Ole Saddam's pistol


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Franco2shoot
September 30, 2010, 12:15 PM
I was watching the History Channel the other day, and they had that tired old shot of Saddam walking into some Govern'mt chamber with a pistol on his hip. Unfortunately, the shot wasn't in tight enough for me to make out the make/model, but I'm sure we have GunGeeks out here that know what it is/was. Wonder where it is today? Not the NRA museum for sure.

Will start the clock running at 1115 and see if I don't have an answer in the next 15 minutes.


(slow day here what with all the rain)


KKKKFL

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docnyt
September 30, 2010, 12:15 PM
Iraqi Hi Power?

docnyt
September 30, 2010, 12:18 PM
9mm Glock 18C rather. LOL.

Zeeemu
September 30, 2010, 12:23 PM
"Wonder where it is today?"

Last I heard it was presented to President Bush. Hmmm ..., I wonder if it was on a silver platter?

W L Johnson
September 30, 2010, 12:27 PM
I've got it, bought it at a gunshow along with Hitler's mauser.

They have to be real, no one lies at a gunshow, do they?

Jim Watson
September 30, 2010, 12:33 PM
I am sure a dictator can have whatever he likes, but I have seen pictures of him with an identifiable High Power.

PTK
September 30, 2010, 12:34 PM
He carried a 9x19 Tariq, and at times an "Iraq High-Power".

http://www.adamsguns.com/tariq.htm

http://www.adamsguns.com/iraq-hp.jpg

shotgunjoel
September 30, 2010, 12:34 PM
Here's a better shot http://boingboing.net/2010/02/24/saddam-husseins-priv.html
Looks like a Hi-Power to me.
Wiki says that he carried a Hi-Power http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Browning_Hi-Power#Military_service
How could have they presented it to the President, you couldn't have a handgun in DC then. He should have been arrested!

phoglund
September 30, 2010, 12:35 PM
That dictator at least got something he didn't like...in the end.

The handgun I've seen pictures of him with was a Hi-Power.

SharpsDressedMan
September 30, 2010, 12:43 PM
I think some the the Hi Powers for Iraq were Hungarian PJK-9mm copies, made for the Iraqi government. There are archive photos/movies of Saddam firing a Hi Power in the air. He was allegedly captured with a Glock 18, which resides in the White House now on display (brought back for G.W. by the Army).

rbernie
September 30, 2010, 12:44 PM
Supposedly, he was holding a Tariq when he was captured. That is the pistol that Bush had presented to him.

GRIZ22
September 30, 2010, 12:56 PM
Supposedly, he was holding a Tariq when he was captured. That is the pistol that Bush had presented to him.
__________________


Same here. I read it was going to the collection for the Bush Library.

Cosmoline
September 30, 2010, 01:39 PM
I also remember seeing him cap off rounds from what looked like an Iranian Mauser carbine. And didn't he have a gold-plated handgun or two?

Here's a better shot http://boingboing.net/2010/02/24/saddam-husseins-priv.html

He barged in on that poor kid's birthday and is in the process of stealing his cake!

rcmodel
September 30, 2010, 03:34 PM
I always though it was a commercial Mannlicher-Schoenauer 1951 carbine.
Or perhaps a BRNO ZZK/CZ 550 Mannlicher carbine??

http://www.famouspictures.org/index.php?title=Image:SadamFiringGun.jpg

rc

Cosmoline
September 30, 2010, 03:41 PM
That was another one. The guy was a gun nut, whatever his faults.

rbernie
September 30, 2010, 03:47 PM
I stand corrected - it was not a Tariq 9mm but was indeed a Glock 18C:

http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2009/jul/06/saddam-hussein-gun-bush-library

Sebastian the Ibis
September 30, 2010, 06:10 PM
Hmmm, I guess when you are a former president you can have post-86 MG's. Must be nice.

JellyJar
September 30, 2010, 06:43 PM
If I remember correctly, shortly after the fall of the Saddam government I saw some US soldiers in one of Saddam's palaces going through some of the goodies he had stashed in it. In addition to booze and such I remember seeing what were either NIB Colt
Diamondbacks or Pythons.

Sure would like to buy one of those!

wideym
September 30, 2010, 07:08 PM
One article I found in either the Army Times or the Stars and Stripes was about soldiers finding a cache of hundreds of Browning Hipowers NIB at one of the Iraqi Secret Police buildings. They were turned over to the Iraqi goverment supposedly to arm the Iraqi police, but later the Iraqi police were issued Glocks.

shotgunjoel
September 30, 2010, 11:02 PM
From the picture at this link http://www.nytimes.com/2009/07/06/us/06gun.html?hp
it appears that the Glock 18 is of recent production (Gen 3 features like rail and finger grooves). I thought that Glock only made a few 18's back in the 1980's. Are they still being made, and who buys them other than dictators?

pikid89
September 30, 2010, 11:13 PM
but later the Iraqi police were issued Glocks.

I heard the iraqi police were issued Smith & Wesson Sigmas or M&Ps

xXxplosive
September 30, 2010, 11:18 PM
Iraqi double stackie.....................for sure.

psyopspec
September 30, 2010, 11:21 PM
Last time I was at the Infantry Museum at Fort Benning, they had about 6 firearms that used to be effects of the Hussein family.

Silver S&W Magnum revolver and a Hi-Power are the only ones I recall off the top of my head, but it was interesting to be able to see it. The first time I went to that museum I was a PV2 in BCT. The next time I went I was looking at displays about wars I was in. First time I truly felt old.

REAPER4206969
September 30, 2010, 11:23 PM
I thought that Glock only made a few 18's back in the 1980's. Are they still being made
The Glock 18/18c are limited production models and were made in GEN1/2/3 configuration. Yes, they are still in production.

I heard the iraqi police were issued Smith & Wesson Sigmas or M&Ps
The Iraqi military and police are the largest single users of the Glock pistol. They use the model 19. Afghanistan bought some Sigmas.

JT-AR-MG42
October 1, 2010, 01:48 PM
PTK,
Is that one yours?
Either way, nice photo of a rare variation pistol. Thanks!

Bet there would be a strong market for those here in the U.S.


JT

CleverNickname
October 1, 2010, 07:36 PM
Hmmm, I guess when you are a former president you can have post-86 MG's. Must be nice.

The Bush Library will own it, not the president himself. Museums can possess post-samples.

mustang_steve
October 1, 2010, 07:52 PM
Doubtful it was an Iranian Mauser....keep in mind Iran and Iraq pretty much were in constant war over border disputes during Saddam's entire reign (to the point that the warfare was just accepted by those living in that area as a part of life).

SharpsDressedMan
October 1, 2010, 10:22 PM
If you can explain to me why an "organization" or institution in this country has more gun rights than an individual, then I'll accept that a museum can own machineguns. Consider that it is entirely possible that convicted felons can make up 100% of the board, employees, etc, of any institution like a museum, and we have the fallacy of the law (or BATF rulings, more than likely). I wonder who undergoes the background check for a museum to "possess" the firearm? I would even bet that Saddam's firearm wasn't even brought in with proper import papers.

KodeFore
October 2, 2010, 05:46 AM
I am just guessing I would think an armorer would "render inoperab
e" the G18 long b4 it was put on public display. I wonder if GW has a gun collection of his own?

CleverNickname
October 3, 2010, 12:29 AM
If you can explain to me why an "organization" or institution in this country has more gun rights than an individual, then I'll accept that a museum can own machineguns.

I should have been a little more clear. Only museums that are government-owned/operated can possess post-samples and form 10 guns. Presidential libraries are run by the National Archives and Records Administration, so they're considered to be part of the federal government even though they may also receive some private funds. A state or local government-run museum would fit the bill too.

There is no requirement that a government entity be a law enforcement agency to possess a machine gun, only that the gun be possessed for official use. If there's a definition of "official use", I haven't been able to find it in the CFR, but both the form 5 (http://www.atf.gov/forms/download/atf-f-5320-5.pdf) and form 10 (http://www.atf.gov/forms/download/atf-f-5320-10.pdf) both refer to "governmental entities", a superset of "law enforcement agencies."

I am just guessing I would think an armorer would "render inoperabe" the G18 long b4 it was put on public display.

Making a machine gun receiver into a non-gun pile of parts requires that the receiver be torch cut into 3 pieces. With a Glock you'd end up with a not-exactly-museum-exhibition-quality puddle of goo with some metal bits floating around in it.

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