Bury a rifle?


PDA






Kman
July 14, 2010, 10:27 PM
Ok, paranoia aside,, anybody out there burying guns?
Last weekend at the the GS, guy walks in with two Garands that look like they spent the last six months in a river. Apparently this guys father buried these two rifles on his property,,now his poor son is trying to salvage what he can. What I'm wondering is this a common thing among some folks? :confused:

If you enjoyed reading about "Bury a rifle?" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
gondorian
July 14, 2010, 10:32 PM
Tears :(. All I've heard about is sealing a rifle and some ammo in a pvc pipe and burying that. shhh, I think I hear a helicopter ;)

jcwit
July 14, 2010, 10:45 PM
Don't try that today, they'll be watching you dig the hole via satallite.

jojo200517
July 14, 2010, 10:46 PM
I can't say I have ever known anyone that actually did this, I'd use something cheaper than a Garand tho if I was gonna do it.

If time comes that I have to bury them then I think instead it's time to start using them.

JoeMal
July 14, 2010, 10:47 PM
Seriously? This blows my mind in a huge way...some people just wish a SHTF would happen.

If you're thinking about burying your rifle until you 'need' it, send it to me and I'll hang on to it for you

Larry Ashcraft
July 14, 2010, 10:55 PM
Credit, Tamara:
If it's time to bury it, it's time to dig it up.

KingMedicine
July 14, 2010, 10:57 PM
This is breaking my heart... Im fine with most anything, BUT TWO GARANDS!

bushmaster1313
July 14, 2010, 10:58 PM
Mossberg sells a JIC (just in case) pistol grip shotgun in a PVC case.

http://www.mossberg.com/products/default.asp?id=28

Shopping A Round
July 14, 2010, 11:00 PM
Seriously? This blows my mind in a huge way...some people just wish a SHTF would happen.

If you're thinking about burying your rifle until you 'need' it, send it to me and I'll hang on to it for you
I doubt old folks from WWII were hoping for a SHTF scenario. True paranoia sounds fair to me.

Kman
July 14, 2010, 11:03 PM
I'm with you guys on this as far as for protection goes,,but it would be a neat little gift to future generations,,,bury a nice SKS in PVC pipe,,,give the treasure map to your son/daughter on their birthday.

inSight-NEO
July 14, 2010, 11:06 PM
If I had to bury a rifle it would certainly be a trusty AK47.

But, if things ever got so bad that I had to start burying weapons, then I would probably have much, much more to worry about.

JoeMal
July 14, 2010, 11:11 PM
But, if things ever got so bad that I had to start burying weapons, then I would probably have much, much more to worry about. QFT

KC&97TA
July 14, 2010, 11:17 PM
Instead of burring outside in the dirt, a false compartment in the floor or in the ceiling would be alot better idea, easier to get to, safer climate conditions... or place it in the wall next to the copper water lines if you're afraid of a metal detector sweep of the floor

Nico Testosteros
July 14, 2010, 11:43 PM
Why the Hades would I bury a gun?
They don't sprout and grow other ones like a tater does.
The likelihood of them getting ruined is pretty high.

And if I was going to, I wouldn't tell anyone here.

hso
July 14, 2010, 11:54 PM
is this a common thing among some folks?

A very few. Some obviously don't know how to do it successfully.

BushyGuy
July 15, 2010, 12:11 AM
you can bury a gun in a large sewer PVC pipe make it long enough for a rifle and glue on screw on ends on both side it would make a great tube to bury a rifle in it.

dougw47
July 15, 2010, 12:16 AM
...were lost in a boating accident in the Gulf, while I was trying to seal the oil spill.

metalman8600
July 15, 2010, 12:39 AM
They make special sealing containers to put things, any thing, in the ground or water and have it safe. I saw one as a gunshop a while ago. It was a large orange tube that had very thick double rubber o-rings that sealed tightly when you screw the lid shut. Coated in oil and in a container like that, you could even put a valve in it that sucked out the oxygen and created a positive pressure vessel containing an inert gas... then you could bury an item forever and it be fine.

FatPants
July 15, 2010, 01:19 AM
I have a co-worker who buries AK's, ammo, food, etc... He has all of his caches GPS tagged, and mapped on several maps. He is in the process of building a fallout shelter by burying a re-enforced shipping container. His house (A very VERY nice house btw) has hidden compartments, and several years worth of food. He is NOT preparing for Zombies, or TEOTWAWKI, or anything like that, he just takes the "Be Prepared" thing to a level that keeps his mind at ease. If you ever met the guy, you would never even guess that he had all this stuff. Interesting guy.

Different strokes for different folks.

cauberallies
July 15, 2010, 05:30 AM
I know someone that has a crate with about a half dozen ARs, and massive quantities of ammo hidden and sealed for long term storage. I don't know whether or not he has them buried, as he won't tell a soul, but I did see them right when he got them.

This guy also has a basement beneath his basement which functions as a bomb/fallout shelter or panic room, enough food and water to last two families a year, and a faraday cage for protecting his backup hard drives and emergency communications equipment from EMPs. There's prepared, and there's prepared. I'd say this guy is the latter.

bigfatdave
July 15, 2010, 06:46 AM
They don't sprout and grow other ones like a tater does.
Yeah, everyone knows that to grow a crop o' guns you have to plant gun seeds.

I planted a bunch of these:
http://www.cci-ammunition.com/images/ballistic_images/22_SHORT_CB_0026.jpg
I wonder what will grow!

Sav .250
July 15, 2010, 06:50 AM
Different strokes for differnt folks.

LHRGunslinger
July 15, 2010, 06:51 AM
If you're thinking of burying your gun clean it, heavily oil it, wrap it in an oiled cloth, then drop it in a vacuum sealed bag (just in case) THEN bury it. Once you dig it up you clean it again to remove the excess oil and ta-da you're ready to rock.

May those Garands rest in peace.

boxcab
July 15, 2010, 07:42 AM
Credit, Tamara:

Quote:
If it's time to bury it, it's time to dig it up.

It is always good to have a Plan B. The future is never clear to see.

-Boxcab

GRIZ22
July 15, 2010, 08:10 AM
Some obviously don't know how to do it successfully.
__________________


There was an article in Backwoods Home Magazine in the past year or so where someone did successfully bury a rifle and ammo for an extended period.

http://www.backwoodshome.com/articles2/wood115.html

Friendly, Don't Fire!
July 15, 2010, 08:13 AM
In a climate where frost may be deep in the ground, unless all precautions are taken to eliminate any condensation as a result of temperature variations, I would say the gun would eventually be rusted -- the same for the ammo, if it is steel case (like Wolf).

I agree, any storage should be made indoors, if possible, in a building that is heated every winter.

Taniwha
July 15, 2010, 08:38 AM
Buried Firearms aren`t uncommon in New Zealand and Australia. Between my Father, his brother, my brother and myself, we have 19 weapons buried in 7 cache's on 2 family farms, and at least 5 of my friends (that I know of) have weapons buried in thier back yards.
Due to Incredibly restrictive gun laws that came into being after the 1990 Aramoana Massacre in New Zealand and the 1996 Port Arthur Massacre in Australia, All full-auto and semi-auto Rifles were affectively outlawed.
As well as hi-cap mags, most Handguns, shotguns with more than 3rnd mags and any rifle mag that will hold more than 10 .22rnds, Regardless of the rifles calibre!
A length of 150mm plastic pipe, with screwed on endcaps, will comfortably hold 2 weapons. Pack it full of grease, Shove it into a 225mm plastic pipe, pack out with more grease, attatch endcaps with epoxy resin/fibre glass, wrap the whole lot in PipeWrap anti-corrosion tape and you can bury that sucker anywhere you please for as long as you like.

Links to Aramoana,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aramoana_massacre
and Port Arthur. For anyone interested.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Port_Arthur_massacre_(Australia)

Ragnar Danneskjold
July 15, 2010, 08:49 AM
There's nothing inherently wrong with burying a few rifles just in case. Though I would have gone with 2 AKs instead of 2 Garands. The AKs would stand up to the beating MUCH better, and not be nearly as much of a loss if they got jacked up.

I have a co-worker who buries AK's, ammo, food, etc... He has all of his caches GPS tagged, and mapped on several maps. He is in the process of building a fallout shelter by burying a re-enforced shipping container. His house (A very VERY nice house btw) has hidden compartments, and several years worth of food. He is NOT preparing for Zombies, or TEOTWAWKI, or anything like that, he just takes the "Be Prepared" thing to a level that keeps his mind at ease. If you ever met the guy, you would never even guess that he had all this stuff. Interesting guy.

There's a much simpler level to it too. It may just be a hobby. Some people collect stuff, or work on old cars, or a multitude of other activities that could be considered objectively pointless. Your friend happens to collect survival gear. But as long as it's something the person wants to and isn't hurting anyone in the process, who cares?

Tallinar
July 15, 2010, 08:51 AM
If it's time to bury it, it's time to dig it up.

Too true.

berettaprofessor
July 15, 2010, 09:17 AM
Don't try that today, they'll be watching you dig the hole via satallite

LOL; I garden. A lot. I must be keeping an entire shift of NSC employee's busy trying to figure out what I'm putting in each hole.

ny32182
July 15, 2010, 09:27 AM
If I were subject to this level of paranoia, I would hide them in the walls rather than bury them outside.

LHRGunslinger
July 15, 2010, 09:36 AM
The better you hide something the harder it is to acccess

Zack
July 15, 2010, 09:38 AM
All my guns...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

...were lost in a boating accident in the Gulf, while I was trying to seal the oil spill.

Now thats a new one!

Friendly, Don't Fire!
July 15, 2010, 09:58 AM
Buried Firearms aren`t uncommon in New Zealand and Australia. Between my Father, his brother, my brother and myself, we have 19 weapons buried in 7 cache's on 2 family farms, and at least 5 of my friends (that I know of) have weapons buried in thier back yards.
Due to Incredibly restrictive gun laws that came into being after the 1990 Aramoana Massacre in New Zealand and the 1996 Port Arthur Massacre in Australia, All full-auto and semi-auto Rifles were affectively outlawed.
As well as hi-cap mags, most Handguns, shotguns with more than 3rnd mags and any rifle mag that will hold more than 10 .22rnds, Regardless of the rifles calibre!
A length of 150mm plastic pipe, with screwed on endcaps, will comfortably hold 2 weapons. Pack it full of grease, Shove it into a 225mm plastic pipe, pack out with more grease, attatch endcaps with epoxy resin/fibre glass, wrap the whole lot in PipeWrap anti-corrosion tape and you can bury that sucker anywhere you please for as long as you like.

Links to Aramoana,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aramoana_massacre
and Port Arthur. For anyone interested.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Port_Arthur_massacre_(Australia)
LOL
When our civilization kills itself, these pipes will be orbiting throughout space and will eventually be found by someone, possibly in the past, in another time-space warp.

Dan Forrester
July 15, 2010, 10:11 AM
Maybe the old man was trying to dispose of them for whatever reason. Maybe he stole them 50 years ago and now in his old age thinks he needs to get rid of the evidence. Just a thought. You never know what’s going through someone’s head.

You don’t necessarily have to fear massive NWO gun confiscations to bury a couple guns. Think if the **** really did hit the fan on even a local scale like a hurricane or earthquake. The police will be out there confiscating people’s guns and searching vehicles once curfews are in place. Remember most cops now a days are trained in Iraq where this stuff is just every day work for them. Well if I want to head to my vacation home (or retreat) out in the country while a state of emergency has been declared (which is usually a couple days before a disaster) CCW, sale or transportation of firearms is now prohibited. You get stopped by the cops and your guns are gone. Maybe you weren’t even aware of the law; but ignorance is no excuse.

If you had something stashed in an easy to find place at least you would have something to defend yourself with. Sure you could use a safe or hide it really well but if burglars have days or weeks to take their time with your safe or find you hiding spots they’ll get what they want. This is particularly easy at someone’s vacation home or retreat where the owners might not stop by for weeks or monnnths.

Dan

LHRGunslinger
July 15, 2010, 10:25 AM
@ Dark Tranquility: Isn't it nice that the government takes away our guns when we need them the most?

wishin
July 15, 2010, 10:30 AM
Don't try that today, they'll be watching you dig the hole via satallite.
You'll be fine if your shoes aren't shined.:neener:

Adventurer
July 15, 2010, 10:34 AM
Don't forget where you buried it. Imagine archaeologists finding your cache 5000 years from now. :)

bigalexe
July 15, 2010, 10:48 AM
Links to Aramoana,
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aramoana_massacre
and Port Arthur. For anyone interested.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Port_Ar...re_(Australia)

Not to threadjack but let me get this straight:
2 mentally ill lone gunman go on shooting sprees = Everyone gets deprived of a right to defend themselves.

***!

LHRGunslinger
July 15, 2010, 10:54 AM
Suggestion. If you're going to bury your stash use a good ol ink n paper map to remember where you left it. The US government aka Big Brother monitors all electronic communications in this country.

Mp7
July 15, 2010, 10:59 AM
@Tanihwa

I always supsect Coober-Pedy wasnt about Opals.
It´s Blokes who forgot where they buried all those SKSs :)

http://www.traveldudes.org/files/tips/CooberPedy%201_0.JPG

There´s many a K98 lying in the ground around here, probably just put in waxed-paper or wrapped in a leather-Coat. No PVC pipe back then. They´ll be rusted away now.

DeepSouth
July 15, 2010, 11:10 AM
I have a friend who says there is no need to bury a gun because wall paneling comes down and goes up so easily. I don't know if he knows that from experience or not, I'm not gonna ask either.


+25 on if it's time to bury them, it's time to dig'em up.

Manco
July 15, 2010, 11:18 AM
Who knows, such a practice might just come in handy if you're up against liquid-metal robots from the future. :eek:

TexasBen317
July 15, 2010, 11:20 AM
My Dad several years ago "hid" a couple of pistols in the attic. Not from the government, just cause that is the way he was. He also took all the keys from NEW locks he bought and hid them UNUSED,, we found the locks when he died, but never did find the keys. The guns hidden in the attic were ruined,, I have one hand gun, just because my Grand Dad, carried it as a railway mail clerk, but it will never fire again.

Justin
July 15, 2010, 11:27 AM
Last weekend at the the GS, guy walks in with two Garands that look like they spent the last six months in a river. Apparently this guys father buried these two rifles on his property,,now his poor son is trying to salvage what he can.

I'm starting to think there's a mental illness that causes some people to confuse rifles with tulip bulbs.

carlsca
July 15, 2010, 12:00 PM
Don't forget to cover the whole thing with tin foil to keep out the alien rays...

MisterMike
July 15, 2010, 12:04 PM
My Doomsday preparation consists primarily of making sure I have a good-sized cache of wine and beer, and of having a lot of candy bars in the pantry, so the whole idea of sealing and burying guns and ammo, building Faraday cages to protect against EMP, and so on is a little foreign to my way of thinking. Of course, this means that I'll be among the first to go once Doomsday actually does arrive, but in the meanwhile I'm pretty happy with my state of (un)preparedness.

On a practical note, I'd just add that I've seen a lot of smart people underestimate the thoroughness of their preparation of machines for long-term storage. Mother Nature has a way of destroying those things that are less than ideally pickled. If I were going down this road, I'd slather my guns with a protective anticorrosive coating of some sort (grease?) before sticking them in a sealed container. Even so, once they're buried there's a pretty good chance that, in all but an arid climate, roots, critters or ground movement will breach the container.

Blackbeard
July 15, 2010, 01:27 PM
If it's time to bury it, it's time to dig it up.

I disagree, if nothing else than for practicality. The time to bury them is when they are banned. The time to dig them up is when enough of the population is ready for an armed revolution. While those two dates should be the same, in reality they are several decades apart.

KarenTOC
July 15, 2010, 03:01 PM
Oops, my bad. I thought this was the follow-up to the How do guns die? thread. Nevermind.

Shadow 7D
July 15, 2010, 06:25 PM
True, but on the other hand, I also love the threads here where someone finds a gun in a wall during remodeling, believe I saw one about 2 months ago where a plumber found a rifle and shotgun fixing something in a members house. Also seen a few from the Rust Queens thread, ruined in an attic or basement or dug up from some farmers field.

If you bury it, you have to let someone know, but then the truly paranoid won't do that because it's not a secret if 2 know.

BullfrogKen
July 15, 2010, 06:52 PM
Last weekend at the the <gun shop>, guy walks in . . . .

More fibs have been told following that line than probably any other. Perhaps a fishing story or, "My name is _________ and I'd like your vote" can rival it.



Finding some buried guns sounds a lot more interesting than, "what can I get for these two rifles that were neglected and never cleaned?"

Hatterasguy
July 15, 2010, 07:15 PM
No, the world isn't ending and its a shame to ruin good guns like that in the dirt.

If you want to bury something go bury a Walmart special, not Garands.:rolleyes:


My guns live in my safe, which is dry, and they stay well oiled because I have a lot of money tied up in them.

The Lone Haranguer
July 15, 2010, 07:16 PM
From the comfort of my computer chair ;) I would say that if it is time to bury your guns, you should be using them instead.

earlthegoat2
July 15, 2010, 07:19 PM
If you bury your guns, what are you going to point at the the GMen who try to take them away?

I know this is not really the idea, but.....I just dont care.

John Parker
July 15, 2010, 07:22 PM
There's nothing inherently wrong with burying a few rifles just in case. Though I would have gone with 2 AKs instead of 2 Garands. The AKs would stand up to the beating MUCH better, and not be nearly as much of a loss if they got jacked up.

I don't think that an improperly buried AK would do any better than an improperly buried Garand, except be easier on the wallet. And heartstrings.

robhof
July 15, 2010, 07:39 PM
Along the lines of buried guns; when I was stationed in the Phillippines at Clark AFB, one of our male nurses was into caving and after a week-end of caving with a Negrito(proper name for aboriginal Philipino) guide he came back to work with pic's of his find, a crumbling crate full of foil packets that contained cosmoline packed Colt 1911 frames and barrels with additional foil packs of new grips. I asked if I could buy one and he said that;:cuss: guns are illegal to own in the PI so he turned them into the Security forces. This was in 1980 so they had been stored at least since 1945. From the pic's they looked like the day they rolled off the assembly line. Went with him a few times after that and no repeat of the above.

FIVETWOSEVEN
July 15, 2010, 07:52 PM
A friend of mine found a Smith Corona Springfield in a wall when he was doing some work at someone else's place. Problem is though that he Sporterized it ruining its value.

oldbanjo
July 15, 2010, 08:28 PM
I gave a gun to my son in law about 10 years ago that was still coated with cosmaline, every thing was protected, including three clips which were wrapped with red paper then cosmaline. When I bought the gun, I had no use for that cal, so I removed a piece of paneling from an inside wall and put the gun in the wall where it sat for almost 30 years. When I moved where I am today I gave it away. The gun was a M1 Carbine made in 1943 by Underwood Typewriter Co.
Mint condition. My son in law said he had never seen that gun before, I said that's why I still have it, no one had ever seen it. When I look at these sights it shocks me to see how many people put pictures of their guns on these forums. I'll talk about a few, but not all. Nobody has seen all my guns.

WCSO
July 15, 2010, 09:38 PM
I am going to go with one of Bullfrogken's favorites and tell a gun shop "fib". About 40 years ago I worked for a gun shop in sales and light duty gunsmithing. One day a guy walked in and sat a paper bag on the counter and proceeded to empty the contents.
First was a large jar and then a large piece of burlap. He unrapped the burlap and inside was a hunk of rust. It had obviously been a handgun at one time but was so rusted you could not tell what it had been, just misshappen rust in the form of a revolver. The thing could have still been loaded but it was too far gone to determine that. Even the grips had rotted away so they were probably wooden. The guy told me he had been digging in his back yard and hit something with his shovel. He got down and moved enough dirt by hand to see that the item was a glass jar so he carefully pryed it out of the ground. The jar lid was rusted away but at one time someone had sealed the lid with wax. It appeared that the burlap had been soaked in oil and still had the smell of oil on it. The guy wanted to know if there was someplace I could send the gun so that it could be restored and/or a least identified. FAT CHANCE! He told me there had aslo been a small cloth pouch in the jar but it had turned to dust when he tried to open it. Inside the pouch were a few coins but he didn't bring the coins with the gun (rust) so I didn't see them. If I remember correctly he said they were USA and dated to around 1860. The story of the 2 Garands made me think of this incident. Wouldn't you love to know the story behind this find and just what kind of revolver it had once been? You never know, it might have been a rare gun or been used is some diabolical crime. The imagination could really run wild on a find like that. The guy told me he was going to go to the courthouse and try to research the property owners and see if he could find out information about who had lived there over the years (a very old house) and try to find out about the gun. I never heard another word about it.

My story has a similar ending to the buried guns in this thread and those in the attic and the 2 Garands. Too bad we don't have more answers to the buried gun questions but I think even with more modern procedures a buried gun is still going to end up as just so much junk. Depends on how long it stays buried I guess.

49north
July 15, 2010, 11:26 PM
You fellas need a history lesson.

CHEVELLE427
July 16, 2010, 12:48 AM
better not bury it on your property, the detectors they have now days will find them, and you will be in deep crap. better to put them on your enemy's property in the dark of night.

also don't depend on a gps to find them again, that stuff will be turned off if the SHTF,
as a matter of fact nothing will work and will most likely be blamed on a solar flair, they have been telling us for years solar flairs might interrupt cell phone and TV , just like shutting down the oil field causes an oil shortage like Exxon Valdez did back when it went aground.

belive nothing you here and half of what you see now days

wideym
July 16, 2010, 04:14 AM
An emergency cache is still a good idea. Not that you should bury your entire collection of weapons and ammo, but a couple of good rifles along with ammo and cleaning equipment for "just such an emergency".

The only good place I could think of to actually bury these items would be deep in a National Forest, where development is highly unlikely. Then again with a bad memory like mine, where would I hide the grid coordinates or map? What's the use in secretly hiding items you think the goverment will someday confiscate, only to leave an X marks the spot map in your desk drawer for agents to locate?

Maverick223
July 16, 2010, 10:40 AM
What's the use in secretly hiding items you think the goverment will someday confiscate, only to leave an X marks the spot map in your desk drawer for agents to locate?While I would be hesitant to bury anything on govt. property, there are ways to conceal the purpose of a map. In your case, just label it "Good camping spots" and have several other locations (from other nat. forests, or popular camping areas) listed on the same map.

:)

Gryffydd
July 16, 2010, 11:20 AM
If it's time to bury it, it's time to dig it up.

Nobody said you had to bury ALL your guns. That doesn't mean it might not be good to have a confiscation proof backup.

gunnutery
July 16, 2010, 12:19 PM
For your reading pleasure, here's an article I read a while back, just for kicks.

http://www.scribd.com/doc/13087631/How-to-Bury-a-Gun-and-Ammo

CHEVELLE427
July 16, 2010, 01:31 PM
i would think one would bury/hide anything the government was after so if /when the people have had enough and rise up they wont have to depend on how many rocks they can pack to toss at the red coats.

just my thinking on WHY

oldbanjo
July 16, 2010, 09:49 PM
If any fool tries to overthrow this Gov. They had better bend over and start kissing their *** goodbye. No civilian can fight the Military in this country. If you think you can then you must be on some heavy duty medications. By the way could someone tell me how to work the spell check.

Gryffydd
July 16, 2010, 09:54 PM
If any fool tries to overthrow this Gov. They had better bend over and start kissing their *** goodbye. No civilian can fight the Military in this country.
Yeah, and those Afghanistani hicks with mules and WWI rifles could never turn back the Russians. Oh wait.
Oh yeah, and who is our military made up of again? If things get bad enough to overthrow the government (which I just don't see happening), do you really think the military is going to stay a cohesive whole and fight against their own brothers and friends?

One would hope that Americans would wake up and VOTE before they have to wake up and SHOOT.

konfederate.kowboy
July 16, 2010, 10:20 PM
i remember hearing an account of a world war two G.I. who cleaned his rifle everyday he was deployed just to take it home and stick it in a big box of salt. but this could just be a t.v. thing. maybee the old man didnt want to keep it.


although i have wondered about burying a gun or two with food and ammo in various places just in case...

oldbanjo
July 16, 2010, 10:56 PM
We helped them, they weren't using ww1 Stinger missile's. Every Helo sent up was being shot down. And yes the Military will stick together, no one in their right mind will allow or be part of a civil war. This country is made up of two types of people, leaders and followers. Kill a few leaders and the followers will swap sides. You can only depend on one person, thats yourself. I didn't just get off a turnip truck. Look at the news they said that poles show that 80% of the people think the economy is improving. If what the news said is true then there are a lot of brain washed people.

Mr.Davis
July 17, 2010, 12:09 AM
You fellas need a history lesson.
Enlighten us.

MinnMooney
July 17, 2010, 02:31 AM
Griz22 (post #25) : an article in Backwoods Home Magazine

I just finished reading this article and found it quite interesting. He either really knew what he was doing or had a generous quantity of horse sense because it worked very well for 15 years !

The part that I would change is that I wouldn't bury it vertically. It makes for an extremely hard "find" years later as attested to by the fact that it took him two days of digging/searching before he found it. I'd bury it in a 1'-2' deep trench horizontally. That way, it could be found with a metal locator. I know, I know; some think that the Feds will be able to find it, also, but on 20-200 acres - they won't make the week-long effort it would take to find the weapon... or the 2 weapons.... or the 10 weapons... or.

MinnMooney
July 17, 2010, 03:19 AM
Not true... Not true at all !!

If our gov't or a foreign gov't (hereinafter known as : "that gov't") were to try and make Americans a subserviant class of people by taking our weapons and ammo, they would succeed to a certain extent. Just look to Australia for an example and at the pile of guns hundreds of yards long by 50 yards wide (10' tall) that were collected and destroyed.

That gov't might find and confiscate some, many or even most of the guns because they will make it a FELONY to withhold any weapon. Most folks wouldn't want to be a felon so they'd surrender most or all of their guns out of fear. Lots of 'computer brave' mall ninjas on these gun forums would turn over every single gun that they own because they are paper tigers.

Luckily, there are many, many patriots in this country with courage and conviction so millions upon millions of guns along with ammo would, at that point, be buried in back yards, in the back 40 or in hidden rooms/compartments. That's why posts like this are so very important. But - you need to have the supplies purchased well in advance so that there won't be a 'paper trail' of people buying PVC pipe to the point of causing Menards, Home Depot and the like to notice a run on those items and literally run out. That creates news and attention - 2 things that we wouldn't need at that time.

It's not being paranoid if there is a risk, however small, of it being true.

Be prepared.

Be prepared in advance.

Purgatory
July 17, 2010, 03:54 AM
"All my guns...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

...were lost in a boating accident in the Gulf, while I was trying to seal the oil spill."

Ok....you have GOT to elaborate. What sick super secret mission were you on under the guise of a clean up crew that involved the need for ALL your guns and THEN....we can start with the HOW did you lose ALL your firearms, sir? :scrutiny:

oldbanjo
July 17, 2010, 06:13 AM
In Australia It only took a few weeks. The first gun they outlawed was pump shotguns. If all Americans would stick together, things would be better. Another big problem I see, Is you should not play show an tell with your guns. No one living needs to see all your guns, keep most of your guns and ammo out of sight. Fixing up one nice gun for show is fine but you should have one that no one has seen. People talk, a friend of mine told me that a friend of his had 50 guns. I didn't need to know that Another person told me that he had 75 guns. If you tell one person in a month ten people will know. I've sold a lot of very nice guns Brownings, Colts, and gave away some nice ones Rugers, Mossbergs, Military weapons 3006, 303, 30cal, 7mm. Due to my job I was traveling overseas a lot and didn't think my guns were safe from thief.

Taniwha
July 17, 2010, 07:47 AM
Not to threadjack but let me get this straight:
2 mentally ill lone gunman go on shooting sprees = Everyone gets deprived of a right to defend themselves.

***!
Um, yeah, thats pretty much the way it works in the rest of the world. Crazies do Stuff like this, and the rest of us suffer.

Taniwha
July 17, 2010, 07:59 AM
@Tanihwa

I always supsect Coober-Pedy wasnt about Opals.
It´s Blokes who forgot where they buried all those SKSs :)

http://www.traveldudes.org/files/tips/CooberPedy%201_0.JPG

There´s many a K98 lying in the ground around here, probably just put in waxed-paper or wrapped in a leather-Coat. No PVC pipe back then. They´ll be rusted away now.
You're right. Coober Pedy, Lightening Ridge, White cliffs. All places where Blokes buried/lost thier guns. ;) No SKS's tho, We like FN FAL's here in the Colonies.:D. Bigger Bullets you see.;)

Manco
July 17, 2010, 02:33 PM
If any fool tries to overthrow this Gov. They had better bend over and start kissing their *** goodbye. No civilian can fight the Military in this country. If you think you can then you must be on some heavy duty medications.

I think you underestimate how heavily armed the population is as a whole--we make the Middle East look like a gun-free zone. :D

JoeSlomo
July 17, 2010, 02:39 PM
If time comes that I have to bury them then I think instead it's time to start using them.


I'm with THIS guy...

LHRGunslinger
July 17, 2010, 02:39 PM
@Manaco: I do belive oldbanjo was referring to any one man deciding to overthrow the government not a full blown revolution.

CHEVELLE427
July 17, 2010, 03:48 PM
SHTF
the country will split like before.

some Russian so and so said we will divide into 5 parts
north
south
east
west
and
Texas

Zoogster
July 17, 2010, 07:34 PM
Don't try that today, they'll be watching you dig the hole via satallite.

Now you have to wait until the next storm! When cloud cover and precipitation are blocking most satellites in your area! :neener:


If any fool tries to overthrow this Gov. They had better bend over and start kissing their *** goodbye. No civilian can fight the Military in this country. If you think you can then you must be on some heavy duty medications. By the way could someone tell me how to work the spell check.

I in no way wish to overthrow anything. However a military fighting in a foreign nation does a lot better than fighting at home. At home it depends on the local tax revenue and infrastructure to continue to operate.
Once the economy goes down hill and the insurgents are "committing acts of terrorism" and destroying local infrastructure, logistical support for the military goes down hill fast.
Of course then the government starts taking out loans, and recruiting other governments (NATO) to help it out. Effectively putting your nation's future financial system in the hands of the foreign loan giving entities.

The insurgents in foreign nations fail because the economy and infrastructure backing the military force they are fighting is undisturbed, thousands of miles away. They can never actually defeat the military playing only defensively and attacking those foreign troops at a local level because the logistical support is undisturbed.
However if they do come over here and attack the US, then the population supports actions against them even more (like after 9/11) and is willing to sacrifice even more resources attacking them.


Yes the military can typically prevail in direct conflict, but when it is supported by local infrastructure being hit by car bombs, suicide bombers, led to booby trapped locations with false intel, has military and police locations under attack etc It can only last so many years before both it and the economy and infrastructure it depends on begin to crumble.
At which point you typically see military coups, or others trying to take over the failed and weakened state which can neither meet the needs of the people nor keep those it employs happy.
It is also of course vulnerable to foreign conquest at that point, and has minimal influence in foreign affairs (like China would just take over Taiwan for example, Israel would be left to fend for itself, and many other examples where the US sphere of influence has an impact etc etc)


So bottom line is insurgents are much more effective when fighting in the same locations that the military they are fighting receives its financial and logistical support from.
When the insurgents are fighting the military thousands of miles away from where the military receives its financial and logistical support (Like in current international conflicts) they fair much worse.
For example, the oil infrastructure had to be secured and well protected by the US and NATO before the Iraq government was able to support itself and security forces with such resources. The US and NATO's logistical and financial support were immune to being weakened by local attacks. Making it unbeatable, but the local security forces could never prevail until they had the oil up and working. With the oil they then have large amounts of foreign funding and supplies coming in.

Well in the US the economy is not as simple as just protecting the oil, or refineries, or power plants. The infrastructure is too diversified, and as a result impossible to really protect with the military by securing just a few key locations. It would have to become a complete authoritarian state with guards everywhere (and when you pay that many people to stand around versus those actually working and producing, your economy starts to tank too.)

Do you know how much a single bomb or missile costs? Compare that to average tax dollars received per capita. Add in additional security costs and the costs of rebuilding existing infrastructure that is targeted. The military can only last so many years fighting an insurgency in their backyard before the whole system starts to crumble.
Then you have soldiers that would have ties to insurgents, some that would snap when forced to fight their own people. Imagine if even .1% started mowing down their fellow soldiers. Fort Hood type events on a massive scale, and using support or issued weapons.

Currently military bases are not being attacked in the US, nor are police stations, family members of those in either are not being kidnapped if they go in public, etc etc All the types of things that happen in local insurgencies.
Currently the military goes abroad and fights, and then comes home to safety. That doesn't happen in an insurgency.

Insurgencies takes years to prevail though, they are not like conventional wars. People in developed countries with a current high quality of life will be unlikely to support such things even if they did in the initial years.
It is a lot more than just fighting or dying for a cause, an entire quality of life goes into the gutter, the economy and quality of life in general crumbles as tax dollars can no longer meet the needs of government.
The only thing that decides who wins in an insurgency is the support of the people. I don't think the average person in most developed nations has the patience to win one.
As their quality of life begins to deteriorate as the economy tanks their loyalties will begin to change. In that the governments tend to have an advantage over insurgents and rebels.
In a third world hell hole the reduced quality of life in a war is only moderately worse than everyday life before the war, so the population is more prone to support long term resistance and stick to idealism and support for rebels.
The quality of life in a developed nation however is night and day, and I think after a couple years most would want to see the fighting over, no matter who won. Which favors the existing government.
So it becomes which side has better propaganda.
It is not glorious and even once one is won there is always people who will try to seize power for themselves, and set up a government worse or not much better than the one people sacrificed for years to remove.





If time comes that I have to bury them then I think instead it's time to start using them.

In the context of self defense against common criminals once guns are outlawed, then self defense with those guns is a crime. So if you have some stashed away you can certainly retrieve them, but then what? They are no longer useful for anything except offensive action.
Defensive action is illegal. Criminal attacks you and you use it, you go to prison for a long time.
You cannot take it to the range, you cannot use it for recreation, and you cannot defend yourself or family without going to prison for it.
It generally is more of a liability than a tool of preservation at that point for defensive applications.
And time to start using them? Use against whom? It sounds good, but who are you going to attack?
I seem to recall a McVeigh around the time when we began to see assault weapon laws (he was a strong gun rights supporter), and Waco/Ruby Ridge incidents...and I also recall more people trying to distance themselves from his actions than rallying to some cause.
He attacked the regional headquarters of the agencies that he felt were responsible, and his actions were condemned, nobody rallied to him.
So why do you think anything you would do with your outlawed gun would be different?


Guns are almost never banned outright. They know not to back the population into a corner of all or nothing. They Ban gun type A but if you comply they will let you keep B and C. Then expand the definition of type A, then heavily restrict type B. Then when the methods have been successful and most people just have type C they heavily restrict type C, the type of gun governments fear the least (like your typical shotgun, .22 etc), until just a minority of sportsmen have them.
But they are still legal, and there is always still people who can get special occupation licenses or otherwise be granted licenses for special reasons for even the types "banned" for most.
So "ban" is always technically a misnomer, even when that is what is essentially imposed.
There is always some licenses or legal ways for some limited numbers of people to obtain anything.
Most of the military's armaments for example are produced by private companies. From missiles and guidance systems, to fighter jets and tanks.
Even if they are unobtainable for most they are not "banned".

Manco
July 17, 2010, 08:26 PM
@Manaco: I do belive oldbanjo was referring to any one man deciding to overthrow the government not a full blown revolution.

I must have missed the post that suggested a single-man revolution. ;)

Ky Larry
July 18, 2010, 12:24 AM
There is no reason to bury guns. The government couldn't care less about how many and what types of weapons we have. The real threat is from the super-secret space ships they are working on in Area 51. They are reverse engineering brain wave disruptors captured from aliens. Then they can control the whole world by altering our thought process. Forget about oil shortages, ammo shortages, and food shortages. The government is going to ban TIN FOIL. Then we won't be able to make protective hats. If you're going to bury smoething, bury tin foil.:what:

Topcat
July 18, 2010, 12:43 AM
Would'nt you want to coat it in cosmoline or is that now outdated?

oldbanjo
July 18, 2010, 02:17 PM
ZOOGSTER: That was very interesting. I'm not going to list things that I know could be used to defeat an overthrow of this countries gov. I sometimes think the news media should be restricted on what they say, It's almost like their on the other side/helping by making suggestions, just to make/get news. You can't get three people to stick together in America, how in the world would you get 100's. Canada is showing their gov that they wont stand for gun control. It is surprising that it is working.

4thPointOfContact
July 18, 2010, 02:22 PM
The problem with false compartments or hiding firearms inside one's house is.... plausible deniability. If something is cached on your property you might be able to say "somebody musta buried it there that night we had the bad rain storm, mister gubmint man." If you bury it off property you might lose it, but you can't be linked directly to it.

It's possibly 'tin foil', but caching does make a certain amount of sense. As long as you can find it again, you haven't lost the use of it. I prefer parks and recreation areas, myself.;)

theotherwaldo
July 18, 2010, 02:52 PM
I've buried guns, but not to hide them from the government. One was buried because I had no place to store it and couldn't carry it with me. I buried another because the person that I was living with was freakin' insane and couldn't be trusted around a gun. (Turned out, she already had a gun hidden away. I found out when she shot her cat. She thought that it was a cougar.)

I recovered each of these guns at a later date, none the worse for their time underground.

If I were intending to bury any more guns then I certainly wouldn't announce my intent on a public forum.

Blackbeard
July 18, 2010, 05:40 PM
If time comes that I have to bury them then I think instead it's time to start using them.

Take a look at this report (http://www.kccn.tv/)and tell me if the guy involved would have use for a buried gun somewhere. Basic summary is, guy is sighting in a .22 rifle on his property, someone calls 911 "man with gun", deputies show up, arrest him, open his safe and take all his guns for "safekeeping". Now, since they took everything, he might have use for a buried gun, right? If so, should he have started shooting people instead of burying it?

Art Eatman
July 18, 2010, 06:51 PM
Some things really shouldn't appear in public, regardless of how many votes they get. 89 posts is more than enough...

If you enjoyed reading about "Bury a rifle?" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!