Can anyone identify this unusual tokarev variant?


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robin2y
August 30, 2010, 05:15 PM
I have a bit of a stumper: a tokarev variant that is distinctly different from the original russian or typical clones from china and eastern europe.

There are a few distinct difference:

1. the front of the slide is scalloped like a 1911 instead of the traditional straight cut over the recoil spring cover.

2. the top of the slide has a flatter radius similar to a 1911 instead of the traditional semicircle top and the front sight is longer.

The finish is excellent. There is noticeable heat treatment at the locking lugs on the slide as the finish has a different clolour. The serial number is 1951-21-003###. The only other marking is a sigma in the heat treaded area.

I have seen a twin to mine with a very similar serial number so i know that it was part of a production run. Given that the slide appears to be forged, someone would have had to made special tooling since there is significantly more metal on this slide compared to the traditional.


http://i829.photobucket.com/albums/zz212/robin2y/cgn/3toksideview.jpg

It is the one in the middle, between a russian refurb and a new norc.

http://i829.photobucket.com/albums/zz212/robin2y/cgn/3tokfrontview.jpg

This angle shows the scallop at the front better.

http://i829.photobucket.com/albums/zz212/robin2y/cgn/unusualtok.jpg

This angle shows the flatter top, note the extra meat on the side between the extractor and start of the radius.

Can anyone identify? Given the changes follow the styling cues of a 1911, my thoughts are that someone was considering an export model for the north american market.

R

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Mp7
August 30, 2010, 07:09 PM
no clue.

Envious though. :)
Even though its slight changes to the orig
and some to the norinco ...

... it looks bigger :-)

Sum1 will jump in on this shortly.

Clark
August 30, 2010, 07:11 PM
It looks like a T-33 Russian built between 1936 and 1946, but you need better pics and someone more knowledgeable than me.

This forum has a couple posters that are experts at identifying Tokarevs, but not everyone is as polite here at THR, so watch your step:
http://forums.gunboards.com/forumdisplay.php?17-Military-Handgun-Forum

robin2y
August 31, 2010, 12:02 PM
Thanks gents,
The top pistol in the first pic is a 1942 T-33.
All parts interchange with the russian and chinese.
Other noteable differences are the front sight (longer and more gracefully curved) and the magazine floor plate - all other ones I've seen don't have a seam on the top where metal was folded around.
R

zoom6zoom
August 31, 2010, 12:17 PM
Is there a Circle 11 marking? Looks like a Polish Tok to me. I believe the grips are incorrect, though.

robin2y
August 31, 2010, 04:15 PM
Nope, there is no cirlce 11.

r

robin2y
September 2, 2010, 05:03 PM
Thank for your assistance gents,

An expert from the other forum Clark recommended has stated that it is a rare Bulgarian tokarev and was able to provide details about the corresponding magazine which weren't observable from the pics i posted.

r

AdeQ
April 7, 2013, 01:21 PM
I have one with serial number #1951-21-002***. There should be a "10" hand stamped on the trigger guard. Factory 10 is located in Sofia, Bulgaria and is today simply known as Arsenal. They recently opened a facility in Las Vegas to manufacture AKs for the US and foriegn markets. The Bulgarian magazines are distinctive in that they show a seam along the side that differs from any other Tokarev magazine.

Mizar
April 8, 2013, 05:11 PM
There is no Bulgarian TT 30/33 - either the pistol, or magazines. Tulski Tokarev was never produced in Bulgaria, or parts for it. As for the Arsenal factory - the former "plant #10" is located some 150 miles north-east from Sofia in the city of Kazanluk.

I don't know what this pistol is, but it's definitely not a: Russian TT 30 (or 33), Polish, Romanian, Chinese or Hungarian Tokarev.

Boris

Jim K
April 8, 2013, 05:46 PM
It looks like a TT-30, but it could also be a post-war production TT-33. Does the barrel have the locking lugs only on top (like the 1911) and a removable backstrap? If so it is a TT-30.

Jim

Mizar
April 8, 2013, 06:15 PM
Mr. K, TT30 looks on the outside exactly like TT33 except for the trigger - the later one having a rounded top so it can be disassembled without the removable backstrap. There are 3 Tokarev variants produced in Soviet Russia: TT30, 33 and TT 51 (from 1951) - the later one having different slide serrations. Serial numbers are different (less digits and no dash) and they bare the markings of Tula plant. The last year of production was 1953.

Boris

leadcounsel
April 8, 2013, 08:29 PM
Polish. Known for those slide serrations and excellent fit and finish.

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