Input please...


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silverdagger
August 16, 2010, 10:00 PM
A friend and I are in the planning stage of constructiing a competition shooting gallery on his five acre parcel of woodland. We want this to be a fun range, low-maintenance if possible, and challenging to our abilities with weapons of all kinds. ( have you seen "Top Shot" on the History Channel? )
Need ideas for targets, glleries, and challenges. Black powder to 50 BMG and rim fire to 45 long colt. Please post or email your ideas.

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Jim Watson
August 16, 2010, 10:32 PM
Black powder in .50 BMG? Wow.

jmorris
August 17, 2010, 12:21 AM
A friend and I are in the planning stage of constructiing a competition shooting gallery on his five acre parcel of woodland. We want this to be a fun range, low-maintenance if possible, and challenging to our abilities with weapons of all kinds. ( have you seen "Top Shot" on the History Channel? )
Need ideas for targets, glleries, and challenges. Black powder to 50 BMG and rim fire to 45 long colt. Please post or email your ideas
My best idea is to forget a 50 BMG if you only have 5 acres. Actually .22 lr might be too much depending upon how the land is laid out and what you want to do.

I don’t want to seem discouraging but “top shots” while good for “us guys” is pretty lame. If you don’t even have to shoot and your off…

Top shots but we are going to carve chickens, or throw knives or…I think next season they should incorporate back massages…or at least that’s what the wife says.

Gary G23
August 17, 2010, 07:13 AM
"My best idea is to forget a 50 BMG if you only have 5 acres"

I agree

silverdagger
August 21, 2010, 10:40 AM
Thanks for the answers so far. I guess I didn't make myself clear. We are building an outdoor range. I was asking for your input for some fun target elements to add to our circuit. Different shooting positions, target ideas, and elements that you may have seen that we haven't considered. Space is not a problem. We are both retired LEOs and have large gun collections. We both belong to a local range, but would like to build our own with some different and more interesting and challenging elements. Between the two of us we have derringers, odd calibers, various revolvers, autos, rifles, shotguns of all kinds etc. We're looking for challenging ideas such as moving targets, twist targets, pop ups, exploding targets, challenging distances, timed-fire elements stuff like that. I'd still like to hear about interesting gun challenges that you have seen, and any particular ideas that YOU would add if you were building a practice course for yourself. All answers welcome.

Tilos
August 21, 2010, 10:54 AM
The target cost alone would break the bank for me.
Lots of steel targets for sale on-line for $$$$$$$$$$+shipping.

Start thinking balloons:D

silverdagger
August 21, 2010, 03:56 PM
Thanks Tilos. We have some steel reset targets, but will likely make more. Balloons are a good idea, different colors, they move, are cheap to replace, and easy to clean up at the end of the day..plus they can be inflated to any size from 2 - 8".

Tilos
August 21, 2010, 05:44 PM
Think helium balloon, floating above and attached to, a cheap RC car:eek:

If you have the skills needed to make your own steel that will lower the cost but low carbon soft steel gets pocked up quickly and becomes a hazard for back splatter.

Been there, done that.

1SOW
August 22, 2010, 12:00 AM
One range here has: "Different SIZE" ballon racks. The put a little sand in them and inflate to various sizes and hang them up.

They also have a neat section that has 4' (approx.)posts supporting a 4x4X 10'(?) wooden rail with an angled steel deflector protecting the wood. On the rail, they sometimes use small steel targets or bowling pins or balloons. They shoot "time only" with time penalties for misses. (Makes for easy scoring.)

The pins are a favorite if you can find a cheap source or shoot .22 only. They were also a favorite in Fla at an F.O.P. range where I shot.

At that Fla range they had two interesting set-ups. One was a short section of "windows and doors" that had bad and good guys visible when you moved through. They also had a section with fixed steel plates and gongs that were shot in various sequences, strong hand/weak hand etc. Being permanently set up / non-reactive made it easy to manage. Audible hits were noted or you can use spray paint.

I have shot helium filled ballons at a turkey shoot--on a 3-4' string in the wind. They provided the gun-a 9" bbl .22 revolver- try to be fast with that bbl!


re non-hardened steel: As you probably already know back-splatter is NOT the worst problem. A complete 180 deg ricochet is very possible when a fresh bullet hits an old dent. It will literally turn around and come back at you. I have seen it happen myself. .22 rimfire can use softer steel with less likelyhood of bad ricochets.

jmorris
August 22, 2010, 10:31 AM
A friend and I are in the planning stage of constructiing a competition shooting gallery on his five acre parcel of woodland.

Space is not a problem.

I have never seen an outdoor range that was only 5 acres. Many I have been to have that much or more just for parking.


We're looking for challenging ideas such as moving targets, twist targets, pop ups, exploding targets, challenging distances, timed-fire elements stuff like that... any particular ideas that YOU would add if you were building a practice course for yourself.

Here are a few targets I have built. (you'll have to click on the photos to watch the videos)

Adjustable timed electric infrared activated targets, including pop up, swinger, double swinger, turners and a drop turn.
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/th_autotargets.jpg (http://s121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/?action=view&current=autotargets.mp4)


Flopper hooked to clam shell.
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/th_flopclam.jpg (http://s121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/?action=view&current=flopclam.mp4)

Portable runner
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/th_runner1.jpg (http://s121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/?action=view&current=runner1.mp4)

Reed rattler
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/th_shortvis.jpg (http://s121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/?action=view&current=shortvis.flv)

It is to be used behind cover like this.
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/th_short.jpg (http://s121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/?action=view&current=short.flv)

The good old TX star with counter rotating non threats is always a crowd pleaser.
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/th_funstar.jpg (http://s121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/?action=view&current=funstar.mp4)

Motorized pinwheel and TX star
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/target/pinwheel.jpg
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/target/powertxstar.jpg



The next three are best for long range as you don't have to reset them

Auto reset rifle target
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/target/HPIM0417.jpg

Flasher rifle target
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/target/flasher/DSC02098.jpg
Looks like this when hit
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/target/flasher/DSC02099.jpg

Auto reset plate rack
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/3g/platerack2.jpg

You can also combine them like this video using the auto rifle target in a pistol match and as the plate rack resets it spins the pinwheel with 4 threats and 4 non threats. (These last 3 are all videos just click on them)
http://i664.photobucket.com/albums/vv5/qvideo/mvsa/aug15/th_aug1412.jpg (http://s664.photobucket.com/albums/vv5/qvideo/mvsa/aug15/?action=view&current=aug1412.mp4)

The running man target can also be use as moving cover
http://i664.photobucket.com/albums/vv5/qvideo/mvsa/aug15/th_aug143.jpg (http://s664.photobucket.com/albums/vv5/qvideo/mvsa/aug15/?action=view&current=aug143.mp4)

Here are sequential activated popups
http://i664.photobucket.com/albums/vv5/qvideo/mvsa/aug15/th_aug147.jpg (http://s664.photobucket.com/albums/vv5/qvideo/mvsa/aug15/?action=view&current=aug147.mp4)

The only limit is your imagination an having a place to keep everything.

jmorris
August 22, 2010, 10:41 AM
Here is what the pop up targets in the last video look like.

Pop up

http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/target/popup1.jpg

Just the TX stars shot strong hand, freestyle and weak hand can be a decent challenge. (It is a video just click the photo)
http://i664.photobucket.com/albums/vv5/qvideo/mvsa/aug15/th_augg144.jpg (http://s664.photobucket.com/albums/vv5/qvideo/mvsa/aug15/?action=view&current=augg144.mp4)

Or put one in front of another paint one plate on each black for a no shoot and start by hitting one plate on each to get them both spinning.
http://i121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/3g/th_joetxstar.jpg (http://s121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/3g/?action=view&current=joetxstar.mp4)

silverdagger
August 22, 2010, 10:58 AM
jmorris: THAT's what I'm looking for! Great ideas, Thanks. I'm gonna add some of those elements (might even call it "The Morris Level" LOL )
I agree that 5 acres would make a nice parking lot for a range ( in the city ), but in the North, where I live, there are square miles of unpopulated woodland and countryside on 3 sides of the 5 acres. Safety will of course be paramount, but we will consider that at each shooting station. There is a "Junk yard" about 6 miles away that has steel, angle iron, and target material by the truckload. What we need are ideas. Now we have some, Thanks, ..and keep 'em coming!

jmorris
August 22, 2010, 11:12 AM
"junk yard" steel will likely not make very good targets. The photo below is 1" thick but didn't hold up very well.

http://i664.photobucket.com/albums/vv5/qvideo/gn/1insteel.jpg

http://i664.photobucket.com/albums/vv5/qvideo/gn/steel1in.jpg

You need to keep steel flat and smooth so the bullets you send at them don't come back. AR500 for rifle and AR400 for most all pistol rounds is the way to go.

Shadow 7D
August 22, 2010, 03:14 PM
what where you shooting it with??

I would think something like a spring loaded empty can dispenser (think magazine for a pistol) it you want to do it right, please take the time to do some earth moving so the neighbors don't get pissed at you shooting at them. The bullet is your responsibility.

jmorris
August 22, 2010, 03:44 PM
what where you shooting it with??


My 50 BMG. The OP said up to 50 BMG, just letting him know that is easier said than done.

You can also just go real simple and put some golf balls out and as you shoot them they get more difficult to hit the further you drive them out.

Tilos
August 22, 2010, 03:58 PM
I was going to suggest golf balls but thought they would appear lame compared to jmorris's stuff.
I was amazed at what little damage a round nose handgun bullet, lead or jacketed, does to a golf ball.
For lead, it's just a little entry/exit smudge, and NO HOLE:what:.
When hit, climbs the berm and then rolls back down.
jmorris I believe I once had a link to your website and all the stuff you have made....would you post it for US?

jmorris
August 22, 2010, 04:06 PM
jmorris I believe I once had a link to your website and all the stuff you have made....would you post it for US?

A lot of it is here. http://s121.photobucket.com/albums/o213/jmorrismetal/

Tilos
August 22, 2010, 04:11 PM
Here's a site with the mother load of target designs:

http://www.parmarng.org/freeidaho/AlSkDjFhG/index.html

jmorris: thanks for the link

jmorris
August 22, 2010, 04:46 PM
Here's a site with lots of targets:

http://www.parmarng.org/freeidaho/AlSkDjFhG/index.html


The Reed rattler I built above using Ken's plans from that link.

Zak Smith
August 22, 2010, 05:07 PM
Last time I bought AR500 plate it was about $1100 for a 8x4' sheet, which is enough to make 32 1ft square targets or a lot more smaller ones. That's actually not bad. The trick is finding someone to water cut it for you at an affordable price, and then to fabricate all the stands.

bgeddes
August 23, 2010, 12:08 AM
A guy not too far from me is starting a 3gun rimfire shoot. The concept is that everyone owns a few rimfires, and ammo, even real good ammo, is cheap in comparison to shotgun and centerfire stuff.

One handgun, an 'accuracy rifle', and a semi-auto (faster on target) rifle are the tools for this shoot. IMHO, this is a great way to enhance skills without breaking the bank.

Five acres could be plenty for this idea. A few long range precision shots, fast action rifle targets, and creative handgun stuff. The rimfires won't demand exotic steel. The ricochet is the only issue, and proper target design will prevent it.

Just an idea....

Shadow 7D
August 24, 2010, 01:51 AM
A lot of metal fab shops carry Hardox and similar alloys, could you weld it to a back plate to make something that could stand up to a .50, I know 3/8ths bounces 7.62

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