[familyman555]

I found an illustration of this weapon in the book Flexible Weapons by John Sanchez. It looked pretty good and so I decided to try and make it. It has a 1 9/16 inch diameter (9 oz.) iron ball striker. The total weight is 17 oz. It fits pretty good in my front pants pocket even when seated.

[PTK]

"Practical chain mace" is a phrase I never thought I'd read or hear. Interesting, but... odd. :)

[TX expat]

Hmmm. I'm not sure how practical fits into it, but I'll give you it's neat looking.

[familyman555]

A Practical Chain Mace was what the author called it. He also used the term "Modern". I think the comparison is to the historical maces normally seen that have big spikes on the ball and a big handle. Not something that you could carry in your pocket. The maces of old were intended to fight knights with plate armour which is not used much today.

[Deltaboy]

That would get you in trouble in TX.

[Sam1911]

Just out of curiosity... wouldn't that meet most states' definition of a "slung shot?" A lot of impact weapons seem to still be in the "dark ages" in weapons law. Even if you can carry a gun, sometimes it is illegal to carry a lead sap, lead-lined gloves, brass knuckles, nunchuks, expandable batons, and various edged weapons like switchblades or daggers of various definition.

Not that you said you were going to be out-and-about with it, but some might.


...

Like a lot of other impact weapons, it can be deadly, but without skills/practice you might end up hurting yourself (even in practice :uhoh:), or being easily disarmed and hurt/killed with it.

Interesting, but practical would be a stretch, IMHO.

[JShirley]

I think that would be a flail.

Like Sam said, they tend to be illegal.

[GCBurner]

It meets the legal definition of a slung shot in Florida, and would be an illegal concealed weapon if you don't have a CCW license.

[familyman555]

I happen to have a CCW license and from my understanding of KY law I could carry this chain mace concealed. Otherwise it would be illegal to carry it or any other weapon concealed. Now, in reality, I'll stick with my pocket revolver.

[hso]

Kentucky has a weapons law that allows a holder to carry any of the otherwise prohibited weapons.

Interesting piece of hardware and I'm sure that it would do quite a bit of damage, but the legality would have to be looked into on a state by state basis since it would be considered a regulated weapon in most places.

[Motega]

mace has no chain- a club with various sized and shaped heads
spikes on a ball and chain or a mace with spikes= morning star
ball and chain has, to my knowledge always gone by the name "ball and chain"
then there's a flail which is two bars connected with a hinge or 1-2 links of chain with one bar usually longer.

[Rail Driver]

If nothing else, it's a pretty one, and I would love to have one hanging from the robe hook behind my bathroom door... If I'm ever interrupted in the restroom, something like that would be just the ticket to fit my mood.

[Double Naught Spy]

I think that would be a flail.

Right. However recent authors seem to have renamed it as a chain mace

[TX expat]

Personally I think the legality of it is actually quite secondary. If you were every unlucky enough to get into a situation where you had to use it, you'd be crucified in court for whipping out such a nasty looking device. Even if it were 'legal' to carry you'd be hard pressed to find a jury that would see past how it looks and what damage it caused.

Maybe that's why it's called 'practical', since you're practically guaranteed jail time over it!

[Old Scratch]

It is true that one never knows what a jury is thinking until the verdict.

Detracting nothing from either the flail or its creator (it appears to be a very workmanlike flail) there is a certain Monty Python quality to a "weapon" so anachronistic. A man seen brandishing a flail on the streets of New Orleans might provoke more giggles than calls to 911. The prosecutor reviewing the warrant request would probably start looking for a hidden camera planted in his office by his friends.

I would like to think that even the most deranged legislator would have a difficult time keeping a straight face while chairing the committee on a "Zero-Tolerance, Assault Mace & Flail Ban." That said, there is probably one out there right now developing a schedule of graduated penalties based on the length of the chain, number of spikes, etc.

[bigfatdave]

I like it, although I'm curious how one practices with it while not hurting one's self.

So ... it looks like you stole the handle from an awl or similar device, and the chain is pretty routine ... where did you find an iron almost-sphere with a threaded hole for the eye-bolt?

As to legal concerns, I seem to remember some stuffy old piece of paper that had the phrase "the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed" written on it ... as that ball&chain if obviously an armament, then familyman555's right to keep and bear it shall not be infringed.

[Black Butte]

Practical? Versatile maybe: tack hammer, meat tenderizer, coffee grinder, trash compactor, etc.

[JShirley]

Dave,

There's how things should be, and there's how things are.

If that phrase was correctly interpreted by all states, all of us could have standard infantry small arms~ fully-automatic rifles, machine guns, light anti-armor devices, and all man-portable munitions smaller than nuclear.

You try rolling down the street with your ZU-23 dual mount on the back of your pickup, and let us know how it goes. :(

John

[Gordon]

"ZU-23 dual mount on the back of your pickup"
now THAT'S a thought!:neener That certainly would be a felony if caught carring around ****. While a properly registered but illegally carried 1911 would be a low misdemenor in most law abiding citizen cases the first offense;). Easy choice!

[ChristopherG]

Legal questions, right: Okay. Obviously.

But the long-ago teenage D&D player in me says: Cooooool.

The temptation to hit stuff with it will obviously overwhelm you in time. What kind of practice target will you use? I've got a latex boxing dummy that I'm pretty sure could take it, based on many ASP sessions, but you might get dangerous bounce-back with that.

Come to think of it, you've obviously ALREADY hit stuff with it--so what are its handling characteristics and capabilities?

[Old Scratch]

The already-noted Pythonesque flavor of gun laws:

...And ONE shall be the number of barrels in thy 23mm AAA.

FOUR is right out. Neither shall thee have TWO, but ONE shall be the number of barrels.

[familyman555]

I like it, although I'm curious how one practices with it while not hurting one's self.

So ... it looks like you stole the handle from an awl or similar device, and the chain is pretty routine ... where did you find an iron almost-sphere with a threaded hole for the eye-bolt?

As to legal concerns, I seem to remember some stuffy old piece of paper that had the phrase "the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed" written on it ... as that ball&chain if obviously an armament, then familyman555's right to keep and bear it shall not be infringed.
The striker is a solid iron ball used for ornamental iron fences. I drilled and tapped it.

[familyman555]

I like it, although I'm curious how one practices with it while not hurting one's self.

So ... it looks like you stole the handle from an awl or similar device, and the chain is pretty routine ... where did you find an iron almost-sphere with a threaded hole for the eye-bolt?

As to legal concerns, I seem to remember some stuffy old piece of paper that had the phrase "the right of the people to keep and bear arms shall not be infringed" written on it ... as that ball&chain if obviously an armament, then familyman555's right to keep and bear it shall not be infringed.
Beyond wearing heavy gloves and probably something to cover your forearm as well, the book I got it from recommended a couple things for practice. The first recommendation would be a short kata type thing where you imagine a scenario and act it out but with your swings going through free air. Probably no more than five moves. The second recommendation was impact practice on a wood post covered 6 or 7 inches deep with carpet. This would reduce the rebound to more of a dead stop and make the target more like a real attacker. A short length of bare post left exposed above the carpet could be the skull which would produce some rebound. A further refinement would be to strap a stick arm to the post with a padded glove end. The third recommendation is live practice with mock weapons like rope and a soft foam rubber or cloth ball end vs. a person armed with a rubber knife or other mock weapon. Ideally some combination of all three methods would probably be used. The live practice could act out different scenarios to see what worked and didn’t work.

The striker is a solid iron ball used for ornamental iron fences. I drilled and tapped it.

[familyman555]

Legal questions, right: Okay. Obviously.

But the long-ago teenage D&D player in me says: Cooooool.

The temptation to hit stuff with it will obviously overwhelm you in time. What kind of practice target will you use? I've got a latex boxing dummy that I'm pretty sure could take it, based on many ASP sessions, but you might get dangerous bounce-back with that.

Come to think of it, you've obviously ALREADY hit stuff with it--so what are its handling characteristics and capabilities?
I don't think that I can yet answer the question about the handling characteristics. The book said that of many flexible weapons developed over past centuries this one was the easiest to use. I can see one good strike from a ready position that might end a fight if it connected but I need to play with it some more to give my assessment of it for how a second and third strike attempt would work.

[JShirley]

I did a lot of training with a weighted chain for a belt test. You learn to dodge quickly. ;)

[gordy]

Did you ever see Kill Bill?
There is a striking (pun intended) young lady with a mace.
It didn't turn out to well for her.
Might be fun to play with, I would want one made out of a white foam ball to use in till I knew I was not going to hit myself in the head.
But My wife could put it on Funniest Home Video's and could win some money.

[memphisjim]

I'd make tether for it. I see that as slightly more effective. And way less utilitarian than say a big. Rampage chain

[leadcounsel]

It's a cool novelty, that's for certain. And probably a fantastic weapon for poor serfs who might need to fight slow, encumbered, armored knights.... The long ago D&D fan in me also thinks that weapons of yore are darn sweet...

But ... in the real modern world, it's neither practical, legal, wise, nor efficient given all of the relatively inexpensive and significantly more lethal options.

Without a doubt, 100% of people would view that instrument (whether a flail, mace, or club) as a lethal weapon.

A basic understanding of lawful use of lethal force necessarly starts and ends with "Can I use lethal force?" In a nutshell, NO, unless you are being attacked or threatened with lethal force. Doing so pre-emptively means that you lose the right of self defense. So, here are two common scenarios:

1) You are threatened with non-lethal force. You have the right of non-lethal self defense. As soon as you draw a lethal weapon, you are now the aggressor and the OTHER person is the victim and has the right to use LETHAL force (gun, knife, etc.) against YOU. Bad move.

2) You are threatened with lethal force. Numbers, gun, knife, etc. Instead of drawing an effective weapon, like a handgun, you attempt to defend yourself with said flail. Also probably a bad move.

So, the moral is, while it's probably a cool novelty, time and effort would be better spent on training with your CCW of choice. Enjoy!

[Jim Watson]

A fun project, no doubt; I'll leave the legality and practicality vs modern weapons to others. But it is going to take some technique to avoid flailing onesself. Ever seen a smart alec with his first nunchuks? Ouch.

[Mike OTDP]

Nunchaku are tricky...and the movie techniques have no relationship to serious fighting techniques.

Although as far as weapons that bite back, kama take first prize, in my opinion. You have to be very, very careful with blade orientation.