Springfield loaded 1911 shooting low left?


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Johnny Lightning
February 20, 2011, 06:01 AM
So i got a new Springfield loaded 1911 for x-mas and love it except it consisteltly shoots low left (up to 400 rounds). The low part does not bother me too much and I can train myself to adjust but the left part has me stumped. I would call myself a novice shooter that is a beginner w/ a 1911. I also shoot a G17, a Browning Buckmark, and a Ruger LCP and shoot all of them dead on. I took the 1911 to my local gun smith and he checked it out and said the sights (factory night sights) are fine and he even shot it a couple of times and said that he felt it was shooting center?!? A couple of people have told me to change my grip but if I have to do that it does not feel natual to me in my hand and does not seem to make any difference in the shooting accuracy. I am at the point of wanting to change the rear sight to an adjustable sight possibly the one that springfield makes. If I do that do I need to change the front sight out?

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Twinbrook86
February 20, 2011, 06:20 AM
If your right handed

You are squeezing the trigger to hard

Have some toss in a snap cap in your mag and watch your flinch

Dry fire to correct

Johnny Lightning
February 20, 2011, 06:27 AM
Is it ok to dry fire a 1911? I do not have snap caps currently. If i were flinching wouldn't my shots be all over the place? i am tearing a ragged hole low left w/ only the occasional flyer :)

HM2PAC
February 20, 2011, 06:59 AM
Dry firing is fine. Do it a lot.

Hopefully someone will post a "Flinch Wheel" for you on this thread.

Consistently Low/Left is usually squeezing the trigger too hard.

My own personal solution for this is to get the shooter's fingertip on the trigger rather than the pad or knuckle joint.

mbruce
February 20, 2011, 07:53 AM
Is it ok to dry fire a 1911? I do not have snap caps currently. If i were flinching wouldn't my shots be all over the place? i am tearing a ragged hole low left w/ only the occasional flyer :)
Not if you are consistent with your flinches, if any.

If you are squeezing the trigger consistently but incorrectly from a technique perspective then you will have consistent groups...may be low left..etc...but consistent.

Put that bad boy on some sand bags or a vise and fire away....then again firing from a vise isn't as easy as it seems...I found that out too. It took me a couple hundred rounds to figure shooting from a vise...but I'm slow learner and a bad shot ;-)

Toforo
February 20, 2011, 08:49 AM
See if this helps.....



http://i832.photobucket.com/albums/zz243/Toforo/KTOG/TargetGuide.gif



:)

Toforo
February 20, 2011, 08:54 AM
My own personal solution for this is to get the shooter's fingertip on the trigger rather than the pad or knuckle joint

+1
that should help big time!

Carl N. Brown
February 20, 2011, 09:00 AM
At times I have had all the faults illustrated in the chart above. AND in the past I tried to adjust the sights to compensate for what I was doing wrong, and ended up chasing groups low and left in spite of adjusting the sights to try to compensate for my bad habits.

ExMachina
February 20, 2011, 09:28 AM
You say that you shoot your other guns just fine? If you really have a flinch then those should be off too.

Assuming for a minute that your problem is in fact the sights and not the shooter, you CAN adjust your "fixed" sights for windage (right/left)

Johnny Lightning
February 20, 2011, 09:32 AM
K Im gonna keep practicing and try to use just my fingertip for now. I have really been trying to squeeze the trigger and not jerk knowing I am shooting low left. What I dont understand is that i shoot the other pistols i own almost dead on and am having trouble w/ the 1911 platform - anyone else seem to have this problem?

Toforo
February 20, 2011, 09:35 AM
anyone else seem to have this problem?

Some shooters have this (and other) problems when shooting a new/different model gun than they are used to.

How many?
Enough that they make these charts to help.... lol !

jem375
February 20, 2011, 10:28 AM
I had the same problem with a G26, and yes it is your trigger finger. I was pulling nearly all of my shots low left also. Finally realized it was my fault and not the gun...

The Lone Haranguer
February 20, 2011, 11:46 AM
If i were flinching wouldn't my shots be all over the place?
Not necessarily. You could be doing the same thing wrong every time, but consistently. (This was not meant to be facetious.) Try either shooting it from a rigid rest at a consistent, visible aiming point, or having another shooter of known ability try it. There is, of course, always the possibility that the sights really are "off." This gun should have a Novak rear sight, which can be adjusted by loosening the allen-head set screw and moving the sight (it will usually push with your fingers) in the direction you want your shots to go, in this case to the right. This will however only adjust the windage (horizontal deflection). To change the elevation (vertical deflection), you have to change the height of the sights. If they are truly that far off, the gun should be sent back to Springfield, IMO.

mister2
February 20, 2011, 12:07 PM
I have noticed that when moving from one handgun to another (which is everytime I'm at the range), the first magazine will not be as tight (or centered) as later groups which tells me I take some time to adjust to the pistol, etc. This could be true, even moving from one 1911 to another 1911, because of different grips, sights, ammo, etc. Even bigger disparities between DA/SA and 1911, etc. And I'll find as I tire, my groups will open up again.

If I center and tighten up at some point, it may be just more familiarity and comfort level, especially if this is my first 1911. More practice just enables me to stay in the sweet spot longer.

I don't dry fire, per se. I use a small rubber bumper to make sure the hammer never impacts the FP/FPS. This is especially useful when I'm mating surfaces in after a sear touchup, or something. Could be used for aim/trigger practice, too.

Good luck!

SGW42
February 20, 2011, 12:24 PM
I had the same problem when I bought a P220 after having shot a Ruger Mk II for nearly a decade.

Because it was a centerfire I thought I had to hold on to the gun tighter. I was strangling the grip on the gun. I had to get over the fact that the gun would not just fly out of my hand if I didn't have a death grip on it.

I adjusted my grip to put the pad of my finger on the trigger face, and relaxed my grip appropriately, now I can put the bullet holes where I want them.

Johnny Lightning
February 20, 2011, 06:04 PM
After reading some of the problems that other shooters are having and what caused it, I think I may be girpping the 1911 too tight and i may want to think about a new grip that is fuller so that my grip is more natural when shooting.

bigfatdave
February 20, 2011, 06:58 PM
So when do the snap caps you ordered arrive?

brandon_mcg
February 20, 2011, 07:29 PM
had this problem when i transitioned from 9mm to .45 acp. thought i had to have a death grip on the pistol to compensate for the recoil but after 100 or so rounds i finally loosened up and started putting some better shots on target.

hirundo82
February 20, 2011, 08:22 PM
Try warming up with your Buckmark before you go to the 1911. The Buckmark has a similar grip angle and trigger pull to the 1911, and I've found it helps me to get my grip and trigger squeeze correct before moving to the greater recoil of the .45.

Cascades
February 21, 2011, 01:10 AM
Hitting low and left here also. I've had my 1911 for about a month.
I knew it was something I was doing, and everyone's advice seems to fit the problem.

I had read a few articles on how to grip semi handguns, and those I saw said to grip quite firmly. After reading this thread, I'll try a more relaxed grip.

Thanks to all for the shooting tips.

wow6599
February 21, 2011, 11:43 AM
IIRC, SA sends out a lot of Loaded models with front sights that are too high. I sent one in for a few issues and they replaced the front sight with a lower one.....problem solved.

9mmepiphany
February 21, 2011, 12:40 PM
Not know which grip you guys are using I'll make a general grip observation.

The 1911 responds very well to the Thumbs Forward grip. You have to keep the right (assuming you are right handed) thumb on the thumb safety anyway (it is a function/safety issue), so if you just slide your left hand up on the gun, there is a lot of room to point the thumb forward. This does pre-suppose that you are shooting out of a Modern Isosceles stance

TIMC
February 21, 2011, 12:45 PM
Another question; what ammo are you using? Try something different in weight, this also can help.

Lonestar49
February 21, 2011, 02:19 PM
K Im gonna keep practicing and try to use just my fingertip for now. I have really been trying to squeeze the trigger and not jerk knowing I am shooting low left. What I dont understand is that i shoot the other pistols i own almost dead on and am having trouble w/ the 1911 platform - anyone else seem to have this problem?



...

Owning just one, as of now, the 1911 platform actually, IMHO, is one of the best, if not, the_best, due to both its thinner grip and the SAO trigger weight/pull and smoothness it offers vs all my other DA/SA platform Sigs and Beretta.

I shoot the DA/SA/'s far more than the one EMP 1911 9mm and whenever I do take the little 1911 to the range the transformation in both grip/difference/ girth wise, is very evident, along with the lighter trigger pull vs the SA's in most of my DA/SA guns but I never have a problem of, and with, the transition, be with my 1911 or others, at my range, that have problems, much like yours, low and left or FTF/FTE jams. Most of the time it always comes down to shooter error with limp-wristing as far as the jams go and it's always the jerking of the trigger because they're chasing the sights, namely, front, jerking the shot as it passes, or gets on, the point/bulls eye - they're wanting to hit it/and it's take the shot - now!!!

The other, (changing grip-movement) shots going left, problem, can be (low time) lack of understanding of the 45caliber, in that, it does not offer the same recoil-effects of either 9mm or 40cal, et. al., in that, it pushes back far more than flips up. But, in order for you to see/feel the difference, accuracy wise you're gonna need to adjust to things. First, squeezing/pressing off the shot along with not "tightening your grip - fingers", namely, support hand grip/fingers right at the moment of taking the shot.. will twist the gun left every-time and something you can see very easily with "little pressure" while you're practicing trigger pulls using snap caps mentioned below.

Find the right/correct/balanced grip and trust it and don't chase the front sight in "taking the shot too quickly, as in the_now !! effect. Just shoot relaxed by letting the gun do what it does best and your accuracy should come home and at the same time the shots, going left will cease more and more either by grip being stable a/o not jerking the trigger/chasing the front sight/target.

And, keep your focus on the front sight and don't look to see where the shot/s are hitting until "after the shot/s" have been taken.

New gun, new feelings, new changes, that in the long term, usually roll over to most any other type semi handgun and caliber.

Ref: Snap Caps

But get them in 45cal

http://i217.photobucket.com/albums/cc306/Lonestar49/9b_1.jpg

So, "get a pack of snap caps" around 14 bucks or less, load one in the chamber and have one reserve in the mag to practice a cycling procedure now and then as they really do help preserve your firing pin and its spring as it is "meant to hit something" to stop short of "over travel" which stretches the spring until.. well, you don't want it a broken firing pin - no bang/s.. Thus the use of snap caps IMHO..

Enjoy,


Ls

Cascades
February 21, 2011, 10:32 PM
Mine is a Delta Elite. Those .45 caps--might have to use a big hammer and punch to get them to chamber!

Lonestar49
February 21, 2011, 10:51 PM
...

Mine is a Delta Elite. Those .45 caps--might have to use a big hammer and punch to get them to chamber!




Need a big hammer and punch to chamber the caps.. LMAO

Not a chance, as I've use the 45cal snap caps, same brand as above pic/shown in my Colt 1911 Defender and my Sig P220R 45..

They rack *full pull/release of slide and chamber no different than any brand, real, 45 bullets in any make/model/45 1911 or otherwise with the only possibly of not, in a tight, tight, chamber, race gun.. maybe, but any standard issue 1911 NIB, they work fine.


Ls

Cascades
February 21, 2011, 11:25 PM
Since I don't know if you are laughing at me or with me--I figured people here would know that the Delta Elite is a 10mm not a .45. I also figured the .45 caps would not fit the 10mm.

Lonestar49
February 22, 2011, 02:02 AM
...

Just didn't want to scare off the OP's question as to use of them for his 45..

Ya had me going.. :D


Ls

Cascades
February 22, 2011, 04:45 AM
Whew!

ravot
February 22, 2011, 09:47 PM
i'm new to this, so bear the dumb question. i just got (2 more days waiting) a 1911 in 9mm format. obviously i'd get snap caps in 9mm size right? (duh) and this helps how exactly? watching how i squeeze and at the same time preserving the firing ping and other parts?

The Lone Haranguer
February 22, 2011, 10:00 PM
ravot: You've answered your own questions.

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