WA silencer use bill Senate hearing!!!


PDA






Ranb
January 20, 2011, 09:15 AM
Judiciary
1/26/11 1:30 pm
Senate Full Committee
Senate Hearing Rm 1
J.A. Cherberg Building
Olympia, WA

Public Hearing:
1.SB 5112 - Changing restrictions on firearm noise suppressors.
2.SB 5115 - Concerning private transfer fee obligations. (Hearing is on the Proposed Substitute.)
3.SB 5170 - Increasing the number of judges to be elected in Grant county.

Everyone needs to be at this hearing, especially industry representatives, silencer owners and people who want to use silencers.

Ranb

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MD_Willington
January 20, 2011, 01:53 PM
Wish I could, I'm in Pullman WA, next to WSU ATM....

deacon8
January 20, 2011, 02:23 PM
Is there a link that explains what is in the bill. I can't find any details on this bill. If you can't post a link, can someone give a run-down of what the bill would do? And I was hoping for someone more than just a single sentance description, which is why I was looking for a link. However, any extra info would be greatly appreciated. Thanks!

deacon8
January 20, 2011, 02:24 PM
Or is that info not out yet?

Ranb
January 20, 2011, 05:01 PM
Go to http://access.wa.gov to find out just about anything about the government that you need. Click on the government and legislature links to get to the bill information. http://apps.leg.wa.gov/billinfo/ Search for any bill you want. Senate bill 5112 is the companian bill for House bill 1016. http://apps.leg.wa.gov/billinfo/summary.aspx?bill=5112&year=2011

http://apps.leg.wa.gov/documents/billdocs/2011-12/Pdf/Bills/Senate%20Bills/5112.pdf
Sec. 1. RCW 9.41.250 and 2007 c 379 s 1 are each amended to read
5 as follows:
6 (1) Every person who:
16 (c) Uses any contrivance or device for suppressing the noise of any
17 firearm unless the suppressor is legally registered and possessed in
18 accordance with federal law,
19 is guilty of a gross misdemeanor punishable under chapter 9A.20 RCW.

It just makes an exception for registered silencers. The underlined portion is the new part of the RCW that bill 5112 and 1016 adds.

Ranb

MD_Willington
January 21, 2011, 02:05 AM
OT but in the same document:

In a different bill they want to edit the portion above 16 - 18, change dirk and dagger to knife with 3.5 inch blade...

kayak-man
January 21, 2011, 04:46 AM
Ramb - Thank you very much for all the work you've done on this!


Chris "the Kayak-Man" Johnson

deacon8
January 21, 2011, 09:47 AM
Yeah, thanks Ranb. That's good to know about.

Ranb
January 21, 2011, 06:35 PM
In a different bill they want to edit the portion above 16 - 18, change dirk and dagger to knife with 3.5 inch blade...

That is not good. Pocket knives illegal if it passes? http://apps.leg.wa.gov/documents/billdocs/2011-12/Pdf/Bills/House%20Bills/1006.pdf

So if bill 1006 (making carrying pocket knives in your pocket illegal) is attached to the silencer use bill, will the people on this forum still support it? I will. :(

Ranb

MD_Willington
January 24, 2011, 02:19 PM
Well I carry a knife too, but rarely a knife over 3.5 inches...

Now how does this work if I'm a Sikh and I carry a Kirpan...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kirpan


Typically made from iron, kirpans range in blade size from 3 inches (7.6 cm) to over 3 feet (90 cm), though Sikhs in the West wear kirpans with a blade of about 3.5 inches (9 cm). Most Sikhs wear the kirpan concealed under their clothes. To the Sikhs, it is a highly important religious symbol; it is rarely used as a weapon.

Ranb
January 24, 2011, 06:48 PM
It will have to be carried openly then. Does their dogma required that it be concealed? My religion (common sense) requires that I use a silencer whenever it is practical. :)

Ranb

MD_Willington
January 27, 2011, 03:40 PM
Any word on the reading yesterday, I checked committee notes and nada...

MD_Willington
February 4, 2011, 03:04 PM
Feb 3
Rules Committee relieved of further consideration.
Placed on second reading suspension calendar.


Uh, what just happened?

Ranb
February 4, 2011, 03:46 PM
Here is a tutorial on the process in Olympia; http://www.leg.wa.gov/LIC/Documents/EducationAndInformation/Bill_HistoryPage_Tutorial.doc I am new to this too. :)

I think it means it is still moving forward. Plain friggin english would be nice to use wouldn't it?

Ranb

MD_Willington
February 7, 2011, 03:42 PM
!!! Hey Hey Hey !!!
1016-2011 passed the house 88-4, 6 exempt, just about 90% of the house is FOR fixing it.

Every WA State Rep needs to be contacted ASAP

This is now moving to the Senate, then if favorable, Queen G takes a stab at it.

Feb 7 Committee recommendations adopted.
Placed on third reading. Third reading, PASSED
Yea = 88
Nay = 4
Absent = 0
Excused = 6

Yea:Ahern Alexander Angel Armstrong Asay Bailey Billig Blake Buys Carlyle Chandler Clibborn Cody Condotta Crouse Dahlquist Dammeier DeBolt Dickerson Dunshee Fagan Finn Fitzgibbon Frockt Goodman Green Haigh Haler Hargrove Harris Hasegawa Hinkle Hope Hunt Hurst Jacks Jinkins Johnson Kagi Kelley Kenney Kirby Klippert Kretz Kristiansen Ladenburg Liias Lytton Maxwell McCoy McCune Miloscia Moeller Morris Moscoso Nealey Orcutt Ormsby Orwall Overstreet Parker Pearson Pedersen Pettigrew Probst Reykdal Rivers Roberts Rolfes Ross Ryu Santos Seaquist Sells Shea Schmick Short Stanford Sullivan Takko Taylor Tharinger VanDeWege Walsh Warnick Wilcox Zeiger Mr.Speaker
Nay:Darneille Hudgins Hunter Springer
Excused:Anderson Appleton Eddy Rodne Smith Upthegrove

Ranb
February 7, 2011, 04:42 PM
That is good news. But I just got an e-mail stating that Senate bill 5112 is not on the list of bills getting an executive hearing in the Judiciary committee. Maybe they are stopping work on bill 5112 due to progress on bill 1016, I am not sure. Only one way to find out, write and ask. :)

Ranb

Ranb
February 8, 2011, 03:14 PM
Bill 5112 was heard by the Senate Judiciary Executive Committee this morning. There was no debate. The decision was a unanimous "do pass" recommendation. It goes to the Rules Committee next.

Ranb

Prince Yamato
February 9, 2011, 07:17 PM
I reiterate, this is exciting!

Ranb
February 17, 2011, 09:03 PM
Senate bill 5112 appears to be stuck in the Rules committee. The Rules committee never publishes an agenda so we will not know when it goes for a vote until the bill status is updated as passed or failed on the Senate floor

If you want to use silencers in WA, please write to the Rules committee chairman, Lt Governor Owen. Sending e-mail to the rest of the committee would not hurt either.

Bill 5112 http://apps.leg.wa.gov/billinfo/summary.aspx?bill=5112&year=2011

Rules committee membership http://www.leg.wa.gov/Senate/Committees/RULE/Pages/MembersStaff.aspx

Lt Governor Owen http://ltgov.wa.gov/ and his e-mail address ltgov@leg.wa.gov

Ranb

Prince Yamato
February 25, 2011, 02:43 PM
I realize that the Rules Committee doesn't post updates, but does anyone personally know if the bill is stuck or is it going somewhere? I'd hate to think that all this effort was spent on the bill and then it goes nowhere!

Ranb
February 25, 2011, 04:46 PM
Bill 5112 (allow silencer use) is stuck in committee and going to die unless it is pulled from the Rules committee for a third reading (vote on the Senate floor) by March 7th. I cannot emphasis enough the importance that all WA residents interested in silencer use must call their Senator and members of the Rules committee on the phone to urge them to pull bill 5112 from the calendar for a third reading.

Rules committee members http://www.leg.wa.gov/Senate/Committ...bersStaff.aspx

The last Rules committee hearing consisted of a “package pull” of bills that had no opposition and were expected to pass with little or no debate. I do not know why Bill 5112 was not included in the package pull since it had no opposition in the Senate Judiciary hearing, was not debated at all at the Judiciary executive hearing and was unanimously sent along with a do pass recommendation. I am not aware of any opposition to the bill 5112, and only 4 Representatives voted against the companion bill in the House. One of the Senate aides I spoke to said there was some opposition to the bill, but she would not be specific.

The price of a dozen two minute long distance phone calls is a small one to pay to enjoy the use of silencers in WA. We have until March 7th to get bill 5112 a vote on the Senate floor. If you can, call as many of the Rules committee members as you can. The most important ones to call are the chairman, vice-chairman and the Democrats.

One of their aides will answer the phone when you call, not the Senator. When I call, I tell them my name and city/state and that I am calling to express my support of bill 5112. The aide will probably suggest that you contact your Senator and the bill sponsors, but tell them you have already done so and want to know why bill 5112 has not been pulled from the calendar any sent to the floor for a vote. Ask them if their Senator intends to allow to pull the bill from the calendar and send it to the floor. If they do not say yes, press them for a reason why. Ask them who is opposed to the bill and why. End your conversation with a request that they pass along your concerns to the Senator.

Chances are you will have to leave a message if you call the chairman (the Lt Gov) or vice chairman. If you are not able to get through to the vice-chairman, keep calling until you do. Some of the aides will be in a rush to finish the call, others will want to talk. The Republicans will probably blame the Democrats for holding things up. If they do, ask them what they will do to help pull the bill form the calendar. Good luck and keep dialing.

Randy

Prince Yamato
February 25, 2011, 06:31 PM
Can we maybe get the mods to repost this:



Senate bill 5112 appears to be stuck in the Rules committee. The Rules committee never publishes an agenda so we will not know when it goes for a vote until the bill status is updated as passed or failed on the Senate floor

For now it is stuck and going to die like any other bill in committee unless they pull it from the Rules committee for a third reading (vote on the Senate floor). I can not emphasis enough the importance that all WA residents interested in silencer use must call their Senator and members of the Rules committee on the phone to urge them to pull bill 5112 from the calender for a third reading.

Rules committee members http://www.leg.wa.gov/Senate/Committ...bersStaff.aspx The price of a dozen two minute long distance phone calls is a small one to pay to enjoy the use of silencers in WA. We have until March 7th to get bill 5112 a vote on the Senate floor. Thanks.


I'd like to see more people made aware of this. Perhaps this should go to other forums as well.

Mac11
February 25, 2011, 11:29 PM
Email contact enlisting their support for both 1604 and 5112 has been made.

rustedangel
March 2, 2011, 04:48 PM
Thanks so much for this information! Ranb's link took me to a 404 error, but I was able to browse to the listing of senators on the rules committee. For people who had the same issue, use this link:
http://www.leg.wa.gov/Senate/Committees/RULE/Pages/MembersStaff.aspx
Or if that doesn't work, go to Legislative Committees on the left sidebard, select Senate Committees on the top center, and Rules Committee is on the list.

I ran down the list and called them all, but started with the senator for my district (Scott White). Senator Hewitt's aide told me that the most important people to contact were Senators Brown and Eide as they lead the caucus. I've also notified my 2A supporting friends in Washington about the bill.

MD_Willington
March 3, 2011, 12:02 AM
The house already passed HB 1016,
SB 5112 is the Senate Companion Bill.
It was scheduled for a second reading today.
A public hearing with the Senate Judiciary Committee has been scheduled for March 9th, at 1:30 PM.

WeedWacker
March 5, 2011, 04:08 AM
You can track the bills progress here:

http://apps.leg.wa.gov/billinfo/summary.aspx?bill=1016

yhtomit
March 5, 2011, 01:55 PM
Thanks for the updates on this arduous process.

I hope this goes the way that marijuana legislation and attitudes are shifting, nationwide. Suppressors are a health issue.

timothy

carnaby
March 9, 2011, 02:06 AM
Any updates? Wasn't SB 5112 to have a public hearing tomorrow? Still on?

Ranb
March 9, 2011, 01:16 PM
Bill 5112 is dead. The deadline for action on any Senate bill was March 7. Now they are only considering budget bills and those from the House.

The Senate Judiciary hearing for bill 1016 is Wednesday (today) at 1:30pm at the O'Brien building.

Ranb

rustedangel
March 9, 2011, 01:38 PM
One of the aides for the legislators I called regarding getting SB5112 out of rules committee told me it was fairly likely they would use HB1016 as the vehicle to get the bill through the senate, instead of passing SB5112 and reconciling it. I was also told by several aides that both bills were popular and considered very likely to pass. I plan to keep watching 1016.

misobeno
March 9, 2011, 04:30 PM
Bill 5112 is dead. The deadline for action on any Senate bill was March 7. Now they are only considering budget bills and those from the House.

The Senate Judiciary hearing for bill 1016 is Wednesday (today) at 1:30pm at the O'Brien building.

Ranb
Wait. The Senate Judicial Committee agenda says the meeting is in the J.A. Cherberg building in the Senate Hearing Room #1.

"Full Committee
Senate Hearing Rm 1
J.A. Cherberg Building
Olympia, WA"

EDIT: SOURCE

http://www.leg.wa.gov/SENATE/COMMITTEES/JUD/Pages/Agendas.aspx

carnaby
March 9, 2011, 06:49 PM
Do pass! Sweet!

Ranb
March 9, 2011, 09:09 PM
Yes, it was in the Cherberg building. Five people showed up to support, none opposed. Senator Kline acknowledged that bill 1016 is the same as bill 5112 and that there was no reason 1016 leave without a "do pass" recommendation. Representative Blake was the first to speak, and did so very briefly then left. Kline asked the five of us to send one up to speak so Tom was it.

One of the other committee members asked that they hold an executive session later that day. http://apps.leg.wa.gov/billinfo/summary.aspx?bill=1016&year=2011

Ranb

http://www.tvw.org/media/mediaplayer.cfm?evid=2011031049&TYPE=V&CFID=2428502&CFTOKEN=50085630&bhcp=1 The video of today's hearing also included an executive session in which bill 1016 was referred out of committee with a "do pass" recommendation.

kayak-man
March 9, 2011, 09:16 PM
One of the other committee members asked that they hold an executive session later that day

So for those of us that haven't been involved in politics for quite some time (if being a Page in olympia even counts as being involved) are there any more hurdles left? Is there any other way we can help?

Thanks Ranb for all the work you put into this!

Chris "the Kayak-Man" Johnson

misobeno
March 10, 2011, 01:50 AM
@Ranb, I was also attended the meeting but did not sign in to testify for or against the speech. I from my vantage point I feel that we got a do pass in spite of our showing. As an outsider looking in, our showing and testimony were both weak.

@Kayak-Man, Basically if the bill leaves committee unchanged it will undergo several readings and trial votes in the Senate before going to a final vote. Once it passes through the final vote the only thing standing it it's way is the Governor's signature. Thanks to the strong support of the bill from the legislation I expect Governor Gregoire to sign the bill into law. Ninety-days after the close of this legislative session, the bill will take effect.

Edit: Right now I would like to take the time and recommend that everyone who lives in Washington and supports this bill to write a letter to your senator. If you do not know who your senator is, look them up using the state district finding tool (http://apps.leg.wa.gov/DistrictFinder/Default.aspx).

Ranb
March 10, 2011, 05:15 AM
@Ranb, I was also attended the meeting but did not sign in to testify for or against the speech. I from my vantage point I feel that we got a do pass in spite of our showing. As an outsider looking in, our showing and testimony were both weak.

The testimony at Wednesday’s hearing was very weak. It was because we had nothing new to offer. We pretty much covered all of the bases at the two previous hearings and Kline said he did not need to hear anything else as no one showed up to oppose the bill. You may want to review the TVW videos of the other hearings; we were allowed to speak almost as long as we wanted and covered nearly everything that needed to be covered. I did forget to mention the silencer crime research I performed though. But each legislator got a summary of the crime data in a letter or e-mail from me.

The support for bill 1016 from the gun owning community in WA is very weak. I know many gun owners. Except for the several I have met at the hearings, I only know three gun owners in WA that actually own silencers. I know several that would like to, but when I asked them for some sort of support for the bill, they declined. In my opinion the average WA gun owner cares little for the right to keep and bear arms. They say they do, but their actions (or lack of them) speak much louder than their words.

When you said it got a do pass in spite of our showing, it was a real understatement. I feel we are getting this bill passed for two reasons. First is that our legislators finally know about the silencer use issue thanks to people contacting them. Second and more important is that silencers are a relatively benign issue in the state. Silencer crime is very rare, the police generally are not opposed to their ownership and use by civilians and it is not an important gun control issue in the state. Even Cease Fire Washington is not opposed to the silencer bill.

This means that legislators who would normally be leery about supporting a gun bill have a chance to come out in support of one that is unlikely to be held against them in the future by their anti-gun constituents.

I would like to see other restrictions eased in the future, but if we have the same kind of support we are getting now from the gun owners in the state, then we do not have a snowball's chance in hell of accomplishing anything.

If you have any suggestions about what we could have done better for bill 1016, post it. We always need fresh ideas.

Why did you not take a position at the hearing? Thanks.

Ranb

Ranb
March 10, 2011, 05:27 AM
So for those of us that haven't been involved in politics for quite some time (if being a Page in olympia even counts as being involved) are there any more hurdles left? Is there any other way we can help?

The only significant hurdle left is the Rules committee. They decide if it will get a vote on the Senate floor. Here are the members of the Rules committee. http://www.leg.wa.gov/Senate/Committees/RULE/Pages/MembersStaff.aspx

Write to them (letters and e-mail) and call them. Democrats first as they are the ones deciding what bills get attention. When you call or write, it is important to ask them that they "pull bill 1016 from the calendar". They (or their aide) may tell you to contact your own Senator or one of the four sponsors. Tell them you already have and you want to know if they will pull the bill. It is not enough that they “support” the bill or are “concerned” about it. They got to pull it from the calendar so it does not die again.

The silencer bill is getting much less attention than most other bills on the calendar in the Rules committee simply because few gun owners are bothering to call. There is no substitute for actually writing a letter or making a phone call. It is a very simple thing to do, so they know if they are not getting many calls about a bill, then few people actually give a damn about it. It is that simple. That is why the silencer use bill has died year after year. It will die again unless we give a f-ck this time.

Ranb

misobeno
March 10, 2011, 10:37 AM
I didn't take a position because I was not there to speak, and when I say in spite of our showing, I mean at this particular event. Even though the speaker of the committee only wanted a brief testimony from one representative I would still expect us to put our best foot forward and perhaps consider wearing something besides jeans and a t-shirt. Our side just did not appear serious about the bill. I understand that most of the folks who have a vested intersted in this bill actually have jobs to attend, bills to pay, and guns to feed. Heck, I only made the event thanks to a last minute cancellation, but even I threw on a cheap suit and tie. Would you go to an arraignment in a case you were sure to win wearing a floral print Hawaiian shirt and shorts? If you were going to speak on behalf of your industry in front of your regulators, wouldn't you take the time to rehearse your lines? That's what I mean by a poor showing, but maybe I'm just taking the whole legislative process too seriously.

Now, I understand (and have been a participant in the letter writing campaign, just as there have been strong campaigns, both the one from the 2009-2010 legislative session, and now this one. The reason this bill is unopposed is exactly as you stated. Suppressors are a fairly benign device. Legally registered suppressors have not been used in many, if any, crimes in recent memory and they're just too hard to turn into a boogie man. It's almost like trying to ban car mufflers, to use a tired analogy.

It also helps our position when we remind people that the processes to own a suppressor is long, expensive, and requires a federal background check (though they seem to forget that purchasing a firearm at a store requires this as well). Not to mention the benefits that could be argued about noise pollution reduction at urban shooting ranges, or from hunting activities in frontier areas. Suppressors are just not an easy or beneficial target for the anti-firearm community to attack.

The only significant hurdle left is the Rules committee. They decide if it will get a vote on the Senate floor. Here are the members of the Rules committee. http://www.leg.wa.gov/Senate/Committ...bersStaff.aspx

Write to them (letters and e-mail) and call them. Democrats first as they are the ones deciding what bills get attention. When you call or write, it is important to ask them that they "pull bill 1016 from the calendar". They (or their aide) may tell you to contact your own Senator or one of the four sponsors. Tell them you already have and you want to know if they will pull the bill. It is not enough that they “support” the bill or are “concerned” about it. They got to pull it from the calendar so it does not die again.

The silencer bill is getting much less attention than most other bills on the calendar in the Rules committee simply because few gun owners are bothering to call. There is no substitute for actually writing a letter or making a phone call. It is a very simple thing to do, so they know if they are not getting many calls about a bill, then few people actually give a damn about it. It is that simple. That is why the silencer use bill has died year after year. It will die again unless we give a f-ck this time.

Ranb

I agree! The only way we're going to get this through is if we keep on our legislators to get this thing through, but we shouldn't just be hounding on our legislators we need to hound on our local gun clubs. I haven't heard a peep from the Washington Arms Collectors other than nay saying. There haven't been any posting or publications at my local gun ranges calling for action. There just isn't enough awareness from our centralized institutions that many gun owner rely on for ANY gun news. We need to inform our fellow gun owners, and encourage our gun organizations (clubs, ranges, etc) to post information about the bill.

If the same 30 people keep writing the same 30 senators they're going to start ignoring our letters and our phone calls and we're going to watch yet another suppressor bill die in committee. It's just as simple as that.

Ranb
March 10, 2011, 11:58 AM
Even though the speaker of the committee only wanted a brief testimony from one representative I would still expect us to put our best foot forward and perhaps consider wearing something besides jeans and a t-shirt. Our side just did not appear serious about the bill. I understand that most of the folks who have a vested intersted in this bill actually have jobs to attend, bills to pay, and guns to feed. Heck, I only made the event thanks to a last minute cancellation, but even I threw on a cheap suit and tie.

There just isn't enough awareness from our centralized institutions that many gun owner rely on for ANY gun news. We need to inform our fellow gun owners, and encourage our gun organizations (clubs, ranges, etc) to post information about the bill.

I was happy to have the guy in the jeans/t-shirt up there. When Kline asked that only one person be selected to represent the five of us who showed, I passed Tom my printout of stuff to read and asked him to go, as such he had no time to rehease what I handed to him two seconds before he approached the committee. Tom has been the only representative of the WA firearms industry to ever show up at a hearing for bills 1016 and 5112. He does not make much money and has to travel over 100 miles to get to Olympia.

There were several people who stood out from the rest at the hearings. Representative Blake (sponsor), Brian Wurst (WACOPS rep) and Tom Liehmon (former FFL/SOT, current SOT employee). WACOPS did not send a representative this time and Blake was very brief as he had nothing new to say. Tom is one of the key players here as the rest of us are merely hobbyist silencer makers or owners.

Yes, T-shirts are not the way to go, but his presence at the hearing more than made up for it in my opinion.

The attitude of the WAC is the same as its membership and the WA gun owner population as a whole. They don't care much at all.

Ranb

Prince Yamato
March 15, 2011, 02:53 PM
The bill is in the Senate rules committee. If it passes out of the rules committee, then what? It goes to the governor for a signature or does it go back to the house and then the governor?

Ranb
March 15, 2011, 05:48 PM
If the Senate passes the bill, it goes to the governor for her signature or can become law without it. I think it will pass with greater than a 2/3's majority in the Senate, if the Rules committee pulls it from the calendar for a vote on the floor.

I have been calling, but no one, Repulican or Democrat, will commit to pulling it for a vote. If they get the same number of phone calls and letters (very few they claim) they did for the other silencer bill, then they will let it die also. So we need to call and write more.

Ranb

MD_Willington
March 22, 2011, 10:10 PM
Mar 18 - Placed on second reading by Rules Committee.

41magsnub
March 22, 2011, 10:19 PM
Good luck.. I'm jealous now. The MT suppressor bill to allow its use in the field died in the Senate committee 3 to 9 due to misinformation, ignorance, and ideology.

misobeno
March 23, 2011, 05:27 AM
This is just a friendly reminder to all you Washingtonians.

We are stuck in what I'm going to lovingly refer to as "Senate Rules Committee Hell". This is where bills go to die. Really. This is where SB 5112 died. (SB 5112 was placed in the Senate Rules Committee X file. AKA, the bill boneyard.) Really, each committee is a chance for a bill to die without a hearing. Without a vote. Without any action on behalf of our representatives and Senators. Without action on behalf of a few good senators we're going to end up repeating all of this next year (or in a special session, but we all know how that worked out for HB 1604 (http://apps.leg.wa.gov/billinfo/summary.aspx?bill=1604&year=2009)).

So here's what we we as in us. Us includes you. We need to mount an organized telephone, and letter writing campaign again. That means you need to pick up your telephone, fire up your word processor, or ink that quill and let your Senators (http://apps.leg.wa.gov/DistrictFinder/Default.aspx) know. Of course we will have to be polite, articulate, and not a bunch of mouth breathers. That means you will have to sit down and collect your thoughts. If you're going to speak with your senator or their staff rehearse your lines, and if you go visit them in person. Dress appropriately.

If you choose to contact your senators in writing, please proof read everything. Don't just proof read it yourself, share it with a friend. Preferably a friend who's literate and cares about suppressors. It's important to remember, a well written, articulate, printed, and signed letter carries a lot more weight than an email. Emails are cheap, and the fact that you spent $0.44 actually means something to the clerk, intern, or secretary who forwards your work on.

If one of the following Senators is your senator (http://apps.leg.wa.gov/DistrictFinder/Default.aspx) (Super secret, Brad Owen is everybody's super senator. Send him lot of letters.) it is doubly important that you get in touch with them. These guys have a little more power than your average man or woman on the floor. They can actually get HB 1604 a real hearing and maybe even get us on the Senate floor.

SB 5112 IS DEAD. Long Live HB 1016!

Here's the list of people that need to get harassed.

Senate Rules Committee Roster:
Owen, Brad (D) Chair LEG 220 (360) 786-7700
Prentice, Margarita (D) Vice Chair LEG 312 (360) 786-7616
Hewitt, Mike (R) * LEG 314 (360) 786-7630
Brown, Lisa (D) LEG 307 (360) 786-7604
Carrell, Mike (R) INB 102 (360) 786-7654
Eide, Tracey (D) LEG 305 (360) 786-7658
Fraser, Karen (D) LEG 404 (360) 786-7642
Harper, Nick (D) JAC 226 (360) 786-7674
Haugen, Mary Margaret (D) JAC 305 (360) 786-7618
Keiser, Karen (D) JAC 224 (360) 786-7664
King, Curtis (R) INB 205 (360) 786-7626
Kline, Adam (D) JAC 223 (360) 786-7688
Kohl-Welles, Jeanne (D) JAC 219 (360) 786-7670
McAuliffe, Rosemary (D) LEG 403 (360) 786-7600
Parlette, Linda Evans (R) LEG 316 (360) 786-7622
Pflug, Cheryl (R) LEG 415 (360) 786-7608
Rockefeller, Phil (D) JAC 218 (360) 786-7644
Schoesler, Mark (R) INB 110 (360) 786-7620
Stevens, Val (R) INB 105 (360) 786-7676
White, Scott (D) LEG 402 (360) 786-7690
Zarelli, Joseph (R) INB 204 (360) 786-7634

And just a reminder, if you don't have a clue who your senator is look them up by using the state provided district finder (http://apps.leg.wa.gov/DistrictFinder/Default.aspx).


IN CASE YOU MISSED MY SUBTLE HINT: EVERYONE NEEDS TO CONTACT THE OFFICE OF BRAD OWEN. (http://ltgov.wa.gov/)

leadcounsel
March 23, 2011, 03:41 PM
Contacted them!

Ranb
March 24, 2011, 11:46 AM
Bill 1016 is on the 2nd/3rd reading calendar. As far as I know it is up to Senate Floor Leader Tracey Eide to give it a third reading (vote). Her office needs to know how you feel about the bill.

Ranb

carnaby
March 25, 2011, 12:52 PM
Email sent to Mark Schoesler. My senator isn't on the rules committee.

Ranb
March 28, 2011, 12:51 PM
Senator Eide is the current obstacle to bill 1016 getting a vote on the Senate floor. As the Majority Floor Leader, she is the one that decides which bills on the 2nd/3rd reading calendar get a vote on the floor.

I have been trying to make an appointment to speak to Senator Eide about bill 1016, but her aide says the Senator only has time for her constituents in District 30 (Federal Way and Lakeland area). I am in Belfair, so am not worthy of her time this week and next.

Bill 1016 is on the 2nd/3rd reading calendar. Click here; http://www.leg.wa.gov/legislature/pages/calendar.aspx then click on “calendars” then on “senate floor activity report” then on “regular calendar” to see the bills that are scheduled to be voted on (possibly) by the Senate. The dates on the right are the bills that were already voted on.

There may be reasons why Eide might not allow debate on bill 1016. Maybe she plans to allow a third reading, but her aides will not reveal what her plans are. As you can see, all of the bills that got a third reading are passing so far. Some of them have less opposition than bill 1016, but three of them do not. Bill 1016 passed the House 88 to 4. Three other bills on the calendar did not do as well. HB1357 was 65/31, HB1489 was 58/39 and HB1846 was 80/16. I have contacted every Senator about HB 1016 at least once since the session began. While I did not hear back from most of them, most of those who replied did not indicate having any objections to the suppressor bill. Only two Senators (Kline and Roach) said they had reservations about silencer use, but both recommended that is be passed. None of the Senate aides I spoke to told me that they knew of any objections by their Senators to the bill. So unless Senator Eide has any personal objection to the bill or someone is pressuring her to make it die, she should allow it a vote on the Senate floor.

Someone from District 30 needs to contact her office at (360) 786-7658 and request an appointment to speak to her on the phone or in person. Be familiar with the bill and why it is important that it passes. Stress that it has died (as bill 1604) in the last several sessions, passed with very little opposition in the House, will benefit shooters and home owners near rifle ranges, will not cause crime and will eliminate a victimless crime from the Washington statutes.

If anyone is able to score some time with her, please let us now. I am available anytime at (360) 440-5889 if you want to discuss the bill prior to speaking to Senator Eide.

It is also a good idea to call your own Senator and Representatives and request that they lean on Brown and Eide to get 1016 on the floor.


Randy

misobeno
March 29, 2011, 01:45 AM
Here's the deep link to the current calendar.

Link (http://flooractivityext.leg.wa.gov/senateregular.aspx?id=840#)

misobeno
March 29, 2011, 04:22 PM
Well, that was exciting. The HB1016 passed it's third reading.

yeas, 47; nays, 0; absent, 0; excused, 2. (http://apps.leg.wa.gov/billinfo/summary.aspx?bill=1016)

LWYM425
March 29, 2011, 05:31 PM
Soo????? Whats next?? I don't want to get too excited cause I really don't know what hurdles are left...

LWYM425
March 29, 2011, 05:36 PM
Does it just have to get signed? Anyone have any idea how long that takes?

misobeno
March 29, 2011, 06:27 PM
1. A bill may be introduced in either the Senate or House of Representatives by a member.
2. It is referred to a committee for a hearing. The committee studies the bill and may hold public hearings on it. It can then pass, reject, or take no action on the bill.
3. The committee report on the passed bill is read in open session of the House or Senate, and the bill is then referred to the Rules Committee.
4. The Rules Committee can either place the bill on the second reading calendar for debate before the entire body, or take no action.
5. At the second reading, a bill is subject to debate and amendment before being placed on the third reading calendar for final passage.
6. After passing one house, the bill goes through the same procedure in the other house.
7. If amendments are made in the other house, the first house must approve the changes.
8. When the bill is accepted in both houses, it is signed by the respective leaders and sent to the governor.
9. The governor signs the bill into law or may veto all or part of it. If the governor fails to act on the bill, it may become law without a signature.

We are working on #8.

Ranb
March 29, 2011, 07:03 PM
The law goes into effect 90 days after the session ends. The last day of the session is April 24, so we can use our silencers legally Saturday July 23, 2011.

Ranb

misobeno
March 29, 2011, 07:14 PM
I guess now is as good a time as any to go buy myself a 45ACP suppressor for my G21.

Randy, Thanks for all of your help. You were pretty instrumental in organizing the internet side of this whole thing. If I didn't catch your post on Northwest Firearms I would have missed the bill all together and I wouldn't have been able to organize my local letter / phone call campaign.

I know we're not quite through yet but this is the first time since the start of the bill that I've actually been optimistic.

Edit: In case anyone wants the citation for Mr. RanB's effective date, here you go.

Effective Date: Ninety days after adjournment of session in which bill is passed.Link (http://apps.leg.wa.gov/documents/billdocs/2011-12/Pdf/Bill%20Reports/Senate/1016%20SBR%20JUD%2011.pdf)

April 24, 2011 Last day allowed for regular session under state constitution.Link (http://www.leg.wa.gov/legislature/pages/cutoff.aspx)

carnaby
March 29, 2011, 11:59 PM
The law goes into effect 90 days after the session ends. The last day of the session is April 24, so we can use our silencers legally Saturday July 23, 2011.


Go summer!

FourTeeFive
March 31, 2011, 03:01 PM
When will we know if the governor signs or vetos?

Ranb
March 31, 2011, 03:07 PM
It will be here. http://apps.leg.wa.gov/billinfo/summary.aspx?bill=1016&year=2011

Ranb

LWYM425
March 31, 2011, 06:32 PM
Are you going to hold a class on how to fill out the paper work?

MD_Willington
March 31, 2011, 08:20 PM
Couple videos on the paperwork:
http://libertycans.net/Paperwork_info.html

MD_Willington
April 1, 2011, 05:27 PM
http://apps.leg.wa.gov/billinfo/summary.aspx?bill=1016

IN THE HOUSE
Apr 1 - Speaker signed.

PTK
April 3, 2011, 11:51 AM
One step closer! I'm rooting for you. :)

WaGuns
April 4, 2011, 02:44 AM
Passed!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! All we need now is the Governor's sig to make it all good. She 5 days to sign or veto.. If she does neither, then 90 days it becomes law!

It passed with only 4 votes against and 88(ish) for. So the likeleyhood of her vetoing is slim (knock on wood).

Ladies and Gentlemen... get your Trusts, Form 1's and Form 4's ready!!!

**Side Note: Ranb, this would NOT have been possible without all of your due diligence. From all of us in the WA firearms community, THANK YOU!!!! **

cyclopsshooter
April 4, 2011, 04:18 AM
Dammit, now I gotta get a 1911 barrel and a P-22... Of all the damn rotten luck :cuss:

drews77
April 4, 2011, 07:18 PM
IN THE HOUSE

Apr 1 Speaker signed.

misobeno
April 5, 2011, 07:35 AM
The bill has been signed by the President of the Senate.

LWYM425
April 5, 2011, 01:46 PM
Yay!

carnaby
April 7, 2011, 01:22 AM
If the Governor signs the bill do we still have to wait the 90 days for it to become law, or does it take effect immediately?

WaGuns
April 7, 2011, 12:00 PM
The bill was handed to the gov yesterday. She now has 5 days to sign or veto. If she does neither, it becomes LAW on July 23rd 2011.

carnaby
April 7, 2011, 12:35 PM
Right, but when does it become law if she signs?

misobeno
April 8, 2011, 01:51 AM
Unless the bill is vetoed it will become law on Saturday, July 23, 2011.

carnaby
April 8, 2011, 03:35 AM
So signing or not makes no difference? What's the point of signing?

misobeno
April 9, 2011, 04:51 AM
It gives the governor time to read and veto the bill. Signing it basically seals the deal and ends the wait.

MushroomxSpider
April 10, 2011, 07:54 PM
I read somewhere, can't remember where, that the bill passed with veto-proof majorities. But I don't know for sure because I never dun lernt warshington law in skewl. There's public education for you. In fact, I only remember the veto-proof measures for federal bills from Schoolhouse Rock :D

But even if Washington doesn't have veto-proof measures, I think Chrissy would be crazy to try vetoing it. :P

Ranb
April 10, 2011, 09:42 PM
No such thing as veto proof. This governor vetoed 9 bills last year out of over 900 that passed. A few of those she vetoed had unanimous passage by both houses of the legislature. If she vetos HB 1016, it goes back to te legislature for another vote. It is not an automatic vote. If the House and Senate leaders do not give a vetoed bill another vote, then it dies.

Your education is what you make of it. I moved to WA back in 1999, never educated here, but I am learning lots about the WA political process by getting anti-gun laws amended. I do not think HB 1016 will be vetoed.

Ranb

MD_Willington
April 11, 2011, 07:14 PM
Queen G was supposed to sign it at 14:00 today.. anyone hear anything?

drews77
April 11, 2011, 08:53 PM
OTHER THAN LEGISLATIVE ACTION
Apr 6 Delivered to Governor. (View Bill as Passed Legislature)
Apr 11 Governor signed.

:D

MD_Willington
April 11, 2011, 08:58 PM
.. so who's up for next years fight..... SBRs !!

mamartin
April 11, 2011, 10:04 PM
Great job to all who worked so hard on this. I appreciate your hard work and will enjoy it for years to come.

rbernie
April 11, 2011, 11:42 PM
Great job to everyone that worked this. Ya done good. :)

FourTeeFive
April 12, 2011, 11:53 AM
Excellent! Thank you very much to those who made this possible.

ChristopherG
April 12, 2011, 12:19 PM
Thank you, activists and those who have taken the time to understand and report on the legislative process for all of us.

Here is the actual text of HB1016 as passed and signed: it takes the form of an amendment to the section of the Revised Code of Washington (RCW 9.41.250) which formerly forbade the use (but not the possession) of suppressors (among other things). The amendent added by HB1016 is in bold below (and this is just a reiteration of the unchanged text already given by Ranb above):

_____________________________________________
HOUSE BILL 1016
_____________________________________________

Passed Legislature - 2011 Regular Session State of Washington
62nd Legislature 2011 Regular Session

By Representatives Blake, Condotta, Armstrong, Shea, Kretz, Klippert, McCune, Takko, Van De Wege, Dunshee, Probst, Liias, Miloscia, Finn, Hurst, Springer, Goodman, Rodne, Orcutt, Haigh, Dickerson, Taylor, Warnick, Hope, Dammeier, Kristiansen, Chandler, Ross, Sells, and Upthegrove

Prefiled 12/13/10. Read first time 01/10/11. Referred to Committee on Judiciary.

AN ACT Relating to firearm noise suppressors; and amending RCW 9.41.250.

BE IT ENACTED BY THE LEGISLATURE OF THE STATE OF WASHINGTON:
Sec. 1. RCW 9.41.250 and 2007 c 379 s 1 are each amended to read as follows:

(1) Every person who:
(a) Manufactures, sells, or disposes of or possesses any instrument or weapon of the kind usually known as slung shot, sand club, or metal knuckles, or spring blade knife, or any knife the blade of which is automatically released by a spring mechanism or other mechanical device, or any knife having a blade which opens, or falls, or is ejected into position by the force of gravity, or by an outward, downward, or centrifugal thrust or movement;
(b) Furtively carries with intent to conceal any dagger, dirk, pistol, or other dangerous weapon; or
(c) Uses any contrivance or device for suppressing the noise of any firearm unless the suppressor is legally registered and possessed in accordance with federal law, is guilty of a gross misdemeanor punishable under chapter 9A.20 RCW.
(2) Subsection (1)(a) of this section does not apply to:
(a) The possession of a spring blade knife by a law enforcement officer while the officer:
(i) Is on official duty; or
(ii) Is transporting the knife to or from the place where the knife is stored when the officer is not on official duty; or
(b) The storage of a spring blade knife by a law enforcement officer.

Ranb
April 12, 2011, 02:27 PM
Representative Blake will be submitting a bill to ease the restrictions on SBS/SBR later this session; or so I have been told. Myself and some others are planning to meet with Blake sometime after the session is over to discuss strategy. The things we will need from gun owners and others interested in seeing the law changed are meetings with your Senators and Representatives to discuss the bill and encourage them to push for hearings in committee and of course their vote on the floor.

I will know more after we met with Representative Blake.

Ranb

MD_Willington
April 12, 2011, 02:50 PM
Ranb, I have no problem meeting with my reps:

Susan Fagan used to work with me, her grand kids and my children were in the same school.

Joe Schmick used to own the vending machines where I work, I see him in Colfax and Pullman every once in a while, we have each others phone numbers and email. I also know Pam, his assistant in Olympia.

Mark Schoesler, I usually see him each year at the Johnson parade, July 4th in Johnson WA.

All three are usually at the Johnson parade along with Representative Cathy McMorris Rogers.

I can also pull my neighbors into this, my neighbor, I've posted his blog URL in some posts here, is also interested in SBRs etc.

kayak-man
April 12, 2011, 02:57 PM
Ranb, keep us posted on the Blake meeting. I'd be more than happy to try to set up a meet with Rep Rolfes. Sen Rockefeller has always replied to me when I've written to him (It was probably a form letter, but still, if the man has the sense to send SOMETHING back, he might be able to listen to reason) and I can try writing/meeting with him.

Anyone have any sugestions on where I can find info about SBR/SBS statistics and facts? I'd hate to write a letter that amounts to nothing more than "SBS/SBRs should be legal because I like them."

Chris "the Kayak-Man" Johnson

misobeno
April 12, 2011, 04:09 PM
If we're going to pull this off we're going to need some real industry support and we would have to be on our A-Game (No bumbling bumbleheads in greasy t-shirts, please. You might be a great guy and a staunch supporter of our 2AF rights, but you're really not our strongest representative). Perhaps we could approach this law the same way we approached the suppressor law by "bringing our laws in line with federal law." I expect any attempt at relaxing of SBR/SBS/MG legislation would meet stiff resistance from Ceasefire and other anti-gun organizations.

On a slightly related note a gentleman on the forum I frequent brought up another point that might be worth discussing in the future.


I'd like to push for clear legalization of non-pyrotechnic, recreational explosives in small amounts. Tannerite, despite Dan Tanner's protestations, is not legally mixable or useable in WA without all kinds of licensing and hazmat equipment.
Good writeup here from 2008, but still relevant. (http://blog.ryjones.org/2008/05/22/wishing-doesnt-make-it-so/)

Shanghai Dan
April 12, 2011, 09:46 PM
Heck, I'd settle for opening up the "concealed knife" carry laws. Right now - even with a CCW permit - you cannot carry most knives concealed if you really want to get down to it. Pretty much any concealed (like under a winter jacket) hunting knife could get you busted.

SBR would be interesting, but let's also clean up our knife laws.

Ranb
April 17, 2011, 11:36 AM
SBS/SBR bills submited.

Here is bill 2099. http://apps.leg.wa.gov/documents/billdocs/2011-12/Pdf/Bills/House%20Bills/2099.pdf

It eases restrictions on SBS/SBR by doing away with the July 1994 registration requirement and merely requiring that they be registered with the feds.

Bill 2098 is SBR only, some sort of backup bill I think. http://apps.leg.wa.gov/billinfo/summary.aspx?bill=2098&year=2011

There is a small group of people working on getting bill 2099 pushed through the legislature. It will of course not go anywhere this session, but it should make progress in 2012.

For those that want to help, there is a www.AR15.com forum member that is making a list of people so they can divide up duties to ensure everything gets done in an efficient manner. Look at this thread and contact the forum member by the name of bigscrun.

The best thing anyone can do right now is getting to know your Representatives and Senator. Write to them (not e-mail) and ask to meet with them in the future about the bill. You do not have to give specifics when you write, but ask them when it would be convenient to meet with them. If there are others who want to meet about the SBS/SBR bill, get together and meet your Rep as a team.

Randy

misobeno
April 18, 2011, 12:26 PM
I'm on it! I don't know if we should try making a public stink or if we should try sneaking this through though.

Ranb
April 18, 2011, 01:14 PM
Right now the plan is a low key one. Contact me if you need more info.

Randy
ranb40@yahoo.com

Ranb
April 18, 2011, 01:24 PM
Anyone have any sugestions on where I can find info about SBR/SBS statistics and facts? I'd hate to write a letter that amounts to nothing more than "SBS/SBRs should be legal because I like them."

Next week I plan on sending letters to every county sheriff to find out more on the crime rate associated with SBS and SBR. I should be receiving replies that say they have no such crimes or if they do, hopefully they will include the case numbers I will have asked for. If case numbers are supplied, one of us will need to go to the county court house to search the case file and determine if the sbs or SBR in question was registered or not. Some counties will demand payment for a search up to $70/hour in one case.

For letters that you send to your legislators, you can mention that WA did not have an SBS and SBR crime problem when they tried to ban them along with assault weapons back in 1994. I am sure there is and was a small amount of "sawed off shotgun" crime in WA, but I bet none of them were registered and legally possessed. SBS and SBR were not mentioned at all in the legislative intent when the bill was submitted. You can also say that shotguns with 17 inch barrels and rifles with 15 inch barrels are every bit as useful as their full size counterparts.

Ranb
April 18, 2011, 01:33 PM
If we're going to pull this off we're going to need some real industry support and we would have to be on our A-Game (No bumbling bumbleheads in greasy t-shirts, please. You might be a great guy and a staunch supporter of our 2AF rights, but you're really not our strongest representative).

You are right, we really will need industry support. I heard we had it for the silencer bill, but none of it showed up for the hearings except for WaTom. Yeah he dressed poorly and was ill prepared, but not all his fault. The guy could barely afford the gas to Olympia (I helped pay) and I gave him my talking points ten seconds after I found out I could not speak and right before he approached the committee. He really was the best the industry had to offer to the committee. He covered his stuff then went on to mine right before Kline cut him off. No one else in the industry was willing to do any better.

It was very important that WaTom showed for the hearing no matter what he was dressed like. He was the only one we could count just in case someone from the opposing side said something untrue about the silencer manufacturing indutry in WA. The rest of us at the hearings (other than the WACOPS rep) were just hobbyists representing ourselves.

If the rest of the industry ignores the committee hearings on SBS/SBR like they did for silencers, then we are counting on Tom again. Maybe he can rent a suit. :)

Ranb

misobeno
April 19, 2011, 12:24 PM
I'm already banging on a few industry local folk's doors to see if I can get them to commit some of their time to show up.

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