VZ-58 or FNAR


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moonzapa
May 22, 2010, 02:19 PM
I'm torn between purchasing a new CZ VZ-58 7.62X39 semi auto and the FNAR 7.62X51 rifles. Anyone have any experience with either or both of these rifles? The FN is much more expensive, around $500 more. The FNAR examined at the gun shop had a 16" bbl, which is a bit on the short side for me. I like the VZ-58 because of the caliber, I already load the 7.62X39 for a Ruger mini-thirty.

Thanks!

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armoredman
May 22, 2010, 02:35 PM
If the Czechpoint D-Technic/CSA vz-58, go for it in a heartbeat. If the vz is the Century build, (usually about $5-600), no, I don't trust anything Centuiry has built. I have a D-technik vz-58, and it is the best fun rifle I have ever used on the range. I also reload that caliber, and just started casting for it too.

Rifle, with "extras",

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b13/armoredman/range%20trip/vz58withIsraeliSling.jpg

Target shot with 1x EOTech, seated unsupported at 200 yards.

http://i16.photobucket.com/albums/b13/armoredman/vz%20at%20200%20yards/016.jpg

Not stellar accuracy for any AR guys, but perfect for me.

I have no experiance whatsoever with the FNAR.

Moose458
May 22, 2010, 03:46 PM
No experience with the FN, but I do have the CZ vz58, and it immediately became my favorite rifle. I like my AR and I really like my AKs, but the vz58 is tops.
http://i246.photobucket.com/albums/gg92/Moose458/109515-R1-06-8.jpg

-v-
May 22, 2010, 05:41 PM
The FNAR is essentially a modified BAR-style hunting rifle. While it makes a good civilian rifle, expedient field stripping and the FNAR do not mix. The Vz58 can be field stripped as fast or faster than an AK.

Uncle Mike
May 22, 2010, 05:55 PM
The VZ58 is an excellent rifle for the cost. We are currently doing two of them in the shop now.
An all steel, fairly lightweight semi-automatic rifle that is as simple as it gets, striker fired with simple construction, this rifle is as reliable as an AK but will exhibit the accuracy of an AR and do all this with 7.62X39 ammunition! providing the ammo doesn't let you down.lol

These rifle become heavy fast once one starts hanging accessories all over them.

One of the builds called for a picatinny upper and lower front handguard set, FAB pistol grip and a CAR AR type adjustable stock that will use a straight stock adapter and not an angled one, extended bolt release, extended magazine release and BUIS. If the customer will allow it I'll post some pictures tomorrow!

If your plan is to modify this rifle let me offer you a word of caution concerning the aftermarket items and the vendors who manufacture these items!

We had not done any VZ58's previously, well not at this shop anyways, and I have been put on 'vendor' detail for locating various items for the builds.

While the list of aftermarket parts and vendors is not as large as say the AR or AK family, there are enough aftermarket parts out there to offer pretty much any configuration you may desire.

For purchase of the rifle, let me suggest you call Dan at Czechpoint, AKA D-Technikwww.czechpoint-usa.com/

As for aftermarket swag....PM me with any specific questions.

Check out 'the CZ Forum' www.czforumsite.info/index.php?board=67.0 the folks over there are nice and many of the vendors hang out there. While the site is nothing like this site, you can still get a bit of information there.

If you think add-on accessories for the AR's are pricey, wait till you start adding parts to the VZ!

Anyway, they are an excellent rifle.

1858
May 22, 2010, 06:08 PM
I'm torn between purchasing a new CZ VZ-58 7.62X39 semi auto and the FNAR 7.62X51 rifles.

Hmmm ... if you're looking for a .308 semi auto then I'd strongly suggest a DPMS Panther LR-308 (or similar) rather than the FNAR. However, I can assure you that you'll never regret buying a Vz.58. They're not sub MOA rifles by a long shot but they are incredibly reliable, incredibly easy to shoot and incredibly fun to shoot. Now add in the fact that they're an engineering marvel (bolt neither rotates nor tilts during the firing cycle) and the receiver is machined and now the question is ... why wouldn't you want one?

I put 80 rounds of Wolf 124gr FMJ through mine a couple of weeks ago with zero rifle issues ... steel cases were flying everywhere!! One magazine failed to lock the bolt back on empty but they're $11 surplus mags so I need to go through them all to see which ones work best and then maybe buy some new followers for the ones that don't work as well.

Here's mine ...

http://128.171.62.162/hawthorn-engineering/thr/cz/vz58/photos/vz58_001.jpg

:)

leadcounsel
May 22, 2010, 06:26 PM
I've seen one advertised for $430.

New Production Md. VZ58 AK rifles with milled-forged receivers, metal side-folding stock, 16” barrel with slant muzzle break, cleaning kit, 2-30Rd. mags and manual.

What manufacturer is this and is it a quality one for this price? If not what's a fair price for one?

armoredman
May 22, 2010, 06:54 PM
That would be either a Century build or a home build. Go with Czechpoint, more money better built rifle. Unlce Mike, thanks for the compliments for czforum.com, we're trying. :)

DPris
May 22, 2010, 07:23 PM
Two quite different guns built for two quite different uses.
The FNAR is not built or intended to be a "field" gun.
Denis

Opoche
May 23, 2010, 12:01 AM
Never used the FNAR, but I have nothing but praise for my Vz 58. It's light and it has given me better accuracy that I expected to get out of any 7.62x39 AK (Yes, I know it's not an ak, just comparing it to its contemporaries). Great all around little rifle. If you do get one, spend the extra money to get a czechpoint or CZ USA one. They are both coming through Czechpoint from D Technik in the Czech republic.

Carter
May 23, 2010, 12:06 AM
Those are two really different price ranges and types of rifles. I'd say if you want precision shooting not meant for the field go for the FNAR. If you want a hard to find (I'd dare say impossible) spare magazine rifle that takes stripper clips and goes to hell and back than the vz-58.

Personally I'd skip both. But out of the two the vz-58 would be the most fun if you are doing tactical shooting or wanting a SHTF gun. The FNAR would be better for serious competitions or what have you. Of course there is nothing more satisfying than shooting out to 600 yards and hitting dead center...

Opoche
May 23, 2010, 12:34 AM
Vz mags are a little hard to find, but czechpoint has them in stock for $13 , and every spare part you could ever need.

Prion
May 23, 2010, 09:16 AM
I owned an FNAR and sold it. Never really loved it. Barely sub-moa, not a good field rifle because of weight and difficulty field stripping. So not accurate enough for riding the bench and not a decent battle rifle. I wonder why I ever bought one.

Hammerhead6814
May 23, 2010, 10:54 AM
The overwhelming conclusion of the thread is the VZ-58. Probably because the FNAR is so expensive most of us have never owned one. The field stripping of the FNAR is also a very valid point. Check youtube for a video of it.

armoredman
May 23, 2010, 11:22 AM
Carter, mags are quite cheap at Czechpoint, good ones. They have bunches. :)

Uncle Mike
May 23, 2010, 12:12 PM
Keep in mind also the calibers, the 7.62 X39 is a lesser expensive date, and when shot of the VZ58, is a pussycat!
The 308 is a fine cartridge, however you pay for excellence of the cartridge compared to the 7.62X39 and while the recoil is nowhere near substantial, it is more than the former.

Doing some research, I did find where CZ actually made the VZ58 in 308 caliber for a short time, these however as the article said was a special run.

As for the FNAR, they are not a bad rifle, painfully over priced for what they are and somewhat finicky as to ammo, so I am told.

There are several companies that have put together the VZ, but ONLY two companies are original, Czechpoint and CZ-USA, any other brand is pretty much junk comparably.

Your welcome armoredman, CZforum.com is a wealth of information on the VZ58.

I'm looking forward to finishing up the two customers rifles and starting on my own VZ58!

Maverick223
May 23, 2010, 12:27 PM
Neither? http://forums.nitroexpress.com/images/graemlins/smilies/general/dunno.gif As good as the VZ-58 (Czechpoint version) is, you already have a 7.62x39mm. The FNAR is a glorified BAR, a good hunting rifle, but not much else. I would look into a FAL, AR-10, or perhaps a PTR-91, that way you diversify a little.

:)

45B@cav
May 23, 2010, 01:50 PM
VZ58 all the way. If for no other reason IMO the FNAR is UGLY!!!!!! I have never shot the FNAR but I have shot the VZ58 and it's a solid accurate performer.

armoredman
May 23, 2010, 01:53 PM
Unfortunately, CZ-USA is lo longer able to stock the vz-58s, that is all Czechpoint now.

ifit
May 23, 2010, 05:36 PM
i highly recomend the vz58, mine is from cz-usa bought couple years back, and sad to hear that they dont carry them no more. 2 weekends ago tried some 124gr fmj and was actually surprised how well the vz shot with this ammo

50 yards, vz shouldered, sitting, front rest 6 shots, irons. try to ignore the 2 fliers:)
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y211/kadiindo/448.jpg
http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y211/kadiindo/443.jpg

.3937"
May 24, 2010, 12:35 PM
Unfortunately, CZ-USA is lo longer able to stock the vz-58s, that is all Czechpoint now.

armoredman, is Czheckpoint a dealer? I have just recently "discovered" the vz-58 after having decided to phase out my AR's in .223/5.56 for various reasons. I had owned an AK in the late 80s through 90's but it got eaten in a divorce (along with everything else).

After having cycled 20K+ rounds of .223 & 5.56 through my AR's over the past half decade I decided I don't like the round at all compared to the 7.62s that I fell in love with 20 years ago.

I can't find any vz-58s anywhere near the $500 to $750 price range I've seen mentioned on various forums. I could sell an AR but I want to keep them. When I said "phase out" I mean just put them back in the wall not sell. But unless I can find a 58 for around $750 or less I'll have to turn one of the ARs.

Any ideas where to look?

armoredman
May 24, 2010, 02:22 PM
Czechpoint is the sole importer of the D-technik/Czech Small Arms vz-58, built on a Czech reciever. They run around $1k, give or take a few. The cheaper ones are Century builds of vz-58 kits on US made recievers. Those will usually have a bayonet mount on them as well, as the CSA version usually does not. The Century is, as usual, hit and miss. The CSA/Czechpoint is the original and excellent, plus backed by Czechpoint tio the hilt. The Czechpoint CSA rifle is worth it. Czechpoint also has a lot of accessories and parts. Other are offered by Niet Arms in Canada and NEA, both are being currently imported, can't remember the importer off the top of my head.

Uncle Mike
May 24, 2010, 02:33 PM
Czechpoint also has a lot of accessories and parts. Other are offered by Niet Arms in Canada and NEA, both are being currently imported, can't remember the importer off the top of my head.

Troy Industries is supposed to be marketing some of the NEA stuff, otherwise we just bought from Neit Arms.

Czechpoint has a VZ-58 for you!

1858
May 24, 2010, 02:59 PM
I can't find any vz-58s anywhere near the $500 to $750 price range I've seen mentioned on various forums.

I found my NIB D-TECHNIK build on Gunbroker last year (seller = Green Mountain Tactical) for $720 but those deals seem to be few and far between now. Yo could simply pay $900 and buy one from Czechpoint-USA as suggested or you could do some research on the Vz.58 receiver (http://rapidfire.targetweb.net/cgi-bin/store/agora.cgi/agora.cgi?cart_id=6824384.14212*_85C-3&product=VZ_58_Receiver&Parts&cart_id=6824384.14212*4t6M_0) offered by Rapid Fire out of Troy, Ohio. It's machined from 4140 billet. Lots of parts and parts kits are available from Gunbroker and Czechpoint so it wouldn't be too difficult to figure out how much it'd cost to build a Vz.58. However, in the end, it may be more trouble than it's worth but some folks like a challenge and the satisfaction of knowing that they did the work.

:)

1858
May 24, 2010, 03:07 PM
Here's are some D-TECHNIK builds on GB that might go for under $800 ...

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=170139005

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=170480186

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=170173814

... or you could buy the receiver in the link in my previous post and add these parts (or have your friendly gunsmith do it) ...

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=170677628

:)

.3937"
May 26, 2010, 05:10 PM
. . . . ... or you could buy the receiver in the link in my previous post and add these parts (or have your friendly gunsmith do it) ... . . . .

Does the receiver need any additional milling? Does the kit in the link have everything for a complete build? I've heard the vz58 build is not easy. I have a CNC router and lots of skills, but I've never done a gun kit build. I'm not afraid of it but I've read several places the vz-58 is not a beginner build.

I'm still toying with a .308 platform over the 7.62x39 round but the higher cost of ammo is still steering me toward the vz. The ~$900 for the vz is not unreasonable for the accuracy it has but I think I'll wait until the gun show this weekend to see what I might run across first.

Thanks for the leads all.

Maverick223
May 26, 2010, 05:25 PM
Don't know if anyone mentioned it, but Ohio Ordnance has receivers/kits (all new parts per my understanding) and will complete it for you for about $1k. I don't have any experience with one, but I have heard that they are good builds.

:)

Uncle Mike
May 26, 2010, 06:52 PM
The receivers are complete, but, without going into details, you'll have to press in the barrel, rivet the trigger guard et cetra. Or call up czechpoint, they have theme ready to go.

You wont save much, if any cash putting one of these together from a kit. Just the kits are around $300-

Maverick223
May 26, 2010, 07:37 PM
You wont save much, if any cash putting one of these together from a kit.Mike, I have heard that Ohio Ordnance Works will put together their kit for you, and complete it with bbl, furniture, et al. Looking into getting one myself in the near future.

:)

moonzapa
October 12, 2013, 01:46 AM
This is an extremely old thread that I posted originally in 2007. Well, I purchased the FNAR in 308 Win. It is a high quality rifle but it isn't what I was looking for. I would like to sell it if anyone is interested.
Thanks!

goon
October 12, 2013, 02:05 AM
The VZ-58 is a really interesting design.
My one friend has one that I've run a few magazines full through and I found it very usable. I think I'd take it over a 7.62x51 at this point based on ammo prices unless there is some reason you really need to go that route.

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