Taurus PT1911 AR Question


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Birdmang
September 13, 2010, 03:34 PM
On Buds guns they have this picture...

http://i151.photobucket.com/albums/s135/bassbikerdan/Picture2-2.png


...in the info section for this Taurus PT1911 AR.

Is the info in the picture accurate and worth it for the weapon?

Thanks


EDIT: the gun sells for $582.

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BP Hunter
September 13, 2010, 03:48 PM
I have the PT 1911 with no AR. I have placed about 100 rounds throught it. I only had 2 issues of failure to fire on on the fisrt 50 rounds but has not been a problem since. It has all the bells and whistles as advertised. Is it worth the money... I think so.

Olympus
September 13, 2010, 03:51 PM
It is a bit deceptive. If you were to buy a GI model 1911 and pay a gunsmith to perform those services, then yes the picture is accurate. There are some gray areas though. "Trigger job" can mean a lot of different things to different people. A Taurus factory "trigger job" will probably be completely different from a reputable gunsmith "trigger job".

But because there are so many different makers of 1911s now, that table isn't really accurate. If a person's only choice were a Taurus 1911 or a GI model which would have to be taken to a gunsmith to acheive those features, then it's accurate. But there's TONS of other option, and they fail to take that into consideration. I own a Taurus 1911 and it's a good gun, but I own a lot of other 1911s and they're good guns too. So that should tell you something right there.

SSN Vet
September 13, 2010, 04:06 PM
The Taurus certainly has a lot of popular features and gets pretty good reviews.

I think the comparison is somewhat misleading, as it implies that there is no difference between the features Taurus incorporates into their PT1911 and what you would get if you purchased Ed Brown or Wilson Combat components and had them installed.

Give me $2,100 of fun gun money and I certainly know which direction I'd go with it.

rduckwor
September 13, 2010, 04:43 PM
You need to understand how you are buying a gun with those features for that price.

Does it seem a bit too good to be true?

If so, then it probably is.

Most modern 1911's have some or all of those features depending upon the price point of a specific gun. As the previous posters commented, that list is a veritable shopping list when bringing a GI issued 1911 up to snuff.

Now back to Taurus: How do they provide all those features for that price?

Brazilian labor. Nothing wrong with Brazil or it's workers, but, Taurus has those guns assembled on a line in Brazil with a very minimum of hand fitting and with the least expensive parts they can source.

To sum it up:

Taurus, a gun built on an assembly line with cheap parts and minimal hand fitting and advertised as having great features at an almost unbelievable price.

The reality is that some of these guns run flawlessly, and some do not. The problem is that there is no way of telling which is which until AFTER you have plunked your money down. Then, it's too late if you were unlucky.

Their customer service is ineffective and frustrating at very best. At worst, it is unresponsive.

Take home lesson: It's your money, but you can do better with another manufacturer. And yes, it IS personal experience.

RMD

Olympus
September 13, 2010, 05:17 PM
I've had two Taurus 1911s, I still have one. The ambi-safety broke on the first one I had and this was a very common problem with the guns. My experience with Taurus customer service was completely fine. I called and spoke to a guy and they issued a return tag for the gun and told me to box it up and drop it off at FedEx. It was a simple and painless process and the turnaround time wasn't off par either. I ended up trading that gun for the same thing in stainless and I've been pleasantly surprised with it. There is TONS of information on the Taurus 1911 and you're going to get flooded with information from both sides of the spectrum. Just prepare yourself...

CZ223
September 13, 2010, 06:11 PM
two of them are Taurus Duo-tone models. I also own a Kimber Tac Pro II, a Kimber Eclipse Pro Target, a highly upgraded SS Springfield Mil-spec and, a Rock Island Compact Tactical. The two Taurus guns are more reliable than all the others. Both Taurus guns are more accurate than the others. Both Taurus guns are better looking than all but the Eclipse. If I have to sell all but one handgun I am keeping my Glock 23. If I can keep only one 1911 it will be one of the Taurus guns. When Taurus makes a lightweight commander I will sell my Kimber Tac Pro II and buy one.

PT1911
September 13, 2010, 06:16 PM
I have been more than impressed with both of the Taurus 1911's I have owned.. traded the first one for the second with an accessory rail. When compared to my the Springfield Loaded model I owned and the Kimber I own as well, it shoots as accurately and has proven to be more reliable with a greater variety of ammo.

The Lone Haranguer
September 13, 2010, 08:40 PM
It is a bit deceptive. If you were to buy a GI model 1911 and pay a gunsmith to perform those services, then yes the picture is accurate.
But you still wind up with a $500 pistol with extra bells and whistles. ;)

Full Metal Jacket
September 13, 2010, 08:54 PM
Is the info in the picture accurate and worth it for the weapon?

no.

you get taurus' version of those features, which are worth far less than they claim. a buddy of mine is selling his taurus 1911 after field stripping, he was putting it back together and the slide stop and grip safety both broke. taurus sent him the parts after he mailed in the broken ones (only took them 3 months), so at least he could sell a functional gun...


also, google taurus problems :eek:

TriTone
September 13, 2010, 09:05 PM
Any gun parted out is going to be much more expensive. Same with cars, my car would be three times as expensive if I built it from parts.

Kingofthehill
September 13, 2010, 10:08 PM
two of them are Taurus Duo-tone models. I also own a Kimber Tac Pro II, a Kimber Eclipse Pro Target, a highly upgraded SS Springfield Mil-spec and, a Rock Island Compact Tactical. The two Taurus guns are more reliable than all the others. Both Taurus guns are more accurate than the others. Both Taurus guns are better looking than all but the Eclipse. If I have to sell all but one handgun I am keeping my Glock 23. If I can keep only one 1911 it will be one of the Taurus guns. When Taurus makes a lightweight commander I will sell my Kimber Tac Pro II and buy one.

Wow, so much of that can't be true. as for dependability, you are putting a Taurus against a kimber. Kimbers have quiet a few problems and i would never use a kimber as a benchmark to compare others against.

As for Accuracy. no way... maybe YOU can shoot the Taurus more accurate than the other 1911's you own, but on a rest... i bet the taurus would be outgunned.

And looks... well, that's personal opinion.

I too own a lot of 1911's... from budget to high end customs. In the mix is my Taurus. its an OK gun, but i personally think guns like the Rock Island tactical and Citidel

Having to bend those tabs on the Taurus's trigger is just annoying and not to mention the swartz safety they thought was a great idea to install in their 1911's.

Olympus
September 13, 2010, 10:19 PM
also, google taurus problems

Not really a good barometer of quality. Google (insert manufacturer name here) problems..

VinnAY
September 13, 2010, 10:26 PM
You can only judge for yourself. There are more than a few Taurus complaints out there about the 1911. Some of the stories have to be taken with a grain of salt because Taurus can't control what owner (and/or subsequent owners) did to a gun that resulted in X horror story.

I can complain loudly about the rear sight on my PT1911AR, how it won't stay in place, shoots itself loose. But that isn't a Taurus problem in this instance. I could certainly thump my chest and cry "TAURUS!!!!" on the internet.

Truth is I bought it used and the previous owner buggered the sight swap, reason why that rear sight is buggered. Also scratched up the slide on the front sight, too.

I think you see my point.

My pistol is a finely crafted gun, IMHO. Quite accurate, too. I wouldn't trade it for a Colt, Kimber, or Springer of the same features. I've fired it hundreds of rounds without issue, with the cheapest 230 FMJ/JHP ammo I could find, steel cased wolf included.

It was for awhile my only concealed carry pistol until I built up my Springer GI with a bunch of hopped up parts and such.

I trust it that much.

Skylerbone
September 13, 2010, 10:40 PM
My feeling on the subject is this: There are many excellent pistols chambered in .45ACP. When you make the commitment to own a 1911 it should be a carefully chosen, quality firearm. In my opinion (and this is my sentiment) it ought to be made in the USA. Everything about it save the sights and stocks ("grips") ought to remain stock.

Taurus makes some descent weapons. Their 1911s are forged, accurate and include some descent features. Because I don't tend to buy pistols in quantity, I'll save for something that speaks to me and that's made here.

If $600 is a good deal then buy a nice Ruger or Smith & Wesson polymer frame and enjoy shooting while saving for a nice Colt or S&W 1911.

Full Metal Jacket
September 13, 2010, 11:10 PM
Not really a good barometer of quality. Google (insert manufacturer name here) problems..

if you so easily dismiss thousands of personal experiences on internet forums reporting the same problems, then why are you a member of a forum?

are you saying we should disregard those experiences, yet believe yours? :confused:


(by the way, check out the 1,000 page complaint thread on the Taurus forum....)

Olympus
September 13, 2010, 11:40 PM
if you so easily dismiss thousands of personal experiences on internet forums reporting the same problems, then why are you a member of a forum?

are you saying we should disregard those experiences, yet believe yours?


(by the way, check out the 1,000 page complaint thread on the Taurus forum....)

Unless you can personally substantiate all those claims on the 1000 page complaint thread, you have no idea what the real story is behind each one. So instead of citing something you have no way of verifying or something you have no personal experience with, I'd be a little hesitant to jump on someone who does have personal experience.

I didn't dismiss thousands of personal experiences. I simply stated that you can do a Google search and find problems with any gun manufacturer you can think of. Why am I a member of a forum, because I post personal experience based on things that actually have happened to me rather than relaying information I have no way to authenticate. In my opinion, someone who has actual experience that applies to something I'm interested in is more valuable to me than something simply regurgitating from others.

Am I saying people should disregard those experiences? No, that's silly. Like someone else has already said, some things should be taken with a grain of salt.

Full Metal Jacket
September 13, 2010, 11:47 PM
Unless you can personally substantiate all those claims on the 1000 page complaint thread, you have no idea what the real story is behind each one. So instead of citing something you have no way of verifying or something you have no personal experience with, I'd be a little hesitant to jump on someone who does have personal experience.

might want to read my first post on this thread (you obviously missed it), which outlines one of my personal experiences with taurus.


you're certainly welcome to ignore the multitude of taurus complaints, just like i'm ignoring your obvious affinity for taurus products. ;)

CZ223
September 14, 2010, 12:40 AM
I really don't appreciate being called a liar. Saying that "So much of that can't be true" is just another way of saying that I am a liar. What part don't you believe? I said that both of my PT 1911's are more reliable than my other 1911s, in fact they are the reason I started buying 1911s again. I had previously owned two POS Colts that were the reason for a 15 year hiatis from 1911s. After having owned the first PT1911 for about a year with over 3000 flawless rounds rounds down the tube, I bought my Kimber Tac Pro II and had problems from the get go. A quick trip to a local smith fixed it and it been pretty reliable since but still not as reliable as the Taurus. My next purchase was the second Taurus, a slightly used one this time, just as reliable as the first, though the safety is a little on the light side. Gun four was a springfield GI which I traded a week later for the Mil-Spec with a lot of upgrades. This gun has been pretty reliable although I haven't shot it nearly as much as the Tauri or the Kimbers. I thought the Springfield would be more accurate than it is. Next came a like new Kimber Eclipse Pro Target. It was reliable right from the get go though I have been having a few hang ups recently. The Taurus guns are going strong. The last gun is a Rock Island Comp Tac. It is very reliable with HPs but it hates my reloads. A couple hundred more Hps through it and I will probably carry it on occasion.

As for Accuracy, I will say it loud and clear again, THE TAURUS GUNS (that I own) ARE MORE ACCURATE THAN THE 4 OTHER 1911'S (that I own). Since I won't be carrying a bench rest and sand bag with me to the gunfight, I base all accuracy on offhand shooting. For the record, I was a silhouette shooter for 10 years so I am pretty good shooting offhand. Believe it or don't.

Obviously, looks are subjective. I happen to think that Taurus Blued models are ugly as sin. I wanted the Stainless version until I saw the Duotone. I will still probably end up with a stainless version in the future. It is true that some of the machining could be better, though I have seen more expensive guns with some of the same problems. If you think most of what I have said is blasphemous, this really ought to make you gag. I really only bought the Kimber Eclipse for two reasons. the first was that the price was right, I can always get at least what I paid for it, probably more. The second reason is that it looked a lot like my two Taurus guns.:D Yes, I am serious.

The bottom line here is that all companies make both good and bad guns. The problem here is that one bad gun gets more publicity than 100 good ones. Some moron blows up a Glock and all you hear about is the "Glock Kaboom". Also, people still believe that a more expensive product must be a better product. It just isn't so. Savage rifles are less expensive than their more expensive counterpart and, for the most part, they are stronger and more accurate.

The idea that a product that is made in the USA is better simply because it is made in the USA is absurd. It may have been true at one time, in fact, it was true at one time. The only thing that it means now is that it is more expensive.

Dimis
September 14, 2010, 01:30 AM
(by the way, check out the 1,000 page complaint thread on the Taurus forum....)
people are also notorious for pissing and moaning about every little thing too
ive met people that will say "brand x" isnt worth a dime because the nickle plating isnt as shiney as it was in the ad

its a 4-600 dollar gunand you will get what you pay for
that being said i own a PT1911B-1 (the railed one) and have had no trouble at all it acuratly hits where i aim OFF a bench when its realistic for defense i have yet to have a single failure to fire or eject in about 3k rounds and the fit on mine looks pretty solid even if it was done by an essembly line worker and not ed brown or bill wilson

the features are as stated on that list and they are not common on guns in that price range (if anyone can find me a reputable brand new with those features for $500 ill buy them two just for SNGs)

the selling point for me was a gentleman that works for probation and parole enforcment that carries a taurus he told me that it has served him well since day one even though he originaly bought it as a project gun but due to the fact it functioned so well he decided to use it as his carry piece

DasFriek
September 14, 2010, 01:41 AM
Ive had my PT1911 1.5 years and 2000 rounds now.
Its only required a new Wilson 47D mag around 600 rounds as i was having feeding issues which the mag cleared that up.
At 800 rounds i had to replace the extractor as i didn't notice mine didn't have enough tension and it had peened its self to where extractions were starting to have failures. Another Wilson part (extractor) cleared that up.

Thats when i found out when you replace any 1 part in the slide you have to replace them all if you use standard parts. If i had bought another Taurus extractor it would have been none issue. So the last 1200 round ive been running mine as a series 70 model with no firing pin safety. Ill be buying a new firing pin and plunger in a few weeks as im doing other upgrades on the gun.

Atm im in the process of replacing all the internals with all high quality non MIM parts as ive decided this gun will be a keeper.

So ive only had 2 issues and both were easily fixed by myself which is alot better than some other horror stories ive read about other 1911's.

Accuracy is amazing imo. My outdoor range only allows 25 yards as its shortest range and you cant move your target closer. With cheap ammo i can do some pretty small groups.

My guns bluing which was thin to begin with is showing quite a bit of holster wear from 1 year of ccw. And i noticed my slide is a bit wiggly which i never noticed before. This doesn't affect anything but it makes me want to get the gun to a smith soon. Even tho i try and do all my own work on my gun i dont trust myself with slide and frame fitting.

I hope to send it off for the slide/frame fitting, And a new bake on refinish and also have the sides of the slide ground so the Billboard is gone.

Imo the Taurus has been better than any other gun in its price range $500-$600 with the STI Spartan being the next step up in quality.
Forget the $2100 value crap they talk about, But the gun shoots as good as many $1000 guns. But the internals aren't as good as those guns either.

Mine came with a 4lb trigger and with an added 22lb recoil spring shoots so flat i can get back on target faster than any other pistol ive shot except for .22lr's.

Imo, If you can do basic 1911 repairs and adjustments the PT1911 may be a good gun for you. Forget sending it back under warranty unless its a major issue.
Also i highly suggest buying a stainless model.

If i didn't trust and like the gun so much i wouldn't carry it as my weapon of choice for ccw or sink all this extra money into it to carry it threw the next few thousand rounds. BTW the gun didn't need the internals replaced until i botched a trigger job, So it was a good excuse to put high quality parts back in it.

Olympus
September 14, 2010, 10:02 AM
might want to read my first post on this thread (you obviously missed it), which outlines one of my personal experiences with taurus.


you're certainly welcome to ignore the multitude of taurus complaints, just like i'm ignoring your obvious affinity for taurus products.

No, I didn't miss it. And I still submit that unless you have actually owned one of the guns, you don't have personal experience. Telling a story about your buddy's gun isn't the same thing as personal experience. A buddy of mine goes white water rafting every year. But I don't get on forums and talk about my personal experience with white water rafting.

I never said I'm ignoring the multitude of complaints. I'm sure there are a multitude that are valid. But I'm not going to be so naive to believe everything word for word. And I don't have an affinity for Taurus. I only own 1 Taurus gun and it happens to be the 1911. But I also own 5 other 1911s and I'll stand up and vouch for them if someone posts a thread about a particular one. I DO have an affinity for 1911s though.

Also i highly suggest buying a stainless model.


I will second that. That's the only reason I traded the first one I had for the one I have now. The first one was blued and my opinion is that it's a really thin finish. It started showing wear very early on. The stainless is much better.

SSN Vet
September 14, 2010, 04:34 PM
One point to consider...

If you ever get the bug and decide you want to tinker and build on your Taurus frame, it has been reported that they have changed some of the standard geometries (the sight cuts being one example), which makes many after market 1911 parts incompatible.

Full Metal Jacket
September 14, 2010, 06:01 PM
If you ever get the bug and decide you want to tinker and build on your Taurus frame, it has been reported that they have changed some of the standard geometries (the sight cuts being one example), which makes many after market 1911 parts incompatible.

that's true for certain models. some taurus 1911 models are more compatible than others. it's a complete mystery why taurus would do such a thing.

possum
September 15, 2010, 01:08 AM
I have the PT 1911 with no AR. I have placed about 100 rounds throught it. I only had 2 issues of failure to fire on on the fisrt 50 rounds but has not been a problem since. It has all the bells and whistles as advertised. Is it worth the money... I think so.
i would not be happy with this performance.

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