Firing homemade PAPER shotgun


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Wolfsbane
February 20, 2011, 12:42 AM
I'm not sure if this is the place for this or not.

Take a look at these videos. It sounds like a kid. He made an operational shotgun and shells out of glue impregnated paper.

Homemade Paper Shotgun (ignition test)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m3YSbIGjBQ8

Homemade Paper Shotgun

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IVrRHyRXwq4

Homemade Paper Shotgun Disassembly

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sLpIq57nqoE

Homemade Shotgun (Trigger Group)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XaF3nhSzTDY

shotgun shell stop pt.1

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y4RGZkbhMIk

shotgun shell stop pt.2

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W9P9zUlZcsM

Teaser 2

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=otAFUy32AD0

homemade shotgun shells

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z65q5nk-c8w

homemade primer description

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n4195PUfieE

I'm not sure if this kid is the next John Browning or the next tragic negative firearm news statistic. He's clearly made a firing weapon.

BTW, he's also has videos on making an AK, an MG42, a K98 and a 1911.

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NavyLCDR
February 20, 2011, 12:50 AM
In order to bring this into the realm of legal....

18 USC 922:

(p)
(1) It shall be unlawful for any person to manufacture, import, sell, ship, deliver, possess, transfer, or receive any firearm—
(A) that, after removal of grips, stocks, and magazines, is not as detectable as the Security Exemplar, by walk-through metal detectors calibrated and operated to detect the Security Exemplar; or
(B) any major component of which, when subjected to inspection by the types of x-ray machines commonly used at airports, does not generate an image that accurately depicts the shape of the component. Barium sulfate or other compounds may be used in the fabrication of the component.
(2) For purposes of this subsection—
(A) the term “firearm” does not include the frame or receiver of any such weapon;
(B) the term “major component” means, with respect to a firearm, the barrel, the slide or cylinder, or the frame or receiver of the firearm; and
(C) the term “Security Exemplar” means an object, to be fabricated at the direction of the Attorney General, that is—
(i) constructed of, during the 12-month period beginning on the date of the enactment of this subsection, 3.7 ounces of material type 17–4 PH stainless steel in a shape resembling a handgun; and
(ii) suitable for testing and calibrating metal detectors:
Provided, however, That at the close of such 12-month period, and at appropriate times thereafter the Attorney General shall promulgate regulations to permit the manufacture, importation, sale, shipment, delivery, possession, transfer, or receipt of firearms previously prohibited under this subparagraph that are as detectable as a “Security Exemplar” which contains 3.7 ounces of material type 17–4 PH stainless steel, in a shape resembling a handgun, or such lesser amount as is detectable in view of advances in state-of-the-art developments in weapons detection technology.

LiENUS
February 20, 2011, 02:59 AM
Navy I don't believe it is actually a functioning firearm. It does in fact fire however it fires confetti rolls that appeared to stay attached to the shotgun itself in video I saw. It might fall under some form of fireworks law however.

LiENUS
February 20, 2011, 03:04 AM
Correcting myself in the homemade shotgun shells video wolfsbane linked to he is in fact putting copper plated BBs in. I was refering to this video http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MnE8IIO3-Dk&NR=1&feature=fvwp where he fires confetti type stuff.

Manco
February 20, 2011, 03:21 AM
So what does he intend to shoot with it, paper tigers? :p

Shadow 7D
February 20, 2011, 03:49 AM
It's a form of zip gun, and does work
there have been cases of paper, or paper and metal (thin at that) zip guns being used in prisons.

For fun, look up paper spear gun/crossbows. Yeah that gives a CO nightmares.

FIVETWOSEVEN
February 20, 2011, 11:10 AM
This kid is a genius, but he is doing what I interpret is illegal, he made a paper silencer for his paper 1911.

Shadow 7D
February 20, 2011, 07:07 PM
Um, zip guns are illegal...

tyeo098
February 20, 2011, 07:17 PM
Its more like a homemade bb/airsoft gun.

If he put a real shell in that thing it would asplode.

FIVETWOSEVEN
February 20, 2011, 09:40 PM
It uses a modern form of firing a cartridge.

tyeo098
February 20, 2011, 09:44 PM
It uses a modern form of firing a cartridge.
So the mechanism it uses determines whether or not its a firearm, regardless of whether or not it actually shoots?

Shadow 7D
February 20, 2011, 11:23 PM
The term “firearms” is defined in 27 CFR § 447.11 as
“A weapon, and all components and parts therefore, not over .50 caliber
which will or is designed to or may be readily converted to expel a
projectile by the action of an explosive, but shall not include BB and pellet
guns, and muzzle loading (black powder) firearms (including any firearm
with a matchlock, flintlock, percussion cap, or similar type of ignition
system) or firearms covered by Category 1(a) established to have been
manufactured in or before 1898.”

Legionnaire
February 21, 2011, 09:05 AM
Looks to me that would be illegal ... at least on paper ... :D

tyeo098
February 21, 2011, 12:31 PM
So if he lined it in tinfoil, that would make it legal since it would show up on an xray?

It looks like hes just using the primer to send thing ablaze...

MrCleanOK
February 21, 2011, 01:05 PM
The shell has a black powder charge, and I would think having a fixed cartridge would make it specifically not a muzzleloader.

Zoogster
February 21, 2011, 05:30 PM
Shadow 7D: It's a form of zip gun, and does work

It is not a zip gun, it is a real gun.

There is no federal laws against "zip guns", and in states with the term the definition varies and is highly subjective.
However the action operates entirely as many real guns, so to declare it a "zip gun" even in those states would be akin to declaring the same actions in metal "zip guns" outlawing many real firearms.
However to even include the "zip gun" argument requires him to be in such a state.

This thing is designed and functions much as a common action, it does not hide the fact that it is a firearm, and there is no law against building your own personal firearm.

Shadow 7D: Um, zip guns are illegal...

Not federally, and not in most states. There is no federal definition of "zip gun", though there is some that would fall into the realm of AOWs like pen guns. This however is not such a design.
This is a firearm.

FIVETWOSEVEN: but he is doing what I interpret is illegal, he made a paper silencer for his paper 1911.

That would be a different video, but could be valid if it was also a functioning firearm.
However that has nothing to do with the paper shotgun.


Legionnaire: Looks to me that would be illegal ... at least on paper ...

I see the joke, but why?


As for the law NavyLT cited:


(1) It shall be unlawful for any person to manufacture, import, sell, ship, deliver, possess, transfer, or receive any firearm—
(A) that, after removal of grips, stocks, and magazines, is not as detectable as the Security Exemplar, by walk-through metal detectors calibrated and operated to detect the Security Exemplar

So it needs to be as able to trigger a detector as the "security exemplar" with in this case the shotgun stock removed.
That means any internal metal components could towards that.
Let us see what the "security exemplar" is:


(C) the term “Security Exemplar” means an object, to be fabricated at the direction of the Attorney General, that is—
(i) constructed of, during the 12-month period beginning on the date of the enactment of this subsection, 3.7 ounces of material type 17–4 PH stainless steel in a shape resembling a handgun


So it needs to be as sensitive as 3.7 ounces of a stainless steel, an alloyed steel that is itself far from the most ferrous or magnetic of materials, and an even smaller amount of other materials would qualify.


The trigger group clearly has metal in it, it has a spring, a rod, and other metal.
These alone may be plenty.


Also "the types of x-ray machines commonly used at airports" are some pretty high quality x-rays post 9/11 and can see clothing and all sorts of materials.
The legislation says nothing about requiring the item be metal or the outline be metallic, but rather than it be visible to the X-ray.
I think this thing, especially with the black paint that likely has a metallic pigment, would be easily visible to modern X-ray machines at airports.
While this is the only part of the law that could possibly be interpreted against the individual, I imagine modern airport X-ray machines would have no problem seeing it and its outline along with the metallic internals.



If this individual is over 18 they have legally created a shotgun.
A real shotgun firing real ammo, just very weak ammo.


Edit to add: Though the ATF could declare it to have "no sporting purpose" as a firearm over .50 bore diameter, and thus an illegal "Destructive Device".

Zane
February 22, 2011, 12:49 AM
I hope is is really careful with his MG42. Given his attention to detail and that his other examples actually fire, he might actually make an NFA item out of paper and glue.

o Unforgiven o
February 22, 2011, 05:08 AM
The term “firearms” is defined in 27 CFR § 447.11 as
“A weapon, and all components and parts therefore, not over .50 caliber
which will or is designed to or may be readily converted to expel a
projectile by the action of an explosive, but shall not include BB and pellet
guns, and muzzle loading (black powder) firearms (including any firearm
with a matchlock, flintlock, percussion cap, or similar type of ignition
system) or firearms covered by Category 1(a) established to have been
manufactured in or before 1898.”

Im no lawyer, but does'nt the fact that it is a bb gun make it legal?

Shadow 7D
February 22, 2011, 08:00 AM
NO
which will or is designed to or may be readily converted to expel a
projectile by the action of an explosive


Somewhere in the tangle there is a definition that states an AIRGUN (bb etc. but on that works on PNEUMATICS) is NOT a gun, but put a cartridge in it and now you have a GUN

Shadow 7D
February 22, 2011, 08:02 AM
So you could have 9mm Automatic, but you would need a hell of a scuba tank to run it.

xcgates
February 22, 2011, 08:10 AM
From an engineering perspective, that is sweet! We could use more people like him, and fewer laws here.

Colonel
February 22, 2011, 08:29 AM
So you could have 9mm Automatic, but you would need a hell of a scuba tank to run it.

Where there's a will...

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcT4QIVct_vqsEHr1U25kXMRvojZ5_uF1pFipQov-qylstfA-7eC9w

Coyote3855
February 22, 2011, 11:35 AM
^^^^^ Excellent.

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