Should I get a Muzzle brake for my 300 Win Mag


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General Lee
December 27, 2010, 07:59 PM
I recently started to upgrade my remington 700 300 win mag. I got a Bell and Carlson stock and I have a Krieger barrel on the way. The gun is going to be heavy so I am wondering if the muzzle brake is worth it.

Pros: less recoil, less rise

Cons: Loud as hell. somewhat hard to clean.

Ideas / Input please!!

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usmarine0352_2005
December 27, 2010, 08:36 PM
Try this, Gentry's Quiet Muzzlebreak. I have one and love it.


http://www.gentrycustom.com/pages/products.html



If you are only using it for hunting I wouldn't get one. I'd use a PAST shoulder pad for sighting in and leave it at that.



If you are going to shoot it a lot then a muzzlebreak wouldn't be a bad idea.


.

sappyg
December 27, 2010, 09:04 PM
no muzzle break. too loud.
i'm glad they are out of vogue now.

JDMorris
December 27, 2010, 09:08 PM
Don't do anything until you shoot it.

General Lee
December 27, 2010, 09:12 PM
I plan on shooting a lot with it. I mostly do benchrest, but I do plan on taking down some game with it in the future.

JDMorris
December 27, 2010, 09:14 PM
Shoot it to tell if it kicks too bad, If it doesn't you won't need a muzzle brake.
If it's bad you do.

sappyg
December 27, 2010, 09:20 PM
recoil bothers you too much Lee? it does me.

General Lee
December 27, 2010, 09:55 PM
The recoil doesn't bother me as much as the loss of sight picture. The main reason I am looking for ideas on both now is I am having a guy machine the barrel for me and I would assume it would be a lot easier / cheaper to get both ends done at once if i were to get the brake put on.

redbeardsong
December 27, 2010, 09:58 PM
A friend of mine was going to get a muzzle brake for his 300 win mag, but ended up going with a suppressor instead. It helps with the recoil and quiets it down.

Freedom_fighter_in_IL
December 27, 2010, 10:47 PM
Well Lee, If you don't mind getting cussed at at the range and if recoil really bugs you, then get one. But be ready for some serious meltdowns from anyone else at the range with you. A MB on a 300wm is LOUD. Even those new "quieter" ones are still too loud for my taste. I have seen several range bosses send people away for having them on. Granted they are nice and all for staying on target but not really worth the hassle to me personally.

JDMorris
December 27, 2010, 10:49 PM
Even if you have a muzzle brake on a .300 wm you wont be staying on target like a .223 can, it will probably be like a .308 win that still jumps you off target.

Geno
December 27, 2010, 10:55 PM
I just bolted my Weatherby Mark V .300 Win Mag into a new B&C stock. The recoil pad on the B&C does a great job of taming recoil. I had considered getting a muzzle break on mine, but it no longer needs one. And for what it's worth, I am pushing my 165 grain reloads about as fast as powder can burn...we're talking two-times compressed loads. :evil: Try it in the new B&C stock first.

Regarding what Freedom_fighter_in_IL said of muzzle break noise, that advice is as accurate as can be. They can also tend to kick up a bit of dust and such even at a bench rest height. Finally, if you look into the muzzle break data, it reduces recoil far more with heavy bullets (200 grains) than it does light bullets (150 grains).

Geno

LoonWulf
December 27, 2010, 11:08 PM
I would also suggest shooting the gun before adding a muzzel brake. If you have a heavy barrel coming in and a total gun weight in the range of around 12lbs, your not going to get smacked overly hard. My .300 runs at just under 9lbs scoped and loaded, and i dont think its a horrible kicking gun. I WILL stop shooting it every 5 rounds and shoot something else...mostly for the gun, but also to give myself a break and get my game face square again. If you let your barrel cool all the way, which i dont. You should be able to get by shooting it round after round for a while. No mater what you do, you WILL lose sight picture firing that large a round. Also muzzel brake will soften the blow, but it will also kick everything up of ground and if your shooting from a long bench off the bench also. A top ported conpensator might help some, but again, you suffer noise pollution.

Acera
December 27, 2010, 11:24 PM
I've got them on both my 300's, it helps tame the recoil. I have never seen, or heard from anyone I know of have an issue at a range with the noise. (but I guess some people are sensitive) It's a rifle range for %$##^s sake, the guns make noise. If it bothers you, use plugs and muffs for your range time. I tend to choose benches away from other folks out of courtesy, no matter what I am shooting.

coug
December 27, 2010, 11:27 PM
I like the 300wm. if you reload try RL-25 or retumbo my favorite powder in the 300wm is RL-22 but if you try some just a bit slower your rifle will quite kicking you and start shoving you. this will work very well if you have a 26 inch or longer barrel. this has been my experience you may also want to try H-1000. A lot of guys don't realise you can change the way your rifle recoils with just powder change.

Freedom_fighter_in_IL
December 27, 2010, 11:32 PM
I've got them on both my 300's, it helps tame the recoil. I have never seen, or heard from anyone I know of have an issue at a range with the noise. (but I guess some people are sensitive) It's a rifle range for %$##^s sake, the guns make noise. If it bothers you, use plugs and muffs for your range time. I tend to choose benches away from other folks out of courtesy, no matter what I am shooting.

Sorry there Acera, but I shouldn't HAVE to DOUBLE up my hearing protection for YOUR shoulder comfort. I have seen a guy get his eardrum blown completely out because they were sitting next to a guy at the range with a muzzle brake on rifle with only muffs on and was not warned. There are a LOT of public ranges around nowadays that will not even allow them on the range. Yes guns make noise but how much should be considered TOO much? Sorry but when adequate hearing protection is used and you STILL get a drum blown, I have to draw the line there.

sappyg
December 27, 2010, 11:33 PM
save yourselfs some money and forget the muzzle break. i loose sight picture with my 243.
if the recoil is too much for you Lee then maybe you should look at other calibers.

TonyAngel
December 27, 2010, 11:35 PM
I shot a savage in the same caliber not too long ago. It had a muzzle brake on it. I was impressed by how well it worked. I don't think I'd go for one on a hunting rifle, but for the range, if you want to shoot a LOT, it turned the 300 win mag into a very managable shooter. It kicked less than my .308. The down side is that you'll be burning up barrels.

sappyg
December 27, 2010, 11:41 PM
real men don't need muzzle breaks.

General Lee
December 28, 2010, 12:42 AM
lol... It is not like I need training wheels for my gun. The reason I want a muzzle brake is as listed above to help sight picture and on target time. I am no small dude and to those who made all the real man comments.. well you know where to stick it.

I have already put a Bell and Carlson fully adjustable tactical stock on the gun and I am waiting on a Krieger #10 MTU barrel (10 week wait if anyone is interested in that information). I think I will wait to get it put on after reading some helpful posts and considering it some more myself.

Thanks for the input!

Acera
December 28, 2010, 10:01 AM
There are a LOT of public ranges around nowadays that will not even allow them on the range.

Well that is probably IL. Not here in Texas. We don't seem to be that overly sensitive. I have one on my 50 also. Sappyg have fun with one of those that does not have one on it:uhoh:.

I did not mean to imply that others around you should be use double protection, that is their personal choice. I have never been harassed by anyone over them. Maybe it's a regional thing? I do notice that where you tend to live in this country determines a lot of unusual customs regarding this sport. That may be part of this. Maybe down here in the south we just don't get as worked up over such minor things.

sappyg
December 28, 2010, 10:13 AM
truthfully i don't have the guts to fire a 50 cal w/o a break on it.

@ lee, you know i was just kidding right :D

david58
December 28, 2010, 11:25 AM
Well that is probably IL. Not here in Texas. We don't seem to be that overly sensitive. I have one on my 50 also. Sappyg have fun with one of those that does not have one on it:uhoh:.

I did not mean to imply that others around you should be use double protection, that is their personal choice. I have never been harassed by anyone over them. Maybe it's a regional thing? I do notice that where you tend to live in this country determines a lot of unusual customs regarding this sport. That may be part of this. Maybe down here in the south we just don't get as worked up over such minor things.
Used to live in Texas, and shot at a range near Fort Worth. Design of the range made noise worse, the 300's with brakes made it miserable with doubled-up hearing protection. I stopped shooting there - seemed every time I showed up to shoot, somebody had one of those cussed things.

Living in Oregon, I simply don't know anyone that uses a rifle with a MB. That includes all of my elk hunting friends (I use an -06). I don't know anyone that is afraid to admit that a 300 isn't a bench gun, either - darned things hurt, as do most centerfire hunting caliber rifles. I'd suppose that if you brought one to the range where I'm at, you'd be asked to shoot waaay down at the other end of the bench.

As to a regional thing - I don't know. Being a born Southerner, I think we'd say we were less likely to get worked up being asked to not bring the MB to the range in consideration of others, than to say we'd just sit there and get jangled about. At the same time, I'm surrounded by folks that don't step up to the big magnums to hunt elk, mule deer, bear, and even moose. To each his own - I've had my shoulder surgery, and certainly never want another.

longsman
December 28, 2010, 12:06 PM
It might be worth trying a silencer. Most silencers reduce recoil in the same way muzzles do. Additionally silencer will suppress muzzle flash and it will help save your eardrums.

If you look on the Zack Smith's site, they do some mighty silencers for tactical rifles, they seem well made, although they are quite pricey.

Only thing you have to watch with silencers is Point Of Impact shift. But if you hang around verious forums, like SnipersHide, 6mmBR or even here, you'll definitelly find people who tried them and can tell you weather silencer keeps constant POI.

Freedom_fighter_in_IL
December 28, 2010, 12:22 PM
Well Acera, being that I am born and bred southern through and through, I would have to say you are incorrect about your assumption. I personally do not feel that hearing is a MINOR thing either. Having lost most of mine in my left ear from too many times without hearing protection has kind of taught me my lesson. Maybe one day that lesson will be taught to you as well.

And as far as ranges not allowing them, I have seen it in Tennessee, Alabama, Georgia, Pennsylvania, Maryland, and several other states where they went so far as to POST "Weapons with muzzle breaks not allowed".

david58
December 28, 2010, 01:49 PM
We have to remember that Texas "South" is different from "South" South. :D

coug
December 28, 2010, 02:05 PM
is the manhood of southern men the topic? just kidding, just shoot it when you get it back and if you don't like it..... put the break on it..

Acera
December 28, 2010, 03:27 PM
Freedom_fighter_in_IL I understand what you are saying. It seems "too dangerous" for some to even play a football game this past weekend.:rolleyes:
This is just another example of the wussification of America. Oh no, that big bad gun is too loud, cry, whine, complain, moan. If you don't like it, move 1 table down. Be a man, and grow a pair.

The last time I had my hearing tested it was good, and above average for my age. I guess I had the forethought and intelligence to take care of my hearing, I pity others who were not so smart, but that is not my problem. (ex 11 series in the Army, and Const. Mgmt. working career. So I have been around noise all my adult life.)

I go out of my way to put distance between myself when I shoot and others. But sometimes that is not possible. Good thing we don't shoot at the same place.

sappyg
December 28, 2010, 04:41 PM
Acera,
i really take issue with what you are saying. most people don't like the noise of a breaked rifle. enjoying the noise does not make you a man and i think it has very little to do with your region. i am a southerner and honestly i find the use of breaks somewhat rude. for me, using one on a public range is disrespectful to say the very least.
frankly, telling others to 'grow a pair' expresses that exact sentiment. one could also gather that using that logic the use of a break is not needed... cause you're a man... and you've got a pair... you know ;)

Freedom_fighter_in_IL
December 28, 2010, 05:10 PM
It's ok sapppyg, I know I have a pair. I have a little sweetheart that would send Acera crying home to mommy looking for "his pair" in a Ruger #1 chambered in 450ne that I do not feel the need for a brake as well as a couple of 300wm's. Hell one of my .444 marlins has a ported barrel and I don't take it to public ranges because it is too dern loud.

As to the OP, I understand what you are asking and to answer honestly, a brake is not going to take a whole lot of muzzle rise out. Not out of the .300wm anyway. Unless your weapon is pretty heavy, you will still come off paper. The .300wm I am about to start a build on will be between 14 to 22 pounds (still haven't decided which barrel length I will go for yet is why the weight variance). If I go for a 24 inch heavy barrel it will reduce a pretty good bit of muzzle rise and a brake with an upward output would probably stand it off pretty well but I won't put one on it in the event that I wont be alone on the range that I will be shooting at. But I am building it for ridiculously long range gong banging and not for paper.

dubbleA
December 28, 2010, 06:16 PM
To each their own, it's a personal preference. If you want to brake your rifle, go for it......if you dont well then dont.

I just ordered a brake for my 17 lb .223 and didnt feel the need to get anyone on the internet's approval. I am blessed with my own private indoor/outdoor range so as not to offend anyone else.

Fuego
December 28, 2010, 09:16 PM
Forget the brake. And it is a brake, not a break.

If the recoil of the .300 Win Mag is too much for you, then adjust your handloads down into the "pleasant" range.

I shoot a Remington 700 in .300 Win Mag, sighted in for full power hunting loads. When I am doing recreational shooting or teaching someone to shoot, I dial the scope down a few clicks to get the softer loads to point of aim.

I am old. My guns are old. My powder is old. I do not enjoy a day at the range that leaves me with a sore shoulder and cheek for a week.

sappyg
December 28, 2010, 09:25 PM
'brake' it is. you are correct fuego. i suck at spelling almost as much as i suck at shooting :D

ritepath
December 28, 2010, 09:27 PM
Most magnums are too loud already, adding a muzzle brake only makes it worse. A muzzle brake on anything is like having those coffee can noise maker mufflers on cars.

General Lee
December 28, 2010, 09:31 PM
I am aware it's personal preference and obviously in the end I have to make up my own mind. I was under the impression forums were to talk about things with other people who may have already done what you are talking about and get feedback. That is my main goal.....

I never knew a muzzle brake discussion could bring about so much flaming!! I hope this is just due to the cold weather and people not taking out their aggression on their targets.

9X23WIN
December 28, 2010, 09:40 PM
Since you are installing a new barrel and have concerns, I would at least have the barrel threaded for a muzzle brake. Add a brake when you need it or place a thread protector when there is no brake present. Don't worry about the naysayers on the net. It's your gun, shoulder, enjoyment and money. :p

JDMorris
December 28, 2010, 10:13 PM
The only thing I really fire without ear protection, is a .22 rifle with shorts..
I have fired other things.. 9mm's, .22 mags, .22 lr pistol, and a 12 guage once..
I never do it more than once to say the least, and It's only to shoot at a critter, snakes, rabbit, squirrels..
I have never fired a shot while hunting with my .308 cause I have only been once and I didn't shoot a deer..
But I don't think I want a brake on my .308, My hunting partner uses a 700 VTR with a brake that's very loud.
I don't like brakes to say the least..

Freedom_fighter_in_IL
December 28, 2010, 10:21 PM
On a side note (and to get back more to the point) if you do decide to go with getting one threaded, make sure you have someone that is VERY good do the thread cut and crowning. Some have said that a brake will screw your precision up. I feel if it is properly aligned and you have had your barrel work done correctly it shouldn't affect your accuracy but it may very well change POI a bit.

Also, most DEFINITELY take it off if you plan to go hunting with it. A braked .300wm will make your ears bleed without hearing protection. And those hearing protectors that allow you to hear are NOT enough trust me on that. Not with them. Get a matched thread protector made and go shoot it a bit before you go hunt because more than likely POI will change a bit.

9X23WIN
December 28, 2010, 10:40 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=evr_tP9cJWY&feature=mfu_in_order&list=UL

sappyg
December 28, 2010, 10:56 PM
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wqgSSAh8Cqs

Freedom_fighter_in_IL
December 28, 2010, 11:05 PM
LMAO those 2 have to be my FAVORITES!

double bogey
December 28, 2010, 11:05 PM
I have one that looks similar to the one pictured. To me it is not that effective with smaller bullets. It also seems to slap me in the face occasionally. However, it works very well with 200 gr. and up bullets. Way soft recoil, like a .243. I personally only shoot it now with larger bullets, thats where the .300 winmag shines anyway. If I need smaller bullets, I use my 7mm Rem mag. Whatever load I shoot in 7, it doesn't recoil that bad. If you plan to shoot a lot, get the brake, but if you use small bullets, I think you will be dissapointed.

sappyg
December 28, 2010, 11:09 PM
one more and i'm done:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CbnMws6973k

Freedom_fighter_in_IL
December 28, 2010, 11:13 PM
LMMMMMMMMMMMMAAAAAAAOOOOOOOOOOOO, I hadn't seen that one. GOOD one sappyg!

Skylerbone
December 29, 2010, 12:13 AM
Seems the blood is out of the water now? Well we'll see. My father turned 63 today. He bought his first 300 Win. Mag. this past year in the form of a barrel for his Encore Pro Hunter. The rifle is lightweight, has an Energy Burner stock and a Simms recoil pad. He opted for a Brockman Brake as he has had surgery, injections and arthritis after ~40 years of military/LEO service. The Brockman is loud but it can be closed with a simple twist and the noise level goes down (and the recoil goes up).

It makes for a great compromise; a controllable magnum that can be used for extended range sessions and a hunting rifle that doesn't deafen anyone when that once in a lifetime shot presents itself.

The old man managed to squeeze off 60 rounds in one sitting last month and still went to the gym later that day without any pain or bruising. It has given him a new lease to shoot larger centerfire calibers for the forseeable future.

Courtesy should always be the rule at any range whether speaking of shooting with a brake or not chatting with the next gent in the middle of shooting his groups.

Tomcat47
December 29, 2010, 12:20 AM
I cut the muzzle brake off the end of my S&W Howa .300 Mag. and had it re crowned.

Hated it............:fire:

In Low light it was like looking at the sun through a scope and it was so loud it would knock your equilibrium off! LOL

I chose Sight and Hearing over my shoulder disliking recoil!

Loved that rifle after that!

biggameballs
December 29, 2010, 12:27 AM
If you need a break to shoot it dont buy it. Everyone loves those magnums! They really lay the smack down on those paper targets you know.

When I see a guy with a MB on his magnum at the range I cant help but think "D Bag"

sappyg
December 29, 2010, 12:58 AM
this would make a good sig:

"Courtesy should always be the rule at any range."

i may swipe this one skylerbone.

S... i said i was done :evil:

Skylerbone
December 29, 2010, 11:19 AM
In all fairness to my "D Bag" dad, he's getting ready for our moose trip next November thus the .300 was a purpose driven purchase. He's wanted to hunt one since the '60s when he was stationed in Alaska (he enlisted on his 17th birthday). I'll cut him slack for the brake at this juncture.

As for range etiquette, we belong to a private club. I try to bring extra ear plugs for anyone who needs them and chamber flags for those who forget them. I'd guess I've gone through a dozen of each this year alone, asking only that they be used.

HKGuns
December 29, 2010, 11:23 AM
I've got them on both my 300's, it helps tame the recoil. I have never seen, or heard from anyone I know of have an issue at a range with the noise. (but I guess some people are sensitive) It's a rifle range for %$##^s sake, the guns make noise. If it bothers you, use plugs and muffs for your range time. I tend to choose benches away from other folks out of courtesy, no matter what I am shooting.

Well sir, you probably just ran into someone like me who didn't say anything to you but you absolutely ruined my day of shooting. I shouldn't be flinching when I shoot my weapon, let alone when you shoot yours. How about buying a .308 and live with the recoil? Or, as suggested further up in the thread, start rolling your own and improve the recoil by changing the powder?

As IL said, I shouldn't have to pay for your shoulder comfort when at the range.

Edited to add: Get out to the range and shoot. That will do more for your accuracy than any upgrades you can make. A fancy barrel, stock and muzzle break won't fix the most critical component of accuracy. -Your skills at sending lead down range.

My deer rifle is more accurate than I am without any upgrades.

Tomcat47
December 29, 2010, 07:12 PM
Thats cool to take extra plugs to pass around!

And seeing that your dad is going to hunt with it......I see the reason to stay away from the saw! :D

They do tame the recoil!

Skylerbone
December 29, 2010, 09:10 PM
The chamber flags are the biggie as they're required but more than once I've seen people with guests milling about and whispering. It doesn't take much to figure out they don't have enough to go around. I'd sooner provide them than take a chance with safety or with a potential member being told it's OK so long as no one else is around.

I've been given more help over the years than I've repaid and for that I owe. Same here for good advice, I just wish I had more to offer and sometimes wonder if certain members were born with a rifle in one hand and an engineering degree in the other. Were I not so opinionated I would read much more and post much less.

Forgot to add on that Brockman brake that closing it returned the rifle's report back to a saner level and that the chronograph (we tried 2) didn't care if it was opened or closed, the ammo matched factory specs both ways (no loss of velocity).

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