 18, 2010, 11:22 PM
The term is irrelevant. Under the circumstances you describe, the "guns" are not firearms and if the device is permanently attached then by definition they cannot be attached to a firearm.

springwalk
May 18, 2010, 11:39 PM
naturally the moderators/silencers of these airguns, though difficult to remove, can be removed via heat and torque and be used by a enthusiastic tinker on another firearm. Of course the word "permanent" was used in the context as not easy to remove, as one commonly does to unscrew a silencer by threads. Why the atf allows this I dont understand.:confused: oh, just found another airgun company, BSA, that markets it as a "unremovable sound dampener" to be on the good side of the ATF

Wahoo95
May 20, 2010, 12:11 AM
SILENCER.....the proper term is SILENCER here in the States, however everyone likes to call them SUPPRESSORS. Across the pond they like o refer to sounds reducing devices MODERATORS.

Zak Smith
May 20, 2010, 12:27 AM
No need to get wrapped around the axle with regard to silencer vs. suppressor. Both are in common use in the US, and virtually all manufacturers call them suppressors or use the terms interchangeably.

Conqueror
May 20, 2010, 09:01 AM
Tell that to the yahoos on my youtube videos who insist on giving me lessons about silencers even though I'm the one who owns them and they aren't. :)

TexasRifleman
May 20, 2010, 09:34 AM
SILENCER.....the proper term is SILENCER here in the States, however everyone likes to call them SUPPRESSORS.

Well, the word "silencer" is in the NFA, and has been since 1934 so it seems fair to say that silencer is correct here in the US.

But like Zak says, doesn't really matter much.

Suppressor is probably more honest though, since few firearms are really "silenced" with one.

ILikeLead
May 20, 2010, 09:55 AM
So the Moderators "Jorg" and "Zak Smith" are useful for decreasing the noise around here by 15-20 dB? Or should we call them suppressors?

(Sorry for goofy humor... please don't ban me!)

CoRoMo
May 20, 2010, 10:13 AM
If you get banned, they should more appropriately be called SILENCERS.:D

please don't ban me either

Gord
May 20, 2010, 01:24 PM
I like "The Suppressor" as a title to be bestowed on whichever mod has the largest ban quota each month :neener:

bkjeffrey
May 20, 2010, 02:05 PM
So each moderator is a Suppressor and the one with the most bans is The Silencer?

What about the ones that always lock threads for whatever unknown reason? I feel a lock coming on, watch, I betcha.

springwalk
May 21, 2010, 12:18 AM
"silencer" is a misnomer. I have several top performing over priced aluminum tubes with baffles in them and theres nothing silent about them when comparing their muzzle report to what Hollywood uses on their action packed films that guide society to believe its a stealth tool of assassins. Suppressor is a better term in regards to the actual performance and to be on the good side of the mainstream dummies of our society that think silencers (suppressors) magically hush a firearm down to a mouse fart. Hardly.:rolleyes: The only combo close to being hollywood quiet is a good .22 can like the silencerco sparrow or gemtech outback mounted on a bolt action rifle. Now thats a performing silencer!

crushbup
May 21, 2010, 10:46 AM
"silencer" is a misnomer. I have several top performing over priced aluminum tubes with baffles in them and theres nothing silent about them when comparing their muzzle report to what Hollywood uses on their action packed films that guide society to believe its a stealth tool of assassins. Suppressor is a better term in regards to the actual performance and to be on the good side of the mainstream dummies of our society that think silencers (suppressors) magically hush a firearm down to a mouse fart. Hardly. The only combo close to being hollywood quiet is a good .22 can like the silencerco sparrow or gemtech outback mounted on a bolt action rifle. Now thats a performing silencer!

That is stunningly irrelevant.

Jorg has it right. I would venture a guess that because they say it was developed for the Canadians that they used the European term.

chugcatsts01
May 22, 2010, 10:32 PM
I have three threaded .22 bolts and nothing that I have ever heard is quieter. Does any one even make a modern single shot breechoading .22LR that can be threaded?
Halfbreed II

mrnkc130
May 23, 2010, 01:53 AM
Tell that to the yahoos on my youtube videos who insist on giving me lessons about silencers even though I'm the one who owns them and they aren't.

I am always amazed at the comments on you tube videos, for people that are spending so much time on the internet they sure blurt out some of the stupidest, misinformed comments i've ever seen on the internet since Al Gore invented it. It would literally take them less time to google silencer, or machinegun and see the hundreds of hits with shorts blurbls explaining ownership than it takes them to write thier ignorant comment.

I only read them for a good laugh.

Also, I concur silencer and suppressor are both correct

Avenger29
May 23, 2010, 06:26 AM
I have three threaded .22 bolts and nothing that I have ever heard is quieter. Does any one even make a modern single shot breechoading .22LR that can be threaded?

The Rossi or H&R .22s could both easily be threaded, but if you already have bolt actions threaded it wouldn't make a bit of sense, IMHO, to choose a single shot break open style over a good bolt.

chugcatsts01
May 25, 2010, 05:31 AM
I forgot to say does anyone make a .22 LR pistol that can be threaded for a compact carry type weapon with closed breech single shot 'I guess'.
Halfbreed II
Possum is the other white meat.

pikid89
May 25, 2010, 07:45 AM
ive seen a ruger MKII pistol with a supressor adn with a maually locking bolt that turns it into a straight pull bolt action

chugcatsts01
May 25, 2010, 11:22 AM
Thanks for the info, I have all three of my ruger's threaded but doubt if i will modify any of them. It is something to consider and my freind is a gunsmith I will see what he thinks, I am not a 'hit man' or do any thing illegal, I just want some thing I can slip in my pockets in two peices [pistol and silencer].
Halfbreed
Possum is the pther white meat!

Dave Markowitz
May 25, 2010, 01:26 PM
When Internet weenies get all bent out of shape at people using the term "silencer," I like to post this ad by the man who invented them:

http://i30.photobucket.com/albums/c340/davemarkowitz/LotImg29947.jpg

bkjeffrey
May 25, 2010, 01:41 PM
retract comment

springwalk
May 25, 2010, 08:20 PM
Benjamin airguns has a fairly new precharged pneumatic that has a ported tube shrouding the barrel to quiet the rifle to Hollywood silent. Its mentioned the ATF allows it cuz it cant be taken apart. I wonder if they'd extend that to an integral .22 Ruger 10/22 or MK3 upper that Gemtech makes thats sealed, not able to be disassembled?

Zak Smith
May 25, 2010, 08:51 PM
Title II applies to firearms, so it does apply to integral firearm silencers

chugcatsts01
May 25, 2010, 10:45 PM
Yes it do apply to those built in silence barrels. I have an AWC titanium ARCHANGEL T.
It is granteed for life and I use it on .22LR, .223, 220 swift.22/250 on and on, you get it.
They supply it with a matching thread protector and goes off and on like butter. A local gunsmith threaded other guns for me and he did a good job. At $140.00 a pop its worth getting them all threaded. The sub sonic rounds are really quiet and with the supersonic 'crack' from the others one shot is hard to tell where it came from.
Halfbreed
Remember Possum is the other white meat.

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