Tactical/CCW clothing questions (Royal Robins and Wilderness belt)

[Kharn]

My somewhat-anti parents decided the world wouldnt end if they got me a Wilderness Instructor's belt (1 1/2", polymer lined) and a pair of Royal Robbins 5.11 Tactical pants for Christmas (amoung other goodies, most of which I can put to use for gun-related activites, like the Craftsman toolbag that is gonna be my new range bag). Now I've got a few questions, as I'm a total newbie to Skunkabilly-approved clothing:

For the belt, which way should the V on the V-ring be pointing? Normally I wear my belt so the end points to my left, but with this belt the end reverses back. The V pointing to the left (so the tab points back to my right) seems to be working out, but I wasnt sure if there was a "correct" way to wear it.

For the Royal Robins, what is that utility strap above the right pocket used for? So far, the only use I've found is to clip the carbineer on my keyring to it. Is it supposed to be a drag handle or something?

Kharn

[Skunkabilly]

My somewhat-anti parents decided the world wouldnt end if they got me a Wilderness Instructor's belt (1 1/2", polymer lined) and a pair of Royal Robbins 5.11 Tactical pants for Christmas (amoung other goodies, most of which I can put to use for gun-related activites, like the Craftsman toolbag that is gonna be my new range bag). Now I've got a few questions, as I'm a total newbie to Skunkabilly-approved clothing:

I have the polymer lined belt. I wish I got the 5-stitch instead, the sucker is THICK, but I have the 1.75" which makes it a tight fit through belt loops, you should be okay with 1.5". I just got the 1.25" ring belt and golly it's cuuuute :)

For the belt, which way should the V on the V-ring be pointing? Normally I wear my belt so the end points to my left, but with this belt the end reverses back. The V pointing to the left (so the tab points back to my right) seems to be working out, but I wasnt sure if there was a "correct" way to wear it.

As far as I know, you're doing it the right way. The V points to your support side and your shooting side gets the extra belt. What I don't like about the polymer insert belt is it makes the belt thicker which may keep you from attaching stuff to your belt between your midline and 3:00, depending on how long your belt runs. The nice thing about it looping back that way is if you need to put more mags on, you can put them way up to your 11:00--with regular belts, you have the end of the belt hanging there which takes up valuable real estate.

For the Royal Robins, what is that utility strap above the right pocket used for? So far, the only use I've found is to clip the carbineer on my keyring to it. Is it supposed to be a drag handle or something?


It's for rock climbing stuff I guess, but supposedly it's handy for keeping the muzzle of your OWB piece tight to your butt so it doesn't stick out when you bend over. But if you're carrying, you shouldn't be bending over anyway--you should be squatting. Drag handle, lol. MAN DOWN MAN DOWN :D

[Kharn]

I did say I was a tactical-clothing newbie. :)
The rock-climbing gear explanation seems to make sense, my sophomore-year roommate was a hardcore climber (so much so that he failed at least one class because he went climbing instead of studying), and always wore stuff similar to Royal Robbins (if not Royal Robbins themself).

Kharn

[Skunkabilly]

Yeah, but does he have Oakley gloves with carbon fiber knuckles? :neener:

[Kharn]

Nah, he called guys with all the high-tech extra safety gear a bunch of p***ies. But then, he was always searching for more bandages (conventional and Ace-type) and calling his mom regarding insurance coverage for doctors visits about his torn-to-hell hands. :scrutiny:

He never really paid attention to reason, he had to take his last final that year with at least one broken finger (he just taped his whole hand together and said he'd visit his doctor at home rather than Student Health) because of a slip at the climbing gym the night before the test.

Kharn

[TechBrute]

And people say that GUNS are dangerous...:rolleyes:

[LeonCarr]

Tactical is a state of mind, not how you dress. To me, being Tactical is instead of having a pair of $40 Royal Robbins pants, spend $17 on a pair of blue jeans and $23 on AMMO, so you can learn how to shoot your gun. Fancy pants don't mean squat if you are laying face down in the street dead.

Just my .02,
LeonCarr

[TechBrute]

Ok, I guess that's valid if you only have $40. In real life you can spend the $40 on the pants because they're darn good pants, and then you can buy ammo, too. I liked RR pants prior to knowing they were so tactical.:D

[LeonCarr]

Hey TechBrute,

I just think it is funny when you see people dressed like they just walked out of an FBI press conference, with their Polo Shirts, their Royal Robbins pants, their Danner boots, and they can't hit the broad side of a barn with their handgun when you see them at the range :).

Just my .02,
LeonCarr

[Skunkabilly]

Tactical is a state of mind, not how you dress. To me, being Tactical is instead of having a pair of $40 Royal Robbins pants, spend $17 on a pair of blue jeans and $23 on AMMO, so you can learn how to shoot your gun. Fancy pants don't mean squat if you are laying face down in the street dead.

$23 is all it takes to learn how to shoot? :rolleyes:

[TechBrute]

Hey TechBrute,

I just think it is funny when you see people dressed like they just walked out of an FBI press conference, with their Polo Shirts, their Royal Robbins pants, their Danner boots, and they can't hit the broad side of a barn with their handgun when you see them at the range .

Just my .02,
LeonCarr
I think it's funny when people assume that because you're wearing Polo shirts, RR pants, and Danner boots that you can't hit the side of a barn.:D

Also, I want in on that $23 shooting method, because so far I've spent thousands on classes, ammo, high-end weaponry, gear, and RR pants.:neener: :D

[VaughnT]

On the issue of the belt, I prefer to wear it so that the V on the V-ring points to the right. I wear the 5-stitch WIB (much prefered over the plasticized Combat Shooter's Model) and have found that the weight of the gun/holster would drag to belt through the dang loop, practically undressing me in the stall. Not good.

Solution, reverse the lay of the belt and the V-ring acts as a stop as soon the the first beltloop is encountered.

As for the pants......I had a pair and got rid of them fast. Being 100% cotton, shrinkage was a problem; shrinkage is something my fat butt can't deal with. Secondly, the tactical black quickly faded around the fabric edges leaving me with a mottled look that wasn't as camoflaging as I might have liked. Something about pinkishpurple edges that didn't appeal to me.

Now I wear Tru-Spec Swat Tacticool Uniform Pants, with the superhuge three inch belt loops and the ultrawesome calf pocket.....a perfect place for your spare ammo or bug or medkit or throwing stars. Durable, well-cut, fade resistant, 100% BATTLERIP fabric.

[LeonCarr]

What I am saying is that money is better spent on ammunition and training, instead of fancy pants. It does not matter if it is 23 dollars or a million dollars.

Just my .02,
LeonCarr

[Skunkabilly]

'Battlerip fabric'? LOL sounds like something I could use after eating Mexican food :D

[Daniel Flory]

LeonCarr- Some people actually have money for all the ammo, classes, and gear that they want. I know it sounds crazy, but it is true. The commodity at that point is time. So if I have time, and I'm wearing a $100 Rosen belt, $70 Sparks holster, all mounted on $80 Brooks Brothers casual pants while taking a Awerbuck class where I shoot 1000K rounds out of a $2.5K custom 1911, ad infinitum, where do I skimp on training by buying too much gear?

I would wholeheartedly agree that in general, it is best to pick software over hardware if you must choose between the two financially. But for some, $40 isn't a big deal; thus it doesn't encroach on their training budget.

[Skunkabilly]

And they were gifts from his 'somewhat anti parents'. I'm sure mom is a lot happier buying him a $40 pair of pants than $23 of ammo. :p

[Kharn]

Damn, I never thought a question about which direction my belt buckle should point would go so far.

Kharn

[444]

" just think it is funny when you see people dressed like they just walked out of an FBI press conference, with their Polo Shirts, their Royal Robbins pants, their Danner boots, and they can't hit the broad side of a barn with their handgun when you see them at the range "

What I think is even funnier is someone that is so arrogant that they can judge how well someone shoots because of the way they are dressed. Heres a question for you, I wear a Wilderness belt everyday at work (along with probably half the department), I also wear Danner boots (along with about half the department since they are both ANSI and OSHA approved which is required in our dress code and can be had with zippers). I own about a half dozen pairs of RR pants. If you see me wearing this stuff off the shooting range, how do you label me then ?

"What I am saying is that money is better spent on ammunition and training, instead of fancy pants. It does not matter if it is 23 dollars or a million dollars."

I don't have to make decisions between clothes and ammo. I can afford both. I can afford to buy more clothes than I can wear, more ammo than I have time to shoot, and more courses than I have time to attend. It isn't an issue. Not to mention, it is none of your or anyone else business how I spend my money. After the government extorts their piece of the action, the rest is mine to spend as I please. What happens if I spend $25 on a pair of jeans or I can spend the same amount on a pair of RRs. Is it OK if I buy the ones I want, or do I have to check with you ?

[SapperLeader]

RR pants and shorts have actually been cheaper for me in the long run. I have bought god only knows how many pairs of blue jeans and kahki shorts in the last 5-7 years trying to find a pair I liked with pockets in the right spots. Then one day, in a camping store, I saw these royal robbins 5.11 pants. I tried on a pair, I liked the pair, I loved the pair. It had pockets galore, more pockets than i knew what to do with( at that time that was true, now all pockets are being used properly.) I didnt like the price, nor the store I was shopping around in. I found the same pants, and even some shorts online, ordered three pairs of each, and my hunt for a proper pair of pants was over. Now, most of my jeans are 20, same with the kahki shorts. I spent 30 each on the rr pants and shorts, and after a year of hard use, they still look like they do the day I bought them. I have no plans to ever repalce the rr pants with anything but rr pants. So I dont see how my buying a better quality pair of pants, has anything to do with my ammo and training budget, nor my shooting skills.

[SapperLeader]

Sorry Kahn, forgot to answer your question after my little rant :) I too wear rr 5.11 pants and shorts, and use a wilderness belt. I wear the v pointing to the left, It just seems to lock together, and hold up my pants in a more comfortable fashion. I use the small ring in the front for the keys, and have my surefire flashlight hanging off the back loop. The flashlight actually annoys the crap out of me back there when Im riding in the car, but works as a temporary solution until I can order a horizontal flashlight holder.

I hope you enjoy your new pants and belt, Ive been wearing my pants for a year, and the belt for 9 months, and love them both.

[LeonCarr]

I forgot...what were we talking about ? :)

I would still rather shoot more ammo.

Just my .02,
LeonCarr

[EricO]

VaughnT wrote, "Being 100% cotton, shrinkage was a problem; shrinkage is something..."

Seinfeld or Costanza, to Elaine - "Oh my God! Women know about SHRINKAGE, right?"

Elaine, in response - "Sure, you mean in laundry right?"

Costanza - "OH MY GOD, OH MY GOD!!!"

Sorry, I had to do that. I thought that I'd add a little levity to the issue. Hopefully there's some Seinfeld fans out there that recognize that episode.

EricO

[TechBrute]

The beach house episode. Funny.

I've not had a problem with my RRs shrinking. As a matter of fact, they seem to shrink less than some of my jeans.

[Skunkabilly]

Shrink? Heck if they shunk, mine should fit by now :D

[45R]

You guys are killen me :)

[TechBrute]

Yeah, Skunk, do they even make RRs in 28"?:D

[Skunkabilly]

LOL. I don't know...29" is when you have to shop in the kid's section and I'm too embarassed to do that.

Besides, I need to buy my pants and belt 6" large for my Beretta :D

[444]

I wore my kahki RRs to a get together on Christmas and the lady of the house along with her mother in law both commented on how nice my pants were and how they wish their husbands would get pants like that. :eek:

I actually understand what LeonCarr is talking about. I have had the same attitude about other sports. For example someone wants to go skiing for the first time and they have to go buy all the cloths and equipment right down to the wind tunnel tested sunglasses and they don't even know if they are going to like it. Someone buys a horse and immediately starts dressing like a minor character in a "B" cowboy movie with the big belt buckle, hat (specific one for summer and winter), boots, certain jeans etc. Somebody buys a Harley and they have to start wearing a vest, get a couple tatoos, and wear their wallet on a chain.
But I see these pants as being different. Over the years I have worked at jobs where I was able to wear pants with cargo pockets. First BDUs and later when I worked as a paramedic for a private ambulance company. I always carry as much stuff in my pockets as I can get in there. Having two extra pockets is a welcome addition to me. Having a little pocket for my cell phone is nice so I don't have to dig though all my junk to get to it when it is ringing. The real deep back pockets make losing your wallet less likely. I bought my RRs after attending my first shooting school. I wanted to shoot as much as possible which means I have to stay on the firing line as long as possible. I don't want to have to keep going back to get more ammo etc. There is also a limit to what you can comfortably carry on your belt. After getting the RRs I went to my next class with magazines in every pocket and in my mag pouches. I was able to carry other little items that were nice to have on my person. They seemed to be cut right so I didn't split the seat out when assuming a sitting position. They seem to be the perfect pants for shooting. I don't really see them as being a "wanna be" type of item. And, I really like to wear them as a casual pant also, and they don't look bad.

[Skunkabilly]

The reason I like the RR pants is the back pocket. They're so darned big, they fit rifle mags, shotshells, extra pistol mags, a Nalgene bottle (hard to move, but it'll go in there in a pinch), my Canon 420EX flash, etc. etc. etc.

The Wilderness belt just goes with it, like peanut butter and jerry. :)

[TechBrute]

I like the back pockets because you can get in them while sitting. I also like the reinforced knees.

[Kharn]

I love the back pockets when standing, but occasionally my wallet gets in a bad position when I'm sitting in my Blazer and is a total pain in the butt, er, mid-thigh (the center console prevents easy access to adjust wallet). No pain, no tacticility? :uhoh:

Kharn

[444]

I actually started carrying my wallet in my left cargo pocket because it was more comfortable than sitting on it.
With pants like this, you have that option.

[Skunkabilly]

I rather have my wallet down there under my thigh than behind my butt.

I carry my papers (dl, ccw and less than $40 of cash) in a shirt pocket. Makes the popo less nervous if I pull it out from there than from my hip, and easier to get to at the drivethru :)

In a carbon fiber wallet of course.

[TechBrute]

Shirtpocket? You mean where you keep the pocket protector? :D

[dav]

Skunk, I know your penchant for Carbon Fiber accessories... but this is the "ultimate" tactical wallet...

wallet (http://www.thinkgeek.com/interests/giftsunder20/5f21/)

[Skunkabilly]

dav :cool:

I got some stuff from THinkgeek for my coworkers :D

Shirtpocket..yes, the pocket protector and notepad keep the wallet snugly in there. If it's too loose, the stuff there slips out too easily and shirt pockets with retention may be a fauxpas for business casual dress :)

[fix]

I find it quite comical that folks associate RR pants with concealed carry. It's a safe bet that 90% of the wearers are usually "wearing".

[tommyc]

I have 4 or 5 pair in Tan. For me, they're just real damn comfortable. I wear them working around the house, IPSC matches, grocery shopping etc.. They even work as business casual attire when needed. They're also great for those longs trips in the car. The large back pockets allow my wallet to sit further down on my body not causing any discomfort while driving long distances. I find them to be more practical than anything else. Most of the tactical wannabe's in my neck of the woods seem to go for the desert camo look anyway.