10/22 Liberty Training Rifle incl. Pics


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Al LaVodka
July 11, 2010, 12:38 AM
As many know, Project Appleseed is a national program to train people in the tradition of basic rifle marksmanship. The “Liberty Training Rifle” developed as a cheaper-shooting alternative to centerfires and is based on the Ruger 10/22.

http://appleseedproject.blogspot.com/2008/02/liberty-training-rifle.html

For fun I decided to sign up for two days of an Appleseed class this Fall. It was also an excuse to find my old 10/22 and modify it for the class which is what I've done here. I've added the Tech-Sights that make the picture look like everything from the Garand to the M-4 (which is very easy but was a real chore for me personally because of what was previously mounted and stuck -- I had to drill parts off!). I also added a Buffer Technologies Bolt Buffer.

Everything else I already had including an extended mag release, ventilated handguard, flash-hider/muzzle-break, 50-rnd. mag., swivel studs and Quick-Detachable sling swivels (1"), quality adjustable sling (may switch to wider swivels and a more serious loop sling before I go)... Click pics below!

I've shown you mine, now let's see yours!

Al

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scottishclaymore
July 11, 2010, 01:02 AM
I just finished building one of these. I'll get some pics taken tomorrow and put them up there. I'll be at the Davilla, TX shoot in case anyone else is going.

scottishclaymore
July 11, 2010, 01:38 AM
Bah. Couldn't wait.

Here is my LTR and accompanying gear.

http://i42.photobucket.com/albums/e306/Scottishclaymore/100_0151.jpg

Started with a stainless model Ruger 10/22. Added Tech Sights, an M1 Carbine-style stock designed for the Ruger 10/22, and a surplus M1 Carbine sling. Five 10-round magazines, two 25-round magazines. Also have a .22 caliber boresnake. This, along with a rag, a can of solvent, a can of lubricant, a pen, a small journal-type notebook, eye & ear protection, multitool, and Tilly hat, and 500 rounds of CCI Mini-Mags, make up my appleseed gear.

Also, I have a Yugo SKS that I have recently outfitted with tech sights. They have improved my groupings with it by 200% easily. I'll be taking it along as well.

MikePaiN
July 11, 2010, 09:07 AM
:neener: Scott, I was going to build the exact same rifle for LTR(too match my real M1 Carbine) but in the end I figured it was to expensive a venture and went the cheaper route with a Marlin 795

http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x298/Mikepain_pics/DSC02657.jpg
http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x298/Mikepain_pics/DSC02659.jpg
http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x298/Mikepain_pics/DSC02658.jpg
http://i181.photobucket.com/albums/x298/Mikepain_pics/DSC02662.jpg

scottishclaymore
July 12, 2010, 12:27 AM
Mike,

Nothing wrong with the Marlin at all. :)

That said, I must say the feel of the pseudo-M1 is very, very nice. I will say I didn't notice the expense since I've been purchasing each component over the course of about 6 months. I love it like it is, and my dad liked it so much I built him the same setup for Father's day.

ScratchnDent
July 12, 2010, 12:33 AM
I looove those Tech-sights.

http://i288.photobucket.com/albums/ll198/ScratchnDentthr/1022002.jpg

Trebor
July 12, 2010, 05:17 AM
What can you do to improve the 10/22 accuracy with that pseudo-Carbine stock?

I like the M-1 Carbine look, but I'd only get one if you can still do some accuracy tweaks to the gun with that stock installed.

scottishclaymore
July 12, 2010, 10:02 AM
I don't see why you couldn't. The only functional difference I can see between it and the regular stock is the wooden handguard over the top of the barrel. What kind of accuracy tweaks did you have in mind?

winknplink
July 12, 2010, 11:58 AM
Just got the sights on mine and got them dialed-in yesterday. Still pondering stock/trigger upgrades. Trying to make the Appleseed shoot in southern IN next month.

http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll92/zurkon/001.jpg

http://i286.photobucket.com/albums/ll92/zurkon/002-2.jpg

CraigC
July 12, 2010, 12:26 PM
Best thing you can do for a stock carbine that you plan on using with iron sights is to have the barrel set back and rechambered. Makes a world of difference. Though you 'may' have to still free float it to get the best results. I went a different route with a Clark midweight barrel. This one shoots well under a half inch at 50yds and 3/4"@100yds with Wolf MT. Shot a best score of 242 with it back in April, with Federal bulk ammo.

http://photos.imageevent.com/newfrontier45/sixgunsiii/large/Nodak%20NDS-22-18b.jpg

bigfatdave
July 12, 2010, 03:16 PM
What can you do to improve the 10/22 accuracy with that pseudo-Carbine stock?

Improved ergonomics, mostly. The tech-sights are adding most of the improvement, plus the sling, with the stock a distant third.

I built mine because a) .30 carbine ammo was a bit too expensive for plinking, b) My M1 carbine is a relic I don't want to abuse, and c) I wanted a trainer I could shoot all day for $20.

"accuracy improvement" is all great, but I'm not going to be shooting the real thing or the trainer off of a bench, I'm going to do appleseed with them and punch targets (and maybe small game) with them.

Hatterasguy
July 12, 2010, 03:27 PM
I'm going to throw a set of those sights and a sling on my 10/22 for the Appleseed. If I go back next year I may through a trigger pack into it.

I'm not 100% on shooting the 10/22 though, I may bring it as a backup and shoot my Sig or K31 insted. If I can get a decent set of iron sights for the Sig its going.

gb0399
July 12, 2010, 03:54 PM
I am also going to an appleseed this October. I was planning on building a training rifle like the ones above, but I have recently changed my mind and I am looking towards the M&P 15-22. What do you think about that?

winknplink
July 12, 2010, 04:38 PM
I am also going to an appleseed this October. I was planning on building a training rifle like the ones above, but I have recently changed my mind and I am looking towards the M&P 15-22. What do you think about that?

I was going to use an AR, but I have trouble getting prone with a 30-round magazine (short arms, I reckon). By the time I paid for 3-4 20-rounders, I could have purchased the tech sites for the 10/22 and been money ahead (not including ammo savings). So I just went that way.

I don't know of a short mag for the M&P 15-22, there may very well be one, IDK, but if you can get prone with the mags you have, I'd say go for it. From what I have read about selecting an Appleseed rifle, "people" say the 15-22 is more accurate 'right out of the box', but that the 10/22 shows more potential for accuracy with some work after purchase. Again, not my personal experience, just what I have read.

gb0399
July 12, 2010, 04:41 PM
I believe you are refering to a thread I started a few days ago where I asked about the accuracy of both rifles. That was one of the factors for me deciding to go with the M&P.

gb0399
July 12, 2010, 04:43 PM
Winknplink, curious, you said you are going to an appleseed in southern IN, and not one in KY. I know there are plenty in KY, any reason for the one you chose?

winknplink
July 12, 2010, 04:47 PM
The event in Evansville is practically in my backyard.

gb0399
July 12, 2010, 04:49 PM
thats a pretty good reason

Floppy_D
July 12, 2010, 05:02 PM
I'll play:

http://i205.photobucket.com/albums/bb11/floppy_d/M122-2.jpg

http://i205.photobucket.com/albums/bb11/floppy_d/M122-3.jpg

Nikdfish
July 12, 2010, 06:12 PM
I did one a while back based on a SS Wal-Mart Special. Tech sights, extended mag release & sling w/ quik detach swivels. The long barrel on the special works well with iron sights...

http://www.skhowell.com/images/IMGP1914-web.jpg

Nick

winknplink
July 13, 2010, 12:16 PM
Yeah, I can only imagine how clean the sight picture is with the 20" bbl.

earlthegoat2
July 13, 2010, 12:29 PM
Do you have to use a military style aperture or would a Williams peep sight conversion like this work as well?

http://i285.photobucket.com/albums/ll66/earlthegoat2/SDC11413.jpg

Sorry about the quality but you can barely see the sight at the rear. It also has a raised fiber optic in front so I could get a more comfortable cheek weld.

ScratchnDent
July 13, 2010, 01:14 PM
Do you have to use a military style aperture or would a Williams peep sight conversion like this work as well?

You can use any sight set you like at an Appleseed, they aren't picky about gear!

CraigC
July 13, 2010, 01:16 PM
It will work fine but you may find the fiber optic front sight to be a little less suited to fine work than a black post.


Yeah, I can only imagine how clean the sight picture is with the 20" bbl.
Actually it's 22", even better!

Nikdfish
July 13, 2010, 01:29 PM
Pretty similar to the sight radius on my M1 ...

http://www.skhowell.com/images/liberty-n-M1.jpg

Nick

OpelBlitz
July 15, 2010, 01:26 PM
For those of you using the Ruger 10/22 with the M1 Carbine stock - I'm assuming you only use the hasty sling method right? That was my main problem with going this route, and therefore went the Marlin 795 route.

kyjam
July 15, 2010, 07:10 PM
I wanted to post a picture of the GI slings we use at Appleseed so you can find one before you go. We use 2 sling positions and this sling will work for both.

http://www.appleseedstore.flyingcart.com/?p=detail&pid=10&cat_id=0
You can get them at different places online, but I could find this link quickly to provide a pic.

OpelBlitz
July 15, 2010, 08:22 PM
kyjam, did you read my post, and do you know what I'm referring to? I've been to quite a few Appleseeds. http://www.rifleshootermag.com/shooting_tips/sling_0612/ also explains the two positions.

The sling on the M1 Carbine, and 10/22 rifles with the M1 Carbine-style stock, attach in the front using a snap, and wrap around an oiler container through the opposite end of the stock in the rear. Using the Deliberate (preferred) sling with the M1 Carbine is therefore unfeasable. So my question was to everyone who has this type of stock, do they just use the hasty position then?

gb0399
July 15, 2010, 09:52 PM
kyjam, did you read my post, and do you know what I'm referring to? I've been to quite a few Appleseeds.

I don't think she was posting in response to your post. By the way she is an Appleseed instructor, she probably understands.

OpelBlitz
July 15, 2010, 09:54 PM
I can see that happening. My apologize to kyjam.

bigfatdave
July 15, 2010, 10:49 PM
OpelBlitz, mostly hasty, but if you drop the oiler and put in a small dowel (or in my case, a fragment of a bamboo chopstick) you can pop out the rear sling point fairly handily.

Works for the real deal too, it isn't pretty but it is functional.

kyjam
July 16, 2010, 09:32 AM
Opelblitz, sorry. I was mainly posting to the guys with 10/22s and 795s to show them the type of sling preferred. :) Participants have used zip ties, you name it, to get a military sling to work on their rifle.

alemonkey
July 16, 2010, 10:27 PM
I love my Tech Sights. Best thing since sliced bread. With the Green Mountain barrel mine is an awesome shooter. It's a little dirty in the second picture, after a long rainy Appleseed weekend.

http://i249.photobucket.com/albums/gg215/bkoenig1975/IMG_0894.jpg

http://i249.photobucket.com/albums/gg215/bkoenig1975/IMG_1433.jpg

winknplink
July 18, 2010, 11:55 AM
How is the slip-on front sight base for .920" bbl working?

alemonkey
July 18, 2010, 01:56 PM
How is the slip-on front sight base for .920" bbl working?

It works great, it just glues on with a little locktite. It's been banged around through a couple Appleseeds and a lot of range time and it's still holding strong.

I was really happy when Tech Sights came out with that bull barrel adaptor. The standard 16" lightweight barrel on a 10/22 is just too light for me to shoot well off hand. I need the extra weight to help hold it steady. I didn't want to use a scope, though, so this gives me the best of both worlds for my purposes.

You-Two
September 16, 2010, 01:57 AM
Best thing you can do for a stock carbine that you plan on using with iron sights is to have the barrel set back and rechambered. Makes a world of difference. Though you 'may' have to still free float it to get the best results. I went a different route with a Clark midweight barrel. This one shoots well under a half inch at 50yds and 3/4"@100yds with Wolf MT. Shot a best score of 242 with it back in April, with Federal bulk ammo.

http://photos.imageevent.com/newfrontier45/sixgunsiii/large/Nodak%20NDS-22-18b.jpg
CraigC,

What front sight base did you use to mount the Tech Sight front on the Clark midweight? I have the same barrel & stock and was disappointed I couldn't add the Tech sights. Your setup looks nice and I'd like to do the same thing. Mine is currently setup with a 4x Nikon, shoots really well.

Thanks!

bpl
September 16, 2010, 09:20 PM
If one were considering buying a 10/22 in order to build an LTR for a future Appleseed event, which model would be best, and why? I'd actually like to build two, one on a youth model and the other on an adult model. Thanks!

CraigC
September 16, 2010, 10:14 PM
That's the lowest base I could find, one from Marbles. Due to the increased front sight height, I had to use a shorter National Match front sight post and a Tech Sights TS200 module for the rear to get the proper elevation. Took a lot of tinkering to get it right but it works great. Not totally satisfied with the stock though, the pistol grip is too short and I need another half inch of comb height.

You-Two
September 16, 2010, 10:16 PM
That's the lowest base I could find, one from Marbles. Due to the increased front sight height, I had to use a shorter National Match front sight post and a Tech Sights TS200 module for the rear to get the proper elevation. Took a lot of tinkering to get it right but it works great. Not totally satisfied with the stock though, the pistol grip is too short and I need another half inch of comb height.
Thanks for the info!

alemonkey
September 17, 2010, 08:59 PM
If one were considering buying a 10/22 in order to build an LTR for a future Appleseed event, which model would be best, and why? I'd actually like to build two, one on a youth model and the other on an adult model. Thanks!

BPL, i would just buy the standard model and add Tech Sights & sling swivels. It really doesn't need anything else. That being said, if I was starting from scratch I would get a Marlin 795 since they're cheaper and usually more accurate in stock form.

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