[Gergify]

So I'm shopping around for a new weapon. Mainly something that will last me for as long as I need it. Will see mostly range shooting / fun shooting. However I'm also looking for something that could work as SHTF rifle as well. By SHTF I mean physical protection, but also piratical survival like hunting and such.

I've looked at both AR-15 and Ak-47. I like both, however I like the reliability of the AK and the accuracy of the AR (who doesn't) and I can't decide on either. I've started looking into Bull-pups, because I really love the feel of them.

I've heard mixed opinions about the Kel-tec RFB. Just want to know what you guys think in terms of what I'll be using for if its a good choice.

Here is what i've come up with:

Pros:
1.) .308 caliber: Large powerful round, suitable for hunting and long range shots. It's expensive, but it will better justify me getting into reloading
2.) Bull pup: For me I love the compactness of the rifle
3.) Unique: Could be a pro or con, depending on the person. I personally like the look
4.) FAL mag compatible: No proprietary magazines

Cons:
1.) a bit over my price range. Hard to find used
2.) Not a lot of info about longevity or reliability in adverse conditions
3.) In a SHTF scenario, replacement parts will be nonexistent.

So is it worth spending my effort on, or should I continue to look at Ar-15 and Ak-47s? The more proven systems?

[General Geoff]

The RFB is in a different category from the AR-15 and AK-47 style rifles. It is chambered for a full power rifle cartridge, not an intermediate cartridge. That said, in a SHTF scenario, realistically, you won't need too many replacement parts since society will either calm down before you need them, or, if you survive long enough to wear out your rifle, you could easily just scavenge a more suitable and easier-to-find replacement.

Any quality AR-15 will not suffer undue reliability issues. Likewise, any quality AK will be plenty accurate for most combat purposes. The main difference comes with sights and optics mounting options between the two platforms. The AR is far more modular and much more suited to modern optics than the AK. That's why you're paying more. And yes, when push comes to shove, it is somewhat more inherently accurate.

The RFB is very new. And you will pay a premium for one until supply catches up to demand. But from all reports I've seen, they're solid rifles.

Also keep in mind that the savings from ammo cost alone, by choosing an AR or AK, will allow you to afford an RFB in a couple years anyway, even if you only go to the range occasionally. .308 is easily double the cost of 5.56x45/7.62x39.

[TIMC]

If you don't have and AR or AK then get one of those before busting out on the RFB.
I own several AR's, a couple of AK's and an M1A as well as the RFB. I think the RFB is a nice rifle but I would not buy it before owning an AR or AK.

Don't get me wrong, I like my RFB but not as my first go to rifle. As far as a SHTF rifle you really shouldn't worry about parts. If things are really that bad the cold truth is your rilfe will probably survive longer than you will whatever you have. also what ever you have if you need to use it and win you will probably have other weapons to claim after the fight.

[Girodin]

Cons:
1.) a bit over my price range. Hard to find used

I'd change that to simply: Hard to find.

[epijunkie67]

It sounds like you like the idea of a .308 but aren't excited about the price of the KelTec. Have you considered a Saiga in .308? AK frame, .308 round, high cap mags, pretty accurate (less than an AR, but still accurate), and pretty inexpensive.

There are a variety of improvements you can make to the sights including a techsights addition, and with an integrated scope rail you can add pretty much any optics you want.

It's one of the best "bang for your buck" .308s I know of.

[Water-Man]

I don't quite understand the comments about not surviving in a SHTF situation.:confused: I fully intend to survive.;)

[Zerodefect]

A good AR is extremely reliable. Just don't pack it with mud or do stupid things with it. For any practical use in the US, the AR will be perfectly reliable. Just avoid the cheap imitations and stick to quality brands like: BCM, Colt, Larue, LMT and you'll be fine.

Unfortunatly I rarely see a quality AK, most I've handled are just Chinese rattle traps.

I like Keltecs new shot gun. But I'll pass on the RFB. .308 in a bullpup deosn't suit any of my needs.

Also check out the FN FS2000, LMT .308, 14.5" BCM's.

[TIMC]

I don't quite understand the comments about not surviving in a SHTF situation. I fully intend to survive.

We all "intend" to survive but the point I was making is if the world gets that bad where there is a total loss of civil authority and people are killing each other for food one person on his own will not likely survive more than a short time in an urban environment. Proper training and safety in numbers is where you would have the best chance but even that could be unlikely for the average person. I know that doesn't paint a rosy picture but it is probably closer to the truth of how it would be. Mexico right now is a good example for just a glimpse of how it would be and they still have federal authority

Back to the RFB; I do think it would be a great gun for room clearing but experience from mine tells me hearing protection is required for this rifle. The bullpup design puts your ears much closer to the muzzle than other rifle designs.

[epijunkie67]

Back to the RFB; I do think it would be a great gun for room clearing but experience from mine tells me hearing protection is required for this rifle. The bullpup design puts your ears much closer to the muzzle than other rifle designs.
I've looked at the RFB and considered getting a silencer for it for just this reason. The ones for .308 tend to be about 8-9" long which would add at least 6" to the barrel length but it would seriously reduce all that muzzle blast.

I wonder if you could get one half that length that wouldn't fully muffle the blast but just reduce it significantly while still preserving the compact length and weigh less in the process?

[henschman]

If you like the greater power, max effective range, and penetration of the .308/7.62x51 yet you want a more tried and true design with more available spare parts to stock up on, you might look at some different rifles in that caliber... to name a few, the M-14/M1A, the various .308 ARs, the FAL, the Saiga .308, the G-3 based rifles like the HK-91, PTR-91, and CETME. None of those are bullpups though... unless you get the bullpup conversion for an M-14.

I would personally never totally rely on an untried rifle with no spare parts, like an RFB, for a SHTF rifle. Nothing wrong with having one, but it ought to at least be backed up by something you know you can rely on when the chips are down. The Kel Tec may end up proving itself, and spare parts may become readily available, but until then I will keep my M1A as my main battle rifle.