Why the hate on the XD's?


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southeastshooter
December 2, 2010, 10:18 PM
Hey everybody I just turned 21 last Friday :) So naturally I have been deciding on a handgun, well actually for the past year. After very extensive research, shooting etc. I had it narrowed down to the Glock 30, XD 45 compact and the M&P 45 compact. So I decided to go with the XD for various reasons and was planning on ordering it next week. Tonight while doing a little looking around I stumbled across m4carbine.net where there is much hate for the XD line. I am not one to go on a few opinions but they really make me second guess my choice. Is the XD really a bad weapon? I'm not saying at all that it is better than a Glock or M&P but in my opinion it is on par with those models. What do yall think?

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PT1911
December 2, 2010, 10:21 PM
it is a great weapon that is capable of doing anything that the others can do.. if it feels good in your hand and you prefer it to the others you will definitely not regret the decision to get it.. there are haters for every design out there, but when you get right down to it, any of those options will serve you well for the remainder of your life and continue to serves someone else afterward as long as it is properly maintained.

M1key
December 2, 2010, 10:24 PM
Here is an objective review:

http://www.xdtalk.com/forums/general-sa-xd-xd-m-talk/156561-cutting-through-hype-myths-xd-good-enough-professional-use.html


M

ratt_finkel
December 2, 2010, 10:26 PM
You really can't go wrong with any of the selections. And certainly, none of them are "bad". Don't listen to the internet haters. Must opine on guns they have never even held, let alone shot.

The one thing I have learned from the Internet forums and my own experience is this; try it out for yourself. If YOU shoot it well and performs reliably, then pick the one that fits you best.

You should be able to find a range that offers all those models for rent. Try before you buy!

BlayGlock
December 2, 2010, 10:26 PM
Because its not a glock.

southeastshooter
December 2, 2010, 10:30 PM
I agree and thanks for the fast responses. That was seriously quick! It's just that this is the only handgun money permits for me to buy for a long time and I will be carrying for self defense and don't want to buy something that will let me down if I even need it.

PabloJ
December 2, 2010, 10:31 PM
Here is an objective review:

http://www.xdtalk.com/forums/general-sa-xd-xd-m-talk/156561-cutting-through-hype-myths-xd-good-enough-professional-use.html


M
How is one going to get untainted opinion on item lovers forum?

I would pick the one that feels best in hand.

Imon
December 2, 2010, 10:33 PM
They need to make it more XXXXXTREME :fire:

HS produkts, I mean.

Mr.Davis
December 2, 2010, 10:38 PM
Many of the real and imagined "pros" around the internet have red marks on their lips from all the Glock Kool-Aid. A lot of them struggle with the distinction between "preference" and "true superiority". The XD versus Glock debate is a perfect example of preference.

http://i765.photobucket.com/albums/xx297/tdavis021484/010haters.jpg

I love my XD. It is more accurate than me, it is safer than a Glock (although both are very safe), I like the grip angle better, and it has never, EVER choked through 2000+ rounds. That said, I'd never demean someone for buying a Glock - they're good guns too.

People can criticize my guns when they start paying for them.

76shuvlinoff
December 2, 2010, 10:39 PM
The odds are you won't regret it but if you do you won't lose your money or at least not very much of it. Not much to hate there.

REAPER4206969
December 2, 2010, 10:44 PM
What makes you prefer the XD over the Glock or M&P?

Hanzo581
December 2, 2010, 11:19 PM
I have the XD45, it felt better in my hand than any Glock I have held/shot. That's why I chose it. As far as reliability goes, the XD will serve you well despite what the die hard Glock loyalists will tell you.

http://springfield-armory.primediaoutdoors.com/SPstory11.php

sprice
December 2, 2010, 11:20 PM
I would go with glock or s&w. I dislike the xd's and i have owned one and Prefered my glock.

Cards81fan
December 2, 2010, 11:22 PM
What makes you prefer the XD over the Glock or M&P?
I prefer the grip angle of the XD, the grip safety of the XD, the method of take down (lever versus switch), the XD factory sights, front slide serrations, and the XD's trigger (true single action). I also got my XD used, for a heck of a great price; far better than any Glock at the time.

Note I have a plain-Jane XD, not an XDm. I really like the XDm's capacity, backstraps, and trigger. But those are moot since they were unavailable when I purchased my pistol.

I do prefer Glock's Tennifer over the XDs, lower bore axis, RTF finish (particularly on the Gen 3 RTF pistols that others found too rough), and size of the baby (26/27/33) Glocks.

All in all, the XD wins out for me. But I still have much respect for its competition.

ATAShooter
December 2, 2010, 11:41 PM
Love My XD

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v326/ATAShooter/xdplatesmall.jpg

M1key
December 2, 2010, 11:44 PM
How is one going to get untainted opinion on item lovers forum?

I would pick the one that feels best in hand.
The author ain't a lover. He calls it what it is...serviceable, with flaws.

Matt018
December 2, 2010, 11:45 PM
IMHO it is a copy of a glock. I shoot a G26, and a glock is the original. A XD is just like a glock, Just occasionaly with a silver slide.

tinygnat219
December 2, 2010, 11:51 PM
There's absolutely nothing wrong with the XD series of pistols. I am still trying to wrap my head around the fact that there is a bunch of hate out there for them.

They've been proven, their cost is decent, and they offer some advantages over the S&W line of M&P lines especially with the XD45 having 3 more rounds than the M&P line 45s.

If you like how one sits in your hand, I recommend picking one up.

Hanzo581
December 3, 2010, 12:00 AM
I would go with glock or s&w. I dislike the xd's and i have owned one and Prefered my glock.

What didn't you like? It may be helpful to the OP to know that.

Jackal1
December 3, 2010, 12:05 AM
I own 2 XD's (45c and 9mm subcompact). I have shot 4 different glocks both in full size and compact. I have also shot two S&W M&P's, one full size the other one compact.

I would buy the M&P.

The XD trigger is atrocious on both of my guns as well as on both of my brother's XD-45c's as well as on my sister's XD-45c. The XD trigger is considered 'single action' but it has a massive spring force stacking effect going on which makes it difficult to shoot accurately. It is okay for duty use, I suppose.

XD Trigger stack:
1) depress trigger safety spring
2) depress trigger spring
3) depress firing pin block safety spring
4) depress sear spring
5) extend (slightly) the firing pin spring as the sear moves

In total you are depressing 5 different springs that all kick in at different point in the trigger pull. This makes the XD trigger pull rather difficult to operate smoothly.

In retrospect I think my siblings and I all wished we had bought a different gun. My preference is the M&P.

YMMV

Nomad, 2nd
December 3, 2010, 12:07 AM
I FAR prefer the feel of the XD...

However, the failures I have seen have made me (when I translated to 'fantastic plastic' from my 1911's) go to the Glocks (Owned an XD first)

Mags... not reliable when they get dirty.

Guns... lock up.

Not trusting it.

Mike J
December 3, 2010, 12:13 AM
I have an XD-40 that is an accurate, reliable pistol. I have shot a couple of Glocks & liked the way they shot & handled also. The biggest advantage I see to the Glocks is that parts & accessories are widely available. Find what works for you & go with it.

The biggest thing that made me pick the XD over the Glock was I wanted a .40. Glocks chambers did not appear to be as well supported at that time as the XD's(this was in late 2007). Glock has since given their .40 caliber chambers more support.

Shadow 7D
December 3, 2010, 12:45 AM
for me it was a price and beauty thing
I liked the long slide (tactical??) version, and in 40, at the time, wow, more than few years ago, it was there, felt better, and to me looked better...
so thats what I ended up with, and that it was cheaper (rebate offer and just less expensive) it's what I got.

mstrat
December 3, 2010, 01:20 AM
Few thousand rounds through my XDm 9, and not a single problem. Can't find a single thing not to like about it.

I was originally going to get the XD 9, but found that the grips on the XDm felt a thousand times better in my hand. That alone made it worth the extra money (I don't really care about the other perks of the xdm over the xd, though).

Glock and M&Ps are fine firearms too. Personally I don't like the grip angle of the glock, but i can't find any other real flaws in either of them.

In short: Of those three, you can't go wrong. Go with your gut feeling. Whichever feels right in your hand, is compatible with your wallet, and makes you smile. :)

FatPants
December 3, 2010, 01:22 AM
I prefer the glock. I had an XD 9, and while it was very accurate, it was not as reliable as my glocks.

I do not like the fact that I cannot buy parts for an XD. Everything must be sent back to SA to be repaired, which is a hassle, when I can buy just about anything for the glock online, and have it delivered to my door (most fun shops stock glock parts as well). Not a big deal for most people, but I am a competition shooter, and being without my gun for a month or more is not acceptable.

The XD ergonomics certainly feel better than a glock, but in my experience, a handgun grip isnt like a bicycle grip where I will be holding it for long periods of time. It comes out of the holster for a minute or two, then its back in the holster, so if my pinky isnt 100% comfortable, its not a big deal as long as I can shoot the gun accurately, and acquire targets quickly. Glocks do point very natural for me, I know a lot of people complain about the grip angle, but for me, it is spot on.

I personally am back on target quicker with the glock, and my scores have improved since making the switch. XD's are fine guns, but not for me. I see a lot more XD failures at matches than I do glocks as well.

TG13
December 3, 2010, 01:25 AM
i prefer the XD grip angle over the Glock.. i like the M&P's grip feel, though, i just don't like the take down lever/10 round mags/goofy 15 round mags..

the stock trigger does take some getting used to.. once you find the break and reset points, then train to keep your finger from going past those points, the creep is negligible.. but it does take time to figure it out, then train with it to become proficient.. most new XD RH shooters end up shooting to the left and below where they are aiming.. it's a combination of jerking the trigger and not knowing where the reset is.. it's true the trigger jobs aren't cheap, but you can get a break at 2.5lbs and a near 1911 short stroke on the trigger..

this video should show how far it can go.. this is very short and seems to be a pretty light trigger, overall..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6YmAojjuKxc&feature=related

there are many parts and accessories for the XD/XDm available..

i am quite happy with my XD45 Service.. it's been reliable, will feed everything.. i have not tried LSWC, but i would be very surprised if it didn't feed them also..

XDs are not Glock copies.. they share much more with the Sig than the Glock..

oh.. Melonite and Tenifer are the same exact metal treatment.. (http://durferrit.de/en/unternehmen/firmengeschichte.htm)

the XD is a great pistol.. pick it if you like it.. if not, find something else that fits with what you require.. i suppose that's why there are so many to choose from.. there is no "one size fits all"..

DeathByCactus
December 3, 2010, 01:49 AM
My pistols before the XD were all 1911's. My two prized are my Colt .38 super that I grew up shooting (gift from my dad at 15), then on the day I got my concealed carry a Kimber .45 CDP II Pro. I carried the Kimber daily... one day I decided I wanted a double action gun and oddly enough within 48 hours I was the owner of a .40 XD.

The XD is now my carry gun, range gun, car gun... The 1911's stay on my nightstands. It's just as accurate, holds more rounds, has an 11 degree angle, familiar safeties and it is AMAZINGLY QUICK AND EASY TO BREAK DOWN ALLOWING FOR CLEANING SPEEDS THAT ARE INSANE compared to how long it takes me to break down my 1911's. Not to mention it weighs about the same fully loaded as my fully loaded Kimber.

I love my XD... only bad thing I have about it is the justification to keep my Kimber CDP II around. I'll never get rid of the colt.

Just to note... the wording in this thread right below the HATE sticky thread is slightly ironic....

Confederate
December 3, 2010, 02:16 AM
The XD lovers just hate the Glock because it has no safety and won't fire limp-wristed like their guns will. Glock owners know there isn't any reason for a gun to shoot limp-wristed and safties are for pansies (just keep your finger off the trigger!). Popping a round into the chamber and putting it into a holster is the way real men carry their guns -- and all those accidental gun discharges with the Glocks are clearly the faults of people who didn't know how to use them.

If you're not man enough for Glocks, buy one of those other guns. But you don't see people throwing XDs out of helicopters or leaving them in cement...no sir!

So buy what you want, but if you want a man's gun, get a Glock.

David E
December 3, 2010, 02:51 AM
I would go with glock or s&w. I dislike the xd's and i have owned one and Prefered my glock.

So? Without factual information detailing the "why," (mere "personal preference" is not factual information) no one cares.

IMHO it is a copy of a glock. I shoot a G26, and a glock is the original. A XD is just like a glock,

Then you've never taken the slide off of both and compared the workings. They are totally different designs.

The XD lovers just hate the Glock because....

I don't hate Glox. I have over a dozen of them. I even used a 21-SF to win a title this year.

There are good things about Glox and there are bad things about Glox.......the same as any other gun. So you need to decide which of the things are bad and which things are good......for YOU.

But you don't see people throwing XDs out of helicopters or leaving them in cement...

Then you missed Chaim Stein's recent article in Handguns (and reprinted in "Testfire") where he took an XD and replicated the tests Glock had done to their gun. The XD made it through it all with flying colors, no malfunctions, etc, etc, etc.

The XD is a fine gun. I made Grand Master in Production with my XD-40 winning some titles along the way. Very reliable gun. It lends itself easily to some trigger work. I have one set up for carry/defense.

If you prefer it over the others and you shoot it better, then buy it with confidence.

harmon rabb
December 3, 2010, 07:35 AM
There's xd hate?

Between the glock, xd, and m&p, you can't make a wrong choice. Get whichever one feels better in your hand, whichever one you think is prettier, whichever one you can get a better deal on. Really doesn't matter.

I'm partial to the xd because I shoot them better than the glocks. I also think the xd trigger is better than the glock trigger. But that's just me.

fxstchewy
December 3, 2010, 08:18 AM
I own Glocks, S&W's, Rugers and XD's, i have never had a failure with any of my XD's...........:)

XD9GUY
December 3, 2010, 08:29 AM
I see that there are a few Glock Lover's/XD Haters posting here.
They both have their strongpoints. However, I did the research and came up with the XD9 Subcompact for the size and capacity. Also I looked up the XD (Extreme Duty) testing and it was very impressive. You can read the article. They ran 17,000 rounds through a stock off-the-shelf pistol BEFORE they even started their "Extreme" testing.

Here's the article:
http://springfield-armory.primediaoutdoors.com/SPstory11.php

chupacabrah
December 3, 2010, 08:43 AM
people go back and forth on this all the time.

I own or have owned Glock, XD, and M&P.
I've really liked all 3, and never had a problem out of any of them.

People complain about the glock grip angle, but I can shoot as well with it as my XD or 1911--I don't even notice the angle. they also complain about the triggers, which I don't get too much either. I think people get all caught up in whining.

These are all quality products, and it is really hard to go wrong.

I like that the XD has a grip safety, and I'm kind of leaning towards getting an XD as a full size...but it is very hard to decide!

jlg
December 3, 2010, 09:00 AM
I've shot all three and now own an XD and an M&P. I didn't like the way the glock felt...however, I believe it is an excellent firearm...all three are excellent firearms. You won't be dissapointed with any of them.

BTW, through the end of the year, Springfield is offering (3) three additional magazines by mail with the purchase of an XD. So you get a total of (5) five magazines. That sweetens the deal a little.

Azb
December 3, 2010, 09:41 AM
The XD is a fine firearm. They all are, in fact.

I owned an XD for a while. It never malfunctioned and was very accurate. The only reason I still don't own it is that I prefer a hammer and a manual safety. Purely personal preference. If the XD was the only gun available for me, I really wouldn't have any problems carrying or shooting it.

Az

jimjc
December 3, 2010, 10:02 AM
Well I`ve owned Mercedes, BMW`s and Lexus I liked them all and would not hesitate to buy any of them again. I`ve owned Glocks and XD, among many others and I like them both, I would buy them again. I now own a XD Tactical that I like very much I sold a Glock I also liked very much. If you are buying a gun for sport it isn`t like your married to it, enjoy it until you want to buy another.

What I`m trying to say is buy what you like all these guns you listed are accurate, reliable, well made and good looking. Your purchase will not be the only gun you will ever own, there will be others. Buy one shoot the cr-- out of it, have fun and buy another and do it again. There is no "HOLY GRAIL GUNS"

joe_security
December 3, 2010, 10:37 AM
I dont see it as a slam against the XD. Everyone is M&P crazy these days. There is nothing wrong with the XD.

Deanimator
December 3, 2010, 10:52 AM
The XD series are decent guns. I know several people who own them. They all seem to like them.

I bought a Glock 22 when they first came out. I hated the step in the slide of the XDs, and didn't see the need for the grip safety, so I've stuck with the Glocks.

jem375
December 3, 2010, 11:45 AM
No hate for the XD on my part, I like my XD 45 much better than a G30,36, or 21... I own 5 45's and it's not my favorite but shoots very good.

EWO
December 3, 2010, 11:55 AM
It's really just a matter of personal preference. The hate comes from the internet fanboys. I own Glock and prefer them myself, but it's just a matter of personal preference. Nothing wrong with the XD 45. My friend has one and it shoots just fine.

Omaha-BeenGlockin
December 3, 2010, 12:04 PM
Don't know about hate--but I just don't like them---no objective reason.

Played with one in the store when they first came out--right then and there I knew it wasn't for me---have no interest in one and will never buy one.

bartman06
December 3, 2010, 12:17 PM
I might get a XD one day but right now i have 2 issues with it. The grip safety is to small. I would want it a little longer and a little wider, the last thing i want is to miss it in my time of need. The last thing i don't like is the magazine, it is way to weak of a mag. Usually they bend when they are dropped. If Springfield fixed those 2 things then i would not hesitate. Until then I'm waiting.

FatPants
December 3, 2010, 12:52 PM
I might get a XD one day but right now i have 2 issues with it. The grip safety is to small. I would want it a little longer and a little wider, the last thing i want is to miss it in my time of need. The last thing i don't like is the magazine, it is way to weak of a mag. Usually they bend when they are dropped. If Springfield fixed those 2 things then i would not hesitate. Until then I'm waiting.

Springfield doesn't manufacture the XD, so it would have to be HS in Croatia that made the changes. Springfield just imports them.

InkEd
December 3, 2010, 01:25 PM
That is probably the first time I've heard those two complaints.

Most people think the magazines are some of the best magazines without being "overbuilt."

As for the grip safety, I don't have anything (pro or con) to say about it.

My guess is that you prefer a lower grip position or oversized grip safeties like those found on some 1911s. IMHO if you can shoot an arched MSH 1911 with standard grip safety, the XD is a very smooth transition into polymer framed guns.

The XD gets jeered by alot of Glock fans because they feel it's a rip-off. They are similar enough to compare but still a distinct difference. (Coke vs. Pepsi/ Ford vs. Chevrolet/etc.)
I like the Glock pistols but the XD slightly edges it out for ergonomics for me.

The M&P is a nice gun, too. I would trust my life to one without a problem. The backstraps are nice but the trigger felt "chintzy" to me.

PabloJ
December 3, 2010, 01:34 PM
I do not dislike the xd, but it's much uglier then M&P and it's not made in USA.

The Lone Haranguer
December 3, 2010, 01:37 PM
Who hates them? :confused: I admit I was a little underwhelmed by the one I tried (rental), but I didn't hate it. I just liked the S&W M&P more. :)

Dmonster
December 3, 2010, 01:37 PM
I had a XDm until a couple weeks ago and never had any problems with it. But, the only reason I chose it over the Glock was that it felt better in my hand (closer approximation of a 1911). I have friends with both, and as far as I can tell either would be a good option. Personally, I don; have any experience to speak of with an M&P

BillH
December 3, 2010, 02:38 PM
Seems to be a good pistol, though it didn't feel right to me. After swapping (for practice only) at the firing range my friend sold his and bought a P239 like mine.

J_McLeod
December 3, 2010, 02:47 PM
I never fired an M&P. Fired both the XD and Glock at the range before choosing the XD 9. I like it so much that If I get another full size auto, it very well might be another XD. Don't like the grip angle, trigger pull or takedown of the Glock.

Just One Shot
December 3, 2010, 03:47 PM
The XD lovers just hate the Glock because it has no safety and won't fire limp-wristed like their guns will. Glock owners know there isn't any reason for a gun to shoot limp-wristed and safties are for pansies (just keep your finger off the trigger!). Popping a round into the chamber and putting it into a holster is the way real men carry their guns -- and all those accidental gun discharges with the Glocks are clearly the faults of people who didn't know how to use them.

If you're not man enough for Glocks, buy one of those other guns. But you don't see people throwing XDs out of helicopters or leaving them in cement...no sir!

So buy what you want, but if you want a man's gun, get a Glock.
I guess you haven't seen the XD torture test done by none other than a Glock guy?

http://springfield-armory.primediaoutdoors.com/SPstory11.php

Man's gun?

I know plenty of non Glock owners that you wouldn't want to make that comment to their face.

verdun59
December 3, 2010, 04:37 PM
There is no rational or logical reason for the hate. My XD-9 has never missed a beat, is one of the most accurate guns I own. I used to own a Glock and it never missed a beat either. But the XD won out for me. It's a good gun made substantially better with a Powder River trigger kit.

kwelz
December 3, 2010, 04:42 PM
I don't hate them. But I dont' reccomend them to people.

Extremely high bore axis.

Almost impossible to replace the stock sights.

Grip safety can and has malfunctioned which can only be fixed by shipping the gun off to be worked on.

I used to have 3. Sold them all and run M&Ps mainly now with a couple Glocks mixed in.

southeastshooter
December 3, 2010, 04:48 PM
Thanks yall. This is why I post here because I will always get responses no matter what. I saw someone say a lot of people are m&p crazy right now and those people are the only ones I see putting down the XD's. I'm sure it's not only S&W people but anyway I honestly love the Glock and consider myself very adapt to weapons safety but I just don't know if I can get over carrying it without an external safety and I just don't like the m&p's. I would love to get an HK but sadly cannot put that much money into it (i'm a student) and if I don't buy a handgun soon I won't be able to for a long long time. So I have no idea what i'm getting yet but i'll let yall know when I do buy. Thanks again!

kwelz
December 3, 2010, 06:47 PM
HK is good but in my opinion not worth the money. It offers nothing over a Glock or M&P and costs considerably more. You can get an M&P, Glock, or XD for under 500.

ratt_finkel
December 4, 2010, 12:46 AM
Dude, just go to the range and shoot as many different types of guns as you can afford to. You might find out you don't even like the tupperware pistols ;)

smoothdraw
December 4, 2010, 02:47 AM
The only thing i do not like with the Xd is that Glock is better. Glock is simple only 2 controls. Slide lock and magazine release. Reliability is unquestionable. The trigger reset of Glock is very short so you'll be able to shoot multiple times fast. No grip safety to fool around. The tenifer finish and the barrel quality of glock is awesome.

So it's not much hate in Xd i think. There's just so happen that there's a better choice. Because there's Glock.

For me the best handgun in form and function at whatever cost, are custom 1911's and Glock. And history supports.

DukeNukem
December 4, 2010, 06:17 AM
Glocks must be better. Rap musicians are always singing about them. You never hear them singing about other brands of guns.:neener:

jem375
December 4, 2010, 02:22 PM
Usually the hate portion of an XD is a Glockaholic trying to tell you how much better a Glock is and for a lot of people that is a bunch of BS...

Cards81fan
December 4, 2010, 02:27 PM
The only thing i do not like with the Xd is that Glock is better. Glock is simple only 2 controls. Slide lock and magazine release. Reliability is unquestionable. The trigger reset of Glock is very short so you'll be able to shoot multiple times fast. No grip safety to fool around. The tenifer finish and the barrel quality of glock is awesome.

So it's not much hate in Xd i think. There's just so happen that there's a better choice. Because there's Glock.

For me the best handgun in form and function at whatever cost, are custom 1911's and Glock. And history supports.
If the barrel quality is so superb, then why does seemingly everyone spend $100 on a Lone Wolf so they can 1) shoot unjacketed lead bullets, and 2) improve the chamber support on the .40 caliber models?

Just playing devil's advocate here. ;)

I think there is nothing wrong with the Glock barrel as long as you are aware of the polygonal rifling. But to say it is superior to the XD or M&P is a bit much. I consider them on equal footing in that area. I do prefer the Glock finish on the steel parts over the XD

uspJ
December 4, 2010, 02:32 PM
I had a 4" xd .40 and it was a great gun. My only complaints where that the sights were different from what I was used to and took some time to get used to getting good accuracy. My second complaint was that the gun was too loud even with ear plugs (the model I had was a ported model). I know that was not the fault of the pistol in any way it just made me not enjoy shooting it which is the point of having it. I would not hesitate to buy a 5" 9mm xd if I found one for the right price.

John Wayne
December 4, 2010, 02:59 PM
I own an XDM9, with 4,600 documented rounds through it. I have experienced 8 failures, all failures to eject and all usually after the gun had about 500 cast bullet handloads through it without cleaning or oiling.

I owned a Glock, which had a higher percentage of failures. I have friends who own Glocks and the reliability rate seems to be comparable to my XDM. I know some people with Glocks with over 1,000 rounds and no failures; others experience the occasional FTE. I can say the same for the XD.

I shoot Glocks well but I like the XD for the following reasons:

-it is cheaper than comparable Glock models
-it has a well-supported, conventionally rifled barrel
-it has metal sights that don't break off like stock Glock sights
-it has a very well-designed grip safety
-I prefer the trigger pull (opinion)
-I perfer the ergonomics (opinion)
-compact models come with extended magazines and compact mags
-there is a free 3 mag promotion on all new XDs now
-it has an ambidextrous mag release
-it has a slide release I can actually use
-reliability and accuracy are just as good as comparable Glock models
-XDs have not been subject to the same "product upgrades" (i.e. RECALLS) as have Glock models
-frame and rails actually feel sturdy, not flimsy (opinion)
-it has a loaded chamber indicator that you can actually see and feel
-it has a striker cocking status indicator that can be seen and felt
-.460 Rowland conversion availible for .45 models. It is not availible for the Glock, which indicates to me that the Glock is a weaker design.
-it has front cocking serrations standard
-it is availible with a SS slide
-it has a finish on the slide that does not feel like a non-stick frying pan
-cocking serrations feel better to me (opinion)

Reasons to go with a Glock:
-slightly lighter and more compact
-mags are cheaper (not counting SA promos)
-you can rebuild the entire gun yourself
-LE/Military promo offers will get you a gun for the same price as an XD
-availible in two more calibers than the XD (.380 and 10mm. XDs were briefly offered in the now defunct .45 GAP)
-slightly lower bore axis
-it has a few 22 LR conversions availible (which some consider to be a moot point, given that they usually cost more than a dedicated .22 LR pistol, but I'm trying to cover all bases)

The next reasons apply only to competition:
-Glock models are availible factory ported and with slide cutouts for competition
-Glock sponsors shooting matches wherein you can only use their guns

I've heard Glock owners say that they don't like the XD because of the grip safety, as though it somehow reaquires the adoption of a new manual of arms. The MOA for both guns is equally simple; pick up the gun and pull the trigger. Only the field stripping is slightly different, and is no more complicated with the XD.

The Glock is not a bad handgun. For me though, there is nothing a Glock can do that an XD can't do better and for less money.

Deanimator
December 4, 2010, 03:50 PM
I've heard Glock owners say that they don't like the XD because of the grip safety, as though it somehow reaquires the adoption of a new manual of arms.
I've had grip safeties on M1911s not be properly depressed in bullseye matches.

I don't need the grip safety, so seeing as how it's not optional, I'll stick with the Glock.

And police surplus 2nd Generation Glocks are MUCH cheaper than new Springfields or Glocks. I don't like finger grooves and won't EVER put a light on a handgun, so I'm getting what I want, cheaper.

John Wayne
December 4, 2010, 04:09 PM
The M1911 is a completely different gun with its own fan club and series of problems. I have never seen an XD not fire because of the grip safety. I don't recall reading about it either.

That's like saying all polymer guns are bad because you owned a Taurus with a polymer frame that cracked on you. It's not an inherent design flaw; the flaw lies in the execution of the deisgn.

Ghosty1
December 4, 2010, 04:20 PM
without having read all the thread and i soon will....
gotta agree with all above. i shot a lot also. XD seemed fine. ballistically, i mean, no diff.
butr i gotta go glock. if you are gonna go tupperware, do it right. XD IS a knockoff.
fine weapon, but a knock off.
however, as i learned, and others have said on this thread. shoot them all.
whichever one "feels" right? theres your gun.
thats how i found the ubitious G17.

Ghosty1
December 4, 2010, 04:22 PM
ubitious...i meant ...yea that word...ill be banned for spelling or loving glocks soon lol
jk

-G

Ghosty1
December 4, 2010, 04:23 PM
south, that is very valid concern, as to pistols.
personally, i hate external safetys. the glock, in that respect is perfect for me.
i train with it often, and its as much instinct now, to not put my finger on the trigger as to not.
that is me. its also why i never carry chambered.
to each his own. carrying a deadly pencil, is a thing that required thought.
my respect to you all.

-G

Mr.Davis
December 4, 2010, 04:40 PM
Reliability is unquestionable. The trigger reset of Glock is very short so you'll be able to shoot multiple times fast. No grip safety to fool around. The tenifer finish and the barrel quality of glock is awesome.

So it's not much hate in Xd i think. There's just so happen that there's a better choice. Because there's Glock.

For me the best handgun in form and function at whatever cost, are custom 1911's and Glock. And history supports.

I suggest easing up on hyperbolic terms like "unquestionable".

There's never been a perfectly reliable machine made. I saw four separate Glocks jam at my last Steel Showdown match, one brand new, all firing factory ammo. Let me assure you, their owners were asking plenty of questions.

possum
December 4, 2010, 05:28 PM
i have an xd service model with over 18,500rds through it, i couldn't be happier with it. It is accurate, and reliable, there is nothing else i could really want and or ask for in a defense handgun.

cracked junior
December 5, 2010, 11:39 AM
i have had my xd45 tactical for over 4 years now. never had a problem with it. only had one round that wouldnt fire. it also wouldnt fire in 2 other 45s. one xd and one taurus 1911.

i have shot over 500 and 800 plus rounds through with no cleaning(2 separate outings to the range). total rounds is over 3,000. recoil spring may need to be replaced as it is easier to pull slide back then a new xd.

a coworker is a die hard 1911 guy. he cant say a good thing about anything else. owns several from kimber, wilson combat to name the ones i know of. until he shot my xd. he now has a xd 40 compact as his conceal carry gun.

i am planning on buying the xd 45 compact for my conceal carry gun.

Deanimator
December 5, 2010, 11:46 AM
The M1911 is a completely different gun with its own fan club and series of problems. I have never seen an XD not fire because of the grip safety. I don't recall reading about it either.

That's like saying all polymer guns are bad because you owned a Taurus with a polymer frame that cracked on you. It's not an inherent design flaw; the flaw lies in the execution of the deisgn.
One MORE time:

I don't need OR want the grip safety. Hence, there's absolutely no reason for me to spend significantly more money to get a gun with one.

The XDs seem to be decent guns. There's just no reason for ME to get one, since it offers ZERO advantage over the Glocks I carry.

I'm not trying to talk anybody out of getting an XD. I'm stating why there's no reason for ME to buy one.

Ky Larry
December 5, 2010, 12:03 PM
Now that all the B.S. and good advise has been posted, just remember :

1. It's your <edit> you are going to be protecting so get what you trust.
2. You may find in the future your needs change. Just because you choose Brand X now doesn't mean you can't change to Brand Y or Z in the future.
3. Opinions are like you-know-whats. Everybody has one.
4. Try to learn the difference between solid, reasonable advise and the blathering of the Gun Shop Commandos.

By becoming a gun owner, you have chosen to take on a very adult responsibility. Good luck.

INMY01TA
December 5, 2010, 01:44 PM
According to M4Carbine.net all the guns I own are junk. :rolleyes: I own 2 XDs and an M&P. The XD45 is my favorite.

possum
December 5, 2010, 04:58 PM
According to M4Carbine.net all the guns I own are junk. I own 2 XDs and an M&P. The XD45 is my favorite.
yeah tell me about it, especially since alot of the big names in the training industry are making the switch and or have been using the m&p's for a while now.

moonman16
December 5, 2010, 05:21 PM
XD'S are fine, XD(M)'S are better. Glocks do not fit my hand at all, but I have not yet tried a Generation 4 Glock.

wbwanzer
December 5, 2010, 07:34 PM
I like my XDm in 9 very much, and have about 1000 rounds through it with zero malfunctions. It's fast becoming a favorite.

sigma 40ve
December 5, 2010, 09:29 PM
FWIW, I currently own several (dozen+)polymer pistols. Glock, S&W, Keltec, SA, and Steyr. I have likes and dislikes among all of them. Of all of them, my old G22 2nd gen LE trade in would be the last to go. Anyway, I would have no issues at all about grabbing any of them in a "need to" situation. My advice is to try out as many as you can before a purchase if you are on a limited budget. Like anything else you can buy a lemon in any brand. I have taken my S&W Sigma 40VE and SA XD 9mmSC on 2 road trips totalling over 14k combined miles. I wouldn't take them if I didn't trust them. IMO you can't find more hate for the Sigma on the internet than any other pistol. I trust mine 100%. It all comes down to shooter/owner preference and experience with an individual/particular pistol. FWIW, my wife outshot me a couple of weeks ago using my SA XD bitone service 9mm. This was after she hadn't shot in about a year after developing a very bad case of the flinches. It was good to see her tear up the 10x ring on the target at 15 yrds using the SA XD9mm. Got her interest back into shooting.

Trent
December 6, 2010, 02:21 AM
I currently own XD's and Smith & Wesson M&P's in 9, 40, and 45. (This is not from overindulgence, I simply still have many handguns left since I closed down my gun shop a year ago).

I've used each major type of pistol in pin shoots / IPSC and I am fastest - by far, with the Glock 21 in major auto and my old Ruger P95DC in minor. The reason for this? Not necessarily weapon design, but familiarity. Each weapon points different. When I point a heavier handgun, I point it like my Glock. When I point a lighter handgun, I point it like my Ruger. I can't consciously control this, so my point of aim is always screwed with other weapons with a similar feel and I end up missing - or worse, having to take longer to consciously line up my sights.

The more I practice with other handguns, the more I find my skills degrade on the first two I'd bought over a decade ago. Sure, there's a few I've found that "point" like my Glock, or my Ruger, but even though my point of aim is true my trigger control sucks because it's unfamiliar. :)

My advice here isn't about which handgun to buy. You said you are a new shooter. So my advice is that whichever one feels good and you end up buying, make it a lifelong choice. Too many people get caught up in the "newest" / "greatest" / "best" ever produced. Or, they end up not happy with that first weapon, and jump from gun, to gun, to gun, and never really get better.

Some people (like me) just like guns, and have too damn many of them. Then their wives tell them to start a gun shop to sell them off, and 3 years later end up with 4x as many as they started with. :)

So.. Instead of spending money buying more, and more, and more weapons, unless you're getting a weapon that fills a new, necessary, and specific "role", spend the money on ammo and (if you have them nearby) training classes.

Eventually, with time, ammo, and practice, that first handgun will feel like it's a part of you, and all others will sort of feel like a glove that don't quite fit right.

Just my .02.

Ghosty1
December 6, 2010, 02:29 AM
that was a little gay there, mr davis lol.
-G

Ghosty1
December 6, 2010, 02:35 AM
trent i love you! um...if you wanna pm me or something...ill try to help unload the inventory. i have to wait for wifes ok though.

as to post, yes. well put.
get what feels good. id add this, im hesitant, cuz its old debate,. but oddly the ppl that own them for the most part dont care.
9mm vs 45
the only folks that really seem to care (again no slam meant to anyone) are those that dont shoot either a nine, or a 45.

i dont really care for the xd personally. it IS a glock knock off, without the goodies of the glock. ive shot them personally. even in .40
if it works for the shooter, better than a glock, then go for it.
but to just nut off cuz you dont like plastic....its kinda not ok....

shoot em, think, shoot em again. decide. be happy. i wont be robbing him either way....

-G

Ghosty1
December 6, 2010, 02:37 AM
that part was to sigma, btw. lol.

you actually only own one polymer....anyway i mean no problems. if you like the XD, sweet.
lets just try to keep misinformation is plentiful. just ask a liberal.

i did not say that, and happy shooting bro.

-G

Ghosty1
December 6, 2010, 02:38 AM
again, missed a few words lol.
yall can finger it out...ill learn to edit...as soon as ikm happyt with my loads lol

-G

Trent
December 6, 2010, 02:46 AM
9mm is FAST to recover and get a second shot on.

45 is BIG.

I can't seem to find both. (And don't say 40 S&W, because I'm not a fan).

FWIW, and not trying to be pretentious here, just putting this out for sake of argument - I hold our club record on 5-pin shoots in Major Auto with a bone-stock Glock 21 @ 3.03 seconds (we shoot from low ready). I can't even come close to that with anything else out there. Yes, the Glock is good, but I don't think it holds THAT big of an edge in speed over everything else (except maybe the H&K USP, aka... "brick slide"...). It's simply triggers. I cannot stand the triggers on an M&P or XD. They feel alien to me.

Not that they are better, or worse, but I've put tens of thousands of rounds down range from Glocks, and under a thousand each with the other pistols. So they feel wrong.

If you buy an XD or M&P and shoot it pretty much exclusively, 10+ years from now you'd say the same thing about all the other guns.

It's all in experience. Get what feels right in your hand and don't look back or second guess yourself.

And... That's all I'm saying. :)

Ghosty1
December 6, 2010, 02:57 AM
agreed mstrat.

i like the bold. go with yuor gut.
and it was also a comp shooter.....

you will always shoot better with what feels right. always. just ask ...him/her lol

i personally dont like sprigfield XD.
that me, i shoot like crap wiht them
if you shoot great...im all behind you.

rock out, with your glock out!
had to say it....

-G

Ghosty1
December 6, 2010, 03:00 AM
agreed trent also.

that pretty much says it all.

get a good gun, one that feels right, and you can trust...after that, its all just preferance.

and dry fire it allot. lol. trent, give me tips....


-G

Trent
December 6, 2010, 03:08 AM
Tips?

1. Buy ammo
2. Shoot ammo
3. Reload ammo
4. Repeat

Find out who's running IPSC or IDPA matches in your area if you've never been to one. I shot handguns for 10 years before I met up with someone and discovered them.

I was pretty damned convinced by then, that I knew how to shoot, and shoot really good.

Boy, was I really, really wrong. Fumbling through my first match was more than a little depressing. Yeah, I could shoot alright - at paper, while not moving, without a timer running. I got my eyes opened up so wide that day, it made me rethink everything I knew about guns from the ground up.

Never assume you know everything, and always listen, watch, and learn new ways to improve yourself.

That's all the advice I can give. :)

Snakum
December 6, 2010, 05:39 AM
Pistols are just tools, opinions are worth what you pay for them, and preferences are just that and not factual evidence of a failing.

Buy what you think feels good, points well, and has a good trigger. Buy a mountain of ammo. Shoot under competent instruction. Repeat.

Personally, I want a pistol that feels/handles and points like an M&P, comes with a stainless slide and has the extra capacity of the XD, has the trigger pull and reset of the Glock 35, and the reliability of Glocks in general.

evan price
December 6, 2010, 06:44 AM
Honestly, I really don't care what a bunch of anonymous bungholes on the internet think. I buy what I like and shoot well and I don't care what name's on the slide. The only people that seem to be h/\t0rz (or whatever the 'leet' types spell it as) are the ones who have an agenda- "The more who agree with us, the more kewl we are!"

As for me and mine, frankly my dear, I could give a- darn.

Autolycus
December 6, 2010, 07:52 AM
I prefer Glock because the company makes parts available to it's customers. I also like the vast aftermarket support as well as Glocks support through GSSF. The XD is a nice gun but it felt strange to me. A friend od mine has one and he likes it a lot. Him and his wife are comfortable with ot but were not with my Glock. There is nothing wrong with the XD series. The people who bashed it were just brand loyalists.

If cost is an option I would get a Glock through GSSF and call it a day. The Glock 19 would be my first choice for an all around gun.

Prosser
December 6, 2010, 09:40 AM
I don't discriminate. I despise ALL over priced, foreign made, plastic pistols with horrible triggers.:cuss::evil:

You want to buy a gun made in Croatia, go right ahead. Glocks, at least to me,
are really 200 dollar pistols, jacked up to 600 dollars, thanks to millions in advertizing, and president Obama, and the old Democrat congress, with Pelosi as the dull point of the spear.

There are so many, far better value options then any of these guns, it's not funny.

I don't know XD designs, or many other plastic pistols well enough to comment on the cost of customizing them to MY liking. If someone gave me a Glock 34 or 35, I would be able to start with a pretty good place, trigger wise, and maybe just adding a new barrel would be all that was required.

I think a Glock, completely tuned and tricked out, is a 500 dollar gun.

From the comments, the XD trigger design doesn't give me warm and fuzzies.

I've shot a Glock 30. It grouped as well as a combat shotgun. The Glock 34, tricked out for race gunning, was hyperaccurate, great trigger, and just flat out neat.

If you want a 45 ACP, for me, I like 1911's, and they come in a variety of
sizes. They also come at price points that are so close to the plastic guns that I've never been able to pull the trigger on a plastic purchase.

Whoops. I just realized the Kahr PM 9 is a plastic pistol.:o If I could buy a Kahr PM45 in our sick state, I'd be giving it long hard consideration.

easyg
December 6, 2010, 12:14 PM
I had this XD45 Tactical for a while, but I was terribly inaccurate with it.
I think it was the trigger-pull.
While it is a single-action pistol, it had a terrible trigger-pull unlike any other single-action pistol I have ever shot.
I really didn't care for the grip safety either.


http://i112.photobucket.com/albums/n165/allenXdog/HPIM6525.jpg

MikePapa1
December 6, 2010, 02:13 PM
I love these types of discussions, you get the partisan's of every stripe. Very amusing.

Let me disclose my bias. I'm a Sig guy. I love them. That being said, I've owned Glocks and sold them all. I don't know what it is, they just didn't feel "right" to me. Never had any trouble of failures, they just never grew on me.

I have two XDs, however, a 9 and a .45. I really like their feel, they're accurate and have functioned flawlessly. The XD9 is my desk gun, the XD45 is in my nightstand. I still carry SIG, but there's nothing wrong, at all, with XDs.

Flipper56
January 6, 2011, 01:03 AM
If it were not for those Glock style triggeres, I would have one myself.....just do not feel right.

theGUNaddict
January 6, 2011, 05:31 AM
I would go to the range and rent both to see what gun you like. I have the glock 30sf and love it.

Fishman777
January 6, 2011, 11:49 AM
let me start by saying that I'm more of a revolver guy, and don't shoot autoloaders as often.

Anyways, I want to like the XD line, but my own limited experience with the XD9 wasn't very positive.

A few years ago, I rented an XD9 with the 4" barrel. I was interested in seeing how easy it would be to limpwrist a few different types of autoloaders. One of the guys at the range suggested that I try the XD. I decided to humor him and I rented the XD. Anyways, I was holding the gun loosely, trying to induce a malfunction. With the XD9, I succeeded before shooting through the first magazine.

It was a failure to feed and round actually got stuck at an awkward angle.
The nose of the round went in at the wrong angle and the round got stuck. For the life of me, I couldn't tell you how this happened. I'm not really that familiar with the XD. It was a rental gun and I was using reloads made by a local "company".

After fumbling with the gun for a little bit, I finally decided that the safest way to remove the round would be to lock the slide back, remove the magazine, and then use something other than my finger to dislodge the round. In total, it took me a few minutes to clear this malfunction. I can't remember if I used a pen or if it was one of the tools that I carried with me in my range bag.

I have no axe to grind with SA, nor do I work in an industry that is even remotely related to guns. I live in Illinois and my family immigrated to the US from the former Yugloslavia. I have every reason to want to support this company.

Anyways, I also shot several other guns that day, with the reloads, and was not able to induce malfunctions in the PX4, 90-two, P226, CZ 75, or the G17.

This experience soured me on autoloaders. I was afraid that my wife might limp wrist an autoloader in a defense situation when I wasn't around. For this reason, I filled my safe with revolvers. It took me about three years before I actually broke down and bought my first centerfire autoloader.

Listen, I don't dislike XDs. For a while, I was actually think of buying an XD45 compact, even after this experience. I've never read anyone else having this specific problem, so I figured that it was a fluke. Still, when I finally decided to buy my first centerfire autoloader, I went with another gun.

I think that most large gun manufacturers make good, reliable guns. I don't think that any guns are perfect, but I don't think that you could go wrong with an XD. For me, I prefer the M&P, and ruger and S&W revolvers.

STL73
January 7, 2011, 12:44 AM
Someone may have already covered this. After market sights are easy, easy, easy to come by....went to my local gunstore, bought meprolights for my xd .40 sub and had it back in my hands in about 15 minutes, still dead on.... I have had that same xd .40 for about 4-5 years now and even though I have aquired other pistols in the meantime, I hang onto it due to the reliability it has proven to me. I also have a service model xd .45 and a Glock 45. Both excellent weapons with absolutely no hiccups, definitely handle different, I think that part of the challenge and fun is mastering different weapon systems. Can't go wrong with either choice, both are excellent guns... I think someone said it best when they said " there is no holy grail of guns".... good luck

STL73
January 7, 2011, 12:50 AM
one last thought....@Prosser, I just recently picked up a Kahr PM45 roughly 4-5 months ago, thoroughly impressed, if you do ever get a chance pick one up, you wont be disappointed....

AOK
January 7, 2011, 01:27 AM
Personally I don't own any XD's but I have shot a few of them and I do like the way they feel in my hand. However, one of the biggest drawbacks for me is the grip safety. I will never carry a gun with a grip safety. In addition, out of M&P's, Glocks, XD's, and HK's I've seen more XD failures during classes when being ran hard than the three others mentioned. While they likely wouldn't be ran that hard in a self defense situation it's enough for me to choose the other three brands. Again, I think they are nice guns, but they aren't my first choice. Different strokes for different folks I guess.

CZ57
January 7, 2011, 01:29 AM
The XDm .45 ACP with a PRP trigger kit w/trigger stop ($100) and a solid stainless guide rod ($25). Bought it in July and totally love it. The trigger is great now and it will feed SWCs that give the XD trouble.;)

JDGray
January 7, 2011, 06:19 AM
Hey everybody I just turned 21 last Friday So naturally I have been deciding on a handgun, well actually for the past year. After very extensive research, shooting etc. I had it narrowed down to the Glock 30, XD 45 compact and the M&P 45 compact. So I decided to go with the XD for various reasons and was planning on ordering it next week. Tonight while doing a little looking around I stumbled across m4carbine.net where there is much hate for the XD line. I am not one to go on a few opinions but they really make me second guess my choice. Is the XD really a bad weapon? I'm not saying at all that it is better than a Glock or M&P but in my opinion it is on par with those models. What do yall think?

All I can tell you is what a local firearms trainer tells everyone, and that is XDs break very fequenly in his classes. May be fine for the recreactional shooter, but put thousands of rounds through it in a class, they dont hold up. He likes the other two mentioned weapons just fine;) Not every XD goes down, but enough for him to not trust them. I have owed a few with no issues to speak of.

skarr
January 7, 2011, 07:03 AM
I share your confusion with people who are quick to call anything trash and not offer reasoning or personal experience. I can tell you I threw a couple mags through a buddy's XD-9 and I like it. The recoil is very manageable, control placement works for me, and it feels like a solid piece of equipment. I'm not crazy about how it sits in my hand, or the 1911 style grip safety. Then again I'm sure my hand is different than yours. Try em before you buy em. Any particular reason why you are going with sub compacts and not just compacts?

White Horseradish
January 7, 2011, 07:46 AM
Is it too late to post this? (language warning)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GBdYBc0BLgQ

Drew78
January 7, 2011, 10:08 AM
I will say this for the opinions you saw on M4Cabrine, there are a NUMBER of guys on that forum, and IN that thread who really, really know what they are talking about when it comes to "service platforms". I would heed some of those posts, but in the end, it is your decision.

Regarding the safety issue, ANY gun is inherintly dangerous. If one needs to rely on a manual safety to feel comfortable with a platform, you need to recheck your gun handleing proceedures. You dont pull the trigger, the gun dosent fire. Simple as that. Mechanical safetys are just that, mechanical, and can fail. This can be a VERY situation when one relys on that safety to safely handle a firearm. Rant off.

Best of luck OP and congrats on the big 21!

-Drew

9mmforMe
January 7, 2011, 12:11 PM
Regarding the safety issue, ANY gun is inherintly dangerous. If one needs to rely on a manual safety to feel comfortable with a platform, you need to recheck your gun handleing proceedures. You dont pull the trigger, the gun dosent fire. Simple as that. Mechanical safetys are just that, mechanical, and can fail. This can be a VERY situation when one relys on that safety to safely handle a firearm. Rant off.

People make mistakes when handling firearms, so why not have a manual safety aside from the "cognitive safety" if he feels he wants one?

KenW.
January 7, 2011, 12:12 PM
As a Deputy Sheriff I had carried 1911s (Colt,and Kimber) since 1995. About a year ago I transitioned to a XD45c, and haven't looked back. I even got a XD9SC for off-duty and extraditions.

I shoot the XD line almost as well as the 1911; but gained increased capacity and durablity. I like the grip angle and pointablity over that of the Glock. Each XD has functioned absolutely flawlessly. They are box-stock except for night sites.

I've fired Glocks, but have only handled M&Ps. I only wish I had bought the XD45 with the thumb safety, but I've gotten used to not having one now.

Drew78
January 7, 2011, 12:26 PM
People make mistakes when handling firearms, so why not have a manual safety aside from the "cognitive safety" if he feels he wants one?
I have no problem with people wanting pistols with manual safties and I really was not positioning that post towards any one individiual. I read something regading safties on one of the pages and it just seems that some people look at a manual safety on a pistol as an "out" to relax thier trigger finger discipline/pistol handleing techniques. To me that is a dangerous combo, can accidents happen with or with out a MS? Absoultly.

For me, and as much as I hate to use the term "tactical", there are many reasons why I dont want ANY kind of MS or mag disconnect near my EDC pistols. I am a fan of snubbies and glocks. But this isnt about brand, heck, I once had an M&P9c with no MS or mag disconnect but unloaded it as I didnt shoot it as well as my Glocks.

Best to all!

9mmforMe
January 7, 2011, 02:12 PM
My P95 has a manual safety and though I'm not in love with it It doesn't faze me at all. I simply train to wipe of the safety everytime the pistol is in my hand; and with the DA trigger on the first pull, I feel very comfortable.

I definitely agree with you, Drew, that someone becoming lax in following safe gun handling procedures, due to the presence of a manual safety, would be unwise. I, like you, don't like magazine disconnectors either.

I've never shot the XD so I can't offer an opinion on its functioning but I don't like the aesthetics at all. Now give me one of their Mil-Spec 1911s and I would be very happy.

HKGuns
January 7, 2011, 04:01 PM
There is nothing and I mean NOTHING ubiquitous about Glock.

Glocks are nothing more than knock offs, so you you don't have much on the XD after all do you? You gotta just love the Glock trolls.

HoosierQ
January 7, 2011, 05:33 PM
Southeast

For quite awhile there, the XD was a gun that you almost never heard a bad word about. CZ same way. Somebody always hates Glock. S&W and Ruger too. But nobody ever said a bad word about XD for a very long time. Rather uncanny really.


Having fired one, I can say it is very nice...a full-sized, regular (not M) .45...very nice gun.

Their compact model is quite a chunk really but the full-sized 5" barrel models are nice.

There is a great deal of parity between these quality firearms today. Glock, XD, S&W, HK, Sig, Beretta...they're all good really even if they appeal to different people.

Drew78
January 7, 2011, 05:58 PM
There is nothing and I mean NOTHING ubiquitous about Glock.

Glocks are nothing more than knock offs, so you you don't have much on the XD after all do you? You gotta just love the Glock trolls.
Sure hope u aren't reffering to me as a glock troll. I am not a fan boy for glock. I have shot lots of platforms and I shoot the glock best. I also like their reliability finish and ease of replacing parts as part of routine maint.

To say a XD is the same as a Glock is ignorant. They maybe the same color on the frame but that's it. I never "urinated" on the XD, it just isn't for me. They sit way too high in my hand.

OP I would suggest either the Glock or Smith M&P line given my experiences...

If you are looking for a troll, perhaps a bit of self examination is in order based on the tone of your post.

roadliner
January 7, 2011, 06:16 PM
Like some of the other guys, I bought my XD before the model with the safety came out. I didn't know if I'd like after carrying 1911's for so long, but I do. Like the grip angle and the accuracy. Don't really know why people hate it, probably the same way they hate Glocks, Taurus, Rugers ect.

Dogguy
January 7, 2011, 06:50 PM
The only thing about the XD I don't like is the grip safety. That's because the grip safety is one of several things about the 1911 I dislike.

But I don't hate the XD and I don't hate the 1911. If you were giving them out, I'd stand in line as long as necessary to get one. But neither of them are on my "wish list" as something I will buy in the future.

"Glocks are nothing more than knock offs...."

I'm sorta havin' difficulty following this. What did Glock knock off from? I mean, I know there was a plastic framed pistol before Gaston came along but I have problems resolving that fact with the "knock off" statement.

By the way...how did it ever get to the point that someone has to diss all other guns just because that person prefers using one type/model/brand of gun. Sorta gives the impression that that someone is insecure in their preferences.

pistolpacker
January 7, 2011, 11:17 PM
I have two XDM's one full-sized in .40 s&w and the other is the new XDM compact 9mm. I absolutely love both of them. I have put just over 5,000rds through the full-sized and about 1000rds through the compact without any kind of problems what so ever from either one. They are a joy to shoot. Handguns mag. did a 20,000 rd torture test on the XD and you can check it out if you go to google and type in XD torture test magazine review. The XD they tested performed flawlessly and got great remarks, i suggest you read the article. Glocks have been around for over 20yrs which has given them a lot longer in the market place to prove themselves and gain a loyal consumer base, plus they are great guns and ultra-reliable. Personally I dont like the handle on the glocks or the grip-angle and the trigger pull stages more than I prefer.
Go XD and you wont regret it.

DenaliPark
January 7, 2011, 11:35 PM
Here is an objective review:

http://www.xdtalk.com/forums/general-sa-xd-xd-m-talk/156561-cutting-through-hype-myths-xd-good-enough-professional-use.html


M
An objective look at a weapon that not one major LEA has any intention of ever adopting, from a fan site? LMAO

M1key
January 8, 2011, 12:02 AM
An objective look at a weapon that not one major LEA has any intention of ever adopting, from a fan site? LMAO

Don't hurt yourself.

This:

http://www.thehighroad.org/showthread.php?t=460059

It's marketing, plain and simple. Smith & Wesson took a page from the Glock marketing book and ran with it. Gaston Glock figured that if he offered all kinds of services that departments weren't used to getting, they would buy his guns. It worked. He flew 5 officers from my department back east and put them through a week long armorer's school, for free. He then offered replacement parts for the guns that were purchased.

Our department's decision to buy the Glock had nothing to do with the quality of the gun, only the back up service and free training that came with them. One particular person in the training division was wowed by it all, and convinced the Sheriff that it was the hot ticket. I could tell many horror stories about our Glock 22's, but that not the subject of this thread.

Smith & Wesson has been sending reps to all the departments, large and small, with a trunk full of guns and all the ammunition the officers want to shoot. He was here about three years ago, and the small department in my town went through about 3,000 rounds of Smith & Wesson's free ammunition, firing every M&P the guy brought. After an all day session, they didn't buy one gun from him, but had a great time. Because I chair a group of retired cops, I was invited to the affair and shot all the S&W M&P's. After it was over, I let everyone shoot my XD 357 Sig Service Model, and they all shot better than they had with any of the M&P's, and most shot better than they do with their issue Glocks.

Springfield is having a hard time keeping up with the civilian demand for the XD as it is. I've talked to the Springfield reps at the SHOT Show and they just can't keep them in stock, so there's no need for them to push the pistol to law enforcement at this time. That may change at some point in the future, but only time will tell.

Hope this helps.

Fred


I am hearing the same from a number of LE agencies today, including our local Border Patrol. They are being overwhelmed by Glock and Smith & Wesson in order to get or keep their contracts. And I guess you would have to include the likes of Clint Smith, Chuck Taylor, and Ken Hackathorn as "fan boys" eh?

M

Dulvarian
January 8, 2011, 12:45 AM
I think I have decided that polymer autoloaders are like now like plastic handled hammers. At first, some were skeptical that a piece of plastic could be as good as a piece of nice hickory or ash. As it turns out, tools are tools. Some like the 12 oz hickory handle ball-peen, some like the 36 oz plastic handled framing hammer. Some will never touch one, because the first hammer invented was xxx, and someone human progress will never move an inch further. :uhoh:

Pick the one that you hit the nail best with. Hammer a bunch of nails. If you find that it doesn't hit the nail like you want it, sell it and get a new one, just like any other tool. Or, you just get a really big rack full of hammers. Either option is fine, I prefer option 2.

The really important thing to remember is: Why you bought the tool. Does the tool carry out that function for you, after enough testing that you feel that you can ignore all of the internet/gun-shop commandos and be comfortable with what is in your hand?

Even a crescent wrench is a better hammer than your forehead.

Use 'em, abuse 'em, take it apart and get to know it. Decide for yourself when it needs work, or when something is off, or there is too much wear. Read the manual. Try out different magazines. Swap guns with your friends at the range.

After some experience with your first gun, you will find that there are things that you like and things that you don't. It isn't a marriage. Pretty much everything on the market for handguns is reliable enough, especially after you test it for yourself. Even the absolute best QA program on the planet could miss a mistake, or a problem could occur during shipping, or whatever.

I can say that my xxx is 100% reliable. Until I cock the the slide during reassembly because I am not paying attention or working too fast. While I personally have never done that, I have seen someone else do it. Your 100% reliable handgun just became a pretty brick. Same thing for untested magazines and/or ammo.

Buy one, enjoy it. By the time you figure out you don't like it, you will be better informed for the next one. Post pictures and ask more questions.

Hanzo581
January 8, 2011, 12:56 AM
All I can tell you is what a local firearms trainer tells everyone, and that is XDs break very fequenly in his classes.

Does Glock give him a special kickback for spouting this nonsense?

Or maybe he just has the worst luck on earth.

Dulvarian
January 8, 2011, 01:13 AM
I must be more of a cynic, but I figure 95% of people at gun stores are full of it, and the other 5% aren't talking. Hanzo, I think I have to agree with you. Most people that work with handguns seem to have a 'divine preference' and everything else is crap.

It would be different if he had a log of each and every failure, with a profile of the shooter, round count on the gun, and ammo load. With pictures and statements from witnesses. That's a case study, and I will at least listen to those without rolling my eyes.

AOK
January 8, 2011, 01:31 AM
"Does Glock give him a special kickback for spouting this nonsense? Or maybe he just has the worst luck on earth."

IF he is talking about who I think he is, he's actually an M&P guy and he's well respected as an instructor (and writes articles for a couple gun magazines) in the firearm industry.

JDGray
January 8, 2011, 04:56 PM
Does Glock give him a special kickback for spouting this nonsense?

Or maybe he just has the worst luck on earth.

He doesn't have the bad luck, the people he sees in his classes do. He's a straight up honest guy, that sees alot of different guns in the course of his training, and knows what works, and what breaks. I do believe Magpul pays him though, not Glock.:rolleyes:


IF he is talking about who I think he is, he's actually an M&P guy and he's well respected as an instructor (and writes articles for a couple gun magazines) in the firearm industry.
Same guy

gman45
February 2, 2011, 12:59 AM
I wanted a 9mm. I shopped the market liked the xd9. Finally got it after my 3 day wait. I took it to the range, the pistol cycled flawlessly, with probably 500 round through it, I couldn't hit a barn with it. I figured out @ 36ft if I aim 14inches right 2inches high I can hit bullseyes all day long. I need to find a gunsmith!!!!

helitack32f1
February 2, 2011, 01:22 AM
Just 2 cents from a Glock fan. Buy what works for you. I know many have said that already but figured I would throw my vote in there. While I love Glocks the only reason I do not own an XDm is lack of money. Same reason I don't own a lot of other pistols too. At this point in the evolution of polymer guns, unless you are purchasing a Hipoint or something worse (like Kel-Tec:neener:), chances are you are not going to go wrong and will love your purchase. If it fits you well, is comfortable and shoots well for YOU that is all that matters, especially if it is the only gun you will be purchasing for quite awhile. Good luck and happy gun buying!

mstrat
February 2, 2011, 01:23 AM
I figured out @ 36ft if I aim 14inches right 2inches high I can hit bullseyes all day long. I need to find a gunsmith!!!!

So you're shooting low and left.

I had the exact same problem with my XDm9. Now bear with me:

In the past, I'd only shot rifles (and MGs, and other service weapons), and an M9/92fs (a big heavy chunk of a pistol).

My first private pistol purchase was a 92FS. I was familiar with it, and liked it. I can hit bullseyes all day with it.

Then later I got an XDm 9mm, and continually shot low and left. Range trip after range trip, same thing. I thought something must be wrong with it. But I was wrong. It was not the pistol. It was me.

Fast forward 4 or 5 range trips later, and I can hit bullseyes all day long with it (with a proper sight picture - i don't aim high and right to compensate). The problem was I've always had sloppy technique, but the weight and chunk of other pistols I've used masked it.

I'm not yet sure exactly what the problem was, but I worked on tackling it from multiple angles:
* Recoil anticipation: Random snap caps in the magazine to prove i was anticipating.
* Trigger control. Practice practice practice at a smooth trigger pull straight backwards.
* Paying attention to my sight picture. When i find myself getting sloppy and not focusing on that front sight, I know it's time to call it a day.

I know exactly the frustration you're feeling, and believe me, I feel your pain. But it will take time, practice, patience (LOTS of patience), and possibly even some instruction.

If you're not sure what the problem is, and can't get it figured out in a few range trips, find a range that has instructors for hire on a one-to-one basis. They can observe you and work with you to figure out what you need to work on.

Trust me. It's 99.99999999% likely the gun is fine. It just takes some training to iron out bad habits.

ekgandj
February 2, 2011, 03:06 AM
Ok I will just put my 2cents. I have owned 2 XD's and loved the both. I just did a trigger job on my 40xdsc and wow did the trigger come around. IMO It is the reason that many people have trouble shooting the xd out if the box. It has a very long trigger pull on it and seems to pull the gun left if you do not have precise trigger control. Oh and parts are easily bought online if you want to tinker with stuff. FYI I like glocks too mainly because of the trigger.


Sent from iPhone using Tapatalk

klash545
February 2, 2011, 04:30 AM
i think it stems from its history....way back when it was imported as the hs2000 and was a good $250 pistol. then springer stamped their name on the side,tweaked it a tiny bit and jacked the price up. plus it has a grip safety that locks the slide if not depressed and a lot of folks hate that.

CZguy
February 2, 2011, 07:09 AM
This chart can help pinpoint the problem for shooting technique.

http://i267.photobucket.com/albums/ii299/badgerone/PistolShootingproblems.gif

chieftain
February 2, 2011, 07:29 AM
I bought a XDm9 shortly after they came out. Like it. put in a hybrid custom trigger and was shooting it for my weekly steel matches.

The magazines of which I have 12, need new springs. Guess what??????

Springfield Armory doesn't stock or offer the replacement magazine springs! Neither does Wolf.

Understand this is unique to the XDm9. Doesn't apply to the 40 or the XD's.

That is why I don't like the XDm. Don't like any unsupported weapons.

Go figure.

Fred

INMY01TA
February 2, 2011, 06:42 PM
I bought a XDm9 shortly after they came out. Like it. put in a hybrid custom trigger and was shooting it for my weekly steel matches.

The magazines of which I have 12, need new springs. Guess what??????

Springfield Armory doesn't stock or offer the replacement magazine springs! Neither does Wolf.

Understand this is unique to the XDm9. Doesn't apply to the 40 or the XD's.

That is why I don't like the XDm. Don't like any unsupported weapons.

Go figure.

Fred
Well you can buy rebuild kits but they cost about as much as a new mag. http://midwestpx.com/product_info.php?cPath=27_73&products_id=328

DenaliPark
February 2, 2011, 07:00 PM
There is nothing and I mean NOTHING ubiquitous about Glock.

Glocks are nothing more than knock offs, so you you don't have much on the XD after all do you? You gotta just love the Glock trolls.
You do understand how ignorant this sounds, don't you? It's one thing to be a fanboy, it's something else entirely when it takes command of your senses...

Fisherdave10
February 3, 2011, 12:19 PM
I'm not sure someone already covered this but I don't have time to read all of the posts, but in my personal opinion:

Their bore axis is higher than the competition, they seem too 'blocky' (totally a personal view), they're made in Croatia as the HS2000, marked as Springfield guns and sold for much more than they should be sold for. Springfield is only an importer.

I'm not saying they're bad guns, I just think it's kind of a ripoff that Springfield brands and names an existing pistol and makes a lot of money doing that.

I do like their reputation for durability and backstrap safety. But that's about it. I'd go with an M&P, an American made gun. (I don't have anything against decent quality foreign made guns. My Great Grandpa even immigrated from Croatia)

Holgersen
February 3, 2011, 02:42 PM
I love my XD. People like to hate stuff for all sorts of reasons. The way they look or the way they feel, or where they're made and what type of round they shoot and that may be very important to you, but when you get right down to it all that really matters is that it's reliable and that you're familiar with it.

walking arsenal
February 3, 2011, 02:55 PM
I own an XD-9 sub compact. I've had it for 6 years and I've lost count of the round count.

in my experience with my model the gun works. It's jammed exactly once with wolf steel cased ammo. Turned out the rim on the case was messed up causing the jam. Bad ammo.

The gun has functioned in temps ranging from -20 F to 95 F
I've dropped the mags in sand at the range and fired the gun.
It's been dusty and fired.
It's fired every brand of ammo flawlessly except for the one bad wolf.

XDs are a fine gun. Excellent in fact. They are just as good as a glock or M&P.

They are better and more reliable than the holy 1911 and AR-15 which only run if you keep them clean and well lubricated but that most shooters seem to just love.

For 500$ buy one and you'll be able to use it for life.

WayBeau
February 15, 2011, 09:05 AM
It may be for other reasons, but I'm pretty sure that Front Sight is using the XD. Can't be too much wrong with it if a shooting school is using it.

JMO

WRGADog
February 15, 2011, 10:34 AM
I find little difference in reliability, accuracy, and overall performance of the pistols. They are all fine handguns that you can depend upon if needed. I have a G26, G19, G30, XD9sc, XD45c, XDm 40, XDm 9, and XDm 9 3.8. Each of the guns has ~1000 rounds through them and they have all performed flawlessly. Personally, I like the trigger and grip safety feature on the Springfields. I keep the XD45c in my nightstand and the XDm 40 in my truck at all times. I sometimes carry the others, however, because of size and weight, I usually carry my Kahr PM9. You will not go wrong with an XD, XDm, or a Glock.

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