410 pistol...SBR? SBS, AOW?


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bkjeffrey
November 10, 2010, 01:42 AM
So, if a person was so inclined to damage a perfectly good .410 bolt action single shot and completely abolish any functionality the gun may have by cutting the barrel down to say 10", and refashoning the shoulder stock into a "pistol" type of contraption, what would you end up with? Jail time?

I Know that there are some guidelines set forth by the ATF regarding caliber (something about a half inch), original manufacture classification and smoothbore vs. rifled barrels ect, how would all this play in?

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J.R.W.
November 10, 2010, 02:23 AM
I believe it would be considered an AOW as the bore is under half an inch.

PTK
November 10, 2010, 02:45 AM
It would be a $200 tax and treated as a short barreled shotgun, or more precisely, a weapon made from a shotgun. :)

nalioth
November 10, 2010, 06:13 AM
I believe it would be considered an AOW as the bore is under half an inch. No, sir.

Once a firearm has had a shoulder stock attached, it can never be reclassified as an AOW. It'd have to be papered as an SBS or SBR (short barreled shotgun / short barreled rifle).

Serbu Super Shorties are made from factory PGO shotguns, they are considered "AOW" (any other weapon). Tromix short shotguns are made from factory Saigas (which had stocks installed during manufacturing), and they are considered "SBS".

TexasRifleman
November 10, 2010, 09:36 AM
Once a firearm has had a shoulder stock attached, it can never be reclassified as an AOW. It'd have to be papered as an SBS or SBR

This is correct. If a stock has ever been attached it would be a SBx.

bkjeffrey
November 10, 2010, 10:48 AM
For all intents and purposes wouldn't the .410 be considered a rifle due to being described as a caliber and not gauge?

nalioth
November 10, 2010, 11:01 AM
For all intents and purposes wouldn't the .410 be considered a rifle due to being described as a caliber and not gauge? "Shotguns" have smooth barrels, and "rifles" have rifled barrels.

It's got nothing to do with the name of the cartridge or shell.

TexasRifleman
November 10, 2010, 11:58 AM
It's all written in the law quite clearly.

A shotgun is a firearm designed to be fired from the shoulder and designed to use the energy of the explosive in a fixed shotgun shell to fire through a smooth bore either a number of projectiles or a single projectile for each pull of the trigger.

A rifle is a firearm designed to be fired from the shoulder and designed to use the energy of an explosive in a fixed cartridge to fire only a single projectile through a rifled barrel for each single pull of the trigger.

Caliper_RWVA
November 15, 2010, 09:41 AM
It's all written in the law quite clearly.

Isn't it less clear when you consider that slug guns are shotguns and the Taurus Judge is a pistol (outside of CA)?

After all, what the OP is talking about making is essentially a single shot Judge.

I am confused on this issue, too, because I think that a 20ga revolver would be pretty hot, but don't know if it would be a handgun or NFA.

PTK
November 15, 2010, 02:17 PM
Rifled slug barrels still use shotgun shells, so they are still shotguns (odd, I know)

As for the Judge, it's rifled and under 50 caliber, therefore it's a handgun.

Ron James
November 15, 2010, 04:51 PM
I often wonder why it is so hard for people to under stand that the Judge is not a short barrel shotgun, but rather a .45 Colt revolver with a rifled barrel that also accepts and shoots a .410 shotgun shell. I know it's been discussed and explained a number of times on this forum??????

Sam1911
November 15, 2010, 05:19 PM
I often wonder why it is so hard for people to under stand ...

Probably because Taurus' only real shot at marketing this thing is to hype it up as a legal version of a "sawed-off" shotgun in miniature.

If you look at their advertising, they used to show a pair of "shoot-n-see" type silhouette targets -- one with a few .45 holes in COM, and the second with a cloud of birdshot hits obliterating the head of the target. (All the more impressive for the shoot-n-see rings around each hit which made it look like the attacker's head had just exploded or something.)

Since the screwiness that is the NFA has been ingrained in our culture (even/especially our gun culture), "sawed-off" shotguns have this mystique of hyper-lethality. Surely anything so heavily regulated must be REALLY NASTY!!111!!

Taurus sees something that a few tiny-niche manufacturers have been trying to sell for years, with various .45/.410 derringers and the (once absurd) "Thunder Five" revolver, and they take a chance that they can advertise it as a stone-cold bad-guy slayer to the average US gun buyer.

The result is lots of guys drooling on gun-dealers' counters saying to each other, "I don't know how they snuck this past the ATF, but I gots to get me one a dem!"

Go back in time about 10 years and try to sell those same guys a .410 of any kind (or a 138 year-old revolver cartridge, for that matter) and they'd have laughed at you. Now, it's "da bomb."

A little ignorance doesn't hurt Taurus' bottom line one little bit! ;)

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