Les Baer accuracy


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mattlove444
December 17, 2010, 10:57 PM
I have a Les Baer Concept 5 that has 700 rounds down the tube. Ive been trying to get the accuracy up, and all I am getting is what i can call spray at 15 yards. There are no real groups and Ive tried shooting it from sandbags and offhand. HELP ME!!!:banghead:

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p95
December 17, 2010, 11:07 PM
Matt, get a friend who you know can shoot, go to the range with you and
Both of you shoot the gun. By watching each other shoot, the two of you
should be able to work thru the situation. If NOT call Les Baer.

mattlove444
December 17, 2010, 11:09 PM
Ok. Would the ammo choice make a difference? Im using the same type of ammo that Les Baer uses to test the guns before they leave the factory.

M1key
December 17, 2010, 11:57 PM
The last time I shot a Les Baer (long slide), I was using Winchester White Box 230 fmj. I was putting 5 shots into about 2.5 inches at 25 yards--at night, with the pistol rested on my knees, using headlights of my car to illuminate the target.

Does that help you?

M

robctwo
December 18, 2010, 01:44 AM
It's hard to tell if it's the gun or the shooter. I have a couple Baers and they are both accurate. Some days I shoot them better than others. Have you shot some .22 pistols while shooting the Baer? I know putting some .22 down range gets my sight picture at ignition to be better.

Find someone that can shoot and have them run it through it's paces. If it is accurate, have them give you 5 quick pointers. Grip, stance, finger placement and pull or press, sight picture and follow through.

When I'm shooting well I see a spark of the muzzle flash just before the sights rise with recoil.

There is also a possibility that something is wrong with the gun.

The Wiry Irishman
December 18, 2010, 02:24 AM
With any pistol, not just something of Les Baer quality, blame the shooter before you blame the gun.

Ridgerunner665
December 18, 2010, 03:38 AM
I've tried all the popular brands of ammo in my Baer (a stainless Stinger), except Wolf...and all of them are accurate...some more so than others, but not a single brand could be called anything near "spray".

With my reloads...I can hit Skoal cans at 50 yards, at least 3 times out of 7 rounds. (the misses are me, not the pistol)...and every once in a while I can hit 7 out of 7.

It could be the pistol...even Baer lets a lemon out the door occasionally (they all do).

With that said...its usually the shooter though. Without knowing your experience and ability, and not trying to offend you either...I'd say find somebody who for sure can shoot straight and let them see what they get out of it.

Then you'll know...

schmeky
December 18, 2010, 12:28 PM
To the OP, with all due respect, a LB spraying at 15 yards is highly unlikely. My LB will do around 1.0" @ 25 yards off a sandbag rest. Your's will most likely do the same.

"Loose" and LB do not go togther.

http://img152.imageshack.us/img152/3894/norincoslide099.jpg

The Lone Haranguer
December 18, 2010, 01:48 PM
Short of forgetting to put the rifling in the barrel or something, it is almost inconceivable that the gun has a mechanical problem causing this inaccuracy. If possible, try having a known experienced shooter try it out, have him or her watch you while you shoot, or (this is a little farfetched, but possible) set up a remote camcorder and produce a video of yourself shooting to be analyzed later.

rmw
December 18, 2010, 02:55 PM
I shot a gold cup and a python that that were not rifled from the factory and they would both hit a pie plate at 25 yards

rtn
December 18, 2010, 05:01 PM
The issue is trigger control, not the pistol. Try dummy rounds mixed in with live rounds. When the hammer falls you will likely see that the sights move off the intended target.

mattlove444
December 21, 2010, 11:34 AM
Wow. Thanks for all the advice guys. I'm heading out to the range in the next few days so I'll try some of yalls suggestions.

Drail
December 21, 2010, 12:42 PM
It may be a problem with the pistol but that would be very unusual. The shop I worked at had a Ransom Rest and if we got a customer claiming their gun was inaccurate we would take them out to the range and put it in the rest and have them watch their gun put 50 rounds through one big ragged hole (one inch). Rarely was the gun inaccurate.

Quack
December 22, 2010, 03:35 PM
how is your trigger control?
when you dry fire the gun do the sights (sight picture) move when you pull the trigger?

mattlove444
January 21, 2011, 08:23 PM
I've got some snap caps and been practicing trigger control and the groups haven't tightened up much. I've got some bags so I'm gonna shoot it off of a rest on sunday when I go to the range if the weather holds and it's not too cold.

918v
January 22, 2011, 01:30 PM
"Loose" and LB do not go togther.



Not all Les Baers are perfect.

My TRS had about .05" of horizontal play between the slide and the frame in the front part of the rails with the barrel out of battery. I call that loose. I dunno about you. Funny, I assumed the rails are cut to the same depth throughout their length. They are not. While the back of the slide and frame rails meet with a zero clearance fit when in battery, they do not in the front. Whatever. Mine preferred Federal 230gr FMJ's which shot under 1" at 15 yards off the bench. WWB shot 2-3" at 15 yards.

People need to remember that a tight gun will not shoot tight groups with every single load. Some will shoot better than others. Yes, a LB is fully capable of shooting 3-5" at 25 yards with "book" loads. "Book" loads are not necessarily accurate just because they are in a book or delivered to us in the form of factory ammo.

So, there may very well exist a situation where a tight gun like a LB will shoot on par with a loose gun like a Colt with a particular load. What you do get with a tight gun is an increased likelihood of good accuracy, not good accuracy all the time.

So find a different load. Try Federal AE. Try some 230gr Golden Sabres. I hear they be accurate too.

schmeky
January 22, 2011, 09:01 PM
My TRS had about .05" of horizontal play between the slide and the frame

Do you mean .050" or .005"? The slide/fit has the least affect on overall accuracy. I have never seen a LB that didn't have a properly fit match grade barrel, which are made by Kart, considered the finest in the industry.

That's were the majority of the accuracy is. There is no doubt different loads shoot with varying degrees of accuracy. Wilson Combat's accuracy load for all their 1911's is 5.0 gns of VVN310 pushing a 200 gn H&G LSWC, which is not availabe as a factory loading.

browningpotato
January 22, 2011, 11:58 PM
Yeah it is probably just a piece of junk, you better sell it to me...lol

Baers are great guns, I am sure you will get it straightened out, if not LB will make it right.

Quack
January 23, 2011, 12:18 AM
My TRS had about .05" of horizontal play between the slide and the frame in the front part of the rails with the barrel out of battery.

how is the fit when the barrel is IN battery?

918v
January 23, 2011, 03:08 AM
Everything is tight because the lower lugs push the slide away from the frame when they wedge themselves between the slide stop pin.

918v
January 23, 2011, 03:13 AM
Do you mean .050" or .005"? The slide/fit has the least affect on overall accuracy. I have never seen a LB that didn't have a properly fit match grade barrel, which are made by Kart, considered the finest in the industry.



It has .050" of play. .005" would be almost undetectable.

My Springer Pro has .005" of slop, which is about perfect.

Peter M. Eick
January 23, 2011, 11:59 AM
Even stock Baer's are good for 3" at 50 yrds.

I would suggest a very good cleaning of the gun an then take it to the range and try some known commercial quality target ammo. If you are still seeing the problem get a known good shot to try it.

Still having issues? Call Mr. Baer. I have found that he is quite helpful to his customers.

rellascout
January 23, 2011, 12:13 PM
Have someone else shoot the gun. Someone with some time on a 1911. Ammo should not make a huge difference IMHO @ 15 yards. Some groups might be a little tighter than others depending on ammo but 99% of the time it is the Indian not the arrow which produces spray on a target.

IF they have the same results contact Les Baer and tell them about the issues. They will work with you to make it right.

918v
January 23, 2011, 01:32 PM
A jump from 1" to 3" at 15 yards is a huge difference... and may qualify as "spraying."

schmeky
January 23, 2011, 11:41 PM
918v,

I'd like to know how you are measuring the .050" horizontal play, as well as the frame rail taper you mention.

Mad Magyar
January 23, 2011, 11:46 PM
What this actually means is that for the vast majority of pistoleros, including myself, most pistols, not just L. Baer; will out-perform the person holding it...
No disgrace in that, just a fact....:( I'd venture to say that most problems occur with the trigger jerk.

918v
January 24, 2011, 12:29 AM
I'd like to know how you are measuring the .050" horizontal play, as well as the frame rail taper you mention.

I placed the frame in a vice. I slid the slide onto the frame. I put an indicator on the flat part of the slide at the muzzle and moved the muzzle side to side.

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