Livestock shooting


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mathyoo
May 26, 2010, 02:01 AM
Ok, I don't post here very often. But, I would like to bring to discussion about a problem I have at my ranch house in texas. I like to shoot guns, im working on my degree, i've never been charged with anything other than traffic tickets, and im planning on enlisting.Im a very peaceful and chill person but I don't put up with any BS.

Due to legal reasons I can't discuss everything thats going on right now but I can't sit here and do nothing.

I have a small cattle 'ranch" in southern texas, I have family living there and peaceful recreational livestock. No selling for meat, nothing. Just pets.
Now, my horse and a few cattle were sent to a&m for a necropsy because they died for no apparent reason. Today I learned that they were shot. Dont know who did it but there arent very many people living over there. Its in the middle of nowhere.

I dont know who did it, or why. There should be no reason for someone to do this other than vandalism. I'm not sure what else I can say about it right now, but I would like to mention it on here because it seems there are some intelligent people on here who may be able to offer some advice. Any legal or moral opinions would really be appreiciated.

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Buck Snort
May 26, 2010, 03:29 AM
All I can offer you is some sympathy, its a damned shame people do that sort of thing but, unfortunately, the human race has a certain part of its population that have not respect for other people and their property.

leadcounsel
May 26, 2010, 03:31 AM
1. Determining who dun it - it was a crime, or several crimes, of felony nature. Police and neighbors should be able to tell you if there are other similar instances locally or statewide. List out all of your enemies. Do you have a business with a disgruntled employee, co-workers, school/classmates, teammates, etc.? List all your enemies in your lifetime. Use ballistics to determine the type or types of weapons, likely angle or direction of the shot etc. to piece together the puzzle. Were the shots all from a neighbors house direction, local shooting range (maybe a mile away), etc. or from a road (night time drive by shootings)? Any of your neighbors have suspicious teenagers with guns?


2. Prevention - depending on the size of your property, you can get inexpensive security cameras or game cameras that record video or still pictures via motion activation.

calaverasslim
May 26, 2010, 09:20 AM
I live here in South Texas and I know that your Sheriff should be involved. Has this been reported to him? They will do an investigation, particularly if there have been other cases.

Lee Roder
May 26, 2010, 09:58 AM
That sucks. It was probably fun for somebody though.

the human race has a certain part of its population that have not respect for other people and their property.

A certain part? Just walking out into the desert around here, that "certain part" really seems like 9 out of 10 shooters. That sucks

sonier
May 26, 2010, 10:24 AM
Im having issues with vandalism on my farm, I have had people run my horses into barbwire fences at night as well. personally i value my horses more than my herd of sheep so i keep them close. recently I picked up a stray that is a extreme guard dog at ngiht, she is a sweet dog and since ive kept her otuside ive had no vandalism. she has caught people trespassing at 3 am already.
there is no way on a big ranch or free ranging cattle, to really make sure nothing like this will happen, but if your animals are close to your house id recomend a guard dog something that would raise living hell if someone were to do anything sneaky.

TCOV
May 26, 2010, 10:19 PM
comment deleted.

Rail Driver
May 26, 2010, 10:43 PM
This post sounds like bs. You had to ask a university if your animals were shot?

Cattle are large enough, and some are furry/shaggy enough that a relatively tiny bullet hole could easily be overlooked. The same goes for horses.

Of course it also depends on the caliber and area of the wound (obviously in the vitals somewhere) but I could absolutely see something like this happening.

TCOV
May 26, 2010, 10:51 PM
post deleted.

Art Eatman
May 26, 2010, 11:27 PM
This is the Legal forum, not the "I doubt it" forum. And if it's a day or two before an animal is found, coyotes and buzzards can mess up any wounds.

I'm another who would get the sheriff into it, and ask around with the neighbors to see if it's widespread.

hank327
May 26, 2010, 11:37 PM
You might also check with any cattlemen's associations in your area as they often employ livestock detectives that work on catching rustlers. They might be able to help you out.

.455_Hunter
May 26, 2010, 11:39 PM
I hate to sound like CSI, but did TAMU recover any of the bullets or fragments? If so, have them sent to the local LE organization. Should be fairly easy to tell if you are dealing with a .223, 7.62x39, .30-30 or something more powerful. Might help to ID the shooter(s) if you determine the caliber and likely weapons platform. It would probably be worthwhile (with a sheriffs deputy) to scout the area and look for brass, especially if a publicly accessible road is nearby.

My company had a case of vandalism at our remote test facility east of Denver where somebody dumped a couple of AK mags through our front gate. The sheriffs department was very interested in collecting the spent brass on the driveway to help with a potential future prosecution. When is was about 12, my neighbor's mailbox was struck by a bullet in an act of drive-by vandalism. By using some dowels and a basic knowledge of ballistics, I walked over the the hillside 15 yards behind the box and found a lovely fresh 158 gr LRN .38 slug.

Just food for thought- I am sorry for the lose of your animals... :( :mad:

ants
May 27, 2010, 12:02 AM
Due to legal reasons I can't discuss everything thats going on right now I respect that. But that's exactly why no one here can give you sound moral advice based on relevant facts.

Same with legal advice. Personally, it would be very difficult for me to vital decisions based on legal advice from nameless faceless people on internet forums.

Davek1977
May 27, 2010, 05:05 AM
I've raised livestock and if I had found any dead my first thought would be that they were shot.

odd....I was raised on a working cattle ranch, helping my family to raise 350 cow/calf pairs every year. I recall a LOT of dead animals, due to illness, lightening, depredation, etc. In 32 years, I've seen a lot of dead critters for one reason or another. Not one of them was shot however, so there would be absolutely no reason to automatically jump to such a conclusion. Maybe your experience has been different, but in over 3 decades of dealing with cattle, not one has ever been shot on our ranch (aside from mercy killings, of course)

MachIVshooter
May 27, 2010, 10:54 AM
Check your state's laws. Not the new ones; The ones that have been on the books for generations.

Here in CO, there are some very interesting ones regarding protecting livestock that involve the use of deadly force.

mathyoo
May 27, 2010, 10:47 PM
Im just trying to be careful discussing too much about where the shots came from and who I think it might be, and tcov, the animals were sent off by my 80 year old grandfather who still runs things out there but, he doesnt have muscle or equipment to lift the animals and search for any kind of wounds. The're kind of heavy. I was in school when he found them and couldn't come help.

The sheriff is on it and I think a&m have already sent the slugs to the department. Just waiting on a call. Like I said there arent very many people out there and one of them has a bit of a criminal record.

and as for ants uhh, :banghead: whatever.

TCOV
May 28, 2010, 01:17 AM
Sorry, I operated the keyboard before engaging my brain.

george30
May 28, 2010, 01:49 AM
My family owns a cattle farm just like yours. Just pets. How big of a ranch is it? Was this one incident where they all showed up dead or multiple occasions? If the person kept coming back I would hide trail cameras as many places as possible. My advice to you is don't count on the sheriff. Get a friend and walk the property looking for foot prints, shell casings, or any sign of a trespasser. It sounds like a teenager to me. Good luck

mathyoo
May 28, 2010, 05:39 AM
All 3 of em turned up dead the next morning, Im going out there myself again soon to look for any casings and to see if I can figure out which direction the shots came from. I'm going to be hanging out more at night over there on and off for a little while. Its not that big of a property so if anything else happens ill be able to be right on it. I don't know what I would have done if I had actually caught them in the act. :fire: Gonna have to do some more research on texas gun laws.

Art Eatman
May 28, 2010, 10:23 AM
mathyoo, since this is all up in the air from any legal standpoint, you might start a new thread in General about what you find.

Start a new thread here in the Legal forum about Texas laws on property protection.

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