Detroit CCW Instructor calls for IHOP Boycott


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gearchecker
November 19, 2010, 11:12 PM
Link attached.

http://www.onlineprnews.com/news/78142-1289675534-detroit-michigan-ccw-class-instructors-ihop-boycott-site-tops-600-members.html

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Double Naught Spy
November 20, 2010, 01:27 AM
I see where they say that they have 660+ participating in the boycott. I wonder just how many of those 600+ people actually eat at IHOP with any regularity.

VPLthrneck
November 20, 2010, 02:15 AM
I wonder just how many of those 600+ people actually eat at IHOP with any regularity.

Only when they come down from the upper peninsula to make their annual Christmas shopping trip would be my guess.

BBQLS1
November 21, 2010, 08:54 AM
The story reminded me of this:

http://www.wafb.com/global/story.asp?s=9943104

hso
November 21, 2010, 11:26 AM
I applaude the boycott of any business that posts against legal carry, but this reason
Ector, a former robbery victim, believes that the restaurant's ban on handguns creates a dangerous dining environment for customers. just doesn't resonate with many inside and especially outside of the carry community.

In my opinion I would add the argument that such postings are discriminatory and increase the danger to the community. They're discriminatory because citizens exercising their guaranteed rights are being excluded. Increasing the danger to the community by forcing gunowners to leave their firearms in their vehicles in unsecured parking lots subject to theft to patronize the posted business.

If we're going to participate in the effort we might want to add to the reasons that the posting of business is not acceptable.

NavyLCDR
November 21, 2010, 11:39 AM
I would say that a good reason to give for protesting a posted business is that their prohibitions are only against law abiding citizens. That is the only people the prohibitions affect. Criminals are criminals and aren't stopped by prohibitions and signs. All a prohibition does is affect my ability to retain the means to protect myself from violent crime, it does nothing to prevent the criminal's actions.

I've never had a problem with IHOPs in Washington. I've open carried in 3 or 4 locations and they also offer a military discount.

HOWARD J
November 21, 2010, 02:00 PM
This restaurant is located in downtown Detriot---one of the safest areas in the city.
A great percentage of people in downtown are there to work or play at the Detriot casinos...It is against Michigan law to carry a gun into a casino.
IMO many people will leave their weapon at home anyway---b/cause they know better than to leave it in their car in Detriot////////////////////////////////////

Full Metal Jacket
November 21, 2010, 06:56 PM
many businesses, including gunshops, disallow the carrying of firearms for safety and liability reasons, not as an assault on the 2nd amendment. for this reason, i do not blame them. gunshops are obviously not "anti-gun".

legally owning a firearm does not automatically instill any sort of intelligence or safety upon the user.

wrs840
November 21, 2010, 07:11 PM
I go (infrequently) to only one gun store that has posted that any weapons brought into the store must be unloaded. I CC, and I comply. It still bugs me. Everybody who works there open-carries. I assume they're loaded. Every other gunshop/pawnshop I frequent, most, if not all people that work there are carrying concealed, and most of them know I am too, and seem to be glad to have one more armed "good-guy" in the store to balance-out the parade of questionable looking characters in there for pawn business... Maybe that's a Western NC ethos kind of thing.

Avoiding IHOP has been a long-standing habit of mine, so I've had no opportunity to see their signs.

Les

Nushif
November 22, 2010, 08:31 AM
many businesses, including gunshops, disallow the carrying of firearms for safety and liability reasons,

Hehe, not around here. 8)

hso
November 22, 2010, 11:01 AM
Gunshops might do this to prevent accidents that might occur when customers handle their carry gun inside the business. Others may simply post to keep the thing in the holster while in the shop. Regardless, their goal is to prevent negligent discharges on the part of patrons.

lloveless
November 24, 2010, 01:38 AM
Yet another reason to boycott IHOP! I don't eat in their restaurants due to poor service, overpriced food, and food that is just plain bad for ya.
ll

0VERKILL
November 24, 2010, 05:15 AM
Gunshops might do this to prevent accidents that might occur when customers handle their carry gun inside the business. Others may simply post to keep the thing in the holster while in the shop. Regardless, their goal is to prevent negligent discharges on the part of patrons.

Not to argue that this might not be there reasoning, but why would anybody pull out carry their piece and start playing with it?

As to the boycott, don't forget to call and ask to speak to the manager and inform them of your reasons for the boycott. If they look at sales for the week and they're low they may just assume it's a slump.
If they get 50 or 100 phone calls saying I will not eat here again until this policy changes and see that sales have dropped they may be quicker to change it.

Double Naught Spy
November 24, 2010, 09:00 AM
Not to argue that this might not be there reasoning, but why would anybody pull out carry their piece and start playing with it?

Because some do not have the maturity to be carrying a gun without specific restrictions on their behavior and do not have the responsibility to monitor their own behavior.

Can't find the video at the moment, but maybe somebody else will recall it. There was the video earlier this year of a dude in a Wal-Mart in Arizona that is jacking around with his pistol when it discharged.

People really do these things.

Here is a link to the story...
http://www.azcentral.com/community/westvalley/articles/2010/04/08/20100408el-mirage-walmart-gun-fired-abrk0408.html

ironhead7544
November 25, 2010, 12:07 PM
Texas now has CCW due to a restaurant incident. There have been many other problems at restaurants all over the country. This includes random nuts and robberies. Do a search. Also a friend of mine who owned a gunshop was shot by robbers in front of several customers. He survived but spent many weeks in the hospital.

Geno
November 25, 2010, 03:20 PM
In Michigan, the worst they can do is order you to depart their business if they discover that you are carrying. Other than that, the sign means nothing. Myself, I simply refuse to give my hard-earned money to an anti.

Edit to add: the last time I ate at IHOP, the food was nasty anyhow. You might even say its offense assaulted my taste buds. Can I sue?! :) Hades!!! Change the name to IGAG

Geno

KBintheSLC
November 29, 2010, 01:03 PM
... as if the food wasn't reason enough to boycott IHOP.

Japman
November 29, 2010, 10:24 PM
It is a place of business. They can choose who they invite into their business, as long as they don't discriminate against protected classes. I really don't see what the problem is, especially considering the fact that guns DO pose a significant liability risk for companies and their insurers.

Mr.Davis
December 2, 2010, 09:26 PM
... as if the food wasn't reason enough to boycott IHOP.
Somebody's never had the Stuffed French Toast... :eek:

Mr.Davis
December 2, 2010, 09:49 PM
It is a place of business. They can choose who they invite into their business, as long as they don't discriminate against protected classes. I really don't see what the problem is, especially considering the fact that guns DO pose a significant liability risk for companies and their insurers.
And likewise, individuals are free to organize boycotts against businesses who have policies they disagree with.

Nobody's claiming this is a violation of the 2nd Amendment - they just disagree with the policy and are trying to get the company to change it.

In addition, if law abiding gun owners do pose a "significant liability risk for companies", then why aren't guns-allowed businesses closing up shop all over the place due to lawsuits and liability claims? Oh, right - because law abiding citizens aren't a significant liability risk.

7.62 Nato
December 2, 2010, 11:07 PM
This restaurant is located in downtown Detriot---one of the safest areas in the city.
A great percentage of people in downtown are there to work or play at the Detriot casinos...It is against Michigan law to carry a gun into a casino.
IMO many people will leave their weapon at home anyway---b/cause they know better than to leave it in their car in Detriot////////////////////////////////////
Yeah, the safest part of the city. http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/dpp/news/local/items-stolen-john-conyers-government-registered-cadillac-20101130-mr

Full Metal Jacket
December 3, 2010, 04:07 AM
This restaurant is located in downtown Detriot---one of the safest areas in the city.


sure, relative to baghdad. :eek:

hso
December 3, 2010, 09:45 AM
the fact that guns DO pose a significant liability risk for companies and their insurers:scrutiny:

NavyLCDR
December 3, 2010, 10:24 AM
sure, relative to baghdad

Ummm. No. I felt much safer in Baghdad. AND, I could carry a gun there.

Jerry68
December 3, 2010, 02:37 PM
Yeah, the safest part of the city. http://www.myfoxdetroit.com/dpp/news/local/items-stolen-john-conyers-government-registered-cadillac-20101130-mr

Agreed. If you think you are "safe" anywhere in Detroit, you are delusional.

Full Metal Jacket
December 3, 2010, 07:11 PM
Ummm. No. I felt much safer in Baghdad. AND, I could carry a gun there.

Ummm, you should re-read my post, i insinuated detroit was in fact safe when you compare it to baghdad. guess i had to spell that out....:eek:


Agreed. If you think you are "safe" anywhere in Detroit, you are delusional.

agreed! the movie robocop isn't so far fetched....

Stevie-Ray
December 3, 2010, 10:19 PM
Ummm. No. I felt much safer in Baghdad. AND, I could carry a gun there. And why wouldn't you be able to carry one in Detroit, assuming of course, you have a WA carry permit?

earlthegoat2
December 4, 2010, 08:15 AM
When I frequented Detroit in my long ago and more foolish youth I carried a Commander less than legally. I felt a heck of a lot safer. I even needed it once but thankfully no shots were fired.

Back in the 80s Detroit was worse than it is now if you can believe that.

Full Metal Jacket
December 4, 2010, 12:04 PM
Back in the 80s Detroit was worse than it is now if you can believe that.

that's what i hear, but i still can't believe it lol :)

zuriy3k
December 6, 2010, 12:33 PM
Is this not the iHop on Jerfferson that has a metal detector you have to pass thru in order to get in. Why would anyone want to eat at place like that... for anyone to support a place that forces you to submit to this in order to spend your money cpl/ccw holder or not is sort of missing the point. Before long you will need to clear one before going to a McDonalds or you will need one to pull into a gas station. Hats off to the organizers but the true power would be from the non cpl/ccw holders organizing and doing the same thing!!

chrt396
December 6, 2010, 02:49 PM
I prefer Waffle House!!! :barf:
Seriously...how much more do you have to pay to go to Denny's or Village Inn....someplace with a higher perceived level of safety & cleanliness!
I understand that this is not the point of the post, but I CAN tell you this! I have been to the pistol and rifle range many times, and seen CCW holders handle their guns in a extremely un-safe manner. They wave them around, point them back towards other shooters...generally acting like idiots! Keep in mind..the CCW test does NOT really quiz or test you on safety or most of all..."COMMON SENSE!" I would venture to say..repeating what a previous poster stated, that the IHOP is limiting the liability in their resturant. There may be a majority of safe and responsible gun owners out there, but it only takes one to create havoc. I carry..but I do understand the resturants decision..to a degree. They are weighing the odds. OK...if I allow guns..then we may be safe, but then again some gun-toting dummy might act irresponsibly. The flip side is that the store gets robbed! HHmmm...they chose to eliminate "A". It's a tough choice! Now...keep in mind...I live in a relatively safe area in Florida. Detroit is a different beast. I just don't go into areas where there are problems, just because I have a gun! That's inviting trouble. Think safe! If the eating establishment down the road is safer and allows carry..then go there! It's not like IHOP has a reputation for fine dining!
I have a permit to carry in Florida. The MAIN reason that I got the permit is so that i can carry in my truck without getting hassled by the police departments. If you ask 10 officers what the carry laws are for a vehicle, you'll almost get 10 different responses. None of them correct!! They don't really know. I got the permit so there would be no questions!

Full Metal Jacket
December 6, 2010, 02:51 PM
Is this not the iHop on Jerfferson that has a metal detector you have to pass thru in order to get in. Why would anyone want to eat at place like that...

LOL!

Reloaderharry
December 6, 2010, 03:35 PM
any person with a CCW should have a few of these in their wallet all the time, and be active in handing them out:

http://www.learntocarry.com/nogunsnomoney/NoGunsNoMoney-Variety.gif

http://www.learntocarry.com/nogunsnomoney/GoodCents.png

Print em off and give em out. You would be surprised how many "no ccw" signs have come down here locally after these started to be circulated.

Free PDF file at:

http://www.learntocarry.com/nogunsnomoney/

Residents in other states would have to change the back, but you get the idea.

Unistat
December 6, 2010, 04:21 PM
Back in the 80s Detroit was worse than it is now if you can believe that.

I'm not sure I agree with that, but my opinion is based on anecdotal evidence.

xr1200
December 6, 2010, 07:44 PM
this is a no brainer, store owners have the right to strict access to ppl carring guns.
this is simply an insurance issue and it covers the owners ass in a civil lawsuit.

This guy should be carring his gun concealed in the first place, in order to not draw any attention.

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