Winchester Super X, Model 1 ?


PDA






Kestrel
December 1, 2003, 10:46 PM
Anyone know anything about these? I picked one up today - has a 28", vent rib barrel, modified fixed choke. Steel receiver, wood stocks. Excellent condition. $325.

Has a great trigger pull. Seems to have no overtravel.

Beautiful blueing.

Seems like a very solid gun.

This was evidently the predecessor to the Super X2, I suppose. The design looks a little different, though.

Is this a reasonable price?

Thanks for any info,
Steve

If you enjoyed reading about "Winchester Super X, Model 1 ?" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
sm
December 1, 2003, 11:55 PM
:D
Machined, not stamped, Introduced in 1973, IIRC stopped in 1984. The 'boys in green" had the 1100, which was less monies and stamped*. SX1 fell victim to being a well crafted machined firearm competing with mass produced methods and less retail price.

SX1 is like a model 12, one is semi, other is a pump.

Field, Skeet, Trap and Skeet/Trap combos avail. The Winchester Custom Shop which IMO turned out some the most beautiful guns ever made, did as usual an awesome job with the SX1. Words do not describe the caliber of wood and finished custom SG.

Tidbit, The fella ( name escapes) whom did the SX1 did not design it with a "O" ring...powers that be said since the boys in green had one, re design the SX1 with one. Perceptions of the public I guess.

This same fella did the SX2 and Browning Gold..."didn't see any reason to re-invent the wheel".

Yep, Nu-Line put external knurled chokes on my '74 model SX1, I have put as many as 25K rds in a year through it, for many years in sucession. I have no idea how many rds all total, Guesstimates an easy 150K -seriously, someone firgured closer to an easy 200K, through this one gun of mine alone-- I dunno, I just shoot the darn thing. :D Yep it still gets used. Even in '74 mine came overbored and the FC was lenthened FROM the factory mind you. [ I've fired a "few" shotshells over the yrs and in other guns too]

Brister in his book did testing of semi shotguns, the SX1 was in his testing, the most reliable autoloader. In later writings he again wrote the SX1 was the most reliable. MY experience has shown this to be true today. I have run mine against the "new boys in town", Clays, hunting, 3 gun, steels...sent the new boys crying to momma. Poor old '74 SX1 with wood and blue, stock mag, and no bling bling, will still kick butt and take names. Why, because it runs. The other secret semi shucker I get great pleasure beating the New boys in town with bling bling is a Beretta 303.

IN OLDER autoloaders, the SX1, the 302, 303, and 1100 I'll run against a new benelli anyday,anytime. These old guns are just that good.

*In no way am I bashing the 1100, I still prefer the 1100 over a 11-87 anyday.

;) So In my most Not Honest opinion the SX1 is pc of junk and I'll give you twenty bucks for it ...just to make a wall hanger ;)

Kestrel
December 2, 2003, 12:25 AM
sm,

Thanks for the info! I'm glad I picked the gun up.

So, there is a rubber O-ring in it? (I didn't notice it at the shop, but only looked at it breifly.) How often do the O-rings need to be replaced? Where can they be obtained?

Any other parts that need to be replaced occasionally?

Thanks again for the great info.

Steve

sm
December 2, 2003, 01:09 AM
$25 is my final offer:D

Where is a dang moderator when you need one...He won't accept my offer...

Steve, The "O" ring is similar to the one used on a 1100. Its sits b/t gas system and threads for mag cap. An 1100 will work, so will a rubber band if in a bind. They last a long time, I've run mine 1k rds b/t cleanings ( that was 2 wks of shooting roughly) so I guess I changed mine as little as twice a year and as many as 4. The SX1 is a bit larger/different. Buddy of mine picked me some of the new style at somewhere he went.

This is what I'd do, first contact Winchester and see if the manual is still avail, if not see if the red manual,with all Win guns is avail. [ I kinda doubt it but worth a try].

Nu-Line Guns probably has or can copy the owners manual for you. Probably has the " O " rings too.

Numrich last I contacted had parts also.

There is fellow I've seen on the INternet that deals with only SX1 [don't have link handy, nor have I done business with him, or know anyone that has. IIRC his site is simply "super x model 1" Again I know nothing other than he deals only with SX1

It is "suggested" the recoil spring ( which runs through the buttstock) be replaced I forget what was "suggested" . Mine is a '74 model, I have replaced it once, only one in all these years. That only because I was shamed into getting it done. I was advised to NOT do this myself. Honest, I still have the original, and have measured and had someone spec test it...it didn't need replacing, but I have the original as a spare.

They came with red wooden mag plug, and the metal cap that seals it before putting /screwing mag cap on is a good idea...In case you launch it across the parking lot like I did...I found it tho...bed of a p/u.

I'd get a spare bolt handle, prolly a spring that runs the biolt dealie between bolt and gas system.

I don't have mine handy, nor the manual, its locked up off site. The truth is to jsut get what one might think to get as spare for any gun. I still run mine stock, 'cept for one recoil spring change, and having chokes installed.

Have you noticed the gas/bolt/piston system yet? Now you see why these are so reliable and run so well.

Get the gun, the manual and they are easy to take apart. Clean, lube, BA/UU/ R. If your Mod bbl is like all I've seen,used and patterened, it is overbored from factory, and FC is well done...you are gonna be surprised with the patterns. Do a 3 dr 1 1/8 oz trap load and pattern it at 25 yds, then go to 40. :D It will make you look real good, I assure you.

Man this is like putting a new small block in an waiting to fire it up...go fire the darn thing and get back...I'm pacing and wearing out carpet...

Kestrel
December 2, 2003, 02:08 AM
sm,

Thanks again for the great info. Unfortunately, I won't be able to fire it until after Christmas. (Don't have anywhere to fire it, until then.)

Thanks and I'll try to find those parts and manual.

Steve

sm
December 2, 2003, 02:25 AM
$25 ,RC and a moonpie...my final offer! :p

I can fire it before twenty and five of Dec. :D

If I run across any additional info I'll advise . Having the "exact gun" in my hands "would " assure I am in fact getting the correct info. [ahem]

[Preacherman...I haven't done anything wrong--yet. I ain't coveting, or lusting...just umm, err...answering questions and stuff] weirdest thing just happened tho', big old bolt of lightening...and it ain't raining here...

Dave McCracken
December 2, 2003, 06:14 AM
Steve, as friend sm says, it's oneheckuva shotgun. One of the best. Few come up for sale.

romulus
December 2, 2003, 09:56 AM
The 'boys in green" had the 1100, which was less monies and stamped*.
Would you please expand on that? What was stamped in an 1100? Receivers as far as I lknow are to this day forged and milled. Trigger group is pot metal like all remmies or maybe even plastic like the new 870s, which is a big regret.

The Super X1 is a real beauty and a much purtier gun than its successor - now the X2 has an aluminum alloy receiver (yuck!) and stamped parts like the TG, I believe.

Kestrel
December 2, 2003, 11:31 AM
Thanks for the kind offer of taking the gun. I wish I was as unselfish...;)

Actually, I'm thinking of donating it to charity...

HA! (just kidding)

After reading all of this, I'm delighted to have found it.

Thanks again,
Steve

sm
December 2, 2003, 11:51 AM
romulus:

SX1 has machined parts. Look at the TG, shell latches, ...etc.
1100 has for instance stamped shell latches.

Best comparison is a model 12 and a 870. Both are fine guns and are proven. One made in a time where machined, more hands on for fitting and craftmanship. The other where time is money and we can use these new fangled mfg processes and let some old guys retire.

sigh...lots of stuff that way...


Steve, you take ribbing well, congrats on a nice catch. If I find any info I'll share it.

Covering my butt with Preacherman,..being selfish is your problem with Preacherman...sorry man your're on your own...I got own my problems staying out of trouble... :p

Sparky
December 2, 2003, 11:13 PM
Winchester did a ton of market research before marketing the SX-1. They built the gun "we" said we wanted--all steel, machined, durable etc.,etc. Problem was it never sold in substantial numbers. It was a GREAT target gun, but got reeeeaaaal heavy toting one around afield. I had a Skeet SX-1 & the only glitch it had was a tendency for a little screw that held the vent rib on at the muzzle to work loose. (at inopportune times of course) The rib would slide toward the muzzle & have to be shoved backinto place & tightened. (hadn't heard of Loctite then) The current SX-2uses a lot of the basic design of the SX-1> Hope it lives up to its ancestor.

JAA
August 7, 2010, 11:44 PM
What is the difference between the Winchester Super X Model 1 fixed "Full Choke" and fixed "Full Trap Choke" barrels?

scchokedaddy
August 8, 2010, 03:52 PM
The rib

JAA
August 8, 2010, 07:42 PM
Choke Daddy,
OK, so does that mean the fixed "Full Choke" has a different patterning compared to the fixed "Full Trap Choke" e.g. 50/50 to say 60/40 respectively? How about constriction? Any difference there? Appreciate any help. Thanks.

JohnBT
August 9, 2010, 08:11 AM
Iirc, the trap rib is .040" higher at the second post, so the guns shoots higher like a typical trap gun. I think the constriction is the same as the full choke on a field barrel.

Heck, the mod choke on my field barrel is tight enough for almost anything.

JT

Captcurt
August 9, 2010, 04:37 PM
To quote Ray Bearse, author of Sporting Arms of the World published in 1976 (Yeah, I'm that old), "This is probably the best semi-automatic shotgun that Winchester has produced."

I have one and wish that I had a couple more.;)

JAA
August 9, 2010, 08:37 PM
OK, thanks for the help with that. I agree, these are very impressive guns.

rmbrad
October 4, 2010, 07:51 PM
I have an old Super X Model 1. I need to replace the butt stock, or all of the wood. Does anyone know if there are any other models that have interchangeable wood? I bought my field grade gun in 1974.

JohnBT
October 4, 2010, 08:12 PM
Not that I know of, but they turn up for sale regularly.

Here's a used butt stock up for auction with a starting price of $79.

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=193551520

rmbrad
October 4, 2010, 08:23 PM
Thanks, John.

GW123
November 3, 2010, 01:49 PM
Anyone. I have a Winchester Super X Model 1 that I have had for a long time. The gun loads fine into the magazine and by hand pull, chambers and ejects each round. The problem is that when the first round fires, ejects, and a second round is chambered it will not fire. It is as if the hammer is not cocked. If I manually pull the bolt back, eject round 2 and load round 3 the gun will fire. I believe it to be a spring issue but there is not a good gunsmith in my area. Is this a common problem and do you have a solution and parts? Thank you in advance for any help or advice you may offer.

Captcurt
November 3, 2010, 02:09 PM
Anyone. I have a Winchester Super X Model 1 that I have had for a long time. The gun loads fine into the magazine and by hand pull, chambers and ejects each round. The problem is that when the first round fires, ejects, and a second round is chambered it will not fire. It is as if the hammer is not cocked. If I manually pull the bolt back, eject round 2 and load round 3 the gun will fire. I believe it to be a spring issue but there is not a good gunsmith in my area. Is this a common problem and do you have a solution and parts? Thank you in advance for any help or advice you may offer.
It could be a spring but more than likely it is either the ammo or the gas ports need a good cleaning.

clang
November 3, 2010, 11:33 PM
The other thing that killed the Super X1 is the 2 3/4" chamber. Some of us are perfectly happy with 2 3/4" loads, but 3" Mag was a big selling point.

I had one I sold to a buddy (he bugged me so much for it I had to do it). I miss that gun.

Another thing to look out for is the recoil buffer - they get old and brittle and little pieces of plastic fall out of the receiver. The gun will still fire, but it beats up the back of the receiver some.

Vette Jockey
November 4, 2010, 12:45 PM
It's possible the auto safety spring is broken or installed incorrectly. I had a pair of S & W 1000's that did exactly as you have described when I got them. As it turned out one of them had the auto safety spring installed backwards and the other the spring was missing completely. After I installed the spring correctly they worked perfectly.

K9american
November 4, 2010, 01:44 PM
Good source of Winchester parts:
http://www.midwestgunworks.com/page/mgwi/CTGY/winchester-gun-parts

Virginian
November 4, 2010, 07:05 PM
The misinformation one sees on these forums never ceases to amaze me. Remingtons have no "pot metal" in anything. The trigger group is aluminum. Some newer 870s have a plastic trigger group; innovative from some manufacturers, but cheap if Remington does it. The receiver is forged and milled steel. The aluminum receiver B gun lovers now moan they are too heavy. The 'O' ring doesn't move in service, and I have only had to replace one on nine different 1100s and 11-87s in 47 years, and that one was on a 20 gauge and was pinched and still working fine.
The Winchester Super X was and is a very good gun; not a perfect gun. A lot of people love them for the way they feel and shoot for them. If it felt great to me I would get it. It was designed to go head to head with the 1100 and win. It didn't, and joined a whole pile of others like the Ithaca 51 that were all touted as 1100 killers. A lot of people don't like Remingtons, but a lot do too. That doesn't prove anything or automatically make them bad or good.

jaysouth
November 4, 2010, 07:51 PM
I shot Super Xs extensively for skeet and trap. I bought the last three NIB super Xs that Herman Sports had for $900 in 83. They threw in a used Super X trap gun with a broken stock.

I shot thousands of skeet and trap loads that were so light that they would not set the inertia hammers on a Browning Citori O/U.

You have a fine gun that will last you and your heirs for a long time. Nu-Line Guns in Harvester, MO can do anything that needs to be done to one.

By the way, there were 88,000 manufactured. I have it from an insider at Olin that WW lost between $25 and $50 on each one they sold. But the wood on target models ranged from great to spectacular.

If you enjoyed reading about "Winchester Super X, Model 1 ?" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!