Maryland Consideres CCW Reform and Recognizing Out-Of State Permits?


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Sam1911
January 26, 2011, 10:28 AM
How did I miss this? http://www.fredericknewspost.com/sections/news/display.htm?StoryID=115792

...Delegate Michael Smigiel, a Republican representing Caroline, Cecil, Kent and Queen Anne's counties, suggested just such a reform on Tuesday. He argued at a hearing before the House Judiciary Committee for a bill to require Maryland to recognize concealed weapons permits in Pennsylvania, West Virginia, Virginia and Delaware...

The MD Assembly is considering recognizing out-of-state permits -- including non-resident permits from other states held by Marylanders.

The bill will have a very tough time as it faces opposition from some legislators and (of course) from the MSP who would not be able to impose their "good and substantial reason" criteria to prevent Marylanders from carrying.

I'd suggest that if you live in MD, you should make it a personal challenge to see to it that the phones of your representatives light up like the fourth of July and stay lit until this is passed.

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md2lgyk
January 26, 2011, 11:48 AM
Nice, but why not instead work on making MD a shall-issue state? Theoretically anyway, PA Won't issue a non-resident permit to somebody who doesn't have a permit from their state of residence. So what good would the proposed change do? Most Marylanders simply can't get a permit.

mgkdrgn
January 26, 2011, 12:01 PM
When this happens I hope I'm near a mirror so I can see the flaming flying monkeys coming out of my butt ....

(Maryland escapee)

cavman
January 26, 2011, 12:01 PM
Well, Virginia is a shall-issue State, and by extension so would Maryland become, as Virginia would recognize them.

"For example, a Maryland resident unable to get a permit in Maryland could seek a nonresident permit in Virginia instead. The permit would also be valid in Maryland under the legislation."--article

Sam1911
January 26, 2011, 12:12 PM
Nice, but why not instead work on making MD a shall-issue state? Sure why not? But THIS is the proposal on the table now.

Actually, the article says the original plan was to make the Sheriffs the issuing agencies instead of the MSP (which would be a BIG step toward freeing up the issuing, even if it stayed a "May Issue" state) but that fell through.

Theoretically anyway, PA Won't issue a non-resident permit to somebody who doesn't have a permit from their state of residence. So what good would the proposed change do? Most Marylanders simply can't get a permit.
PA is the only nearby state with that requirement. If this passed, as cavman said, a MD resident could easily get a permit from VA or other recognized state. I have friends down that way who spend 'most every weekend teaching rooms full of Marylanders the required courses and filling out the paperwork for them to get their UT, VA, FL, etc. permits -- just so they can carry in other states that recognize them.

It will face a lot of opposition, but showing a massive outpouring of support would give the Assembly-critters a bit of impetus to continue trying.

627PCFan
January 26, 2011, 12:41 PM
Grew up in Maryland, born and raised. Moved to VA several years ago. I have no faith in anything to do with that state (MD) anymore and its sad. Even as an out-of-stater, Id rather see residents get permits and not us. That 1st step will be the hardest.

Spot77
January 26, 2011, 02:03 PM
The hearing went well yesterday. We have some support from some unlikely people in the legislature.

The Delegate sponsoring the bill did an excellent job preparing for, and testifying during the hearing.

The state police, who are our only usual opposition had their testimony completely eviscorated.

Last year's bill failed by just one vote. The committee hearing the bill has changed a little so we'll see what happens.

zoom6zoom
January 26, 2011, 02:43 PM
I hope you can get shall-issue passed as well. It would be somewhat crazy to think that someone from out of state could carry there, while a resident can't get a permit at all.

Sam1911
January 26, 2011, 02:52 PM
It would be somewhat crazy to think that someone from out of state could carry there, while a resident can't get a permit at all.


Id rather see residents get permits and not us. That 1st step will be the hardest.


Well, remember that this would be de facto allowing any resident that wanted one to have a valid carry permit. Even if MD would not issue their own, a VA or other recognized permit is not hard to get -- many Marylanders already have one -- so it could actually be quite a boon to the Shall Issue movement.

Once Marylanders (and visitors) ARE carrying on other state's permits in MD itself, the arguments against a shall-issue system would pretty much evaporate.

gearchecker
January 26, 2011, 04:06 PM
You all deserve a serious break on this issue. I just threw up a really simple prayer that it goes well, and you can finally get to carry without the hassles currently blocking your path.
If they give it to the Sheriff's departments that will be a huge help, and reduce the burden and backlog at the state level.
It doesn't matter much which department gets to serve you in the end, as long as you get your freedom to carry.

With high regard,
gearchecker

swinokur
January 26, 2011, 05:54 PM
Don't forget the Second Amendment Foundation has sued Maryland over the "good and substantial" reason used by the MSP to deny most permits, including retired LEO]s. It in District Court right now and MD is using every delaying tactic they can because they know the handwriting is on the wall, especially in light of Heller and McDonald.

As Spot 77 said, MSP looked like a bunch of buffoons when questioned about criteria, which is none and how they apply the non existent criteria. They resorted to a bunch of govt. double speak to try and deflect the very pointed questions they were asked and had no good explanations for their non existent system of license requirements. They then tried to blame the GA because they said that's the way the law is written. People who were present knew better and their obfuscation was obvious to everyone

There were some very articulate and reasoned pro gun folks who testified, including a PHD and a Mechanical engineer. We came across a reasonable and well spoken.

Del Smiegel cleaned MSP's clock. Maybe just maybe some sanity can be restored to this gulag. We are taking baby steps on this in light of other ongoing things like the SAF lawsuit.

Maryland Shall Issue which is the grassroots organization trying to restore carry rights is very involved in this fight. Kudos to them

If you want to assist in any way including financially, their web address is


www.marylandshallissue.org (http://www.marylandshallissue.org)

If we win don't win together, we shall surely hang together. This is not a state fight any longer. It's National IMO

blackspyder
January 26, 2011, 06:14 PM
I hope MD recognizes VA CHP's (as that's whats on the table currently) but in reality I'd be even happier for them to become a "Shall Issue" state with that reciprocity for VA and other States would become much easier. Baby steps are accepted though.

fast200
January 26, 2011, 08:53 PM
I hope it happens so I can carry there but I suspect hell will freeze over before shall issue is established in the blue Maryland stronghold.

Bhamrichard
January 27, 2011, 10:10 AM
When this happens I hope I'm near a mirror so I can see the flaming flying monkeys coming out of my butt ....

Spewwwwwwwwwwwww....

Well there went a perfectly good mouthful of coffee all over the place!! Thank you! LOL

mgkdrgn
January 27, 2011, 10:46 AM
Spewwwwwwwwwwwww....

Well there went a perfectly good mouthful of coffee all over the place!! Thank you! LOL
Just be glad you didn't work in the cube next to mine when I use to do computer support from "cubeville" for a living. Lots of Coca Cola on walls of those cubes. ;-) Now I work as an independent contractor out of my home and Coke of the world is safe.

Bdautermann
November 16, 2011, 02:07 PM
I know I'm late to this conversation. Was just wondering what the final outcome of this was. I have recently had 2 attempts to break into my house, and my wife had the CD player, GPS, and a few other misc items stolen from her van. I have been looking into geting a CCW for myself, and her trying to get one also. I would love to know that my wife has the ability to protect herself at any time.

hermannr
November 16, 2011, 08:22 PM
Why would the legislature listen to the MSP? Who is the boss and who is the employee there?

I wonder if anyone would like to bring up the gun crime statistics and compare Seattle (no permit OC, must issue CPL) with say Baltimore?

Another thought. The MSP have a vested interest in crime. The more crime, the more call for control, the more tax dollars spent on crime, more MSP officers, more power...etc...

If the law abiding individual has the ability to protect himself, his family and his property, there would be less crime, les need for police, less call for funding, less men and money for the MSP to control, and less power. Not something a bully wants.

Birch Knoll
November 16, 2011, 08:39 PM
Legislators generally rely very heavily on expertise from various Executive agency heads, since legislators are rarely very knowledgeable about the topics that come before them.

Jason Porter
November 16, 2011, 09:58 PM
Nice, but why not instead work on making MD a shall-issue state? Theoretically anyway, PA Won't issue a non-resident permit to somebody who doesn't have a permit from their state of residence. So what good would the proposed change do? Most Marylanders simply can't get a permit.

Arizona issues non-resident permits with a mail-in and basic classes of instruction:

http://www.azdps.gov/Services/Concealed_Weapons/Permits/Obtain/

hermannr
November 16, 2011, 10:34 PM
Legislators generally rely very heavily on expertise from various Executive agency heads, since legislators are rarely very knowledgeable about the topics that come before them.
Yes, like the US congress did with the Native Americans and the BIA back in the 20's.

If the BIA had done the intent of congress they would have no longer had a job...follow the money....

It is much better information if you ask someone that will not be directly impacted...in MD that would be better served by the local county sheriff's as their funding would not be directly impacted by the legislation, or if impacted, it would be in a positive manner.

627PCFan
November 17, 2011, 09:55 AM
Bdautermann- the bill was killed in Annapolis.

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