Need a Carry Gun: 9mm, DA/SA, Single Stack


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Packman
September 15, 2010, 05:42 PM
Well, just like the title says, I need a carry gun. My 21st birthday is rapidly approaching, and I'm itching. So, I'd like to get some suggestions from you folks.

Here's what I want:
9mm
Double-action/Single Action
Single Stack magazines
Prefer a metal frame to polymer. But I'm open. :)
Small enough to conceal relatively well on a slim guy
Big enough to be fun at the range.
Reasonably priced. (consider an 800$ limit.)

Here's what I DON'T WANT:
Anything Double stack. I have reasons.
1911 Designs. Unless there's a style out there that's DA/SA.


Stuff I've already looked at and decided against:
Sig P239. Just plain too big for what I'm looking for. Not to mention price.
Kahr CW9/P9/PM9. Feels ok in the hand, but I shot them and the trigger SUCKS. Granted it's a DAO, which is largely the reason they're excluded.



My brother carries a S&W 3913 TSW. If I could get my hands on one of those, I'd be tickled. That would be a happy day for me. Sadly, they're no longer made, and next to impossible to find, because everyone who has one wants to keep it. (Including my brother. :neener:)

So, THR, what say you?

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JDGray
September 15, 2010, 05:52 PM
Try a Sig 239:)

9mmepiphany
September 15, 2010, 05:55 PM
Well since you've eliminated the 1911 and Kahr platforms...I really like my Springfield EMP and Kahr CW9...my next obvious choice would be the Sig P-6, which is the LE version of the 225. The German LE trade-in P-6s are very nice and reasonably priced.

If you're generous with your definition of DA/SA, I'd highly recommend the H&K P-7. Again available as a LE trade-in from Germany, they are at prices that won't be seen again. They could well be the finest single stack 9mm of any size available

Packman
September 15, 2010, 05:57 PM
D'oh! Thanks JDGray, I actually meant to say Sig P239. I just pulled out my little bitty notebook and it would appear I fatfingered the post. Sorry!

Also, I'm going to a local gunshow this Sunday, so hopefully I'll get a chance to handle things and look up any of y'alls suggestions.

lechiffre
September 15, 2010, 05:57 PM
i like:
walther p5
sig/sauer p6 (p225)
sig/sauer p239
s&w 3914
beretta m92fs compact l type m (hope i got all that right)

wnycollector
September 15, 2010, 05:59 PM
Check out S&W 908's. They are essentially a value line S&W 3914. Here is a link for a NIB one for $465. http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=190750237

Packman
September 15, 2010, 06:03 PM
9mmepiphany, I wouldn't mind the HK p7. I was just looking at them on Gunbroker, they look to be going for 700-800$. Is that about right? I hear lots of good things about them, with the chief complaint being that they're tricky to find holsters for.

I don't have anything against the 1911 platform itself, I just want a DA/SA for this first gun. I'm sure that a 1911 will follow me home one of these days. :)

I just looked at the Sig P-6. Gunbroker has some cheap...I hadn't heard of these before. This bears further research! Thanks!

Dobe
September 15, 2010, 06:20 PM
You can find a P7M8 for $1000, if you are willing to look around.
This one just sold
http://hkpro.com/forum/showthread.php?128259-BACK-UP-F-S-p7m8-Sterling-KF-REDUCED-*now-with-free-mags

WRGADog
September 15, 2010, 06:23 PM
Walther PPS

docnyt
September 15, 2010, 06:27 PM
This may be an off the wall suggestion, but an East German Makarov PM 9x18 is not a bad first handgun.

Is the CZ Rami a single stack? Others may chime in on that one.

LawofThirds
September 15, 2010, 06:30 PM
No, the CZ 9mm's are all double stack.

I'm curious as to the single vs doublestack requirements, is it hand size or the fear of an unreliable magazine?

The Lone Haranguer
September 15, 2010, 06:33 PM
S&w 3913. :)

h2o4ever
September 15, 2010, 07:06 PM
zastava m88, only thing is a bad trigger.

RatDrall
September 15, 2010, 07:11 PM
Your best bet is a Sig P225 or P239. The P225 has much better balance, in my hand. Here's some in great shape, very hard to find:

http://www.topgunsupply.com/sig-sauer-p225-handguns/

Kahr CW9/P9/PM9. Feels ok in the hand, but I shot them and the trigger SUCKS. Granted it's a DAO, which is largely the reason they're excluded.

Kahr is not DAO, it is striker fired.

Packman
September 15, 2010, 07:12 PM
I'm curious as to the single vs doublestack requirements, is it hand size or the fear of an unreliable magazine?

It's a couple of things. One, I have really slender hands. Single stack grips tend to fit me much better. Two, overall, single stacks have a greater reputation for reliability. Three, and of not insignificant importance, is that I have too much crap carried around with me as it is. Doublestack mags are hard to conceal. :eek:

Kahr is not DAO, it is striker fired.

True, but it still has a really long, pretty heavy trigger pull that didn't impress me one iota.

Deaf Smith
September 15, 2010, 07:24 PM
Saw a mint 3906 S&W for sale. $575 with origional box. This one didn't have the hooked trigger guard to! I'd get it but I need another 9mm like a hole in the head.

Now that gun would work for you!

Deaf

ruckus3008
September 15, 2010, 07:32 PM
the walther pps is not da/sa.

Pilot
September 15, 2010, 07:45 PM
I know its not DA/SA, but the best single stack 9MM is a P7. Either a P7 PSP or P7M8. The best deals are on the surplus P7's.

Aahzz
September 15, 2010, 07:45 PM
3913s are still findable, at under $800 as well. Seek and find. But no, you can't have either of mine :D

Utahusker
September 15, 2010, 07:57 PM
Your best bet is a Sig P225 or P239. The P225 has much better balance, in my hand. Here's some in great shape, very hard to find:

http://www.topgunsupply.com/sig-sauer-p225-handguns/




I agree with RatDrall, The New German police version on TGS's site is all German and comes with three mags which makes it one heck of a deal.

wrs840
September 15, 2010, 08:04 PM
Check out S&W 908's.

True dat. I own one, and it's in a Supertuck IWB on my hip right now. Bud's is still selling new-old-stock, NIB, today.

Or find a used 3913. That's on my wife's hip, out with my kids at Church, right now.

Either fits your criteria nicely.

Les

jwr_747
September 15, 2010, 08:18 PM
any of the S&W 39 series would be a great pick.from the mod 39 up to the mod 3914...jwr

kmrcstintn
September 16, 2010, 12:56 AM
Sig Sauer P239 or used Sig Sauer P225

Jed Carter
September 16, 2010, 05:08 AM
So you don't want a SIG P239 or a Kahr? If I were you I would rent before buying, the SIG may change your mind.
I want a CZ PCR single stack but it does not exist, however CZ does have the CZ 2075 RAMI and 2075 RAMI BD. Otherwise you are limited to S&W, pretty nice guns but large for summer carry IMO, Model 39 was my first pistol.

harmon rabb
September 16, 2010, 08:24 AM
Kahr is not DAO, it is striker fired.

it's a DAO striker fired gun. just like a hammer, a striker fired gun can be DAO or SAO. glocks are DAO, for example; M&P's (despite what s&w claims) and xd's are SAO.

Topspeed
September 16, 2010, 03:23 PM
S&W 3913. Arguably the best single stack compact CCW ever. IMHO.

Strahley
September 16, 2010, 03:58 PM
SIG P239 or a SIG P225/P6 are going to be about your only option for these requirements

By DA/SA I assume you want a hammer, not striker fired

Strahley
September 16, 2010, 04:00 PM
Or the 3913. Forgot about that

STL73
September 16, 2010, 06:53 PM
Go with the Sig. I never understood the whole Sig thing until I had a chance to buy one at a good price. Can't say enough good things about my Sig.

1858
September 16, 2010, 08:48 PM
Your best bet is a Sig P225 or P239. The P225 has much better balance, in my hand. Here's some in great shape, very hard to find:

http://www.topgunsupply.com/sig-sauer-p225-handguns/

Those NIB P225s are a good deal compared to some of the NIB (new old stock) ones on GB when you consider that the NIB ones from TGS have SIG night sights and a Nitron finish on the slide. I have a P225 and like it so much that I want to buy another. I've found a NIB one from '92 for $675 but it has the original finish and no night sights. SIG charges over $200 to refinish the slide and install night sights so the ones from TGS would be a better value.

I have to wonder why P225s with German Police Markings are cheaper than the non-police versions. :confused:

:)

Hawgone
September 16, 2010, 10:40 PM
New member with a hello to all. Just getting back into handguns after a 30 year hiatus. Previouly revolver guy now a pistol convert. Packman several 3913's on Gunbroker now, most auction bid, but a couple "buy now".

jhallrv4
September 16, 2010, 11:01 PM
I can't say enough good things about my 3913NL. Hogue grips on mine, a tiny bit wider than the plastic-fantastic ones from factory, but much better feel. Mine has a carry melt treatment on the slide-release and saftey. Then again, I carry my PPS mostly. It's DAO, but it's rated for +P and fits on my ankle well.
I bought the 3913 a couple of years ago with 5 mags for about 550 as I recall. Smoking deal now.

fastbolt
September 16, 2010, 11:34 PM
3913's & 3913TSW's can still be found. Someone mentioned on one of the forums that S&W apparently released some overrun stock of some 3rd gen guns a while back, including some 3913TSW's and maybe some CS9's, to some distributor. They sometimes clean out their vaults and release some surprises onto the commercial market.

If you want something that feels like a single column magazine frame, but actually has a double column mag which holds 10 rounds, you might try to find a P99 AS compact chambered in 9mm. My SW999c feels as slim as my 3913 in my hands. The Anti-Stress (AS) offers something very close to a Traditional Double Action (DA/SA) when decocked, unlike the Quick-Action (QA) which is a something like the Glock constant (partially cocked) double action with the same trigger stroke each time. Personally, I tend to prefer the TDA models, myself.

If you eliminated the P239 for it's rather chunky grip profile, you might want to consider trying to rent one for test-fire before making your final decision. The Traditional Double Action P239 is a fine compact pistol and makes for a nice shooting compact 9mm. If I didn't already own a handful of excellent small 9's I'd have looked around to pick up a 239 for a decent price some time ago.

I generally don't like to make recommendations about guns unless I have the chance to gain some hands-on experience with someone and can gauge their knowledge, skillsets and experience, but the guns I've mentioned are ones which I've personally come to respect and feel are good examples of quality compact 9's. That obviously doesn't mean they'll suit everyone's needs and preferences, though.

Zerodefect
September 16, 2010, 11:45 PM
It's a couple of things. One, I have really slender hands. Single stack grips tend to fit me much better. Two, overall, single stacks have a greater reputation for reliability. Three, and of not insignificant importance, is that I have too much crap carried around with me as it is. Doublestack mags are hard to conceal. :eek:



True, but it still has a really long, pretty heavy trigger pull that didn't impress me one iota.

If you don't like the Kahr trigger then why would you want a far worse DA/SA trigger. My Ruger p95 and M9 have a worse DA pull on the first shot, and that is the most important and hardest shot to take, followed by lame floppy SA pulls. I'll take a Kahr over those any day.

Single stack mags are not more reliable than double. My Glock mags are the most reliable mags I've ever seen. (Current gen8) Alot of single stack mags don't hold the top round up very well when fully loaded, that top round can nose dive. 1911's do this, but are throated and ramped for it, so it's NBD.

I don't think this is a good time to buy based on those requirements. Better off waiting and learning more about different platforms. I started with a DA/SA, but will never recommend one ever again.

I'd recommend researching: Glock 19/23/17/22, S&W M&P, Walther, HK p9/p7.

LawofThirds
September 17, 2010, 12:42 AM
Most of the feed issues for doublestacks have pretty much gone the way of the dodo and other delicious animals.

My vote would probably go to either the M&P or a good look at the H&K P30 in the polymer section and the new SIG E2 offerings, CZ75 or 85 or S&W 3913/CS9 series for the metal frame options.

Dr.Rob
October 12, 2010, 12:21 PM
Walther P-1's with the hex nut can still be found for a reasonable price, leaving you a lot of money for ammo.

DonRon
October 12, 2010, 01:42 PM
Don't forget to look at the Kel Tec PF-9 and P-11. A lot of 9 mm pistol for the money. By the way, the PF-P fits in most of the Kahr CW 9/40 holsters and the P-11 fits in the Desantis Kahr CW 9/40 holsters.

1858
October 12, 2010, 02:43 PM
I bought a SIG P239 SAS Gen 2 chambered in 9mm Luger last week. It's DA/SA (which is my preference) along with the short reset trigger (SRT) and night sights ... it's one heck of a nice pistol. It comes with one 8-round magazine but the grip is on the short side for me so I ordered five 10-round magazines for it. It's smaller and lighter than the P225 and should make for a really good carry gun.

http://128.171.62.162/hawthorn-engineering/thr/pistols/sig_p239/photos/p239_factory.jpg

:)

Trumac
November 9, 2010, 03:06 PM
I have a feeling you won't like the pf9 if you don't like the Kahr trigger. I can't speak for the pull on the Kahr, but I have a pf9 and it is long, a little heavy and needs to be released fully for reset. If you decide you do like it, I'll sell you mine tho.

ABTOMAT
November 17, 2010, 08:11 PM
I went through the same thing as the OP, and went with a P6 for price and ergonomics reasons. Second choice was a 908 or 457.

P6's these days aren't the bargain they were in 2008, but replace the hammer spring and get the feed ramp machined and you basically get an ugly P225 for around $400+.

usp9
November 17, 2010, 08:34 PM
You can find a nice S&W 908 for $400 or less. It is a good size and certainly well made. It isn't my favorite by any means, but if I didn't have a better choice, it would serve well. Seen here as a comparison with a Kahr TP9.
http://i72.photobucket.com/albums/i186/ripley16/Pistols/Group%20shots/908andTP9012.jpg

Personally I opt for the Kahr, a P9 in particular, because they are so thin and easily concealed. I admit, I'd prefer a hammer on my Kahr if they made one.

SpentCasing
November 18, 2010, 09:51 PM
Go with the 908. A S&W 910 was my first pistol and i will never sell it. Very undervalued/rated line when being made new. Now either no one wants to sell or wants more than MSRP used but good ones do exist for far under your budget.

BigNYMini
November 18, 2010, 11:50 PM
Ruger SR9c

Packman
November 19, 2010, 09:23 AM
Thanks gentlemen,

I've already picked up my Smith and Wesson 3913NL.

I paid 325 for the gun with 1 mag, and then bought 3 extra mags at 10 each. So, I got the gun and 4 mags for 355, before tax.

It shoots great, and even though it's a used police trade-in, I was able to select from a number of them. The finish is decent, and the internals looks as though it was not shot very much. I'm very happy with it.

rscalzo
November 19, 2010, 10:59 AM
You can find a P7M8 for $1000, if you are willing to look around.

Surplus ones are available for less than $500.
Tons of 3913/14 for around $400. I wouldn't pay any more than than.

ABTOMAT
November 19, 2010, 11:19 AM
The $500 surplus P7s are PSPs. The P7M8's have a different mag release, a heat shield, and some other tweaks.

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