NAA Super Companion plywood test


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Tomahawk674
June 30, 2010, 12:37 AM
I shot my NAA Super Companion from 2.5 yards at a sheet of plywood that was half and inch thick. I used a scoop (4.7 grains) 777 fffg and the standard 30 grain bullets from NAA. All 5 shots went right through the board and the box that was propping it. When I have another chance I'll try two boards.

I know someone had posted their NAA wasn't going through a few pages of a phonebook so I wanted to do a penetration test. I'm guessing the other person had a really defective model.

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BHP FAN
June 30, 2010, 04:08 AM
777 is about 15% hotter than Goex real BP, makeing it just about the ideal propellant for our little pistolas.Normally I'm one of the ''real black, or take it back'' clan of muzzle loaders, but in this case, 777 is the way to go.

Ratdog68
June 30, 2010, 10:45 AM
C'mon Tomahawk... quit bein' a tease !! :D

http://i677.photobucket.com/albums/vv134/Ratdog68/Humor/ThreadPitchers.jpg?t=1277909063

Tomahawk674
June 30, 2010, 11:31 AM
Pics:

Shots going in:
http://thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=123432&d=1277911626


Close up of shots going in:
http://thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=123434&d=1277911641


Shots coming out:
http://thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=123433&d=1277911626

MCgunner
June 30, 2010, 11:48 AM
Impressive performance, but that's not plyboard, that's wafer board, and it's considerably easier to punch a hole through. But, yeah, if it'll go through a half inch of THAT, a human skull don't have a chance.

Tomahawk674
June 30, 2010, 11:51 AM
Hmm, I knew my "plywood" looked funny. Well I'll try and see if it goes through and inch of the stuff.

Ratdog68
June 30, 2010, 11:51 AM
Yer Tomahawkness... yer a gentleman, a scholar, and a fine judge of apple cider. :D Grassy Ass Ameeeeego.

Me thinks me wants one of those when the job hunt nets something promising. Lookin' like a fair amount of whallop for a lil' guy.

And, the fact that it's OSB, it makes it realistic of what's out there in the real world. Screw a scrap of drywall onto some 2x4s on the other side of that and you'll KNOW how it does with being contained within a typical house wall (minus the siding material).

Vermonter
June 30, 2010, 01:02 PM
Some type of OSB can be really hard from the glues they use. That stuff looks like it might be because it has the texture on it. Modern OSB is a lot better than it used to be.

GENTLEMAN OF THE CHARCOAL
June 30, 2010, 08:23 PM
Yeah, good thread. Interesting.. I own a couple of the NAA .22 mini mags. I use Triple Seven 3fff. It work's good. I don't mess with them much at all. Hell, it's been over a year since I shot one of them. If I need something small and tucked away I use one of my Colt Uberti Pocket .31's with the 4 inch barrel..Anyway, that's beside the point. I remember someone on a thread here was laughing about the NAA. I just let him laugh. No use arguing with a damn fool. I did tell him that it was plenty strong enough to get someone off of your ass in a hurry and that if it was loaded with half a dipper full as opposed to a full dipper, (half dipper is about a .22 Long Rifle) it would be more accurate and a lot easier to hit with. That little thing is accurate further out than one would think just looking at it...Anyway, glad to see this thread, the tests, and the pictures of the test....

Tomahawk674
June 30, 2010, 09:05 PM
Thanks GOC. I will try shooting through the two boards soon. Like I said, I don't think it's in the bb gun league. I sure as heck wouldn't stand in front of it.

MCgunner
June 30, 2010, 09:05 PM
Actually, IMHO, the NAA Companion or Super Companion is a better carry than a NAA cartridge gun which I also own. It's not so much ballistics, but the fact that I can carry a spare loaded cylinder in a watch pocket and I've got a faster reload (like I'll ever need it, just sayin') than with the cartridge gun. The super companion is fully capable of matching the .22 magnum in these little guns, though. Pretty impressive little piece. I've carried mine as a primary weapon when nothing else would do. I much prefer my 9mm, but hey, the little Super Companion is far better than nothing, or even an edged weapon, when no other option will work. You can carry this thing concealed in a nudist camp.

GENTLEMAN OF THE CHARCOAL
June 30, 2010, 09:22 PM
Yeah, I'vd got a concealed carry permit. Had one for so many years it's hard to remember for sure the date I first got one. But hell, I remember when I first got the NAA's I went whole hog. Belt holsters for either side, ankle holster, extra cylinders, extra nipples, extra base pin, hammer, all kinds of stuff!! I don't know what in hell I thought I was going to do! Anyway, I carried one for a few days after I first got them and I carried it in my shirt pocket! All my shirts have two pockets at least and they all button or zip. Haven't used a single damn one of the holsters! You're sure right. You could hide one of those little things in a nudist colony. Hell, the Colt Uberti .31 is damn near the same. I just drop it into one of my front trouser pockets or a coat pocket and I'm good to go. I don't ever carry one much anymore anyway....

Pulp
June 30, 2010, 10:24 PM
I've got the .22Mag. Back in the BIKMC (before I killed my chronograph) days, I chrono'd it with CCI and Winchester 40 grain bullets. 850 fps with the CCI and 950 with the Winchester.

So it wouldn't take much BP or 777 to improve on that.

MCgunner
July 1, 2010, 08:08 AM
I load my SC with 2.0 grains weight of Bullseye from a scoop I made out of an empty .22LR hull. It clocks a 30 grain pill about 1200 fps. This is what I carry. Of course, it shoots clean, too. 1 grain is around 800 fps which is about what I get from a good .22LR 36 grain HP round in my .22 model.

GENTLEMAN OF THE CHARCOAL
July 1, 2010, 11:43 AM
Just to prove I have the right to get into the conversation!!! I have lot's and lot's of assessories for them. (I own 2 of them)....I don't take good pictures..This one has been locked up in the nylon case for way over a year except for me checking it about every month or so. The other one is still sealed up. This is the only one I have ever used and it could be considered still brand new. PS..Sorry about the lighting and the focus. It could stand to have a little of the grease wiped off that I keep on it since I never use it....

MCgunner
July 1, 2010, 06:04 PM
A black widow grip? :D Nice little gun there and very useful.

The little farts are affordable, yet very high quality construction. I'm amazed they can be so affordable considering the lock work must be put together with watch making tools.

Tomahawk674
July 1, 2010, 06:34 PM
I just got back from shooting the two boards. (1/2 inch each).

- 1st shot was embedded into the first board

- 2nd shot went through the first board and bounced of the second

- 3rd shot went through the first board and embedded into the 2nd board.

- 4th & 5th shots went through the two boards.

Here are pics of the bullet recovered from the 2nd board vs unfired one:

Conclusion: The will surely go through a half inch of OSB and may or may not go through a whole inch of it with 5 grains of 777.


http://thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=123482&stc=1&d=1278023110

http://thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=123483&stc=1&d=1278023110

BHP FAN
July 1, 2010, 06:56 PM
Thanks... that Triple Seven sure is barky stuff!

GENTLEMAN OF THE CHARCOAL
July 1, 2010, 08:03 PM
McGunner..Thank you sir..

Tomahawk674
July 8, 2010, 10:33 AM
I'm out of NAA bullets, a bag of them is $4 but the shipping is $7. I can't find #4 buckshot in less than $25 bags. I went to walmart and bought a tin of 500 .22 airgun pellets for $6, crosman premier hollow points that weigh 14.3 grains each. Don't laugh at me :p

I'll let you know how they work soon.

MCgunner
July 8, 2010, 02:26 PM
Supposed to shoot just with a cap. Don't know, ain't tried it.

Just order 500 or a thousand rounds, then the shipping don't seem like so much. :D

Tomahawk674
July 8, 2010, 02:49 PM
Yes I've heard about shooting airgun pellets with caps only. But, since the pellets are shorter than the standard bullets, I was able to put about 6 grains of 777 in there. That should launch them pretty fast. I'll do some testing maybe later today. I have the OSB boards, another really tough kind of construction board, and a small phone book.

Tomahawk674
July 8, 2010, 06:42 PM
The first test with the pellets wasn't all too promosing. It went through less than half an inch worth of phone book. I'm finding unburnt powder in the back of the pellets though, maybe less powder is more.

robhof
July 8, 2010, 07:38 PM
I tried the pellets in front of 22 blanks for a quieter pest control in a regular NAA 22. The skirt of the pellet plated the base of the throat, took alot of scrubbing with a bronze brush to get it out, in my Super companion I use them with just the caps for my garage range gun, but they throw a 6" group at 20' from a rest, with powder and NAA bullets from a rest; I get 2" group. I've been using a 22lr with a soldered on handle as measure for bullseye; 1.9gr and getting 22lr + velocities.

Tomahawk674
July 9, 2010, 11:45 AM
I had a stock 30 grain bullet left and I tried that against the book for comparison. It made it through the book ok, but the board behind the book made it stick inside.

Loaded normally, the pellets were barely making it half way through the phone book (book is 0.6"). Then I tried them backwards and they worked much better, and made for a heck of a wadcutter! it almost went through the book as well.


Left entry hole is 30 grain stock bullet, right hole is pellet loaded backwards
http://thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=123890&d=1278689627

The stock bullet made it all the way through
http://thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=123891&d=1278689627



Also notice the unburnt powder stuck in the pellet hole. I guess that's what happens with such a light projectile.

arcticap
July 9, 2010, 01:30 PM
There's even heavier .22 pellets that weigh 26 - 28 grains.

http://www.pyramydair.com/s/p/Predator_Big_Boy_Senior_22_cal_28_5_Grains_Domed_100ct/805

http://www.pyramydair.com/s/p/Eun_Jin_22_Cal_28_4_Grains_Domed_125ct/194

Tomahawk674
July 9, 2010, 02:37 PM
Thanks articap, I've actually seen some of those, but the price per bullet is higher than NAA's.

The walmart pellets came out $7 per 500.

MCgunner
July 9, 2010, 08:12 PM
The problem I see with any kind of pellet is leading. I mean, it could happen with enough velocity with the NAA bullets, but pellets are really soft and thin.

tango2echo
July 9, 2010, 10:06 PM
Very cool thread. Thank you.

t2e

arcticap
July 10, 2010, 04:03 AM
Cheaper Than Dirt has NAA bullets for $2.81 which will save you over a buck for a box of 50.

http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/51222-1.html

MCgunner
July 10, 2010, 09:31 AM
WOW, thanks for the link! Not cheaper than NAA, but not bad. NAA offers 100 rounds for 4 bucks. BUT, these suckers have a SWC profile (assuming the picture is correct), not the round nose of NAAs. I'm going to try 'em. :D

andrewstorm
July 15, 2010, 12:23 AM
penatration is very good with 777? all i could stuff into my naa mag companion would only go half way thru my 3in thic book,but that bull eye stuff sent the bullet thru the phone book and the garage wall and out the other side into the ground,(mcgunners load works ):cool:

Tomahawk674
July 15, 2010, 10:47 AM
Well smokeless will always be in another class when compared to bp and its substitutes, but 777 wasn't bad at all. Like I posted on the opening of this thread, it went through an inch worth of OSB boards, and now I'm waiting for some more 30 grain bullets to keep testing. I have this really solid piece of construction wood that's 0.75" thick that I want to do some testing with. It doesn't quite look like plywood, but looks like something you'd use for a countertop. So far when shooting pellets at it, they just bounce off.

Tomahawk674
July 16, 2010, 06:58 PM
I have done some testing with my NAA and 777 fffg. Instead of the the provided scoop of ~4.5 grains, I used a .22lr case, which holds 5+. I shot this really tough board of some kind of fabricated wood. It's 0.75" thick.


Here's the material:

http://thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=124277&stc=1&d=1279320901


Here's what 14.3 grain pellets did to this board. They barely make a mark and come flying right back at me. (Eye protection was being used).

http://thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=124278&stc=1&d=1279320901


Here's the entry holes for the 30 grain bullets:

http://thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=124279&stc=1&d=1279320901


Here's an exit:

http://thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=124280&stc=1&d=1279320901

Loading tip: if you want to load a little more powder in the cylinder, the bullet won't want to go down, so instead of trying to overcompress it, use a flat portion of the loading lever to flatten the bullet noses so the cylinder will fit in the gun and not drag.

MCgunner
July 17, 2010, 09:22 AM
WOW, thanks for the link! Not cheaper than NAA, but not bad. NAA offers 100 rounds for 4 bucks. BUT, these suckers have a SWC profile (assuming the picture is correct), not the round nose of NAAs. I'm going to try 'em.

I ordered 500 to justify the shipping. They came, yesterday. They're the same round nose bullets as NAA sells for $4 a hundred and these were 2.70 or something for 50. So, I guess I got screwed, but not THAT bad. The picture on that sight is NOT the bullet being sold, though. I think they might just buy 'em from NAA and repackage for a profit, not sure. I'll shoot 'em up eventually. Don't need any more bullets at this time, at least. :D

arcticap
July 17, 2010, 12:26 PM
Sorry to hear that their photo is wrong.
At least they didn't rustle your cattle! :D

andrewstorm
July 18, 2010, 12:07 PM
:cool:mc gunner what u see is not what u get ever ,u need to develop a sixth sence,on mail order ,as i say,pay then pray,you get what you orderd,allways read the fine print,and between the lines. wonder what the companion would do with a 4 inch barrel,i think ill have some custom work done on mine , hows the oil spill on the coast ie B P,s blunder, hope it doesnt affect you or yours.

Mr Woody
July 18, 2010, 01:19 PM
I have not read all of this tread but if anyone is interested in a cheap and repeatable penetration test here is what I did for college project:

Take a couple 1x6 pine boards and cut them into sections about 1 foot long. Stack them together and put a board on each side and screw through the board into the sides of every other stacked board. Shake out the loose boards and you now have an even spacing. You can continue this as long as you want. Shoot into the boards and see how many they go through and how the bullet performs. It's easy for anyone to repeat and compare results.

Woody

andrewstorm
July 18, 2010, 01:35 PM
From what I have read,the phone book is the closest thing to ballistic gelatin laying around the house , as it can flex ,wood shooting is fun though,

arcticap
July 18, 2010, 07:27 PM
I've seen interesting results left by various .22 lr's, shorts and CCI Stingers being fired through a bar of Ivory soap. You can really see the difference in velocity & expansion from the size & shape of the hole that's left in the soap which stays intact. The cavities all had a cone/funnel shape with either more or less powder residue left behind.

Busyhands94
March 1, 2011, 02:45 AM
i like that a lot! i will be getting one of these little wonders soon but i will put a rear sight on mine for enhanced accuracy!

batjka
March 1, 2011, 07:58 AM
I have read a report from a gentleman that loaded 1 gr of Bullseye into a Super Companion. He got an uneven ignition because the powder was not filling the chamber. The bullet got stuck in the barrel and the next bullet exploded the gun. So please be very careful with a 1gr load. You might have to tilt the gun muzzle up before taking a shot to ensure all the powder is concentrated against the cap.

This is the reason I actually got a Freedom Arms mini (equivalent of a LR Companion) instead of the Super Companion.

BHP FAN
March 1, 2011, 12:59 PM
You don't need to put a rear sight on it, they actually make a red dot lazer for it! Seriously though I bought a bunch [500] of bullets, but I'd sure like to find a mold for mine.

BHP FAN
March 1, 2011, 01:01 PM
http://www.cheaperthandirt.com/SCP834-1.html

Busyhands94
March 1, 2011, 09:38 PM
Lyman sells a nice mold for .22 bullets, you can choose what alloy you want and you can recover the lead from your backstop and then melt it, skim off the impurities, and pour some more bullets for free! and you can also get wheel weights from auto repair shops, used lead from shooting ranges, you can get a huge hunk of lead from old car batteries (wear gloves, eye protection, and a respirator when recovering/melting it because of the chemicals) and you can basically shoot the same lead over and over again an infinite amount of times! here is a nice bullet mold if anybody is interested in making their own! http://www.midwayusa.com/viewproduct/?productnumber=538620

Jaymo
July 22, 2011, 08:34 PM
Something to keep in mind when shooting .22 airgun pellets through the SC is the fact that .22 airgun pellets are smaller diameter than .22LR bullets. .22 pellets are between .219 and .221 diameter.

I really wish NAA would put the long barrel and sights of the Mini Master on the SC.

BTW, pure lead airgun pellets are no softer than pure lead .22LR bullets.
In fact, Crosman pellets aren't pure lead, and are harder than pure lead pellets.

The Eun Jin pellets are nice. I use them in my .22 PCPs for small game hunting.

Busyhands94
July 23, 2011, 03:24 PM
i found out how to shoot the pellets out of the Super Companion. just put two grain in there, then a wad of newspaper on top then you put your pellet on top. heavy pellets work best, but light ones will do. if yo go too light they will keyhole. i found that RWS domed pellets work fantastic! they penetrate well, and will sail right through a half an inch of wood. i used an old fence board to hold up my target and it worked well! i also tried some vintage Benjamin High-Compression pellets in my super companion. they worked really well and i could hold a pretty small group with it.

another pellet trick i found works well, cut the skirt of some Beeman pointed tip pellets. you will have a lead cone. now make ten of those. then, load them under 4 grains o powder with a newspaper wad. the result is two projectiles that will still fly through a fence board with relative ease. you can collect the tips of the pellets, load three per chamber on top of 4 grains of powder with a wad. then drip some candle wax on there to keep em' in place. they turn on their side for a cutting effect. they leave 3 oblong holes a shot and penetrate well! i figure 15 0f these things should do some damage!

Sincerely, Levi

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