+P and +P+ 9mm Ammo: What guns do you use?


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SharpsDressedMan
July 9, 2010, 08:48 PM
For those that use a 9mm, and use the hotter +P and +P+, what guns do you use it in, and which load do you use? I have a small cache of Win 127 +P+ and was wondering which guns were designed for using it. I know it is best to limit the use, but I plan to practice with slightly lighter loads, but sight in and carry the "good stuff".

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jaysouth
July 9, 2010, 09:22 PM
If you plan to shoot less than 50,000 rounds of hot-hot ammo, do not worry about it. All major labels will handle it fine. If you can afford this much ammo, why worry about errornet BS about high pressure ammo.

A 'small' cache will not hurt any gun above a Hi-point.

Concerning wear and accelerated wear from hot ammo, your wrists and wallet will wear out before your gun.

legion3
July 9, 2010, 09:45 PM
I agree...

it would be hard to afford enough +p+ to do any real harm to modern 9mm firearms.

Any NATO spec gun should be fine. Glocks for example will handle it all day and twice on Sunday. Almost all my 9mm Glocks have fired plenty of Ranger 127 +P+ with no ill effects. These include first generation G17 and G17L to a modern era Glock 26 and 19.

This is an older report but interesting. I have not found the Glock 19 issue to occur however, so I disagree with that. Interesting that the new Browning hi Powers also cruise with +P+.
Anyway its an older report.

wnycollector
July 9, 2010, 10:08 PM
My preferred carry round is the Federal 9BPLE 115 gr +P+, but I am down to my last mag of that:( I currently carry Magtech's 115gr +p+ JHP. I have put ~500 rounds of +p+ ammo through my S&W Model 910 w/ wolff 18lb recoil spring with no ill effects.

chieftain
July 9, 2010, 10:14 PM
NATO SPEC 9mm equals American +P pressures. We Americans emasculated the 9mm many years ago to what we call "standard" pressure. It was designed as what we call the +P. Which by the way does NOT exceed SAMMI specs.

+P+ does exceed SAMMI specs.

It is about pressure. One thing is absolute, higher pressure loads will always wear the weapon more than lower pressure loads. Always.

With that said, Any Glock, HK, Beretta, Highpower, Glock, Walther, Ruger, S&W, etc. That is certified to handle NATO ammo will handle +P (no difference). As for +P+ loads, in reasonable amounts should not cause any problem for today's 9mm mainline handguns, and most, NOT ALL, earlier made guns.

Presently my CCW weapon is a HK P30 V2 LEM 9mm, and carry Cor-Bon 115gr DPX +P 9mm in it. Deadly accurate and reliable and gentle to shoot.

Go figure.

Fred

brabham78
July 9, 2010, 10:48 PM
CZ 75 D Compact PCR
Walther PPS
Ruger SR9

My normal carry ammo in all three 9's is Cor Bon DPX 115gr 9mm+P

I've done a fair amount of ballistic tesing of 9+P. DPX is one of the top performers from my experience.

Haven't tried +P+

Sapper771
July 10, 2010, 05:35 AM
I currently use Corbon 115gr +P hollowpoints in my G17/G34/G19/G26.
All the reports that I have read on this round have been very positive.
I have not fired very much of this ammo through my Glocks because I am not rich. I have run a few boxes of the Speer 124gr +P through my G17 with good results.

I have been looking into the 147gr weight HPs here recently. Main reason is for the increased penetration they offer. I haven't made up my mind yet on whether or not a switch to the heavier weight would be better.

legion3
July 10, 2010, 07:28 AM
I looked at the and have tried the Corbon DPX. The little bullet that acts like a heavy bullet. I initially thought about putting that in my G26. Stephen Camp chronoed the DPX and 127 +P+ out of the Glock 26 and it showed

DPX
Average Velocity 1181 Extreme Spread 50 Std. Deviation 17

Ranger 127
Average Velocity 1246 Extreme Spread 33 Std. Deviation 13

So I know use the DPX in my back up mags to my longer barreled Glocks.


The 127 +P+ ranger has been around a while an proved it self numerous times.

The Corbon is very expensive. The Ranger less so. Both will work I can just afford to have more Ranger on hand.

FWIW Evan Marshall and his gang at Stopping Power.net are huge fans of the DPX and I have read his second choice would be the 127.

W.E.G.
July 10, 2010, 08:35 AM
http://i227.photobucket.com/albums/dd7/rkba2da/pistol%20pics/Glock/kool_aidGlock.jpg

CDW4ME
July 10, 2010, 09:10 AM
Glock 19 and 26 with +P and +P+
My logic:
Winchester sells a lot of +P+ to police departments, if it caused a problem (like guns blowing up after a box or two) they wouldn't continue buying it.
Glocks are also chambered in .357 sig. If they can stand up to .357 sig then +P and +P+ 9mm shouldn't be a problem.
I would not worry about shooting 1,000 rounds of the +P+ through either of my Glocks over time, other than cost of ammunition (but none of it is free).

jonboynumba1
July 10, 2010, 09:36 AM
Most +P and even some +P+ 9mm ammo really isn't all that hot....for instance Gold Dot's +P 124gr load is about right where it should be to work well (without looking around 1200 FPS) I have some +P Federal stuff somewhere that is well under 1200 (and federals number are usually hyped up a bit IMHO) The federal actually shoots better in our XD9's but the GD is a better bullet IMHO and 9mm really needs to be over 1200FPS to work right IME. For some companies I think +P and +P+ is more about marketing than anything else.

WC145
July 10, 2010, 09:46 AM
My preferred carry round is the Federal 9BPLE 115 gr +P+, but I am down to my last mag of that I currently carry Magtech's 115gr +p+ JHP. I have put ~500 rounds of +p+ ammo through my S&W Model 910 w/ wolff 18lb recoil spring with no ill effects.

I also carry 9BPLE +P+, it is my duty load and the only hollow point 9mm round I use. I've used it in a number of guns and never had a problem. It always feeds well and is very accurate. I've clocked it at an average of 1307fps out of a HK USP. I've never had to use it on a human but it's hell on porcupines, I've had several one-shot stops on them.

Here's a list of guns I've used it in-
Custom 9mm S&W 360J
Taurus 905
Kel-tec PF9
Kel-tec SUB-2000
Beretta Cougar 8000D
Glock 19
HK USP
S&W 1911 9mm Pro Series

IMO any quality modern 9mm firearm should be fine with +P+ ammo, especially if you limit it's use.


ETA:
Most +P and even some +P+ 9mm ammo really isn't all that hot....for instance Gold Dot's +P 124gr load is about right where it should be to work well (without looking around 1200 FPS) I have some +P Federal stuff somewhere that is well under 1200 (and federals number are usually hyped up a bit IMHO) The federal actually shoots better in our XD9's but the GD is a better bullet IMHO and 9mm really needs to be over 1200FPS to work right IME. For some companies I think +P and +P+ is more about marketing than anything else.

When I chrono'd the 9BPLE I also checked a few others, here's how they turned out (all shot from a HK USP)-
Federal 9BPLE 115gr JHP +P+ = 1307fps
Magtech Guardian Gold 115gr JHP +P = 1188fps
WWB 115gr FMJ = 1176fps
Magtech 115gr FMJ = 1133fps

kokapelli
July 10, 2010, 10:16 AM
One of the reasons I bought a Kahr K9 is it is factory approved for +P+ ammo and I have fired a bunch of Hirtenberger 100 gr +P+ from the K9.

I fired a few rounds of the Hirtenberger through a chronograph the guy in the next lane had set up and I don't remember the exact speed but it was well over 1500 fps.

MCgunner
July 10, 2010, 10:20 AM
I carry a +P handload in my Kel Tec and shot it sparingly over the years with that load. It shoots 1263 fps/410 ft lbs with a 115 grain XTP bullet. It's not rated for a constant diet of +P, but for "limited". I also have a Ruger P85 and you can't break that gun with a steady diet of +P+, let alone +P. The P11 is what rides with me daily, though, and if I ever break it (11K and counting rounds in 14 years), it's lifetime warrantied.

BushyGuy
July 10, 2010, 10:43 AM
I used +p Corbon 125 gr in both my Taurus PT92 Compact and my Ruger SR9, it seems they can handle the high pressure loads . I just wont make a habit of shooting alot thru them i only use them for CC, i shoot regularly with WWB and AE 115 gr FMJ.

birddog2
July 10, 2010, 06:15 PM
Hey Jaysouth,
Why the Hi- Point bashing?
Ever owned one?
They are my test guns, thousands of rounds fed through them loaded above Max.
Still have all my fingers, both eyes and 2 reliable handguns.
John

chieftain
July 10, 2010, 10:51 PM
Hey Jaysouth,
Why the Hi- Point bashing?
Ever owned one?
They are my test guns, thousands of rounds fed through them loaded above Max.
Still have all my fingers, both eyes and 2 reliable handguns.


Hi-Point is not a high quality weapon. But as you infer they are much better than many shooters believe.

I would not advise anyone use High or excessive pressure loads on any gun of any marque or quality that is blow back operated as the Hi-Point is. I believe that is just foolish.

I doubt if there was a problem with the Hi-Point it would be your fingers, more likely your arms or head. I hope not. But the science ain’t on your side.

Good luck.

Go figure.

Fred

The Lone Haranguer
July 11, 2010, 08:12 AM
I know it is best to limit the use, but I plan to practice with slightly lighter loads, but sight in and carry the "good stuff".
With this kind of usage, any decent pistol will handle these loads. The only people wearing out or breaking pistols shooting huge amounts of +P+ loads are taxpayer funded. ;) Having said that, I would say that steel-framed pistols like the CZ75, S&W 5906, etc. would be the most durable, followed (or tied) by the Glock 17, perhaps with more frequent recoil spring changes.

kokapelli
July 11, 2010, 09:14 AM
With this kind of usage, any decent pistol will handle these loads. The only people wearing out or breaking pistols shooting huge amounts of +P+ loads are taxpayer funded. ;) Having said that, I would say that steel-framed pistols like the CZ75, S&W 5906, etc. would be the most durable, followed (or tied) by the Glock 17, perhaps with more frequent recoil spring changes.
Since the Kahr K9 is factory rated for +P+ so I would rate it first.:D

mjb
July 11, 2010, 04:17 PM
The only 9mm I have is a Sig 229. However, according to Ruger, you can shoot +P+ in their guns.

kokapelli
July 11, 2010, 04:26 PM
Is that stated in Ruger's manuals?

Deaf Smith
July 11, 2010, 10:04 PM
Glock 26. Winchester +p+ 127gr load. Chrons out of my Glock 26 at 1246.

Deaf

mjb
July 12, 2010, 06:43 PM
I was told that by a Ruger rep over the telephone.

zhyla
July 12, 2010, 06:55 PM
There aren't many guns that are rated for +P+ loads. H&K USP and later are, there's another brand but I always forget it.

kokapelli
July 12, 2010, 07:50 PM
I was told that by a Ruger rep over the telephone.
I want it in writing! What if the guy has a short memory or isn't employed there anymore?

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