Safest way to carry Cattleman


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Topcat
July 12, 2010, 09:23 PM
Hi I have a single action Cattleman .45 made by Uberti does anyone know whether it's ok to load it with six or should I load it with five cartridges like the good old days?

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BCCL
July 12, 2010, 09:25 PM
Only 5, and here's an easy way to do it.

Put the hammer on half-cock and open the gate and load the first chamber, skip the second one, then load the next 4, bring the hammer back to full cock and lower it, and your resting on the one you skipped.

:)

Topcat
July 12, 2010, 09:59 PM
thx for the info I will have to write that down or I will never remember

surbat6
July 14, 2010, 06:14 PM
I agree with BCCL. Carry five - and the best way to load is just as posted. I do have an older Uberti Cattleman and for import, the hammer is rigged with a safety block. When you engage the first notch on the hammer, a little block is lowered to prevent the hammer's forward movement. It's a less intrusive system than the crossbolt safeties and long cylinder pins other imported SAA's have used to pass the drop test. BUT, IMO, it's a CYA measure. I'll rely on the safety between my ears and load 5 in this revolver.

BHP FAN
July 14, 2010, 08:11 PM
like others have said, ''load one, skip one, load four more''....and if you haven't already, buy a Colt SAA base pin.the long Italian basepins drive me nuts.

The Bushmaster
July 15, 2010, 10:35 AM
Oh the heck with those loading rules...Just load it. There is no problem loading 5 chambers at once and rotating to the empty chamber to let the hammer down. Or you can load all 6 chambers and let the hammer down between rounds.

Lar1911
July 15, 2010, 02:14 PM
The uberti have has click that brings the hammer off the round. When I bought mine the dealer was explaining it to me. Go back one click and you will see.

I am not sure if I would trust it, and I would feel fine carry 5 instead of six for self defense or carry for big angry furry attackers (of course practice drawing and coming on target fast, animals will not hesitate at the sight of a gun)

The Bushmaster
July 15, 2010, 02:51 PM
Unless Uberti has redesigned the safety position on their single action or have modified it like Ruger I would never trust the safety position on any single action revolver.

Jim Watson
July 15, 2010, 04:13 PM
I remember reading Skeeter Skelton's instructions to load one, skip one, load four, full cock, hammer automatically down on the empty. Works fine IF your chambers are clean and your ammo is factory or perfectly reloaded. I have seen enough SASS guns tied up with foul chambers, bent brass, and high primers that I just throw in five any old way and roll the cylinder to be sure it turns freely before finding the empty to carry on.

Some of the Italian copies have a hammer block tripped by a pushrod going down into the safety notch. It appears kind of light duty and I would still stick to five loaded.

Some other Italian copies have a long base pin with an extra groove in it to where you can slide it back until the rear of the base pin blocks the hammer from falling farther than the safety notch. Awkward to deal with.

In the book version of The Searchers, Amos (renamed Ethan when played by John Wayne) loads the sixth chamber when approaching an Indian camp. A definite extra round in a hazardous situation was worth more than theoretical day-to-day safety.

rcmodel
July 15, 2010, 04:21 PM
When I bought mine the dealer was explaining it to me. Go back one click and you will see.That is just the standard old Colt type "safety" notch on the hammer. We have known for over 100 years it is a fragile arrangement at best, and should not be trusted with a round under the hammer.

Even a fairly light blow to the hammer will break off the tiny trigger tip holding the hammer, and the gun will fire.

A lot of old cowboys had a gimp right leg because a saddle stirrup fell down and whacked the hammer on a fully loaded SAA while tightening the cinch strap. I imagine the resulting boom was not only painful to the cowboy, but scared the crap out of the horse too.

As noted earlier, the only safe way to carry a traditional SAA of any make is with an empty chamber under the hammer.

1. Load one.
2. Skip one.
3. Load four.
5. Finish cocking the hammer and let it all the way down on the empty chamber.

That not only protects you from an ND, but it protects the fragile hammer hook & trigger tip from being damaged by impact.

BTW: NEVER let a SAA hammer down from the half cock position.
Always finish cocking it every time you load it from the half-cock position.
To do otherwise puts the locking bolt in a bind and will quickly scar the cylinder with a turn ring.

rc

BCCL
July 15, 2010, 05:17 PM
I remember reading Skeeter Skelton's instructions to load one, skip one, load four, full cock, hammer automatically down on the empty. Works fine IF your chambers are clean and your ammo is factory or perfectly reloaded. I have seen enough SASS guns tied up with foul chambers, bent brass, and high primers that I just throw in five any old way and roll the cylinder to be sure it turns freely before finding the empty to carry on.

Jim, you've honestly got me confused here. If the problem you describe is being caused by "foul chambers, bent brass and high primers"...then how will it matter which manner you load? You still have to rotate the cylinder for either method roughly the same right?

Jim Watson
July 15, 2010, 06:46 PM
I give the cylinder at least a full turn after loading and before aligning the empty space.
The quick way can give trouble if the bad round is the last one in.

Lucky Derby
July 15, 2010, 07:27 PM
Another vote for the following.

"1. Load one.
2. Skip one.
3. Load four.
5. Finish cocking the hammer and let it all the way down on the empty chamber."

My former boss put a 158gr SJHP .357 through his calf muscle carring a Colt with all six loaded. He used the so called safety notch, and holstered the revolver. while he was walking around he rested his hand on the hammer spur, That is all it took.

As far as loading six and resting the hammer between chambers a'la the old cap n ball revolvers, that sounds like a great way to break a firing pin and score the cylinder to me.

BCCL
July 15, 2010, 07:55 PM
I give the cylinder at least a full turn after loading and before aligning the empty space.
The quick way can give trouble if the bad round is the last one in.

But wouldn't a bad round get you with either way of loading? At some point it's going to have to rotate around through the frame, no matter how it was loaded.

BCCL
July 15, 2010, 08:02 PM
Along the lines of this topic, I couldn't resist getting out one of my SA's with some aluminum dummy rounds and testing both methods.

With the "Load one, skip two" method, your pretty much fool proof, every time you end up with the empty chamber under the hammer.

Loading 5 straight, you have to turn the cylinder an extra spin around, and look to make sure you have the last round in front of the hammer, to then bring the gun to full cock and rotate the empty one under the hammer.

The "skip two" method was not only faster (average time for me was 8 seconds from gun on the table and 5 rounds laying beside it), but actually easier and less trouble. Loading 5 straight (average time was 13 seconds) was initially quick, but having to spin them around again and make sure they were in the right place before finishing was not only slower, but actually increased the risk of getting the wrong chamber under the hammer.

There might just be a reason why the "skip two" method is so well established. :)

Jim Watson
July 15, 2010, 08:47 PM
Skip two?
I thot it was skip one.

BCCL
July 15, 2010, 10:30 PM
Skip two?
I thot it was skip one.

"two" as in the number 2 chamber....."load 1, skip 2, load 3,4,5,6............"

ArchAngelCD
July 16, 2010, 06:23 AM
BCCL,
If you got the reload down to 8 seconds you are doing very well. Try this and you might cut another second or two off, when loading 3-4 and 5-6 have 2 rounds in your hand each time and you will be even faster.

BCCL
July 16, 2010, 09:00 AM
I'll give that a try ArchAngelCD!

dashootist
July 16, 2010, 07:40 PM
I think you guys missed one critical step, the last one. After putting the hammer down, you should look at the side of the gun and verify the firing pin is indeed on an empty chamber. People can miscount when distracted.

Chris taylor
August 18, 2010, 03:23 AM
Maybe its just me but I never had a problem with having a pistol on my hip with the hammer pulled back 1 click above a live chamber... the hammer cant fall hard enough to set the round off, let alone being able to pull the trigger hard enough through the holster to drop the hammer. Im comfortable carrying this way but some may not feel the same. -Chris-

Sam1911
August 18, 2010, 08:28 AM
Maybe its just me but I never had a problem with having a pistol on my hip with the hammer pulled back 1 click above a live chamber... Chris, did you read the rest of the thread? Yes, this is a very bad idea.

the hammer cant fall hard enough to set the round off,
Yes, it has happened, and does happen, and WILL happen again.

From just a few post back:

My former boss put a 158gr SJHP .357 through his calf muscle carring a Colt with all six loaded. He used the so called safety notch, and holstered the revolver. while he was walking around he rested his hand on the hammer spur, That is all it took.

Let's not advocate poor practices, ok? If you didn't know the risks before ... well ... now you do. :)

Lucky Derby
August 18, 2010, 09:50 AM
Chris, it sounds like you have been lucky so far. I would not count on that continueing.

CraigC
August 18, 2010, 10:23 AM
Only 5, and here's an easy way to do it.

Put the hammer on half-cock and open the gate and load the first chamber, skip the second one, then load the next 4, bring the hammer back to full cock and lower it, and your resting on the one you skipped.
This first post was all that was necessary. This method is absolutely foolproof and you can do it without looking at your sixgun. Do it enough times and it becomes second nature, you'll do it in your sleep. If you are looking for speed and efficiency, this is the way to do it.

Never trust the safety notch.

You can lower the hammer down between the chambers if you like but rest assured you will ring the cylinder and unnecessarily at that.

rcmodel
August 18, 2010, 01:04 PM
the hammer cant fall hard enough to set the round off, You are very clearly wrong, as has been proven by over 100 years of SA ND's carried fully loaded on the "safety" notch.

Bad idea & bad advice to new SA shooters.
Don't do it!

rc

Lucky Derby
August 18, 2010, 01:06 PM
Just thought I would add that anyone who feels they need to carry 6 in a SA revolver needs to invest in a Ruger New Model or and Old Model that has had the retrofit. Or perhaps one of the other SA that incorperate a transfer bar.

foghornl
August 18, 2010, 04:10 PM
Unless you have one of the modern design SA revolvers like the "New Model" Ruger, or other model with the 'transfer bar' ONLY LOAD 5. {or an 'Old Model 3-screw Ruger' with the transfer bar re-fit CAN be carried 6-up}

Dnaltrop
August 18, 2010, 08:52 PM
I'll happily put 6 in my non-transfer-bar Uberti...

If I'm going to immediately empty the gun.

If I'm using shotgun-primer pushed wax rounds.

They're snap-caps.

If I have to walk more than a few steps, you couldn't pay me to walk around with 6 at half-cock.

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