What is "Good Shooting?"


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jamz
December 13, 2003, 10:12 PM
Obviously I am new here. :) I am getting into shooting a bit, as I used to do it a little with my Dad years ago. I think it will be a pretty good stress reliever, especially considering that there is a range within walking distance of where I work.

At any rate, I was at another range (Smith and Wesson Store and range) in Springfield MA the other day, and tried out a Walther P99 .40. It was very nice. A week or two earlier, I had tried out a couple of their .22 caliber jobs. Both are good. I kept my targets for future reference. But I ramble.

At any rate, with a pistol, off the shelf, and not a competition model, what is "Good Shooting" at 25 yards? All within the 10 ring? All a little outside? Hitting the target at all?

Any advice for a newbie? :)

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Navy joe
December 13, 2003, 11:20 PM
First goal for the situation you describe is to have all your shots on paper, count them and see. Take a shot or two and then rest, look at the target whatever, don't just stand there and blast a whole mag downrange at 25yds. Make each shot count. As for what is "good" that is a subjective judgement you must make based on your skill and goals. Absolute good is the fact that most box stock pistols are mechanically capable of keeping all shots in the 10 ring of a NRA 25yd timed & rapid bull. If you can make a identifiable group at that range, you're doing okay. If you get discouraged, move the target closer until you master good groups there.
Firing 25rounds offhand in strings of 5 at a fairly rapid pace I personally expect to end up with a centered group of about 5-6". I judge myself by scoring the target against available score which in this case would be 250-25x on a NRA B-8. Currently I am at 231-4x with my often shot Glock 34.
With a .22 pistol and a two handed actual shooting stance I expect them all in the black. I did 200 some rounds of that silly one handed, weak hand stuffed in the back pocket, bullseye crap tonight:D with my Marvel .22 on top of a Colt 1911 frame. Best score for 50 was a 415-4x of 500 possible, so obviously I need to work on the one handed gig if I am to shoot bullseye.

New guy advice? Get a .22, get lots of ammo, repeat. B/A/U/U/R (Buy ammo use up, repeat) Dryfire. A lot. Never think that what you are doing is "good enough". Be proud of your improvement, just know that you can get better. Welcome to THR.

Standing Wolf
December 13, 2003, 11:55 PM
Any advice for a newbie?

I'd like to recommend joining the NRA and GOA:

http://www.nra.org
http://www.gunowners.org

I've found shooting well varies a great deal. If I'm shooting bullseye indoors, my hopes and expectations are very different from plinking outdoors with friends, and likewise, it makes a great deal of difference whether I'm shooting a match pistol or a center fire revolver. I believe it's more important to shoot than shoot well at first. Shooting for scores can be a wonderful thing, but discouraging sometimes, too.

Sheslinger
December 14, 2003, 01:20 AM
Enjoy shooting and stay safe. Welcome to THR.

Sheslinger

minnesota oldie
December 14, 2003, 07:17 AM
Any shooting is good shooting.

MicroBalrog
December 14, 2003, 08:12 AM
Welcome to THR.:D

Gunhead
December 14, 2003, 10:23 AM
My definition of good shooting when you can put 3 rounds into a 2" group (10-ring) at 25 meters , or 20 rounds into a 4-5" group (10 and 9-ring) at the same distance, offhand.

duckfoot
December 14, 2003, 03:59 PM
To me "Good Shooting" is where you learned a little more or improved over the course of your range session. But, as in preformance, "Good shooting is putting ten shots into a six inch circle at 800 yds.

Advise Huh?

If you shoot a lot (IE more than twice a month) buy a reloading press ASAP, if you don't have one already! If you do buy a reloading press you'll wind up going to the range more than twice a month, just so you can reload more! HHAAAAA:D

CZ-100
December 14, 2003, 04:12 PM
Hitting what you AIM at! :neener:

jamz
December 14, 2003, 07:53 PM
Thanks, all. :) This place was a good find. I found it from my car forum, www.impreza.net (I'm a car geek). I love the way that spelling and grammar and such are all so good here. Makes it easier on the eyes, dontcha know. ;)

My first pistol looks to be a .22 - the ammo is sheap, and I don't have all that much money. I live in Massachusetts, and am taking the "Pistol Safety Class" on Wednesday, with the hopes of a class A when my FID expires in January.

Thanks again for the welcome. :)

JohnKSa
December 14, 2003, 10:08 PM
The NRA has a Marksmanship Qualification Program applicable to various types of firearms and shooting disciplines.

The program can be self-administered for the most part (the highest level requires 3rd party verification) and will allow you to start from square one and progress to a level which most would agree is reasonably proficient.

Some of the shooting discipline qualifications are a bit on the easy side, some are quite difficult to complete.

http://www.nrahq.org/education/training/marksmanship/index.asp

P95Carry
December 14, 2003, 10:16 PM
Welcome here jamz ...... :)

''Good shooting'' ... hahaha ... a multi-faceted term. It is all so relative .. the gun, the ammo, the shooter .... the conditions ..........

I'd say it has to be something rather personal .. in early days anyways .. if each time you go out you find ways to improve and capitalize on your practice such that it becomes beneficial experience then ''good shooting'' today - is being better than last week.!!

Too much obsession with the ''x'' ring can be counter-productive but .. familiarity with your weapon/weapons ..... fluency and proficiency all add up to ''good shooting'' ..... being in control .. and above all - SAFE!!

CTI1USNRET
December 14, 2003, 10:28 PM
"Good shooting" for me is double tapping three silhouettes in the "A" zone in 3 seconds or less from 15 feet (spaced randomly side to side). I do it every weekend and sometimes during my lunch break. I use a Springfield WWII Parkerized 1911A1 45 ACP.

Jayman
December 15, 2003, 12:27 AM
Hey, IMHO it depends on if you are shooting bullseye or tactical. Bullseye is focus on extreme marksmanship at a given range with no time limit. Tactical is pretty much a 6" or 8" ring at varying distance, as quickly as possible.

I started shooting IDPA because I stink at bullseye. ;)

280PLUS
December 15, 2003, 11:37 AM
slow fire = 10 shots in 10 minutes

a score of 80 or better is pretty good or about average for most

remember if the hole is just touching the higher ring line, you get that higher ring score

when you start popping them off in the mid to high 90's people take notice

:D

fyi

then there is : timed fire = 2 strings of 5 shots each , each string gets 20 seconds

and : rapid fire = 2 strings of 5 shots each, each string getting 10 seconds

there is one style target for slow fire and another style thats used for both timed and rapid (scoring rings are different sizes)

the 3 types of strings are combined in different ways depending on what kind of match you are shooting

generally a "round" consists of 3 targets one of each type string and a total of 270 - 275 is about average

happy shootin"

m

goosegunner
December 15, 2003, 12:12 PM
good shooting is shooting better than your average

jamz
December 15, 2003, 07:04 PM
So, 10= 10 points, 9= 9 points, etc. etc.?

Hmm, not bad. I noted that out of 10 shots (unless I was playing around) about 7 of them would be in the 10 ring and a few just barely outside. This is with a Walther P99 .40.

I may have to repeat this experiment. :D

P95Carry
December 15, 2003, 07:10 PM
I may have to repeat this experiment. jamz ..... you don't mention the distance but I'd say ..... if the ''experiment'' is repeated with similar results then you can justifiably claim ''good shooting''!!:)

jamz
December 15, 2003, 07:27 PM
Welp, I *think* it was 25 yards. Whatever "position 1" is at your local range that has those automatic sliding target thingies.

Anyway, you know what they say about beginner's luck and all.

Thanks for the advice, all. :)

-James

Bainx
December 15, 2003, 07:34 PM
I'm gonna sound like an old fogie here but to me, good shooting is when you can make the plastic Coke super-bottle jump 5 times in a row, at a distance of over 15 yards, with your Ruger MKII!

Welcome to The Highroad:)

Oh yeah,

treat all guns as if loaded
do not point gun at something you are not willing to destroy
keep finger off of trigger until ready to fire gun
know target and what is beyond it

280PLUS
December 16, 2003, 08:21 AM
hitting a crow on the fly with your .22 rifle,,,

heard about it,,,

never seen it nor done it myself neither,,,

would like to try some day...

:D

point of interest,,,25 yards is approx 30 paces for the average size male

my pace is exactly 2.5 ft and i'm about 5' 8",

i will admit to stubby legs however

just measure your pace and you will always have a handy measuring tool for long distances in the field

shermacman
December 16, 2003, 09:30 AM
Welcome jamz! As a fellow Massachusetts resident be glad you live here! Once you get your Class A License you can buy a hand gun over ther counter in under 15 minutes, I have! WalMart is stocked with lots of ammo and long guns. There are rifle ranges everywhere.

Having said that, join GOAL. They are the only operation that is paying attention to what is going on.

GOAL
P.O. Box 567
Northboro, MA 01532
508-393-5222

dischord
December 16, 2003, 10:46 AM
New guy advice? Get a .22, get lots of ammo, repeat. I'll second that.

Also, learn and obey the four gun safety rules http://www.thefiringline.com/Misc/safetyrules.html

280PLUS
December 16, 2003, 04:02 PM
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?s=&postid=667067

:D

Valkman
December 16, 2003, 07:30 PM
Hitting the target at all?

Ah, that reminded me of the good ol' days back at the Bullseye range in Sacramento. All the regulars there were seriously into target shooting, but it was open to the public. About once a week or so a guy would come in with a pistol box, and almost always would have a girlfriend along. They'd set up, oblivious to the rules (such as the 5 round per mag limit), and proceed to jack 15 rounds in a 9mm mag while giving the GF looks like "You're really gonna see some shooting now!". Then they'd aim downrange (they had to shoot at 25 yards because everyone else was) and start blasting. By about the fifth round two things would happen - the 70-year old ex-Marine Rangemaster would start to yell "What the Hell are you doing?!" as he headed over, and all the bullets would be coming nowhere near the target. At the end of the mag the Rangemaster would be telling (yelling) him that his shooting style did not lend itself to accuracy, and besides "I'll bet you didn't hit the target anyway". Then the target would be brought back and sure enough there'd be no holes in it. Only then would they realize that hitting the target at 25 yds wasn't that easy.

Good enough at 25 yards is the best you can do while striving to get better. When I started I'd be lucky to score a 50! :)

Keep practicing and your groups will shrink.

Welcome to our group! :D

jamz
December 16, 2003, 08:01 PM
Tomorrow I take a pistol class as a prerequisite to any pistol license here in MA. The instructor is Josh Ulrich, by all accounts a good guy. We'll see what happens at the range. :)

I'm pretty excited about this, I''m taking it with my brother and a mutual friend. Also, it is at the range at which my dad is a member, so he is going to show up when we start at the range, and he's gonna bring all his toys (AR-15, M14, 1911, etc.) :D

-James

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