Old and newer Remington 700s ?


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nathan
January 9, 2011, 01:23 AM
I have a nice Remington BDL 25 06 made sometime in 1994. Its a nice rifle and i have no complaints. Now i read that Remington 's quality deteriorated from 1993 to 2005. What exactly were the drop in QC ? Was it in all Remington models inclding the BDL ?

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PT1911
January 9, 2011, 02:04 AM
Simply put, they have allowed a lot of their rifles to leave the factory with flaws in the crown, excess space between the chamber and the rifling, triggers set badly, locking lugs out of spec, etc... The 700 remains one of the best rifles on the market (potentially.) IF you get one that came out well, then you are set, if not, then it is nothing that a few hundred dollars and a good gunsmith wont fix.

Case in point, a friend of mine had a guy come up to him at a gun show recently and request a trade on a 700, i forget the specific model currently, that retails for over $1000. So he ends up trading for what amounts to under 450 in the rifle and leupold mounts/rings knowing full well that the guy is under the impression that he is getting rid of a problem gun.... Upon taking the gun to the range, that is exactly the case, the crown is FUBAR'd (with no flaw in the bluing) the locking lugs are drastically unevenly worn, there is a huge gap from the chamber to the rifling, the stock is nowhere near floated and the trigger is breaking at 9 lbs...

The gun was pristine, not a scratch on the stock or a blemish in the finish, this is how the gun came from the factory.

So, what would amount to about 500 dollars later to include floating the barrel, recrowning, setting the trigger to an acceptable pull, squaring the action, and turning the barrrel back a full turn, and a number of other things, the gun has gone from shooting 3-6 inch 100 yd groups to shooting .177 (5) shot groups and well under that for (3) shot groups with boring regularity.

http://www.remington.com/products/firearms/centerfire/model-700/model-700-vls.aspx

Pretty close to that model but with a benchrest stock.

brandon_mcg
January 9, 2011, 01:46 PM
nathan,

when i was in the market for a new .308 i had to keep all that in the back of my mind as well. i got the .308 VTR http://www.remington.com/products/firearms/centerfire/model-700/model-700-vtr.aspx

luckily the gun store i shop at is run by some family friends so they let me inspect the 4 or 5 they had in stock and hand choose the one that looked the best from the factory.

out of the all the model 700's i handled that day, i couldnt find any flaws from the factory but keep in mind that was in 2009.

DirtyHarry31
January 9, 2011, 04:19 PM
I bought a Sendero 700 in 270 win. back in the beginning of 1996. It was made in 1994. I was looking to build a long range gun but when adding the cost up I searched GB & I found this rifle for $550 looking new, claimed to have only shot it for 20 (box). It came with the H&S Precision Stock so it was close enough for me. My FFL's smith at the time wanted to see what we could build from this. New ones, not in this caliber were running around $800 on GB. The rifle was brand new without a mark on the bolt body or anywhere else. No powder residue found when taken apart but the recoil lug was at 5 o'clock position instead of the 6. He wanted to play with this before I shot it. It took him one day to align the recoil lug, set my head space, & set the trigger, costing me $120. Took it to the range that weekend with Federal 130 gr. in the "blue" box. Once the scope was sighted (5 shots) I then put my first 3 inside a dime @ 100 yrds. It will keep tight groups (dime to nickle size), as long as I am doing it right, every time I take it out. I was lucky even after I altered it to take stock magazines that this holds it's accuracy. The smith told me that the guy thought he had a lemon but it was sloppy assembly that was the problem. It must of been a Monday built gun. Someone must of had a busy weekend to let this one go thru. By the way, if you want a accurate rifle go for the VSSF in 308.

Flatbush Harry
January 9, 2011, 07:31 PM
Yup, Big Green has let everything go all to heck. Look at the crappy 3-shot group I got Friday at 100 yds with my bone stock 700 SPS SS in .308 Win.

http://i79.photobucket.com/albums/j126/flatbush_harry/sc002e7ec5.jpg

I may just use the damn rifle as a boat paddle, like Robert Redford did with his M1 Garand in "A Bridge Too Far"...or not.

I've had 3 Remmies...this SPS SS, a XHR in .25-06 and a 700 BDL in .30-06...they're all great shooters.

FH

Durty
January 9, 2011, 07:32 PM
How does the 25-06 shoot with good ammo?

Durty
January 9, 2011, 07:39 PM
Wow, Harry. Looks like you got a real lemon. Too bad. All my 700s are lemons too.

Flatbush Harry
January 9, 2011, 07:52 PM
Durty,

My best results to date with my XHR in .25-06 have come from 100gr SMKs with 90gr SGKs close behind. The groups with the SMKs using IMR 4831 have averaged about 0.75" and with the SGKs about 0.8-0.9". I'm still working on loads as I want to use the .25-06 for Coyote. I just picked up some Sierra varmint bullets in 87gr and I'm going to try some Nosler ballistic tips, a bullet I've gotten good groups with in the .308. Worst case, I'll use the SMKs for CO's Wiley Coyote.

Cheers,

FH

PS- With Hornady 117gr SSTs in their factory loads, I've gotten just under 1" more than a few times with the one box I tried. In general, I've had good luck with Hornady Custom ammo in .30-06, .308 and, most recently, the .25-06. I've also been pretty pleased with their brass from these when I reload.

Durty
January 9, 2011, 08:03 PM
Sounds great. Which Sierra bullets did you pick up? I shot a coon yesterday with a Sierra 52 (Matchking HP) out of my Model 700 22-250 and it was a fantastic display of energy transfer, to say the least! I am an absolute proponent of Sierra bullets. Have yet to find one that won't shoot out of my rifles. Unfortunately, I do not have experience with a 25-06, although it would be a great caliber for where I shoot deer in the TX Hill Country. What rate of twist does your barrel have that will stabilize a light 87gr bullet?

redneck2
January 9, 2011, 08:31 PM
I have three 700's. Mine all shoot great. My 22-250 VS shot well under 1/2" with the first hand loads I tried. I've seen some that had the barrel screwed in crooked and you couldn't get the sights anywhere close to right. Remington quality is strictly luck of the draw.

FWIW...a few years ago Remington REALLY got screwed over by Wal-Mart. Wal-Mart ordered a bunch of guns at a low price, couldn't sell all them, and forced Remington to take them back at a huge loss. I think Remington did absolutely anything they had to do for a while to stay in business.

nathan
January 9, 2011, 11:00 PM
Thanks for the info. I went to check my Remington BDL and all seem just fine. I got this from a benchrest shooter for $ 420 in 2000 , it was in excellent like new condition. Me without owning a real hunting rifle i payed cash for it. He promised to help me find the right load for it.

ANyhow he was nice enough to improved this rifle since we were both gun club members. He bedded the stock and free floated the barrel. Tuned the trigger to a lighter pull around 3 lbs. And we worked on finding the best load . I remember we first tried the Sierra 120 gr SP and it didnt group well . Then we settled on the Nosler BT 100 gr that grouped a tight .3 inch at 100 yds. BTW i m not into reloading but was grateful he loaded a bunch of that particular sweet load . I moved on to Houston after that and i wish i could have learned more.

frankenstein406
January 10, 2011, 01:12 PM
I'll have to take a good look at the one I just bought. It's a REM 700 adl in synthetic stock sporter barrel. Simmons 8 point scope, paid 300$ for it used. Guy said it will shoot dimes at 100yards so I guess will find out this spring.

Daniel Boone
January 10, 2011, 01:31 PM
Well - I read everyone's post here and I have come to the conclusion that some people doesn't know much about guns.

The quality of new rifles has gone steadily down hill since the production line changed back in 1980. Not to say that they were making the best rifles in the world in 1980 - just to say that once they tried to cheapen the rifle and took away the RKW high gloss finish on the stock - when DuPont got out of the gun business that things got progressively worse.

Even a blind hog finds an acorn once in a while, so finding a production rifle in a pet caliber - with hand loads that will produce exceptional accuracy is not a big deal in my book. But what I am looking at is these people who only understands calibers, who goes out and buys these cheap Remington Model 710's and 770's and expects them to shoot as well as their dad's or grandfathers model 70's or 700's.

It isn't even that those rifles were always perfect either, just that they were all that were available back in the day and so they bought them and they didn't expect them always to be a tack driver - but a game getter.
With the internet and all these magazines and all these so called gun experts - it is no wonder we have all these lawsuits we have today.
Trying to find marksmanship caliber rifles with factory - cheap - ammo is almost next to impossible. Add to that the wrong bullets or ammo for the rifle and the accuracy will deteriorate to the point of where you will be lucky to hit a softball 5 times at 100 yards with many of these new production rifles.
It is not to say that they are all this way - but to say that most of them are junk and that I will not own one and to say that if one breaks and Remington chooses not to fix it - you might end up with a $300.00 rifle that is broke that costs $300 to fix it, or a disposable rifle if you prefer.

You can buy what ever you want, but I know what is going to be leaning in my gun cabinet and what is going to stay on the shelf at the gun shop and these new rifles are not going home with me.

robdaniels
January 12, 2011, 12:00 AM
I picked up a used remington 700 here a while back and found out from Remington by sending them the serial number that the gun was made in 1980.

Is this gun old enough to not have the host of problems some of the other newer rifle may have?

Here is a question I really wish I knew the answer to. COL.. I place a dummy round in a Hornady Lock-N-Load OAL Gauge. The over all length of the shell with bullet to the riflings is 3.449. Does that sound right?? I mean factory loads are only 3.250. Any comments?

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