Question about sluging


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grubbylabs
December 3, 2010, 11:53 PM
I just put a slug through each end of my springer XD 45 auto and the slug for both end read .449. So my questions are -

1st what sizing die and mold do I need?

2nd have any of you used the Lee sizing dies that go in your regular press, are thy any good?

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billybob44
December 4, 2010, 12:05 AM
I just put a slug through each end of my springer XD 45 auto and the slug for both end read .449. So my questions are -

1st what sizing die and mold do I need?

2nd have any of you used the Lee sizing dies that go in your regular press, are thy any good?
Measure around the outside of the slug/at the widest point. It should be .451-.452". The Lee push through size dies are usually in standard sizes. I think for the .45acp. they offer the .452" diameter. I have sized a lot of bullets with my RCBS LuberSizer, with various diameter lube dies. Just recently I tried the Lee push through die for my .44 slugs. It comes in a .430" diameter. You must tumble lube the cast slugs with Lee Alox before you push through the Lee size die, but it seemed to work OK. I have not shot any of the .44's yet, so I can't tell you if they shoot as well as my RCBS sized/lubed bullets. Hope this helps..Bill..

billybob44
December 4, 2010, 12:09 AM
grubby did you know one of the best bullet suppliers on this forum is in your town?? Check the reloading posts for LongDayJake=RockyMt.Reloading. Jake has shipped a few K of bullets to me in Indiana with complete satisfaction..;)

grubbylabs
December 4, 2010, 12:14 AM
I kinda know him, we met a few times. Jake is a very nice guy. But he moved to Northern Idaho last summer to go to school.

grubbylabs
December 4, 2010, 12:19 AM
Sorry just remeasured and they are .450 on the chamber end and .451 at the muzzle. Thanks

billybob44
December 4, 2010, 12:25 AM
I kinda know him, we met a few times. Jake is a very nice guy. But he moved to Northern Idaho last summer to go to school.
Yea, I haven't ordered from him for awhile. I still have a good stock of jacketed+plated bullets from him. Been mostly casting from wheelweights for most of my range ammo lately. 9MM-.38/.357-.44-.45acp.+.45 Colt.
If you are only casting for 1 or 2 calibers, the Lee push through dies should work just fine. This comes from a 35 year hand loader (Me) that has VERY FEW Lee loading products! Most of my casting tools are RCBS+Lyman. Most of my common handgun loads are assembled on a Dillon RL550, and the rest on an old RCBS RockChucker single stage.

billybob44
December 4, 2010, 12:31 AM
Sorry just remeasured and they are .450 on the chamber end and .451 at the muzzle. Thanks
With that measurement the .452" sizer should do just fine. Depending on your lead alloy, you should use the data in your load manual that is about the middle of the road on speed/pressure. Slowly work up a little until you start to lead your barrel a little, and then back off of your charge .2-.3 of a grain. These should be your best loads for your gun, for range use.

grubbylabs
December 4, 2010, 12:31 AM
I was wondering about the Lee stuff because the reviews for the Lyman luber sizer was very mixed.

I mostly plan to reload for the 45 and a 44 magnum, and if I am lucky I will be casting for a .444 in the future. which I will likely use the same bullet I cast for my 44.

for my 45 I just want a 230 grain LRN and for the 44 I want the heaviest flat nose I can cast without using gas checks.

billybob44
December 4, 2010, 12:42 AM
grubby, I do not shoot/load for a Springfield XD, but I have heard that they can be pretty particular on the loads that they will run well. If I were you, I would stay with a 230Ball type of cast bullet, until you can tweak out your cast loads. I hear that they do not like a SWC bullet style very well.
I have polished the ramps on my Colt Series 80 MK IV and my Kimber so they will take pretty much any load I put through them. I don't think that can be said for the Springer, unless you have done some ramp/recoil spring work?
Like I said, I do NOT know this for sure-just what I have heard on the XD.:uhoh:

billybob44
December 4, 2010, 12:51 AM
I was wondering about the Lee stuff because the reviews for the Lyman luber sizer was very mixed.

I mostly plan to reload for the 45 and a 44 magnum, and if I am lucky I will be casting for a .444 in the future. which I will likely use the same bullet I cast for my 44.

for my 45 I just want a 230 grain LRN and for the 44 I want the heaviest flat nose I can cast without using gas checks.
This is the thing; if you get a Lyman or RCBS lube sizer you ALSO have to get the exact diameter size dies (at about $30.00 each)+the exact top punch for the particular bullet nose design you are using (at about $10.00 each) +you have to buy a wax type of bullet lube, and if you drive them to any speed at all, you need a lube that you will have to heat to flow through the size die. It can total up pretty fast+each bullet diameter/nose design is different. With the Lee push through the whole kit is around $20.00 with one 4oz bottle of Alox to boot.

grubbylabs
December 4, 2010, 12:51 AM
Yup you are right every one I know says don't use a SWC, they only like HP's and RN, so that is what I was going to cast.

I figure if a 230 grain RN was good enough to kill the enemy in WWII then it should be good enough for me.

billybob44
December 4, 2010, 01:02 AM
Sorry grubby I missed answering your starting question. Yes the Lee bullet size dies fit right into your single stage or manual rotating turret type of press. The sizer die screws into the top of your press-they say to any depth-the push through pin snaps into your press ram-where the shell holder normally goes-you tumble lube per instructions, let sit overnight, and just push them through the size die. The red storage box goes on top of the size die to catch the sized/lubed bullets as they come out of the top of the die. It actually works pretty slick==again this comes from a guy that does not like Lee products very well. I will have to say it works, and is cheap..:what:

billybob44
December 4, 2010, 01:19 AM
grubby, if you do not already have your molds yet-a little advise. Again here I go--:uhoh: Your best deal+most productive is the Lee 6 gang mold. The mold sells for about $50.00 and you must also buy the handles separately for about $12.00. Once you get the molds up to temp-2-3 mold fills-they will throw out some keeper bullets, and at 6 at a time, you are not casting bullets all day. I can run out 2-300 in about an hours time, with my RCBS down spout melting pot. If you are going to ladle it in, it will be A LOT slower.:eek: I'm sure Lee has a 230RN-6 gang mold out, and don't forget to get the handles also-they DO NOT come with the 6 pack mold-only the single+double cavity molds.:)
Man, I sure do know a lot about Lee products, for someone who does not use much of it??HA HA...:uhoh:
Check Midway's web site-they have most of what I have mentioned..

grubbylabs
December 4, 2010, 01:34 AM
Do their dies add lube to it, Or are you just getting the tumble lube, also what sizer would I need to buy?

billybob44
December 4, 2010, 11:56 AM
You can re-lube after size, but probably not needed. You should size your .45acp. to .452", and your .44 to .430". Start with these specs. and shoot+check for accuracy/leading.:)

billybob44
December 4, 2010, 12:01 PM
It's your choice, but I keep most all of my cast loads to or below 1000fps. to avoid leading. For me, just not a need to make a fast load with cast bullets. If I want a little hotter, I will go with a plated bullet, if I want a little hotter than that, I go to a jacketed bullet.:uhoh:

243winxb
December 4, 2010, 12:41 PM
Get a lube sizer like a Lyman if you can afford it. The tumble lube is messy. You may need to lube before and after sizing with the Lee die. Size to .452" & .430" I have not tried Alox with a Tumble Lube design bullet. My testing was with XLOX on standard lube groove bullets in 45acp & 44mag. Best used with the 45 and not the 44, unlesss using light target loads. Liquid Alox application

Best results in applying liquid alox are when the alox is heated before applying, or thinned with paint thinner. This makes it flow more easily, and results in a more even coat. One technique is to boil water and pour it into a coffee mug, and then drop the bottle of liquid alox into the mug for about five minutes.

Place your freshly cast bullets into something about the size of a Cool Whip bowl and drop a few drops of liquid Alox on the bullets. Mix the bullets around until they are all coated. Lay the freshly coated bullets on some wax paper to dry. Liquid alox will usually dry enough overnight to reload the next day, depending upon the humidity. Tacky bullets can be dusted with powdered graphite.

If you subscribe to the "more is better" line of thought, your coated bullets may never dry. Don't go for a "golden" color but rather just a light varnish. If you discover that your bullets are sticky the next day, you can get by with using a little less the next time. Keep reducing until the "stickiness" is gone by the next day.

If you are sizing your cast bullets, it is necessary to lube them first. Because the sizer will remove some of the surface of a larger diameter bullet, you may need to re-lubricate the bullets after they have been sized.

Many of our bullets are of the "TL" or Tumble Lube design. These bullets have many shallow grooves that are perfect for allowing Liquid Alox to adhere to a great amount of surface. It has been reported that the accuracy of these bullets is high.

billybob44
December 4, 2010, 01:17 PM
243 is correct. I do lube most of my cast with my RCBS luber-sizer. The only draw back for someone just starting on cast bullets is the $. You can get properly sized cast bullets with the Lee system, it's just slower+more of a mess.
243 have you used the Lyman gas check install tool with your luber-sizer? I just got the little cyl. looking tool, and it says to place under the size die on the press linkage?? How does that help get a .44 gas check on straight?? I haven't tried it yet-just checking with you??:what:

243winxb
December 5, 2010, 10:06 PM
My Lyman 450 is very old. When seating a check on a 30 caliber rifle bullet, i just size normally with the gas check in place. All my pistol bullets are plan base ones.

grubbylabs
December 11, 2010, 12:08 AM
Thanks for all your help Billybob44 and 243winxb I have every thing ordered I think.

At a gun shop I was at in Utah this week I bought:
Lee two cavity mold .452 T/C 230 grain basically a Hollow point profile.
Lee two cavity mold .430 240 grain SWC
Lyman Ladle
Lee 20# bottom pour pot

I ordered from Midway

Lee .452 sizer die
Lee .430 sizer die
Lyman casting book Newest edition 4th or something like that

I think I have every thing I need to get going.

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