Plated -VS- FMJ bullets?


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Wildbillz
December 2, 2010, 07:45 PM
Hi All
I was looking at bullets for 9mm reloads. Cost wise there is not a lot of differance in the FMJ bullets ($80. Per K http://www.goldenwestbrass.com/SearchResults.asp?Cat=4 ) and the Plated ones ($80.88 Per K http://www.berrysmfg.com/product-i14474-c11-g8-b0-p0-9mm_115gr_RN_DS.aspx ) Is there any reason to choose the Plated over the FMJ? I would guess they use the same ammount of powder as the FMJ ones?

Thanks
WB

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Walkalong
December 2, 2010, 07:47 PM
If they are the same price there is no reason to buy the plated bullet, unless it is a bullet you just happen to like and have loads worked up with.

Powder charges for plated are not exactly the same as for jacketed. Another reason to buy the FMJ at the same price is more load data.

OTOH, if you can save money, plated are just fine for general plinking.

32dgrz
December 2, 2010, 08:00 PM
I buy Precision Delta jacketed mostly.
When I do buy Berry's I get them from this source http://www.tjconevera.com/berrys-bullets.html

tactikel
December 2, 2010, 09:44 PM
My closest indoor range mandated no exposed lead bullets. Plated were the only option. Loading data for lead bullets is useful for plated bullets. If for plinking or target shooting they are fine. For any serious use jacketed (fmj or hollow points) are preferred.

CZDave
December 2, 2010, 10:33 PM
Precision Delta
http://www.precisiondelta.com

9mm Luger 115gr FMJ Bullets (Price Includes Shipping) $74.00 Per 1000

This looks like a good price.
Does anyone know of a better deal on FMJ bullets?

PO2Hammer
December 2, 2010, 11:18 PM
Good plated bullets will probably be more accurate than cheap jacketed ones, at least they are with .45acp target loads.
$80 for jacketed is a good sale price, does it include shipping costs like Berry's?

MrOldLude
December 3, 2010, 10:41 AM
Powder Valley sells Berry's 115gr plated RN bullets for $60.80 per 1000 +shipping.

CZDave
December 4, 2010, 12:23 AM
I checked out Powder Valley and found BERRYS 9MM (.356) 115 GR RN-DS (1000).
Isn't .356 the diameter of a lead bullet?

bds
December 4, 2010, 12:33 AM
Isn't .356 the diameter of a lead bullet?
Most plated bullets like Berry's and PowerBond are sized between lead and jacketed bullets at .3555" but we effectively treat them as .356" and use lead load data (BTW, Rainier bullets are sized at .355"). Doing so will give you more safety margin with your reloads.

Good plated bullets will probably be more accurate than cheap jacketed ones, at least they are with .45acp target loads.
True. You know what? Good lead reloads will sometimes be more accurate than average/cheap jacketed bullets. My Missouri Bullets lead 45ACP target loads will outshoot most factory FMJ loads.

Walkalong
December 4, 2010, 09:17 AM
No piss poor jacket to affect the bullets flight.

Lead can be very very accurate.

Jacketed bullet manufacturers go through a lot of trouble to get/make the most concentric jackets they can to make their match bullets.

Where do the lessor quality jackets go? :scrutiny:

PO2Hammer
December 4, 2010, 10:05 AM
I checked out Powder Valley and found BERRYS 9MM (.356) 115 GR RN-DS (1000).
Isn't .356 the diameter of a lead bullet?
.356" is what Berry's uses for 9mm, I also use Rainier .356" .38 Super bullets and .356" Hornady HAP bullets in 9mm.

bds
December 4, 2010, 12:29 PM
Rainier Ballistics website (http://www.rainierballistics.com/mainframe.htm) shows .355" for 9mm and .356" for 38 Super.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=131635&stc=1&d=1291480120

bds
December 4, 2010, 12:42 PM
And PowerBond's website (http://powerbondbullets.com/products.html) is showing .3555" for their 9mm bullets.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=131637&stc=1&d=1291480846

PO2Hammer
December 4, 2010, 12:42 PM
I've never noticed any difference between .355" and .356" in HK, Sig, Glock, T/C single shot and Marlin carbines in 9mm.
BTW, the Hornady HAP bullets measure .3567" with my micrometer. No unusual pressure signs or changes in velocity when switching back and forth between diameters.
We would be lucky if our barrels were consistently held to +/- .001" tolerances.

bds
December 4, 2010, 12:48 PM
As many have experienced, plating process has improved over the decades and now can withstand higher powder charges/velocities.

For reloading practices in general, with .3555" - .356" plated bullets, it is a good idea to use .356" lead load data due to tighter bullet-to-barrel fit they provide, which results in higher chamber pressures.

Most plated bullet manufacturers also recommend that we use the lower lead load data.

I think for many new reloaders starting out who lack the experience to load at the near max/max load data range, I think being on the safer side of load data is a good idea. IMHO

PO2Hammer
December 4, 2010, 12:50 PM
Lead can be very very accurate.
I've never tried lead in .45acp, I was looking at Magnus swaged .452 SWC's. (http://magnusbullets.com/store/page11.html)
Have you tried any of those?
What's your preference in .452 SWC's?

bds
December 4, 2010, 01:09 PM
My favorite target lead load now is Missouri Bullets 18 BHN 200 gr SWC (http://www.missouribullet.com/details.php?prodId=57&category=5&secondary=13&keywords=)with 5.0 gr of W231/HP38 loaded at 1.25"-1.265" OAL. It's been producing consistent sub 1" 5-shot groups at 7-10 yards.

My new favorite plinking lead load is same bullet with 4.0 gr of Promo/Red Dot. Below are sample shot groups shot at 10-15 yards.

http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=131638&stc=1&d=1291482509
http://www.thehighroad.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=131639&stc=1&d=1291482509

billybob44
December 4, 2010, 01:38 PM
I checked out Powder Valley and found BERRYS 9MM (.356) 115 GR RN-DS (1000).
Isn't .356 the diameter of a lead bullet?
Yes it is. The plated bullets are usually the same diameter as cast. I get plated when I can buy them right. Otherwise I cast/shoot my wheel weight cast, and buy the jacketed for my better/warmer loads.

918v
December 4, 2010, 02:03 PM
9mm barrels vary in groove diameter by as much as .003". My Sig has a .357" groove diameter. My Berettas too. Only Colt, S&W and Ruger maintain the .355" dimension. This debate about .355" vs .356" is silly.

buck460XVR
December 4, 2010, 03:59 PM
Good plated bullets will probably be more accurate than cheap jacketed ones.


......and what works well for one guy/one gun don't necessarily work well for everyone/every gun. You won't know till you try. One reason I recommend buyin' bullets in small quantities or "sampler packs" till you find what works the best for you and your gun. Getting a thousand bullets for $5 cheaper than another brand/kind ain't much of a deal if they fly all over outta your gun with your loads. Sometimes accuracy/performance comes at a price, this is especially true with bullets. Everyone's expectations of accuracy/performance can be different also. So is intended use. One of my most accurate SD loads outta my Colt 5'' Government is with Berry's plated bullets. For hunting velocities outta my magnum revolvers, I don't even consider plated.

Walkalong
December 4, 2010, 04:23 PM
I've never tried lead in .45acp, I was looking at Magnus swaged .452 SWC's. (http://magnusbullets.com/store/page11.html)
Have you tried any of those?I usd to shoot Magnus bullets in 9MM, .44 Spl, .44 Mag, & .45 ACP. They make good bullets. They use standard molds used by many bullet makers.

These look familiar (http://www.missouribullet.com/details.php?prodId=57&category=5&secondary=13&keywords=)?

PO2Hammer
December 4, 2010, 07:50 PM
These look familiar?
Yup!
I also found these button nose 185's there. (http://www.missouribullet.com/details.php?prodId=57&category=5&secondary=13&keywords=)
With a BHN of 18, would you expect success (no leading, accuracy) at roughly 850 fps?
I'm using a plated 185 that looks suspiciously similar with your N310 recipe (thank you BTW).
My Sig P220 ST seems to be up to the task, and I'm hot on it's heels with my trigger pulling.
Thanks for all your help.

Walkalong
December 4, 2010, 07:56 PM
Missouri Bullet Company has great feedback here. Give them a try.

Hondo 60
December 5, 2010, 12:15 AM
I'm with Walkalong. MBC has great products & even better service.

Seedtick
December 5, 2010, 12:43 AM
Originally Posted by buck460XVR
For hunting velocities outta my magnum revolvers, I don't even consider plated.

I've had really good luck with the PowerBonds I've been getting from Jacob at Rocky Mountain Reloading. (http://www.shop.rmrbullets.com/main.sc;jsessionid=E31BA09A32FBBCBD03F5E6BE0F1B34EC.qscstrfrnt04)

I'm using his plated 125 and 158 grainers in .357 Ruger Only loads and I load em up just like I do jacketed bullets. They are working great and even chrony a little bit faster than identical jacketed bullet loads.

Now I've not tried any other calibers yet but I wouldn't think there would be any problems. (well, with pistol calibers anyway) I don't know if they would work for a hunting bullet cause I've not tried to recover any, magnum loads, to see how they perform. We have caught some that were launched from a shorty 38 Special (LCR) and those almost look like you could load em and shoot em again. : /

Seedtick

:)

YellowCake
December 7, 2010, 03:17 PM
I shoot Extreme Bullets (http://xtremebullets.com/). I love their phone support and prices are really good.

shoen1200
December 7, 2010, 04:02 PM
I found using plated bullets in short barrel pistols (less than 3.5in) that use polygonal riffling instead of the usual lands/grooves can be a problem.

I have Kahr’s and HK’s in 9mm and 40 s&w that have accuracy trouble when shooting plated stuff – really horrible groups.

I tried lots of different loads and setup and was never happy.

I ended up giving the 9mm and 40s&w plated stuff to a friend.

Those same pistols never have a problem with jacketed.

PO2Hammer
December 7, 2010, 05:40 PM
I have Kahr’s and HK’s in 9mm and 40 s&w that have accuracy trouble when shooting plated stuff – really horrible groups.

I tried lots of different loads and setup and was never happy.


I'm picking up a USP 9mm full size tomorrow and would like to know which HK and what bullet type you had trouble with.

bds
December 8, 2010, 02:40 AM
I found using plated bullets in short barrel pistols (less than 3.5in) that use polygonal riffling instead of the usual lands/grooves can be a problem.

I have Kahr’s and HK’s in 9mm and 40 s&w that have accuracy trouble when shooting plated stuff – really horrible groups.
Hmmmmm. No problem here with my "hexagonal rifled" Glock 27 - shoots as accurate as my G22 with plated bullets (Rainier, Berrys, PowerBond in 165/180 gr).

Maybe it's Kahr/HK thing?

Can other Karh/HK owners confirm this?

Walkalong
December 8, 2010, 08:36 AM
I shoot Extreme Bullets. I love their phone support Yea, she sure is nice, isn't she. I agree, they make excellent bullets.

shoen1200
December 9, 2010, 02:51 PM
PO2Hammer,

Both Kahr PM9 using 115gr RN and PM40 using 165gr RNFP were the worst behaving with plated.

My P2000SK in 40S&w did better than the Kahr's but still not as well as plated.

It helped some if loads used were at/near max limit.

The same loads that would give the kahr PM9 an accuracy fit worked fine from my Walter P99 and a friends Sig P239.

YMMV

PO2Hammer
December 9, 2010, 07:00 PM
Thanks.

54lariat
December 10, 2010, 12:36 AM
My kahr CW40 just hates plated bullets, my Sig 226 is so-so, my CZ40 does not seem to differ from my Jacketed bullets.

Just my .2cents

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