[oweno]

Way back when, there was a catalog called the Johson Smith Catalog - lots of 'magic tricks', jokes, etc. but back in the 30's, they also sold handguns.

Here's some of the prices as advertized in their 1931 edition:

Sedgley Baby Hammerless (.22 short or long) $6.50

H&R Automatic Revolver, .22, .32, or .38 S&W: $10.50

The Defender (a really odd looking combination pocket knife and single-shot .22): $5.00

45 Caliber Government Model Colt Automatic Pistol: $45.00

Here's their writeup on the Colt:

///////

According to government standards, it is adjudged the most powerful automatic pistol, that has proven its superiority in reliability and accuracy. In this model, the slide remains open after firing the last shot. Pressing the magazine catch throws out the empty magazine after which a new load may be inserted. It is an eight shot pistol , 5 inch barrel, length overall 8 1/2 inches , weight 39 ounces. Blue steel finish with checkered walnut grips, shoots 45 caliber automatic cartridges. The action of the automatic pistol is entirely automatic excepting that the trigger must be pulled to fire each shot; continued discharge will NOT result from one pull of the trigger. Each shot throws out the shell and inserts a new cartridge until the magazine is emptied. Has absolute SAFETY MECHANISM that locks the pistol when not in use, thus rendering accidential discharge impossible.

Revolvers and pistols can not be sent by mail, shipped express only.

///////

If anybody's interested, I'll key in some of the other descriptions, they're a hoot - especially the one for "The Defender".

Owen

[BigG]

That's a pretty good description in my book. $45 in the Great Depression was probably about like $4,500 today. :uhoh:

[Mike Irwin]

Oweno,

What was a Smith & Wesson Military & Police in .38 Spl. going for back then, if it's in the catalog?

[oweno]

No Smith & Wessons in the catalog but here's some more Colt prices:

25 Caliber Colt Automatic Pistol: $20.00

32 and 38 Caliber Colt Automatic Pistols (Model 1903, I think?) $25.00

Colt Police Positive Revolver: $35.00

Colt Army Special Revolver: $40.00

Colt 22 Cal. 11 Shot Automatic Target Pistol: $39.50

and indeed, a lot of money in The Great Depression...if a man had a job that paid $25 a week, he'd count himself lucky...and he'd be working a 50 or 60 hour week at that.

[Jim K]

Hi, Big G and guys,

I think the $45 equals $4500 today conversion is a bit off.

For the period from roughly 1880 to WWI, a 1 to 40 conversion works pretty well. For the 1920's and to WWII, a 1 to 30 works, while after WWII through the 1950's a 1 to 20 ratio would apply (a Government Model was $65 in 1954).

Jim

[BigG]

Forgive my penchant for hyperbole, Jim Keenan, my bud. :) So at 30:1 we are talking ONLY $1,350 for a surplus Colt 1911 (real McCoy). :eek: Come to think of it, we aren't so bad off are we? :uhoh:

[Soap]

Adjusted to 2003 USD:

Sedgley Baby Hammerless (.22 short or long) $79.11

H&R Automatic Revolver, .22, .32, or .38 S&W: $127.80

The Defender (a really odd looking combination pocket knife and single-shot .22): $60.86

45 Caliber Government Model Colt Automatic Pistol: $547.70

[carpettbaggerr]

Come to think of it, we aren't so bad off are we?

Well, they used to sell guns by mailorder. With no background checks, or paperwork. From a catalog which specializes in magic tricks. They used to sell guns in most department stores. And hardware stores. And even in some gas station. And nobody thought it was the least bit strange.

We've fallen a long way.

[BigG]

Carpetbagger: Of course you are right about that aspect. I was comparing the amount of money then and now. Pretty much the same. It would take most guys a long time to earn $45 in 1931 at $0.75 per day for some of the men who were lucky enough to have jobs.

Daniel Flory: I think your $547 today is a little light compared to the purchasing power back then. A dollar was awful big in those days or so I'm told. :uhoh:

[Soap]

BigG- The conversions are directly from an inflation table. Thus they take into account the CPI. The CPI measures the cost of goods over time compared to the average U.S. household's purchasing power. I'm not sure what the average household income was in 1931, but the CPI should take that into account.

[Ky Larry]

My grandmother told me that in 1937, my grandfather bought a new Winchester Model 12 shotgun. The price was $35.00. She said it took over a year to save it up.

[BluesBear]

In 1900 you could buy a brand new Colt Single Action Army for a $20 Gold Piece.

In 1980 you still could. :D

[oweno]

The catalog sells other gun-related stuff - here's another writeup (I wish I had a scanner so I could show you the illustrations but I don't...)


////

The Scare-'em Revolver

Better than the Real Thing

Deceives EVERYBODY

Made of solid metal, it EXACTLY imitates a fine Nickle-plated heavy WEAPON

Price $1.00 We pay postage


Beside being an effective joker, this imitation Revolver is just the thing to scare a burglar or other intruder. It looks exactly like a death dealing weapon: you can scarcely believe, even when you are holding it in your hand, that it won't shoot. A lady could frighten a thief with this without risk to herself or anyone else. You can have it lying about without danger and with the certainty of having lots of fun with your friends.

[sebago]

Love those old catalogs. I have one from a local (and long defunct) sporting goods store called Edwards & Walker Co. from around 1937.
Colt Goverment models were $41.50 and the National Match went for $50 even. Unless you wanted the NM with fixed sights, then it was $45.00

Mike, the S&W M&P round butt was $32.50 with your choice of 2,4,5 or 6 inch bbl., blue or nickel. Square butt was $33.00 but only with a 4,5 or 6 inch bbl.. again, blue or nickel. Here's a few others.

The .44 Target went out the door for $45.00. So did the .38/44 Outdoorsman.

.38/44 Heavy Duty $37.50

".357" Magnum $60.00

Colt Shooting Master $52.50

SAA $37.50 with many calibers to choose from.

To put it in context however, at the time, my father managed a farm and was paid $100.00 a month and men he hired as day laborers were paid the going rate of $1.00 a day. It really did take a long time to save up that kind of cash.

[Jim K]

Hi, Mr. Flory,

I have used those inflation tables also, and to me they are quite a bit too low, but I can't quite figure out why. All I know is that they don't really seem to match up with real wages and prices, even on goods that can be validly compared.

The price of gold is one way to compare, but over much of the period the price of gold was fixed in the U.S. and ownership was illegal except under limited circumstances.

Jim

[Sean Smith]

FYI, the Colt National Match guns sold in the 1930s were about 2x the price of a standard Government Model. Interestingly enough, Colt would do custom orders on Government Models back then, too (and did so since 1912). The "custom 1911" is not a new phenomenon, but as old as the gun itself.

[Soap]

Jim,

My gut said the same thing. But I haven't been able to pull up the average household income in 1931 so it is tough to reconcile the low prices.

[BigG]

My friends Daniel Flory, Jim Keenan, and other members:

Don your tinfoil caps. Now, who publishes those CPI tables? The gomit? OK, now do you think they are accurate or trying to promote some agenda? Welp, if it is the gomt, I rest my case. Remove tinfoil hats and resume your life. ;)

[sebago]

Sean, that price difference you mention for the Colt Gov. and National Match models may well be true at some point in the '30's but the prices I listed from my '37 catalog are accurate and match those listed for those same guns in the reprint of the 1939 Stoeger catalog.
The prices in my old catalog are stated to be retail at that so I have to assume someone could get a better deal elsewhere. A difference of only a dollar or two would have been huge at the time.
BTW, gas sold locally for 20 cents a gallon, for many folks it cost a days wages to buy 5 gallons! :eek:

[Soap]

BigG- :D I've calculated the CPIs of recent years and got results close to the govmint. But then again...I went to public school...*dons tinfoil* :scrutiny:

[BigG]

One of the older members, Grampster or someone, mentioned on another thread about the Depression era, "Gas was 12c a gallon but I didn't have the 12c or a car to put it in." :D

[oweno]

Here's another...

////////

Automatic Cap Pistol

Often Better Than a Real Weapon

Fires 50 shots at one loading, a rapid fire repeater

Though this is made and sold as a toy, it so closely resembles a real repeater in shape, that you could hold off a burglar or foot-pad with it. You press the trigger and there is a LOUD REPORT, but no bullet. The frightened thief thinks that you have aimed badly and a quick second explosion has him on the run. It is like using blank cartridges in a regular revolver. You can fire 50 shots in rapid sucession without reloading. The mechanism is self acting . The caps come in rolls of 50 shots, you merely place a roll in the Pistol and then fire.

Price postpaid: 25 cents

////////

Foot-pads, indeed. What it looks like is a regular cap pistol (like I had when I was a kid) and nobody, but nobody would think that the noise it made was anything like a real gun.

Owen

[Sean Smith]

Colt Shooting Master is probably not equal to Colt National Match.

[BigG]

Sean: Col. Charles Askins, Jr. made many a record with a Colt Shooting Master caliber .38 Special. He earned something like 547 awards for pistol shooting. Sucker musta known somethin. :D I believe he said he favored Colt's because the S&W folks were snotballs and the Colt's factory reps were cool. This was at Camp Perry, iirc. Best!

[jfh]

When my uncle died, I inherited his 52B sporter. Fancy walnut, Ebony forepiece (am I saying that right?), Lyman 'peeps', sling, etc. Bought about 1934, he shot it at Camp Perry, I think....

at any rate, as near as my gunsmith friend and I could dig out of old literature, he paid about $52.50 for it new. It's still in what I would call 8+ condition....no additions, changes, etc, except for an adjustable aperture rear sight for my aging eyes. Only thing not original are the magazines.

and then there's the 1940's Detective Special and a 1930's (?) Banker's Special is .22...but I haven't bothered to research those yet.

[Jim K]

Hi, Big G and guys,

During WWII, gas was $.09 a gallon if/when available, price controlled of course and on a ration book. After WWII, it went to .12, then to around .18, which is the lowest price I personally bought it at (about 1949).

As to the 1-30 in the pre WWII period, I saw a 1938 menu today posted in a restaurant. Sandwiches were $.10, same for a bottle of beer and pie or cake. A soft drink was $.05. With the 1-30, that would translate to $3.00 each for the sandwich, beer and dessert, $1.50 for the soft drink. That is just about what they charge today for those same things.

Jim

[Monkeyleg]

Hmmm. That would mean that a Thompson cost about $30 (not adjusted for the '86 full-auto ban price jump). We need a weeping smiley.

[Tango Sierra]

An advertisement for Hillman's grocery stores in Chicago dated August 14, 1935

Lettuce .05
Apples 7lbs .19
Fresh limes 2 doz .25
Calif. oranges 2 doz .25
Tomatoes 2 Lbs .09
Coffee 3 Lbs .55
Fresh Butter 2 Lbs .49
Fresh Eggs 2 doz .57
Pot Roast .10 per Lb
Standing Rib Roast .14 per Lb
Rolled Rib Roast .17 per Lb
Hens .20 per Lb
Chickens .23 per Lb
Ducks .20 per Lb
American Cheese .17 per Lb
Munster Cheese .17 per Lb
Private stock Bourbon .95 Pint
Hiram Walker's Bourbon 1.79 Pint
"Supra" Gin .77 fifth
20Yr.Old Scotch 2.79 fifth
No guns listed.

[Kharn]

Monkeyleg: Tommys sold for $200 direct from the factory in 1934.

Kharn

[Sean Smith]

Sean: Col. Charles Askins, Jr. made many a record with a Colt Shooting Master caliber .38 Special. He earned something like 547 awards for pistol shooting. Sucker musta known somethin. I believe he said he favored Colt's because the S&W folks were snotballs and the Colt's factory reps were cool. This was at Camp Perry, iirc. Best!

I meant that the National Match was not the same gun as the Colt Shooting Master, not that it was better. Haven't shot either one to know. :)

[BigG]

OK, Sean, if you mean a cheaper gun than a National Match 45 ACP, it may well have been. The Shooting Master was a target variation of the New Service Colt revo that everyone has seen in .45 ACP flavor. From the pictures and descriptions I;ve seen, the SM had a smaller grip than the NS, since one of the complaints about the NS was the large hand it took to hold onto the gun and to reach the trigger. Guess it was like unto a 2X4 - or a Glock 21! :D The Shooting Master also had better sights, probably adjustable and of course was available in different calibers.

[Monkeyleg]

Kharn, thanks for that info. I always wondered what the price was. That would probably go a long way toward explaining why they didn't sell many to the general public.