[Buckskinner]

Foks,
I'm trying to bed this ol' rifle. Its my first foray into the high tech arena of glass bedding.

The forward action bolt, the one that goes into the pillar that is also the recoil lug, is ALSO the forward trigger guard fastener, and the same goes for the aft action bolt that goes through the bottom metal and into the tang. That said, I'm wondering if I need to bed the bottom metal before or at least simultaneously as the action bed job?

Buck

[Preacherman]

Why on earth would you want to take a rifle to... OH! :o

:neener: :p :D

[Buckskinner]

Any port in a storm my friend...

[Chris Rhines]

Funny you should ask - I have this old sporterized '03A3 that I've been thinking about pillar bedding. Now as I understand it, you won't need to bed the bottom metal if the pillars are of the proper length. But I could be wrong. This may be the impetus I need to start mixing up the epoxy.

- Chris

[Buckskinner]

Well, its true that there are pillars of sorts already there. But there is a gap between the pillar of the bottom metal and the pillar of the recoil lug and tang. That's the rub. Compressing this gap of wood is bad juju...I'm trying to figure out the best way to solidify that gap with epoxy.

[Houndawg]

I'm not familiar with how the '03 is attached to the stock, but it sounds similar to the Mauser. Why not use the steel ferrules like the Mauser uses?

Mauser Stock Ferrules (http://www.brownells.com/aspx/NS/store/ProductDetail.aspx?p=983&title=MAUSER+98+STOCK+FERRULES)

[Buckskinner]

Those are cool alright...But they won't work on the forward screw of the '03. Might work on the aft one.

But if I was gonna use those, I'd get something that I could cut grooves in for the epoxy to grab a hold of..

[Houndawg]

The Mauser doesn't use the ferrules on the front screws, only the rear. If there's enough wood between the floorplate and the recoil lug, you might be able to cut down one of the ferrules. Brownell's also sells adjustable pillar bedding posts.

[Khornet]

with Brownells Acra-Glas gel. I bedded the action first, relieving wood from the area of the recoil lug and the rear upper tang area-just a little- filling in with acraglas and reassembling the rifle but not turning the action screws down too hard. I relieved the barrel channel in the forend so the barrel is free-floated except for the first 2" which are bedded in the Acraglas. Then I lightly bedded the bottom metal just around where the action screws pass through, and where they press the metal against the stock.

It was quite easy and fun. The result is an 03A3 with GI 2-groove Remington barrel which shoots sub-MOA. Half-MOA, actually, with my handloads. Pillar-bedding wasn't well known back then, and I've never felt a need to change.

After bedding the action, relieve the bedding around the recoil lug such that it only contacts the bedding on its rear face--not on sides or bottom. When the bedding is fully set, shoot it. If not satisfied with accuracy, try tightening the rear screw fully, then tightening and loosening the front screw. The metal should not move. Then do the opposite, looseninng and tightening the rear screw. Ditto. If anything moves, you have a high spot somewhere so that when both screws are tight the reciever is being flexed.

Go for it.

[Khornet]

before bedding the reciever, you can put a couple of thicknesses of electrical tape on the bottom and sides of the recoil lug, leeving the rear face bare. Besure to coat the tape with release agent just as you would the metal. Then when you're done, peel off the tape and you should have no lug to bedding contact except the rear face.

In my rifle, the flat surface behind the recoil lug is also bedded.

Good luck

[Kestrel]

khornet,

Why should you only have bedding compund contact on the rear of the recoil lug?

Steve

[Gewehr98]

But this 1903A4 restoration job got special treatment, including a receiver bedding job, first 1" of barrel, and a free-floated barrel channel and handguard, save for some slight upward pressure at the nosecap:

http://mauser98.com/stack9.jpg

[Buckskinner]

And I like it!

Did you bed the A4?

[Gewehr98]

But yes, that A4 is glass-bedded, as I described earlier in this thread. Hard to beliee something so rudimentary, with that 2.5x scope, would shoot so accurately, but it's definitely a 1 MOA, and sometimes better, gun. ;)

[Khornet]

the way I understand it, you want the recoil lug to oppose the recoil force which is after all parallel to the bore, and keep the action in the same place without exerting and lateral or vertical forces on the metal.

I guess I can't explain better than that, but check out Warren Page's The Accurate Rifle which explains bedding principles nicely.

All I can tell you is that I followed the Acraglas package directions exactly and used Page's principles. This 03A3 was the first rifle I ever bedded, in fact the first gun I ever did any work on, and on the first try it came out shooting 1/2 MOA with my hunting load (Hornady 150 gr spire point, CCI large rifle primer, 4064 51.0 grains, full-length sized case, seated bullet just short of touching lands).

I've also bedded a Mauser action, which has a different recoil lug arrangement, with excellent results. Both were done in the 1980s, and I've never needed to worry about either rifle, or ever think about getting another hunting rifle.

[Buckskinner]

What rings are mounted on that '03? Or is that what makes it an A4? I ask because my receiver is drilled and tapped, and I thought it was aftermarket done. And if it is, then I'm wondering what rings to use...

[Gewehr98]

1. The serial number on the receiver is offset to clear the scope mounts
2. The bolt handle is configured to clear the scope
3. The front sight and front sight band was never installed on the barrel
4. The stock is either a Scant style or C-type full pistol grip
5. The scope base is a military Redfield Jr one-piece, with squared corners
6. The rings are the split-tops as issued, they came in either 3/4" or 7/8" diameter
7. The issue scopes were the 3/4" Weaver 330, (aka M73B1), 7/8" Lyman Alaskan (aka M73), and later variants of the Lyman, culminating with the M84, also seen on the M1D sniper Garand.

Word is that 1903A4's in Vietnam carried Weaver K4-60 scopes, too.

[Kestrel]

Khornet,

Thanks for the info. When you bed a rifle, do you have to remove wood? I guess I'm a little leary of removing wood, if that's the case.

Thanks,
Steve

[mtnbkr]

do you have to remove wood

I didn't. It's called a "skim bed". In my case, I was able to put quite a bit of glass around the front lug and a little around the rear bedding area. Supposedly, it's not as durable as a proper bedding job. I cut my groups almost in half by doing it this way.

Chris

[Khornet]

you do remove wood because skim-bed leaves only a thin layer of bedding to resist compressive force. Skim-bedding will work in a stock which is already very well bedded, but if you're gonna bed, why not make it last?

I did sort of skim bed the rest of the action, in the sense that I wiped on a layer of Acraglas on the internal surfaces to seal them.

You don't have to remove much wood, so don't be afraid to try it. And anything you don't like can be easily sanded away or reduced with a file or Dremel tool.

Most of my action is just barely in contact with the adjoining wood or bedding, for the sake of nice wood-to-metal fit, but the recoil lug and the rear upper tang are firmly bedded.

Also, keep the action screws out of contact with the wood/bedding. Enlarge their channels through wood or bedding so they don't touch anything except where their threads engage the action. Otherwise they'll act as secondary recoil lugs.

[Buckskinner]

Okay, I haven't heard this mentioned, and want to know if y'all have run up against it.

The recoil lug "pillar" contacts (actually sits inside) the guard metal "pillar". And there's nice shiny metal where they obviously contact during firing. Soooo, I'm considering grinding off an 1/8" or so to seperate these two pieces of metal, then bedding action and bottom metal.

Anybody seen this before on their '03?