ny shall issue


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fisher2
December 20, 2010, 04:33 PM
is there any chance of newyork seeing the shall issue light in the next say 5 years? i mean theres 41(?) states that have low crime rates yet are shall issue now what are tehy chances of the rest of us following

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dogrunner
December 20, 2010, 05:51 PM
Fisher, I hate to tell you this, but the ONLY way you are going to get what you want is to instill FEAR into those politicians that oppose it!

You have a culture of "anti" in N.Y. that's existed since the earliest part of the 20th Century, it has not changed and only you shooters that're also VOTERS can affect it.

Recent decisions, ie: Heller, will have some influence, but the real meat of your problem can only be answered by the various shooting alliances in your state.

Hell's fire, we experienced some flack from that sort of N.Y. thinking when our open carry rights were directly impacted by the likes of Reno, aided in no small part by a confluence of So. Florida legislators with roots in your area............show those types no quarter, organize and push the hell out of a positive agenda and you will see results............if you sit back and wait for somebody else to do you will continue to be disappointed...........Florida is on the cusp of regaining some rights that should never have been lost and several other states have done so as well, Mo. and W.Va. come to mind............damned good lessons from both those locales!!!

TexasRifleman
December 20, 2010, 05:58 PM
Anything is certainly possible, Heller opened doors that we don't even know it opened yet.

That said, if it does happen it will take a lot of work so, moving to Activism Discussion for a bit to see if a discussion starts on how to help it happen. If no discussion starts about how this will probably get closed so, what can be done?

Either way, it's not really a Legal question at the moment.

330d
December 22, 2010, 08:59 AM
is there any chance of newyork seeing the shall issue light in the next say 5 years? i mean theres 41(?) states that have low crime rates yet are shall issue now what are tehy chances of the rest of us following


Yeah, when the city breaks free from the mainland, and we get to vote for what WE as upstaters need. But then again that won't ever happen, they need our tax base to support all of their welfare.

bushmaster1313
December 22, 2010, 01:44 PM
Lawsuit has been filed

Kachalsky et al v. Cacace et al
Assigned to: Judge Cathy Seibel
Cause: 42:1983 Civil Rights Act
Date Filed: 07/15/2010
Jury Demand: Plaintiff
Nature of Suit: 950 Constitutional - State Statute
Jurisdiction: Federal Question

parsimonious_instead
December 22, 2010, 04:40 PM
NYS is actually "shall issue" for its bizarre handgun permits, which are a combination of "permit to own" and technically "full carry with target restriction."
The "may issue" part is "unrestricted carry" the issuance of which is up to a county judge.
Interestingly, carrying "off hours" carries no criminal penalty - you're risking a permit revocation, not jail time or even a fine if you're caught.
In addition, each handgun you purchase gets added to your permit... in effect this is firearm registration.

IT's a horrible, cumbersome system, but it isn't fair to broadly call it "may issue."

whalerman
December 22, 2010, 08:00 PM
I don't believe we will ever see change in the gun laws of NY state. There are many reasons for this, media bias, the weakness and one sided teachings of our schools among them. But I ask you to look at one issue in particular. Consider who is left here in the Empire State. Other than our army of civil servants and welfare queens, we have a population that is very comfortable with government controlling their lives. They are not motivated, they are not optimistic people, and their prime purpose is to exist until the third of the month when their check for elbowitiss or ADHD arrives. Our optimistic youth, the ones with energy and motivation, moved out. If you get back to the gun issue, a thinking person understands it really isn't a gun issue, it is a freedom issue. Lazy, unmotivated people don't care much about freedom. NY is what it is. It will likely remain what it is. We have lost so many good people. And the growth of big government has been making it happen for two generations. You can't chase away the best for 50 years without paying a price. I grew up here, and I returned to take care of family towards the end of their lives. But I would in no way wish it upon a young person just starting out in the world. It is beautiful country, but not a beautiful government. We did it to ourselves.

X-Rap
December 22, 2010, 11:31 PM
I have been to NYS 3 times and find it a beautiful place, that said my only connection left Ft Drum on the 15th so unless they get their gun laws straightened out I will visit MN. instead. I think the rural NY is the same as the rest of the world only with bigger gov. I don't see that changing but if I were a res. some of the counties are pretty gun friendly.

wuluf
December 23, 2010, 01:15 AM
I live in Sacramento CA. I never thought I'd get a permit, but the lawyers have been busy, post-Heller. SAF and Calguns sued the local Sheriff's Dept. over may-issue irregularities. The Dept. settled, and Sacramento County is now effectively shall issue. I applied in October and my permit arrived yesterday.

Never say never....

M&P
December 23, 2010, 01:27 AM
Hi Everyone - I'm new here. I just got my pistol permit a few weeks ago. It took over 11 months, but i knew it would eventually happen, and it's for unrestricted concealed carry. It was the longest 11 months and 6 days of my life.

Siberious
December 23, 2010, 08:34 AM
You have a culture of "anti" in N.Y. that's existed since the earliest part of the 20th Century, it has not changed and only you shooters that're also VOTERS can affect it.

This is such a bogus statement that it has *FAIL* written in huge letters.

It was NOT a culture of anti since the early 20th...it was the corruption of the Tamminy Hall Politicians in Manhattan. See, back then, politics were still dominated by those of Irish decent. The influx of Italian immigrants in the early 1900's was an issue of consternation because the Italian crime underground was competing for the same turf and business of the Irish crime underground.

So Timothy Sullivan, who was a Ward Leader during the Tamminy Hall Corruption (he later went on to serve one term in the US House of Representatives) and was also a State Senator, proposed a bill in the State Legislature which was passed and became known as the Sullivan Act, which set up the current system of handgun control and registration that we still have to this day in NY.

Tim Sullivan was as corrupt a politician as they came, controlling the Irish mob, illegal prize fights, horse racing, running illegal casino's, and fixing election results for the area of 14th street and below, which was his ward district.

The Sullivan Act, a state law that required a permit to carry or own a concealed weapon, became law on May 29, 1911. However, with many residents unable to afford the $3 registration fee issued by the corrupt New York Police Department (which was also under the political control of Sullivan) it guaranteed that Sullivans bodyguards could be legally armed while using the law against their political opponents, because his political opponents (who were also corrupt and who also ran their own crime syndicates, albeit on a smaller scale) didn't have the political clout to overrule those who Sullivan would dictate would be allowed to own handguns.

The current NY Law was nothing more than a corrupt political maneuver by a corrupt turn-of-the-century Irish politician to consolidate and maintain control over corrupt turn-of-the-century Italian politicians. In short, it was all about a turf war, criminal activity, and who was going to CONTROL the criminal activity.

What is sad is that this is well known, has been proven and revealed during the corruption trials of the Tamminy Hall politicians, (Sullivan contracted syphilis shortly after the Sullivan Act became law, and died a few years afterwards, not from the disease but from a crime syndicate hit job) but the NY Courts still refused to strike down the Sullivan Act due to the still widespread corruption, and the new powerbrokers stepping up and using the law to *their* advantage by keeping *their* political opponents disarmed, so as to maintain *their* cash flow from *their* criminal activities.

And with current-day control over Manhattan by corrupt politicians who want to make sure that *they* are the ones who control the guns, do you really think that the NYS Legislature is going to repeal a law that is about to celebrate its 100th birthday?

They say that the ones who control the guns, control the people. Well, thats EXACTLY what happened in NY, and continues to this day.

So no...we don't have *antis*...we have a corrupt Legislature (NY City is so heavily populated that they send more reps to the State House than the rest of NY State COMBINED, so the Five Boroughs essentially control THE WHOLE FRAPPING STATE) that wants to maintain control of their little Kingdom called New York. As long as the City Dwellers keep electing the same corrupt politicians, nothing is going to change, and they'll be damned if a Supreme Court is going to give the peasants and peons their freedoms back.

Siberious
Stuck in the Upstate Hinterlands of NY

Xfire68
December 23, 2010, 09:28 AM
This is true of IL. as well. Chicago being of it's populous has control over the entire State.

The past Gubernatorial election was won by the corrupt county of Cook alone!

philpost
December 23, 2010, 10:49 AM
Although I had been interested in firearms for a long time, it was only after I moved to Florida from NYC, that I could really pursue my interests. For instance, because I was arrested once in my life in 1987, and recieved a violation (disorderly conduct, college party on Amtrak property after hours, $50 fine), I would have had to get a record of the proceedings from Bronx county courthouse and deliver them to a police station in Queens to own a .22 rifle. And then MAYBE get approved. However, criminals have no problems at all arming themselves.

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