What's a good shotgun load for bears?


PDA






crazykayaker
October 28, 2010, 02:23 PM
Does anyone have any suggestions for a good defense load for black bears? I have a Maverick 18'' 12 gauge pump. I use 2.75'' 00 buckshot for HD, but I'm not sure that it would penetrate very well in a bear. Maybe rifled slugs?

If you enjoyed reading about "What's a good shotgun load for bears?" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!
withdrawn34
October 28, 2010, 02:48 PM
If you don't have a rifled barrel, I don't think that rifled slug is going to do you much good.

amd6547
October 28, 2010, 03:05 PM
"Rifled" slugs are actually designed for smoothbore barrels, and would be the preferred load for bear defense.

mbogo
October 28, 2010, 03:05 PM
I'd load 0 or 00 buckshot for the first shot, and aim for the face; you may not kill it, but you might blind it, giving you the opportunity to escape.

Load the magazine with Brenneke slugs and aim under the chin as it's coming toward you.

mbogo

highorder
October 28, 2010, 03:11 PM
Load the magazine with Brenneke slugs

This.

jon86
October 28, 2010, 03:26 PM
I'd load 0 or 00 buckshot for the first shot, and aim for the face; you may not kill it, but you might blind it, giving you the opportunity to escape.


What advantage does this give you? The bear will die later with a face full of buckshot. If it doesn't die from the face wound it'll die from not being able to find food. What is more humane, to kill it immediately with slugs or give it a face full of buckshot so it dies a slow painful death?

Fill your magazine tube to the top with slugs.

dak0ta
October 28, 2010, 04:01 PM
You don't miss as easily with buckshot under high stress situations as if you only had the 1 slug. Maybe no time to aim or something. Bears don't necessarily indicate that they're going to attack...

Cosmoline
October 28, 2010, 04:13 PM
This has been discussed in about 1,000 threads to date. Buckshot at DLP range isn't going to give you any better chance of hitting.

Answer: Brenneke hardcast slugs.

Pete D.
October 28, 2010, 04:28 PM
You don't miss as easily with buckshot under high stress situations as if you only had the 1 slug

Yeah, you do. If you can miss with a slug, you can miss with a pattern that is only a few inches wide.
Pete

ReloaderFred
October 28, 2010, 04:53 PM
I live in bear country and can't put out my trash the night before pickup, or they'll get into it and make a huge mess. They come through my yard at night and are a pain in the butt.

Forget the 00 Buck and go with rifled slugs. My wife and I have been cornered by an ornery bear while walking the dogs behind our house and the 9mm I had in my hand got smaller as the bear got more aggressive. When he finally tired of the game after about 20 minutes, the 9mm felt like a .22. You haven't lived until you've had a bear "posture" back and forth in front of you, letting you know he's boss.

A well placed rifled slug at close range will handle a black bear just fine.

Hope this helps.

Fred

rcmodel
October 28, 2010, 05:01 PM
and aim for the face; you may not kill it, but you might blind it, giving you the opportunity to escape.Oh great!

So now you set a wounded, pizzed off bear that is going to be starving loose on your neighborhood!

Shoot the dang bear with a slug and kill it DRT!!
Then somebody else won't get hurt or killed having to deal with your wounded bear later!

rc

lloveless
October 28, 2010, 05:58 PM
The National Park Service in Alaska issues 00 Buck for the 1st shot followed by Brenneke slugs.
ll

ReloaderFred
October 28, 2010, 06:29 PM
I've worked with people from the National Park Service and they aren't the brightest lights on the tree. Stick with slugs for bears.

Hope this helps.

Fred

lobo9er
October 28, 2010, 07:44 PM
So now you set a wounded, pizzed off bear that is going to be starving loose on your neighborhood!

Shoot the dang bear with a slug and kill it DRT!!
Then somebody else won't get hurt or killed having to deal with your wounded bear later!


up close and personal 00 buck to the nogg'n and a black bear will be DRT

though slugs would be my choice

DoubleTapDrew
October 28, 2010, 07:53 PM
Birdshot. At the distances you'd be shooting a bear in defense it'll act like a single column of lead. :neener: (this was sarcasm, don't flame me)

jmr40
October 28, 2010, 08:09 PM
Good quality slugs. Forget about buckshot.

Cosmoline
October 28, 2010, 08:27 PM
The National Park Service in Alaska issues 00 Buck for the 1st shot followed by Brenneke slugs.

Source?

Jason_W
October 28, 2010, 08:38 PM
If chemical deterrents 9bear spray) actually work, it would probably be the easiest way to hit under stress. Of course, wind conditions could be an X factor.

geologist
October 28, 2010, 08:43 PM
2 3/4" Brenneke slugs.

RMc
October 28, 2010, 09:32 PM
...soft lead thimbles! This 3" Winchester 1 ounce slug broke up on small doe at 15 yards - dead deer but poor penetration for bear defense!

ArmedLiberal
October 28, 2010, 10:05 PM
All the bears that I know that prefer shotguns for self defense agree that slugs are the best load. And who would argue with a shotgun totin' bear?

DBR
October 28, 2010, 10:19 PM
I suggest Brenneke hard cast slugs. Around here Dick's Sporting Goods sells the KO version. They are not very expensive. Regular foster slugs are very soft and may not penetrate far enough to do the job.

RandyB
October 28, 2010, 10:23 PM
Slugs. Breneke would be first choice, but any slug over buck would be better in my opinion.

lloveless
October 28, 2010, 11:20 PM
Cosmoline: National Park Service in Kotzebue, Alaska. Talking with the rangers- who took out some archeologists and issued the guns for defense at a "dig". I also questioned the use of the Buckshot, but this is what they reccomended. They have more bear experience than I who has only seen grizzlies in a zoo setting. I have seen the damage they can do to infrastructure(water pipe from resevoir bit and clawed), for no apparent reason. Awesome! I am sure I do not wish to see a griz/brown bear up close and personal.
ll

evan price
October 29, 2010, 10:20 AM
3" magnum 15-pellet 00-buckshot. Then 1-oz slugs. Then running shoes.

mbogo
October 29, 2010, 10:28 AM
What advantage does this give you? The bear will die later with a face full of buckshot. If it doesn't die from the face wound it'll die from not being able to find food. What is more humane, to kill it immediately with slugs or give it a face full of buckshot so it dies a slow painful death?

Fill your magazine tube to the top with slugs.

If you re-read the original post, this was regarding DEFENSE against bears.

My intent with the buckshot load would be to blunt the charge. I'm not concerned with being humane, or the health or well-being of a bear that attacks people (which it may very well view as food).

mbogo

Cosmoline
October 29, 2010, 12:18 PM
who took out some archeologists and issued the guns for defense at a "dig". I also questioned the use of the Buckshot, but this is what they reccomended.

The NATIONAL PARK SERVICE issued guns to archeologists?! Are you 100% sure you have the correct agency? Because what you just said is actually major news. Are you sure it wasn't some state boys, BLM people, or contractors?

As far as buckshot, it's a very old myth that a wiff of buck first is a charge stopper. The buckshot has limited penetration and much less chance of breaking the bones or doing the massive trauma needed to actually stop a charge. Trying to blind the animal is about as effective as pepper spray. It might work, or it might just make the bear angrier. Since the advent of magnum hardcast slugs (not fosters) the entire issue has become moot. Carry magnum hardcasts for the shotgun, and nothing else.

Leadhead
October 29, 2010, 12:48 PM
http://c0388982.cdn.cloudfiles.rackspacecloud.com/aa-12-combat-shotgun-frag-12-automatic-3.jpg

crazykayaker
October 29, 2010, 08:48 PM
Ok! Thanks to all that replied! It seems the general consensus is Brenneke slugs. I have looked at some before, but never have tried any. I will definately be getting some soon. I've looked at the Brenneke THD (Tactical Home Defense) slugs on the Brennekeusa.com website. Do you think these "low-recoil" slugs would have enough power behind them to penetrate a bear's skull, or do you think it'd be better to just get some of the full house 2-3/4'' slugs? My reason for asking is that if the THD slugs did the job as well, then I could use them as a dual-purpose load for 2-legged predators around the house and 4-legged predators out in the woods.

nathan
October 29, 2010, 09:01 PM
Get several boxes of 12g Winchester slugs at Walmart . The one in 15 rd bonus pack for $9. Practice shooting at 25 , 35 and 50 yds. AIm to hit a 5 inch circle . Practice and practice. Convenience to hit the target is key .

Tom Held
October 30, 2010, 11:22 PM
If you're worried about black bears a 30-30 is fine. If you're worried about grizzlies or browns then a minimum is a 300 weatherby with 180 grain Barnes triple shock bullets or better yet a 375 HH. I've hunted all three. I've never hunted with a guide that had a shotgun with slugs for a backup. A lot of black bears are killed every year with a 243.

Spec ops Grunt
October 31, 2010, 12:17 AM
Rock Salt of course!


Shoot yourself as it charges so you'll be seasoned for the bear! :neener:


Regarding Tom Held's post: I do believe that the 30-30 was originally advertised as a bear cartridge.

Magoo
October 31, 2010, 10:44 AM
Anecdotal from a buddy that was a river guide for a few seasons in Alaska (no personal experience, but it made sense to me). His outfit carried 12g loaded first with several slugs followed by buckshot. The thinking was to use the more lethal slugs when aimed fire was possible, but have the buckshot for when you were getting (or about to get, preferably) mauled.

amd6547
October 31, 2010, 05:24 PM
My own preference for black bear (shotgun, anyway) would be slugs...But I couldn't help but noticing that the box of Remington express 00 buck I just put in my shotgun recommends it for black bear.

A and O
October 31, 2010, 05:48 PM
Leadhead, or anybody else in the know.

What slug is that in your post?

Leadhead
November 1, 2010, 01:55 AM
Leadhead, or anybody else in the know.

What slug is that in your post?

It's a Frag-12.....12G fragmentation grenade.
Not sure about the penetration for bear use....:D

A and O
November 1, 2010, 04:27 AM
Thanks for the follow up post. Will check it out.

LemmyCaution
November 1, 2010, 06:12 AM
When I'm out grouse hunting, I carry a slug in my pocket that I can load if I encounter a bear.

Right now I carry foster slugs, but I should pick up a box of hard cast.

EMC45
November 1, 2010, 07:58 AM
Brenneke 1oz. slugs.

lloveless
November 1, 2010, 07:49 PM
Cosmoline, I am VERY CERTAIN of which agency's people I was talking to. I was in the building. The state agency is several hundred feet away and totally different people. I was in and out of the NPS building weekly due to programs they had.
ll

Balrog
November 1, 2010, 07:52 PM
What is better about Brenneke slugs than other brands?

DoubleTapDrew
November 2, 2010, 12:15 PM
What is better about Brenneke slugs than other brands?
This. And which ones? Midway shows about a dozen different brenneke slug loads
http://www.midwayusa.com/Search/#brenneke 12 slug____-_1-2-4_8-16-32
I'd like to pick some up considering my local gun shops dont carry frag-12s :o

leadcounsel
November 2, 2010, 12:20 PM
Bear spray. $40 and doesn't needlessly kill a bear.

dogsoldier0513
November 2, 2010, 01:14 PM
3-inch 1 1/4-oz Brenneke slugs.

Balrog
November 2, 2010, 03:57 PM
Bear spray. $40 and doesn't needlessly kill a bear.

Is it just me, or does a bear chewing off my face not fall into the category of things that need to be killed?

DoubleTapDrew
November 3, 2010, 11:54 AM
Is it just me, or does a bear chewing off my face not fall into the category of things that need to be killed?

I think it depends on the situation and how you got yourself into it...


http://farm5.static.flickr.com/4121/4944085432_00a8cf4c8e_z.jpg

Antihero
November 3, 2010, 04:10 PM
What is better about Brenneke slugs than other brands?

Brenneke style slugs arent meant to expand and are made of a harder lead. Its not necesarily the brand but the style of slug.

Antihero
November 3, 2010, 04:12 PM
...soft lead thimbles! This 3" Winchester 1 ounce slug broke up on small doe at 15 yards - dead deer but poor penetration for bear defense!


That is a foster style slug, which are meant for deer and thinner skinned game and also are meant to expand.

With bear you really dont want expansion as much as penetration.

MrCleanOK
November 3, 2010, 05:33 PM
http://www.hinterlandoutfitters.com/images/2010/accessories-one/medium/37896.jpg
Source: hinterlandoutfitters.com

There's a pissed off bear on the box, so you know it's good.

AJumbo
November 3, 2010, 08:14 PM
All the Brenneke hardcast slugs you can stuff in the magazine, and have a sidesaddle or butt cuff holding more of the same. Don't stop firing until Yogi has gone to the big Jellystone in the sky.

qcsmitty
February 18, 2011, 10:34 AM
Given that the handgun standard for brown bear would be 44 mag or better, a slug must be the correct answer. Yes? Wouldn't buck shot just pi-- him off?

USAF_Vet
February 18, 2011, 10:47 AM
...soft lead thimbles! This 3" Winchester 1 ounce slug broke up on small doe at 15 yards - dead deer but poor penetration for bear defense!


Hmm, year before last I took a small doe with a 3" Winchester 1oz slug and it went clean through her (spine shot) at about 30 yards. She dropped on the spot and was dead by the time I got to her.

Rail Driver
February 18, 2011, 10:59 AM
I don't know about you all, but a bear makes a guy like me feel mighty tiny... If I were in a situation where all I had was a shotgun and I HAD to go into bear territory I would do one of 2 things... #1, pay someone else to go or #2, cast some of my own steel core rifled lead slugs and load up some 3.5" magnum shells.

Youngster
February 18, 2011, 02:19 PM
Hmm, year before last I took a small doe with a 3" Winchester 1oz slug and it went clean through her (spine shot) at about 30 yards. She dropped on the spot and was dead by the time I got to her.

Foster slug performance can vary greatly at 3" velocities at close ranges, especially on tougher target materials. I've seen them break up, flatten out to a thin wafer and underpenetrate, or even flatten out and "frisbee" out of the target laterally after penetrating a short distance.

For bear defense I'll only carry the tougher Brenneke or Gaulandi style slugs, even in regular 2 3/4 format.

Mark8252
March 6, 2011, 10:39 PM
Slugs and more slugs. Nothing but slugs. Period. My friend shot a bear in his cabin with a 357 mag cause thats what he had with him. The bear was finally killed with a 20ga slug by another friend. Not a huge monster bear but big enough to do them all in if it wanted to. Now they have a 12ga with slugs ready at all times.

ksabo45
March 7, 2011, 04:03 AM
A really, really big one, I mean a HUGE ONE.

If you enjoyed reading about "What's a good shotgun load for bears?" here in TheHighRoad.org archive, you'll LOVE our community. Come join TheHighRoad.org today for the full version!