P22 or Buckmark?


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aestheticcm1
September 23, 2010, 04:33 PM
Hi Guys, I'm new to the forum and figured I'd consult you members in assisting me with my decision. I know this is a common theme, but I was looking for more recent input on the P22 than I was able to locate through my google searching.

Anyway, I am looking to buy a .22 semi-auto handgun, and after holding many and firing a few, I have narrowed my search down to two guns, the Walther p22 and the Browning Buckmark with a 4 inch barrel. I have handled many Rugers and although I like the way they shoot, I just can't get past their grips, so they are no longer on the table.

The Buckmark: I like everything but the price tag: $440.

The p22: I like this gun alot as well, and the price tag $250 for one that is barely used sits well in my conscience. However, I'm uncertain about both it's reliability and longevity.

This is where I am really in need of help, so here are my questions:

1) Is the Walther really picky with ammo?

2) Do newer p22s have the same problems (feeding & ejection) that earlier production models did?

3) Will I need to meticulously load the magazine, or will quick and dirty suffice?

4) Is the slide still made out of zinc?

Thanks for all your help. My purpose with this pistol is inexpensive pinking, and I have absolutely no interest in match shooting. I am really just looking for a cheap way to work on my handgun skills and accuracy.

Cheers,

Charlie

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General Tso
September 23, 2010, 04:38 PM
It's still zinc. It just feels like a cheap toy. Look at the ruger 22 semi-autos or S&W 22A.

millertyme
September 23, 2010, 05:07 PM
$440 for a Buckmark? You need to keep looking. I got the stainless model with fiber optic sights and rubber finger grips for $289 on sale from a regular $339. I wouldn't get a P22 just because I've shot them and I didn't really care for them. I'd go with Buckmark over a SW22A as well. The 22A felt cheap compared to the Buckmark and for the slightly higher price the Buckmark really stood out with the upgrades. Even if it wasn't on sale I wouldn't have gone with the 22A. When I was looking for a .22lr auto-loader it came down to the Ruger or the Buckmark after trying out all the others in the sub-$350 range including the Beretta, the 22a, the Ruger in both MkIII and 22/45, the P22, and the Mosquito. Obviously the sale price on the model I got made it a no-brainer. But I really did make sure I was getting something I wanted. I don't regret it at all.

Shadow 7D
September 23, 2010, 05:08 PM
Buckmark, long good history, or pick up a older one, there is a reason that 60-90 year old .22 go for more than new ones.

Ala Dan
September 23, 2010, 05:10 PM
The Browing~! :scrutiny: ;) :D

TonyAngel
September 23, 2010, 05:50 PM
I'd stay away from the P22. I'll say the same for the Sig equivalent, although if I had to choose between the two, I'd take the Sig. The P22s that I've shot were all pieces of crap. Both mentioned are, from what I've seen, ammo picky and kind of take the economy out of shooting .22. All of the ones that I've shot like the hot expensive stuff in order to run right.

Stick with Ruger, Smith and Browning. They run and shoot like a .22 should. That is all day and on almost anything you care to feed them. I own a bunch of Rugers. I just can't seem to pass them up when I see a used one for sale, especially now since the Mark III came out. I grab the Mark II's when I find them. I don't own any Brownings, but have a friend that is the same way with Brownings as I am with Rugers. Nice shooters. Any .22 will hang up once in a while. It's a matter of whether the gun hangs up so much that it takes the fun out of shooting it. I've seen this a lot out at the range with Walthers.

waterhouse
September 23, 2010, 05:51 PM
I'd go with the Buckmark. I also agree that most of the Buckmark versions can be found for under $440.

Pilot
September 23, 2010, 05:51 PM
Ruger MK II or Browning Buckmark. Please.

wow6599
September 23, 2010, 06:03 PM
Browning or Ruger for .22LR handguns. The Walther P22 is a piece of garbage.
I have owned all 3....wish I still had the Browning, love my Ruger and feel sorry for whoever bought the P22 from the LGS.
YMMV

Lakeshore
September 23, 2010, 06:10 PM
Most people who own or have shot both will tell you the Buckmark is the much better choice. BTW it ban be had for well under $440 (Bud's). P22 isn't as accurate and seems to be plagued with all manner of mechanical issues.

frankge
September 23, 2010, 06:30 PM
P22 is a fun gun but not a target pistol. If you use higher velocity ammo like CCI mini-mags it runs fine. I keep it to screw around with or introduce new shooters. I like it because its "blasty" for a 22.

Strahley
September 23, 2010, 07:06 PM
Browning by a landslide or two. And find one cheaper. I got mine for less than $350 out the door

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v228/strahley/guns/buckmarktarget82110.jpg

Hanzo581
September 23, 2010, 07:11 PM
P22, runs perfectly fine with quality ammo.

Strahley
September 23, 2010, 07:23 PM
Put a few hundred rounds through a Buck Mark, then go shoot a P22. You'll probably want to throw the P22 in the trash afterwards. I rented a Mosquito for the hell of it after putting a brick through my Buck Mark, and I wanted to do the same

Walkalong
September 23, 2010, 07:29 PM
Lots of folks report problems with the P22, but almost no one complains about the Buckmark.

I have had a P22, and got rid of it. I still have my Buckmark. :)

Magoo
September 23, 2010, 08:20 PM
I like Walther ergonomics. I've got a P99 that fits my long, skinny fingers very nicely. I've handled some P22s and while the idea and form is there, the thing is tiny (I know, it's a .22, not a .40 :rolleyes:). I wanted one, esp. since a threaded barrel is an option. Couldn't do it. Even though I like the feel of my Walther, I enjoy shooting 1911s much more, and I shoot better with them. The Buckmark grip angle is very similar to that of 1911s. If you're trying to use this .22 for practicing handling and shooting skills, you might want it to be similar to your carry/defense pistol.

I've now got two Buckmarks and don't regret it a bit.

Oh, and google up the "heggis flip" for a nice quick and easy DIY trigger job. And for plinking, the "Ultimate Cliploader" can really help you chew through a brick of cheap bulk ammo in short order.

You can definitely find better prices on Buckmarks.

Tommygunn
September 23, 2010, 08:28 PM
I have:
Walther P 22
Buck Mark -- a clone of Strahley's above.
Ruger Mk III.

I like the P22.
But I like the Buck Mark & the Ruger better.
They're both quality guns made out of steel .... not zinc.

Captcurt
September 23, 2010, 08:48 PM
Of the two guns listed I would definately pick the Browning over the P22, but you should find one cheaper than $440. I owned a P22 for a couple of months. The trigger was almost as bad as my Keltec. We're talking bad. Both went bye bye. Never owned a Buckmark but the few that I have shot were very nice. I could live with one.

But now Rugers are a different thing. I have a 22/45 tapered barrel, a 22/45 bull with a Pro-point, and a Mark 1 in the box. I kinda like the Rugers.

triplebike
September 23, 2010, 09:08 PM
My Buckmark was $270 OTD,very slightly used.

It is reliable, accurate, easy to maintain ( I might get some remarks to the contrary on this one) and just a blast to shoot.

I probably have close to 10K rounds through it, just's shoots & shoots.

Once you put a few hundred rds through one, you won't look back. Excellent handgun

Hanzo581
September 23, 2010, 09:37 PM
What catastrophic problems have you guys had with the P22? I didn't realize so many people hated them...for me it feels great in my hand and I've never had any mechanical problems, am I just lucky?

Shipwreck
September 23, 2010, 09:47 PM
I paid $249 for mine
http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g320/mistershipwreck/Buckmark1.jpg

Gideon
September 24, 2010, 11:33 PM
I have both. For nothing but plinking either is perfectly fine. Here are my observations:

P22:
-fits the hand nicely
-not as accurate as the Buckmark, not even close
-Reliable all the time with CCI Mini-Mags; with other ammo it just depends but when I started shooting CCI Mini-Mags it was like magic. Perfectly reliable from that point forward
-Accurate but again, not like the Buckmark
-Fun, lots of fun
-hard to mount a red dot or similar optical; you can buy a bridge mount but it's plastic. Okay for very simple plinking but still it's plastic.
-A bit of a pain to put the recoil spring back in
-can jamb if it's real dirty (but not with CCI-MiniMags :D)
-Fits small childrens hand's very well so it's been the favorite gun for my children
-you can buy a threaded end to screw on the barrel that can be used to screw on a sound suppressor if you ever would want to do that. Can't do that with the buckmark; you'd have to buy a seperate barrel.

Buckmark:
-ACCURATE; very very accurate; good enough to hunt squirrels with and take headshots
-Totally different feel in the hand but nice
-I hate the gold trigger; looks cheap to me :p
-Fine high end qualify firearm
-solid opportunity to mount a red dot; I put a mueller recticle red dot on mine and the accuracy is FUN and more FUN, can definitely appreciate the increased accuracy when just plinking!
-doesn't fit any of my children because it's a much larger grip. In fact it's right at the limit for being too big for me but this isn't a CCW gun so it's fine.



They're very different guns and I like them both but I guess if I could only have one, I'd go for the buckmark due to better quality, more reliable with more types of ammo and far more accurate. But it does depend on how they feel in your hand. My P22 was the limited edition and came with both the short and long barrel. With the long barrel, the bridgemount and the red dot it was pretty accurate and a fun looking gun.

For what you're doing and if you're on a tight budget I wouldn't hesitate to get the P22 and shoot mini-mags through it for utter reliability. But remember, accuracy is fun for plinking too and if you'd ever be tempted to hunt squirrels with it then get the Buckmark!


PS you can get a Buckmark cheaper; I got mine off the internet for right around $300; it had the fiber optic sights I wanted and the newer style grip.
Gideon

oasis618
September 24, 2010, 11:40 PM
Buckmark all the way but keep shopping around!

buckeye8
September 24, 2010, 11:41 PM
If it's between these two guns, and part of your criteria is "reliability and longevity", it really is no-contest. The Buckmark is several steps above the P22 in "reliability and longevity", along with just about every other criteria you could come up with. Two entirely different classes of pistols.

6x6pinz
September 25, 2010, 09:26 AM
I have both, actually all of the current "hot" 22 pistols out there. The P22 is a great little pistol and many find it less intimidating than the others. I have not had any experience with failures as soo many have had. My P22 even works with the 45 round drum and it is a short barrel. Having said that the P22 is just that a fun pistol to shoot. If you are wanting to work on pistol "skills" you need to look harder at the Buckmark and find a much better deal. I have many rounds of trouble free operation out of my P22 but I am not under any impression that it will last as long as the other major brands. It is too bad some of the people out there can not just enjoy a firearm for what it is rather than bashing it for what they think it should be.

Jed Carter
September 25, 2010, 10:05 AM
I would pass on a used Walther P22, there may be a reason it was traded. Most people run hot or cold on the P22 anyway. I have a Buckmark love it, even at $440 it is a better deal than the P22, you will be able to hand this down thru generations

digsigs226
September 25, 2010, 10:38 AM
I was faced with situation last April, and personally, I regret going with P22.

Accuracy, IMO, is deplorable on this gun, even for a plinker. I freely admit I'm not the greatest pistol shot... but 3.5'' groups at 7 yards is about the best I have done with this pistol. At 15 yards, it's all over the place. I'm sure other shooters can do better than me with this pistol, but this thing is a joke compared to other handguns I have shot.

Reliability has been nothing to write home about either. Last time out at the range I experienced multiple FTE's and even had two times where the hammer fell and nothing but silence followed. Mind you, this was WITH CCI Minimags. I stopped buying the cheap stuff after my first Federal bulk pack where the pistol would constantly FTE the first two rounds of every magazine without fail.

Sure the ammo is cheaper but it is really hard to enjoy a gun when you have to tap, rack, bang constantly and can't hit what your aiming at. :(

KodiakBeer
September 25, 2010, 11:30 AM
I own both. The P22 runs good, but it's just a plinker. It has a mushy trigger and is just too light to shoot well offhand.
$440 is high for a Buckmark, but you may be looking at one of the high-end models. The basic Buckmark "camper" is about $300, has a bull barrel and is a fine shooter.

Stringfellow
September 25, 2010, 11:49 AM
Its been said before, but I will jump on the pile: the Buck Mark is a classic pistol, and you will not regret buying one. You can find one under $300 if you look. I got mine via Gunbroker for $250, in mint condition a few months ago.

If budget is an issue, the S&W 22a is actually considered a bit of a "sleeper" pistol. Generally everyone who has one loves it, provided you can get past its, ahem, "unique" looks. I see them for barely over $200.

kludge
September 25, 2010, 09:49 PM
No contest. Buckmark. The "Camper" is ~$300.

If you bought both today, I can guarantee you that in 20 years you'll still have and be loving the Buckmark.

788Ham
September 25, 2010, 11:51 PM
I bought a Buckmark about 5 years ago, paid around $200 for it NIB, its still running good. I had it out last week, ran about 200 thru it, cleaned it up and its still like new, if you take care of them! I'm like shipwreck, not Bill Hickock, but it shoots like no other .22 pistol I've ever had, had 3 before this one. JMO:cool:

GojuBrian
September 26, 2010, 12:17 AM
Another vote for..

http://i699.photobucket.com/albums/vv360/sanchin31/buckmark019.jpg

millertyme
September 26, 2010, 12:20 AM
^^
Yeah, that's the one I bought. On sale for $289. Love it.

CliffyDeuce
September 26, 2010, 12:59 AM
^ Make that 3 of us. Got it new for under $300 about a year and a half ago. Absolutely no complaints - and my wife (that had never shot a gun before) actually enjoyed shooting it as well. She didn't do half bad either...

PzGren
September 26, 2010, 02:28 AM
P22 or Buckmark?

Among those two I would choose the Buckmark.

captain awesome
September 26, 2010, 03:42 PM
based on all the positive I read on the buckmark, I bought one. haven't shot it much as I lent it to my cousin, who because of some "accidental mistreatment" is now paying off a new gun for me, and the buckmark is now his. before that he owned a p22 which he loved and sold. why he sold it? i have no idea because he is always talking about how great it was;reliable, accurate, no ftf's. But that's what he does, he is always cycling through guns he loves for one reason or another, I think its stupid, he always regrets it. He says he doesn't like the buckmark as much. not as accurate and once in a great while he has a miss feed. I personally didn't see any problem with accuracy, nor did I have any miss feeds. I didn't like the action much though, its stiff, and if your not careful it will bite your thumb. But my replacement gun is a used colt 22 target that's been on layaway for a couple months..

Win_SX-1
September 27, 2010, 12:11 AM
I have a Walther P22 - actually it is my wife's handgun, but I get to shoot it now and then.

In answer to your questions:

1) Is the Walther really picky with ammo?
=> Yes - you need to use quality ammo

2) Do newer p22s have the same problems (feeding & ejection) that earlier production models did?
=> Don't know - my P22 is 8 year old and we've fired over 10k rounds in it. It is not a target gun, but good enough for plinking

3) Will I need to meticulously load the magazine, or will quick and dirty suffice?
=> Don't understand your question. We just load and shoot.

4) Is the slide still made out of zinc?
=> Don't know, don't care

If you are looking for accuracy, go for the Buckmark. The P22 has a changeable back straps that means that the gun can fit both my hand and my wife's (smaller) hand.

We would not swap our P22 - it is fun to shoot and meets our need. It really comes down to what you want and expect from the gun. For fun, both will do. For accuracy, the Buckmark. If more than one person will shoot it, maybe the P22

Col. Plink
September 27, 2010, 12:19 AM
Buckmarks rule!

rtpzwms
September 27, 2010, 12:29 AM
Don't get me wrong I like my P22 but I have owned both and would drop the P22 like a hot potato in favor of the Buck Mark. Which Buck Mark did you find? The camper model with the 5.5 inch barrel MSRP is 349. We all know you can do better than that...

aestheticcm1
September 27, 2010, 06:06 PM
Thanks for all the great feedback and especially the posts from people who own both guns. You guys addressed my questions head on. Yes, I am looking at a slightly higher end model of the buckmark: wooden grips, a slab side barrel, nice finish. I know I can save a hundred or so with the camper model, but I really like the feel of this particular gun.

Thanks again for these replies, I'll stick with the buckmark decision.

Cheers,

Charlie

KodiakBeer
September 27, 2010, 06:20 PM
When you get your Buckmark - do this one modification.

It takes less than ten minutes and makes the trigger (almost) match grade.

Scroll down a bit on this page and see a step by step photo demonstration on how to do the "Heggis flip".

http://www.rimfirecentral.com/forums/showthread.php?t=174356&page=4

Magoo
September 28, 2010, 10:43 PM
As KodiakBear said, definitely look into the Heggis Flip. I'll confess it took me longer than ten minutes, but it was WELL worth the relatively little effort it did take me. You can also use that work to stone any nasty little burrs/machine marks on your hammer and sear (be careful though :uhoh:).

If the model you get doesn't have an overtravel screw, that's also a nice and easy add-on. I've got extras of them and will give you two if you want a couple (one to lose and one to install :p) (shoot me a PM if'n ya want). I can also send a drill bit and tap as well if you'll pinky swear to send 'em back.

There's a "sticky" over on rimfirecentral under the Browning section that is a must read for anyone new to Buckmarks. Tons of info in there.

LeontheProfessional
September 28, 2010, 10:52 PM
Definitely the Buckmark. The trigger is amazing on it is supremely accurate. The P22 has been known to be ammo picky but the buckmark will eat the cheap stuff.

dv/dt
October 24, 2010, 02:26 AM
Just my $.02:

I've had a P22 since Feb, probably put around 3000 rounds through the thing, with no adverse wear. I dosen't handle the cheap bulk stuff real well, but I've found that it works well with Thunderbolts, CCI stuff, and the occasional "American Eagle" ammo.

Its also a very good first time gun for me being that it looks and operates like many of the other semi-automatics out there. Great for teaching new people how to shoot.

David E
October 24, 2010, 02:48 AM
My purpose with this pistol is inexpensive pinking. I am really just looking for a cheap way to work on my handgun skills and accuracy.

Which is it? Inexpensive plinking, or a cheap way to work on (improve?) your handgun skills?

When you plink, misses don't matter much, as long as they were somewhat close to hitting the target. Action type doesn't matter, either. One of the most durable, reliable and versatile is the Ruger Single Six.......a great choice for inexpensive plinking.....but it is a single action and it's pretty accurate.

But when you want to improve your handgun skills, then the understudy gun selection becomes more important. This is presuming you have a centerfire gun you're wanting to transfer your highly honed .22w pistol skills to.

If so, what is your centerfire gun?

If it's a Glock, then the P-22 is not a good choice. This is due to the DA trigger and grip angle. Reconsider one of the Ruger .22's, as the grip angle is closer to the Glock.

If your centerfire is a 1911, then the Buckmark deserves a good, long look, as does the Ruger 22/45.

If your primary is a DA revolver, then you need a .22 DA revolver. S&W would be first choice.

If you do not currently own a centerfire handgun, then what kind will you buy? If you know, then get the .22 that best matches your future centerfire.

If your current centerfire is a semi-auto, consider getting a .22 conversion kit for it.

I own both the P-22 and Buckmark. I've had more trouble with failures to fire with the Buckmark. I can't recall any issues with my P-22. Mine is pretty accurate, too.

Wade Wilson
October 24, 2010, 04:39 AM
I have owned both, the p22 I had was trash. The Buckmark is hand downs fantastic, and considering that you can get either one for around the same price, the Buckmark would be the winner. It seems like 22 auto loader pistols in general are somewhat picky with ammo. I have shot gophers off my porch with a Buckmark, I couldnt ever possibly do this with a p22. Accuracy and quality go to the Buckmark, the P22 is cool looking, that's about it.

BCRider
October 24, 2010, 03:39 PM
Over a 10 year period of ownership the cost of buying a known excellent gun vs one with a long history of reported failings amounts to only $20 a year if the difference is $200.

On the other hand buying a gun with a poor review history will be doubly expensive if/when you find that the rumours are true and want to sell it. Then you'll be lucky to get back 60 cents on the dollar and you then STILL need to buy a reliable gun to shoot.

Having shot a couple of Buckmarks and a P22 at the rental range where I help out during busy times I can say that you'd be wise going for the Buckmark over the Walther. I've also shot in .22 competition against a Buckmark owner. When we swapped guns for some post match shooting I realized that I was at a severe disadvantage due to his having a Buckmark. Yes, they ARE that good. It's all for fun so I sure don't plan on selling my old but superbly reliable S&W422 but if I were looking for the best gun to use that did not have the Luger like grip angle of the Rugers then it would be a Buckmark. They are hands down a winner.

Just be a little patient and shop for a good online mail order deal or for a low time used one to help hold the cost down.

Kymasabe
October 24, 2010, 09:11 PM
I have a P22 and have never had a single problem with it. Now, I must admit that I have been shooting only MiniMags thru the thing or some Winchester High Velocity stuff I found at Bass Pro. But, I clean it after ever-other range session and it just runs without a problem. I do have two daughters who shoot with me and it's their favorite gun. Someday when they're adults, maybe we'll trade it in for a Ruger 22/45 or a Buckmark but for now it's fine. Really depends what you want to do with it. mine by the way is the 5" barreled version and I've had targets that resemble the one that another member posted earlier in this thread.

Atltech
October 25, 2010, 07:40 PM
Buckmark!.Mine has a 4" barrel and next to my Beretta 92FS it is my favorite weapon.What's not to like...built like a '57 Buick,perfect balance and deadly accurate....she's a keeper!:cool:

Dudemeister
October 26, 2010, 11:31 AM
I've got both, a 30 year old Buckmark, and a 6 moth old P22.

I bought the P22 because I like the look and feel of it, but as a shooter it leaves quite a bit to be desired.

I'm not the best marksman, but at 10 yards my Buckmark groups around 2", no strays, just a nice group, the P22, even on a rest will do about 6-7 shots in a 3.5-4" group and 2-3 strays.

I have this bulk ammo made in the Philippines,I bought about 30 years ago, it's standard velocity designed for target shooting (40 grains, solid point). I've shot about 10,000 rounds of it and it's great stuff. Never had any misfires, maybe 5-6 that did not feed properly, but 99.99% of it has been perfect.

The Buckmark loves this stuff. The P22 works well with it too. On the other hand I used some CCI, Federal and Winchester in both, and the P22 only likes the Winchester, it really hates the Federal, and the CCI fails to extract properly about 20% of the time.

The BUckmark seems to be a bit more random (groups are spread out more and I get the occasional stray with the Federal, but it's OK with the Winchester. Still the Old ammo is the best I've had, unfortunately I'm running out of it and can't find anymore like it.

But back to the original Question. If you want a suer reliable, accurate pistol, the Buckmark hands down. The P22 is only for the gee-wiz, ain't it cute factor.

Dentite
October 26, 2010, 12:03 PM
Buckmark or Ruger. I have the Ruger 22/45, my BIL has a Buckmark and I'd be happy with either I think.

MrWesson
October 26, 2010, 01:28 PM
Dont write off the S&W 22a Its better out of the box than a ruger and much cheaper these days(199 at cabelas). If I had the spare cash I would have purchased the buckmark but at $200 cheaper im glad I got the 22a.

Buckmark/ruger mark series/22a/neos are all good pistols

This was my first outing with my S&W 22a at 25 yards unsupported.

http://img180.imageshack.us/img180/8867/img20101026115636.jpg (http://img180.imageshack.us/i/img20101026115636.jpg/)

slimdude
October 26, 2010, 03:14 PM
I would take the Buckmark anyday.

ms6852
October 26, 2010, 05:00 PM
Buckmark very accurate pistol even using bulk ammo at 25 meters not yards.

http://i679.photobucket.com/albums/vv157/ms6852/KNIVES/IMG_6131.jpghttp://i679.photobucket.com/albums/vv157/ms6852/KNIVES/IMG_6151.jpg

tinygnat219
October 27, 2010, 06:16 AM
Buckmark hands down, unless you have a fetish for misfires, misfeeds, jams, and something made of pot metal, then by all means go for the P22.

burley
October 27, 2010, 02:08 PM
http://www.jetguns.com/firestorm-fs22m6-22lr-sport-matte10-round-p-99.html

You can have a ton of fun with any .22 gun. P22s are pretty good with Remington Golden Bullets. You asked about loading the mags. Best is a Ruger/Buck and an

Ultimate Cliploader. Look it up. Love mine.

788Ham
October 27, 2010, 02:18 PM
I've had a BuckMark II since '92, love it! The only mis-fires I've had was due to junk ammo, not the guns fault. I'd buy the Browning agin in a heartbeat, easy to disassemble and clean, well worth the money.

wh!plash
October 27, 2010, 03:47 PM
I own or have shot pretty much all the guns in this discussion, but I still prefer the Smith 22a. Especially the model with the big wood target grips.

The only thing with the 22a is that it has a small nylon (plastic) recoil buffer inside that wear out periodically. I haven't really kept track, but usually every couple thousand rounds.

I'd take my Sig Mosquito over the Walther, and I'm not even really a Sig fan by any means (not a huge fan of the trigger pull). Most people I know have bought the Walther because they wanted a threaded barrel for suppressor, which you can get on the Mosquito too.

Idaho Dana
October 29, 2010, 03:27 PM
Browning or Ruger and/or the new GSG 1911/22. I have had all and Walther was a jam-o-matic.

ThePunisher'sArmory
October 29, 2010, 03:53 PM
I own a Sig Mosquito and my wife owns a "new" P22. They both shoot just fine with CCI Mini-Mag. Those rounds are not that expensive. Sure more then Fed Bulk, but come on..? Its not like your paying for .45ACP. Lastly Ive only been shooting for about 2 years now but I just cant stand it when guys hate on a gun because of the trigger...... Sure it makes a difference in accuracy but if you "learn" the trigger of the gun you are shooting you have no reason to shoot bad. Case in point 1" groups from a Ruger P95 at 10 yards. I have been told countless times how crappy its trigger is.......Ok......So what. When watching TV I will sit and take at least 50 shots with snap caps and "LEARN THE TRIGGER!" Sorry....but that being said I would go with the Buckmark. I plan to buy one soon myself, but I really like my Mosquito.

alaskanativeson
October 30, 2010, 01:12 AM
The P22 "feels" like a piece of crap in my hand, and this is coming from someone who frequently uses a Kel-Tec P32 as a carry gun.

For the Buckmark - Excellent piece of equipment. $440 is definitely way too much. Find a local dealer who will handle a transaction for you and look at the following:

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=197953520

That's $265 for a Buckmark Camper.

Another thing to seriously consider is the Ruger. If there's a better .22 pistol than the Ruger, you're going to spend some serious coin on it. Now I know, you don't like the grip angle. I don't either. There's a solution: The 22/45. The same great Ruger .22 action in a grip that feels like the venerable 1911. Gunbroker has several 22/45 MK IIIs for around $265. Of course, you could lose your brain and do what I did:

http://www.awcsystech.com/products/suppressors/badlander/

An AWC Badlander with a built-in suppressor made from a Ruger 22/45. About the same noise level as my Crosman pellet pistol while shooting the .22 LR. Words don't suffice.

http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g235/Rodgersplace/Jeffshooting.jpg

Vegas Silver
October 30, 2010, 01:55 AM
Since you've already handled them and decided on 2, I'll skip the obligatory, "test them out first" mantra.

I think you've already answered this question yourself. You already have multiple doubts about the P22 (and say you like everything about the Buckmark), and are sort of settling due to the price tag. As you can see though, everyone has pointed out that you can easily get new Buckmarks for 300, so the price point is moot now.

Seriously, I've seen and heard tons of complaints about the P22, as have you since you asked all the right questions. Almost everyone recommends either the Buckmark or the Ruger. I'm in the Buckmark camp. It is a fantastic pistol. I'm not a fan of the Ruger ergonomics or tear down, but I'm sure it is a fantastic pistol as well. I love the Ruger 10/22 rifle, just not the pistol.

Bottom line: Grab the Buckmark and don't look back.

Craig M. Arnold
October 30, 2010, 11:28 PM
I've owned tons of 22 handguns over my 40 plus years of shooting. I had two Walther P22s. Both were POS. Cute little pistols, just not worth owning.

My answer to anyone wanting a great plinking 22lr pistol is either Browning Buckmark (I own 8) or Ruger.

Best regards.

aestheticcm1
October 30, 2010, 11:47 PM
Hey guys, I figured I'd give an update since my last post. I bought the Buckmark yesterday, because the dealer was running a Halloween sale. I took it home, read the manual and disassembled the gun to oil it and generally get a feel for it. I was surprised at the ease of both dis-assembly and reassembly. Around noon today, it was time to enjoy the fruits. Here are my thoughts and observations:

Immediately, I was really pleased with the crisp, light, trigger pull.

---Also, I really enjoyed the sound and recoil of the Buckmark. It felt like I was shooting a weak 380. I only mention this because, last weekend I was shooting my friend's .22 Beretta, which although small, was exceptionally quiet and lacked enough recoil to make me feel like I was pinking with anything other than a pellet gun. Admittedly, that gun was fired only after I had run out of 9mm for the glock & .38 +p for the titanium snub-nose. My point being the buckmark feels and sounds like a "real" handgun, making it an excellent inexpensive training tool.

--The Buckmark ate every brand of ammo I threw at it. *(rounds fired)
I started off with CCI 40 gr RN (100)
--Winchester Hyperelocity hp, (40)
--Remington vipers (30)
--CCI 36 gr. hp (30)
and then on to the real test, the bulk ammo:
--winchester hp 36 gr box of 333 (333)
--remington yellow jacket hp (50)
--golden bullets (20)
--remington thunder bolt rn (50)
--winchester super x (50)

Out of these nearly 700 rounds, I had 2 fte (both winchester 333), and I think it liked the golden bullets the least.

I also had one of the cci hp jam when i racked the slide to chamber the first round (of ten) in the magazine. I noticed on a couple occasions that the first hp of the magazine when stacked to capacity, would chamber lethargically. I'm thinking in these instances it was a combination of (1) not making sure the rounds were well seated in the magazine, when (2) loading the magazine to capacity, and (3) using hollow points. Otherwise, the gun performed flawlessly.

My groups were not as tight as I have shot with .22 rugers, but in those instances, I was shooting with longer barrels (for rear sight alignment purposes) that had been well sighted in. I haven't seriously sighted in the gun, and I'm sure that most of the grouping was due to my own error.

How do I feel about the purchase so far? Excellent. It is day one of shooting and day two of ownership, so obviously I'm prone to lauding the merits of my purchase, but I can honestly say that I scrutinized as much as I could today and didn't have any gripes. I broke it down and cleaned & lubed it afterwords and thought about doing the "heggis" trigger job, but didn't have the balls to commit to it yet. I'll see how it performs with a 550 box of 36 gr federal bulk tomorrow, and I'm sure it will be just as fun as it was today: an absolute blast.

Again, thanks for all the input guys. It really did help me settle on the purchase. Feel free to let me in on other advise about the gun as well as it's quirks, tricks, or otherwise.

Very gratefully,

Charlie

ET
October 31, 2010, 01:51 AM
Congratulations on your new purchase. My wife bought a Buckmark Camper and loves it. She only shoots CCI Mini-Mags and has never had an ftf. When I've shot it I've gotten really tight groups with it. I think you are going to really enjoy shooting your Buck Mark for many years to come. Sounds like you have already gotten a good start on it. I think my wife has only shot 700 rounds total with her gun. She's only had it about a month now.

searcher451
October 31, 2010, 01:20 PM
Good for you -- that's the right call, indeed. The Browning is a terrific pistol that will, if properly cared for, last you a lifetime. Nice job.

Hanzo581
October 31, 2010, 01:43 PM
I have to figure out what type of ammo you guys are using in your P22's to make them a "jam-o-matic"...I'd like to try to replicate the result in mine.

aestheticcm1
October 31, 2010, 03:03 PM
Here's the purchase.

Pilot
October 31, 2010, 03:07 PM
I have to figure out what type of ammo you guys are using in your P22's to make them a "jam-o-matic"...I'd like to try to replicate the result in mine.

Typically anything but CCI Minimags, and even sometimes they don't work. I had three friends buy P22's. They all got rid of them due to reliability issues, plus accuracy was poor, and inaccurate guns, even plinkers, are no fun especially when you have very accurate Rugers and Brownings to fall back on.

Average Joe
October 31, 2010, 03:46 PM
Between those two, get the Buckmark, but not the $440 gold plated version. Get the blue or stainless for much less.

iibao
October 31, 2010, 04:30 PM
I regret selling my Buckmark. :banghead:

Dudemeister
November 3, 2010, 03:25 AM
Just got a set of grips for my Buck on eBay.

After shooting the Buck for the last 30+ years with it's original plastic grips, I though it was high time I gave it a face lift, and since the URX grips don't fit this version, I started to look for some nice target grips. These are just beautifully made, and they feel great. The thumb rest is in the right place, and the checkering is subtle and doesn't dig into the palm.

The seller said they were rosewood, but I think this is cocobolo. The grain figure is just beautiful.

http://digistealth.com/Public/Guns/Buckmark/Buck-grips_01.jpg

http://digistealth.com/Public/Guns/Buckmark/Buck-grips_02.jpg

viking499
November 3, 2010, 07:55 AM
Those grips look awesome on that pistol.

LemmyCaution
November 3, 2010, 09:32 AM
What catastrophic problems have you guys had with the P22? I didn't realize so many people hated them...for me it feels great in my hand and I've never had any mechanical problems, am I just lucky?

A friend has a pair of P22s. We were shooting them one day when, mid magazine, my friend stopped shooting. I looked over and he was holding his face with one hand and feeling around on the ground with the other. Blood was dripping from between the fingers of the hand holding the face.

I asked if he'd been hit by a ricochet. He picked up the slide of his P22 off the ground and said "No. I got hit by this F'ing thing." The slide had broken and shot off the frame, hitting him squarely in the bridge of the nose.

I agree that the P22 has very good ergonomics. I never had any feeding problems with it, but after the episode above, I won't shoot one.

aestheticcm1
November 3, 2010, 09:59 AM
Dudemeister, sweet looking gun. The grips look great and the gun looks flawless.

I have another question for the forum: Do any of you use a "Bsquared" weaver rail/scope base on your guns? I tried to use one on my gun, but once it was bolted into place, I couldn't rack the slide.

Did I install it incorrectly? Is there another part requried? To install I had removed the long sightbase from the top of the gun via the two hex screws, then put the bsquared rail in place and used those same hex screws on that base. After doing so, I couldn't get the slide to move. When I replaced the iron sight base, the slide functioned fine. I'm thinking there might be some unwanted friction somewhere. Anyone had a similar experience?

Any help you can offer is appreciated. Thanks guys.

ms6852
November 4, 2010, 06:01 PM
Congratulations on your buckmark, here is a link that will help you disassemble your buckmark and you can order the tool from rusty as well.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5U-PYQ-M4PQ

aestheticcm1
November 8, 2010, 03:09 PM
Thanks ms6852. An update to my previous post. I simply had to loosen the rear hex screw on the scope mount and the slide worked fine. It was only when I tightened it down all the way that the slide was pinched. Although the locking washers do a good job of keeping the screw from loosening after a good many shots, it would be nice to find a rubber washer or screw length that allowed me to screw all the way in without pinching the slide. Any ideas?

Magoo
November 8, 2010, 03:22 PM
You could grind/file a bit off of the end of the screw to make it shorter, then clean up the lead thread.
ETA: A bit of plumber's teflon tape might make a suitable bushing. Easy to try if you've got some around.

Did those overtravel screws make it to you yet?

aestheticcm1
November 8, 2010, 07:29 PM
Yes they did! Thanks, I was going to pm you about them today. The letter arrived with a small hole in it and one screw. One must have torn out in transit. One is all I'll need to do the job though. Thanks again. I probably won't get to installing it till winter break.

Magoo
November 9, 2010, 11:07 AM
Good deal. I should have packaged them a bit better. I sent two so one could get lost, but you were the one that was supposed to do the losing. Those things are teeny.

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