1911 in 9mm


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greenscape
February 24, 2011, 08:30 PM
Well I posted earlier this week about a Ruger SR9. And it looks nice but now I am thinking about maybe upping the ante and going for a 1911 in 9mm. I like the thought of the low recoil, potential accuracy and the price of the rounds for lots of shooting. Any suggestions ? Smith and Kimber make one. what other choices do I have ? Thanks

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SharpsDressedMan
February 24, 2011, 08:32 PM
Easy. Buy any .38 Super 1911, and get a 9mm barrel and magazine (and maybe a 14-16lb. spring). They work great. Then you'll be able to shoot 9mm all you want, and have the potential of .38 Super for heaver loads.

jrod102
February 24, 2011, 09:10 PM
IDK how much $$$ you want to drop on one but you did mention Kimber and they arn't the cheapest gun out there. You didn't mention what this gun's functionality is as in a ccw gun or a range plinker or what-have ya. That being said I don't know if you want it full size or a compact. Well moving right along,... let me get to the gun at hand. If you can spend about $1100 give or take you need to get a Springfield EMP in 9mm. Sweetest gun in my extensive collection buy far. I wouldn't take love, money, or a share in the rail road for it and it would be the last one I'd part with. Never a failure on any front. Most accurate gun out of the box of any I've ever had. It may cost you a little more than you wanted to spend up front,......... but I'm so glad I did. If a more perfect 9mm 1911 was ever made I don't know of it. I do know that the one I have is perfect for me. I tend to think you'd enjoy one as much as I have mine.
_________________________________________________________________

just because your paranoid doesn't mean they're not after you! :what:

rellascout
February 24, 2011, 09:13 PM
What is your budget?

Browns Fan
February 24, 2011, 09:19 PM
One of the guys I shoot IDPA with has a Dan Wesson Guardian. Very nice 1911!

WC145
February 24, 2011, 09:41 PM
I've got a S&W 1911 9mm Pro Series and a Fusion 9mm CCO. Both great guns, though the Fusion is pricey. If you want a full size gun you won't go wrong with the S&W. It is 100% reliable, very accurate and very fast shooting. I carry it on duty and have used it in a few IDPA matches, it is a terrific piece, one of my favorites.

https://lh4.googleusercontent.com/__3_AZOV0zhc/TNWL4ZS5yzI/AAAAAAAACdw/xTYwR_3g_RU/s576/SDC11213.JPG

Quoheleth
February 24, 2011, 09:41 PM
Rock Island has one - under $500.

I cannot speak to the reliability of their 9mm, but their .45s and .38 Supers have good reputations and I can attest to that in both a Tactical and Compact model.

Q

wally
February 24, 2011, 10:02 PM
I've got the RIA 9mm Tactical. Fantastic pistol. If your only reason to want a 9mm 1911 is to shoot cheap ammo, doesn't make a lot of sense to me to pay more.

Mine was $430 from Centerfire Systems. Already over 3000 rounds through it. Its become my wife's favorite, so I may be looking for another.

cardinalfan
February 24, 2011, 10:23 PM
Colt Defender in 9mm or Springfield EMP in 9mm

The Wiry Irishman
February 24, 2011, 11:18 PM
You can get them from STI, SVI, and Les Baer, too, if your budget is high enough.

ravot
February 24, 2011, 11:29 PM
my original budget was 6 to 700 9mm 1911. unless ur LGS has it, it'll be hard. and i wasn't too patient as the 1911 bug was killing me so si bit the bullet and got a loaded springfield 9mm form gunbroker. 900 shipped.

another option was the RIA tactical.

i want a full body and not a compact so choices get limited.
good luck my friend!

Winkman822
February 25, 2011, 01:23 PM
If your budget allows, I'd hands down recommend a custom build from Les Baer, Wilson Combat or Nighthawk Custom. Barring that, I'd say a Springfield EMP, Springfield Loaded 1911 (PX9130LP), Smith and Wesson Pro Series, Dan Wesson Pointman Nine or Dan Wesson Guardian.

Quack
February 25, 2011, 01:26 PM
9mm 1911's are fun to shoot, i have a few of them

http://photosbydon.smugmug.com/photos/1009301811_fyEgU-L.jpg

http://photosbydon.smugmug.com/photos/1004748393_vcNh2-L-2.jpg

http://photosbydon.smugmug.com/photos/1004740128_Tk8rJ-L.jpg

KodiakBeer
February 25, 2011, 01:38 PM
Why not get a Hi Power?

Hanshi
February 25, 2011, 02:35 PM
I have a custom worked Colt 1911 series 70 in .38sup which I like very much. Always said some day I'd get the barrel and mag for 9mm but still don't have it. In time.

rellascout
February 25, 2011, 05:01 PM
Why not get a Hi Power?

Not the same trigger IMHO. The Hi power is a great gun with a very good trigger if someone has done a proper trigger job but it is not a 1911.

I do not consider the EMP a 1911. It is a 1911 like pistol but they have changed enough of the internal and external dimensions and parts that it is no longer a 1911.

Quack
February 25, 2011, 05:04 PM
most of the std 1911 parts fit.

NG VI
February 25, 2011, 05:30 PM
So if you have a 9mm 1911 can you swap in a .38 Super barrel and use .38 Super magazines and have a functional pistol, or is it a one-way conversion?

Babarsac
February 25, 2011, 05:39 PM
With a $600-$700 budget you can do what I did. Call CDNN and get a S&W 5906 for $299, then call Centerfire and put one of their RIA 1911 9mm's on back-order for $380.

Double the 9mm happiness :D

SharpsDressedMan
February 25, 2011, 06:23 PM
A 9mm 1911 can be made to use a .38 Super barrel, spring, and mag, for the reverse. I even have a 10mm that shoots 9mm and .38 Suepr with the additional parts. They all can use the same slide, although an additional 9mm/.28S slide might insure just slightly better reliability, if one's 10mm slide fitted with the other barrels is finicky on extraction, etc. Mine works fine.

phamily man
February 25, 2011, 07:07 PM
Springfield EMP is a fine choice!

browneu
February 25, 2011, 07:13 PM
Fusion Firearms will make a 9mm 1911. They are nice pistols and mine is more accurate than I am.

NMGonzo
February 25, 2011, 07:49 PM
another vote for the RIA.

It will be my next gun.

G27RR
February 25, 2011, 08:02 PM
If you want a commander size for about $1K consider the STI Ranger II.

http://i1143.photobucket.com/albums/n634/G27RR/STI%20Ranger%20II/STIRangerII14.jpg

Lefty Wright
February 25, 2011, 08:28 PM
I found a lightly used Kimber Pro carry II in 9mm for around $600. Great shooter, reliable and accurate. If I buy another, it will be an STI Ranger II.

(great looking Ranger BTW)

230therapy
February 25, 2011, 08:33 PM
Another vote for the Springfield Armory EMP!

http://i484.photobucket.com/albums/rr204/230therapy/firearms/EMP/EMP-desantis.jpg

cardinalfan
February 25, 2011, 09:20 PM
Colt Defender in 9mm

robctwo
February 26, 2011, 01:14 AM
http://i39.photobucket.com/albums/e186/robctwo/DSCN0906copy.jpg

Les Baer PII, Ionbonded, f/o front sight, Esmeralda slim grips. 2k+

Very nice pistol. I like the looks of the Dan Wesson, and really like the looks of that S&W.

Ankeny
February 26, 2011, 01:03 PM
So if you have a 9mm 1911 can you swap in a .38 Super barrel and use .38 Super magazines and have a functional pistol, or is it a one-way conversion? Maybe, but probably not. A 9mm breach face is smaller than a .38 Super.

SharpsDressedMan
February 26, 2011, 07:45 PM
Any competent gunsmith can fit a .38 super barrel into a 9mm 1911 in about 30 minutes or less.

Kevinch
February 28, 2011, 09:36 AM
Why not get a Hi Power?
+1
I have (3) .45ACP handguns, all are the 1911 format. My only 9MM handgun is a Browning HP - & it wasn't because I really wanted a 9MM. I really wanted the HP, & not in .40S&W.

I'd suggest the HP.

Ankeny
February 28, 2011, 11:44 AM
Any competent gunsmith can fit a .38 super barrel into a 9mm 1911 in about 30 minutes or less. It is a well known fact in gunsmith circles that many 9mm slides have breech faces that will not accommodate .38 Super. Get advice from a gunsmith.

Edited to add. It is true most manufacturers of slides list the breech face of their slides as 9mm/.38 Super. However, I have had two 9mm slides from STI that would not accommodate .38 Super. That issue is not an STI exclusive.

Damon555
March 1, 2011, 05:49 PM
Got this used one today....Shot it 100 times and not a single problem. I love it

http://i6.photobucket.com/albums/y234/edlafond/Weapons/9mm19111.jpg

The Wiry Irishman
March 2, 2011, 12:41 AM
Edited to add. It is true most manufacturers of slides list the breech face of their slides as 9mm/.38 Super. However, I have had two 9mm slides from STI that would not accommodate .38 Super. That issue is not an STI exclusive

Another solution to this would be using one of the rimless .38 supers, like .38 super comp or .38 TJ.

Shooter57
March 2, 2011, 02:03 PM
What did you have to pay for the Kimber?

Damon555
March 2, 2011, 03:05 PM
I got it for seven bills Shooter57

Not as good a deal as my $650 Eclipse Custom II but I'm not going to complain.

KodiakBeer
March 2, 2011, 03:41 PM
I'd suggest the HP.

Yeah. It's roughly the same size and width as a 1911 and has almost double the magazine capacity - 15+1 with the Mec Gars.

I love and appreciate my 1911's for what they are, but in 9mm the Hi Power leads the pack. Just like a 1911, you can customize and give it a superb trigger.

http://t0.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:ANd9GcRAq9d-lTfNywQkRKh56nX0M_bYaDoxr9x95GcYW07DGLoc_KKRmA&t=1

Shooter57
March 2, 2011, 06:34 PM
I'd be happy with that price 555.

Cemo
March 2, 2011, 07:00 PM
I too found a used Kimber Pro Carry in 9MM. Excellent pistol. Fun to shoot. With it's alloy frame it makes an excellent choice CCW.

Rock185
March 3, 2011, 03:43 AM
Hello greenscape. I have owned several 9mm and .38 Supers by Kimber and Colt. The 9mm, in a full size steel 1911 gun, is low recoil, even with +P and +P+ ammo, and a pleasure to shoot IMHO. Ammunition is relatively cheap and plentiful. Accuracy in all my Supers and 9mms, other than the earlier .38 Super Colts that tried to headspace on the semi-rim rather than the case mouth, has been very good. The Colts and Kimbers I have owned had no issues switching from 9mm to .38 Super or vise versa. My 9mm and .38 Super Kimbers, a total of four, all had 10mm/.40 cal. breech faces and have been 100% reliable. My 10mm Kimber had the same breech face size as my 9mm and .38 Super Kimbers. I didn't think to try a 9mm or Super barrel in the 10mm Kimber I owned. ymmv

ckone
March 3, 2011, 11:42 PM
Thanks to RIA you can finally get your hands on a 9mm 1911 for under $600+ and for a while there were none below $800... they're catching on fast.

I have a STI Trojan 9mm, and for the money I do not believe it really has a rival in the marketplace, at $1K I'd pick a Trojan over any other sub-$2k offering from any other maker easy, STI builds more non-.45 1911-style guns than anybody and they have it down pretty good (now if they could just figure out how to blue a gun... different matter). That said, it has it's shortcomings and like any 1911 that's going to see a lot of use, when you end up changing parts out for it to suit you it can add up quick.

Mags are the thing, you need quality mags on a 9mm 1911 and cannot skimp, you'll need Wilson ETM's, Tripp Cobra's, or the "Springfield" Metalforms (best on non-ramped models).

Budget allowing IMHO it goes like this from low to high: 1. RIA Tactical 2.STI Spartan (probably the best bang-for-the-buck) 3.Springfield Loaded 4.(tie) STI Trojan or Les Baer Premier II 6. Custom build

I don't consider Kimber's or S&W's good choices due to their firing pin/Schwartz safety nonsense and inflated price-tags, and I also skip Wilson, Brown's and Nighthawks as they tend to be put together more for the non-shooting 1911-aficionado looking for fit-and-finish over pure performance and I've seen all of them fail more than run in IDPA and USPSA, they may be built too well/tight actially and make a tricky recipe even trickier... I also wouldn't really recommend any of the 9mm 1911 platforms built in "carry formats" such as DW's Guardian; IMO 9mm in a 1911 is fun, but also pretty much one of the most notoriously finicky combos, pretty poor choice for SD when a G17 is the same size, 10 times more reliable and half the weight with twice the firepower.
I know some might disagree with me, but honestly, in the 1911 segment, which I find super annoying, there is often more of an emphasis put on things like finish, "purdy grips" and crap like "fit was so tight I couldn't rack it for 3 years" over whether or not a guy can actually run a bunch of rounds through 'em... The collector aspect doesn't interest me much I guess, but the shooting aspect sure does.

JMHO/YMMV

snakyjake
March 4, 2011, 12:01 AM
IMO 9mm in a 1911 is fun, but also pretty much one of the most notoriously finicky combos

I've read a lot of similar posts on the forums. 9mm in 1911 don't sound reliable enough for self defense. I don't hear the same problems from Sig, HK, or some others.

HankC
March 4, 2011, 12:18 AM
Any issue with finding replacement parts? Is it same extractor as standard .45 1911? Any other parts maybe unique to 9mm? Magazine is different of course.

ckone
March 4, 2011, 12:26 AM
I've read a lot of similar posts on the forums. 9mm in 1911 don't sound reliable enough for self defense. I don't hear the same problems from Sig, HK, or some others.
Yeah, the deal is it's just not a combo that's very forgiving to those who are not interested in learning a bit about what is going on with them and what needs to work out for them to run... but it's not impossible. Basically it's a shorter round in a gun designed for a longer round (and not really known for it's inherent, hands-off reliability).

Timing is the name of the game, mostly it has to do with the springs. If the slide is moving sluggish you're f'ed, if the slide out-runs the mags you're f'ed, if the rounds nose-dive in the mags you're f'ed, etc. - you get the picture...

Seems pretty much every manufacturer over-springs the 9's from the factory, over-sprung 1911's are commonplace as they want newbies to think their guns are "tight" so if it's easy to rack 'em in the shop many think it's not right, also many believe in the myth of frame-battering (which is closer to the tooth-fairy and easterbunny than a real concern, unless you're the type of mall-ninja who's going to put 2 cases of +P+ through it with a 8lb spring as fast as you can!).

In a 9mm 1911 a 10lb recoil spring is great for all-around and where I start, but doubt you'll find even one that comes from the factory with less than a 12 or so.

snakyjake
March 4, 2011, 12:31 AM
Is there a good write-up to what needs to be done to make these more reliable?

ckone
March 4, 2011, 12:34 AM
Any issue with finding replacement parts? Is it same extractor as standard .45 1911? Any other parts maybe unique to 9mm? Magazine is different of course.
The unique to 9mm parts are: extractor, ejector, slide-stop, mags, firing pin, barrel and breech-face. Everything else is the same as the classic .45ACP 1911.

ckone
March 4, 2011, 12:47 AM
Is there a good write-up to what needs to be done to make these more reliable?
No, not really, I spent a fair amount of time on the benos forum picking up things from the many hardcore competition shooters over there before I jumped in and I have learned a lot since then. It's pretty much all about good mags and understanding when you'd want lighter springs or when you'd want heavier.
I don't want to deter or scare anyone from trying a 9mm 1911, it's about as awesome as it gets, cheap ammo, best trigger, crazy aftermarket, kicks like a .22, just want to be honest about what it takes to really have fun with them and avoid headaches... Larry Vickers said something to the effect: "If you're the type who wants to treat your gun like you treat your lawnmower, get a Glock, but if you're the type who might not mind learning to wrench on your Harley Davidson and don't mind being your own armorer you might be a candidate for a 1911..." - think that sums it up, just in 9mm you might have to be a bit better at it than with a .45, that's all.

HorseSoldier
March 4, 2011, 12:49 AM
Yeah. It's roughly the same size and width as a 1911 and has almost double the magazine capacity - 15+1 with the Mec Gars.

I love and appreciate my 1911's for what they are, but in 9mm the Hi Power leads the pack. Just like a 1911, you can customize and give it a superb trigger.

It's just not the same thing at all (which I say as a fan of both and owner of both). Trigger on the HP is nowhere near the 1911, the dimensions are different -- the HP is a great pistol, but if someone wants a 1911 in 9mm it's not the answer. The manual of arms is similar, but so is a CZ-75, an M&P 9mm with external safety, and various others -- the cosmetic resemblance between the 1911 and HP doesn't translate to them handling the same.

snakyjake
March 4, 2011, 01:14 AM
I don't want to deter or scare anyone from trying a 9mm 1911, it's about as awesome as it gets, cheap ammo, best trigger, crazy aftermarket, kicks like a .22, just want to be honest about what it takes to really have fun with them and avoid headaches... Larry Vickers said something to the effect: "If you're the type who wants to treat your gun like you treat your lawnmower, get a Glock, but if you're the type who might not mind learning to wrench on your Harley Davidson and don't mind being your own armorer you might be a candidate for a 1911..." - think that sums it up, just in 9mm you might have to be a bit better at it than with a .45, that's all.

Perhaps this is something to consider regarding a self defense weapon. I don't want to treat my SD weapon like a lawn mower. But I also don't have the time to become a 1911 expert to make sure it won't fail on me when I need it most.

ckone
March 4, 2011, 01:47 AM
If self-defense is the main concern then IMO there's absolutely no reason not to just pick up a G19/17 and start training with it, I've owned just about everything and as far as a combat handgun is concerned nobody has anything on a Glock 9mm (not a Gen4 which is a s**ty toy IMO).

A 9mm 1911, or even any 1911 in-general is probably better treated as an enthusiast's pistol. A Honda is best if you just need to get to work and get the kids to school, a dialed in 1911 is a Ferrari, different thing.

It's always the indian more than the arrow, and while I'm better than many with a one, a Glock's trigger doesn't do a guy any favors, take an IDPA or common silhouette target, mess up even a little with a Glock with a pretty good Glock trigger and you may not even be on the paper at 25 yards, that same mess up with a heavier, well-fit 1911 with a trigger that breaks like a glass rod and you are still in good shape, maybe an inch or 2 left, but still pretty accurate.

Don't underestimate the power of a nice single-action trigger on a heavy, accurate gun to make you look good, it helps a lot. If SD scenarios are the main concern, andcwe were discussing pure self-defense or protection tactics then no question, I'd choose a Glock, but if I wanted to take the BG's eye out at 25 yards I'd want the 1911...

WC145
March 4, 2011, 10:08 AM
Quote:
IMO 9mm in a 1911 is fun, but also pretty much one of the most notoriously finicky combos

I've read a lot of similar posts on the forums. 9mm in 1911 don't sound reliable enough for self defense. I don't hear the same problems from Sig, HK, or some others.

It's not like the 9mm 1911 is a new idea, they've been around for better than half a century. If you've got a gun that doesn't work the problem isn't the caliber and the factory should be making it right. I own a number of 1911's in .45, .38 Super, and 9mm. As I posted earlier in this thread, my S&W 1911 9mm Pro Series is my duty gun and it has run 100% right out of the box. I got it last May and immediately put 900rds through it over four days of training and qualifying. Since then I've shot another 2000 or so rounds out of it between training and IDPA and still no problems. I haven't done a thing to it except shoot, clean, and lube, it's simply a very reliable, very accurate, and incredibly fast shooting gun.

My off duty gun is a Fusion 9mm CCO which had some issues due to the configuration the original owner ordered when he bought the gun. A trip back to Fusion for a fully ramped barrel (under warranty) and voila', it runs perfect.

FWIW, I shoot 115gr FMJ on the range (WWB, UMC, MagTech) and my carry load is Federal 9BPLE 115gr JHP +P+.

Shipwreck
March 4, 2011, 11:34 AM
I have ONE 9mm 1911, but it is one of the ultimate models, IMHO - hahaha...

http://i59.photobucket.com/albums/g320/mistershipwreck/Operator-red2.jpg

buckhorn_cortez
March 4, 2011, 11:42 AM
Larry Vickers said something to the effect: "If you're the type who wants to treat your gun like you treat your lawnmower, get a Glock, but if you're the type who might not mind learning to wrench on your Harley Davidson and don't mind being your own armorer you might be a candidate for a 1911..."

Larry must not like lawn mowers - I wash, wax and maintain all of mine regularly...Larry shouldn't project his personal short comings onto everyone else.

All of my 1911's are reliable. That includes the short ones, long ones, .45's and 9mm. Put thousands and thousands of rounds through all of them and they always work...what do the Glock people continually say...? Oh, yes "they always go 'bang'." If you want a cheap, ugly gun, buy a Glock. If you want an accurate good looking gun get a 1911.

My experience with IDPA and my guns does not match the "1911's aren't reliable" meme. Mine run all the time. But, I keep them clean, PM springs on a regular schedule - including magazine springs - the single, biggest, potential malf generator in my experience in well used 1911's. Invariably, when I ask a person with a malf "When did you last change the magazine spring?" - the answer is "I've never done that." I change all of mine once a year. They're inexpensive and it only takes about 2 minutes per magazine to ensure reliable feeding.

I suppose regular maintenance for some people falls into the " wrench on a Harley" degree of difficulty. If you're that mechanically challenged, then you'd better get the Glock and pay someone to shoot it and maintain it for you just to be extra safe.

If you want a polymer 1911 style, the Wilson Spec Ops 9 runs and runs. Expensive, yes - but it works all the time with little to no maintenance and needs NO tweaking out of the box. It may be the Glock of 1911's except it looks good and it's accurate...

snakyjake
March 4, 2011, 12:00 PM
It's not that it is difficult or laziness, it's just that some of us don't know. I just clean and lube because that's what the owner's manual says. I've never seen a maintenance schedule of when to change parts. I've also never seen anything that explains to me feed ramps, and other "reliability enhancements". I don't know what is to improve reliability vs. performance vs. accuracy vs. durability vs. historic original vs. the collector customizations.

The 1911 world is a huge and diverse world, and a confusing one....at least to me.

buckhorn_cortez
March 4, 2011, 12:15 PM
It's not that it is difficult or laziness, it's just that some of us don't know. I just clean and lube because that's what the owner's manual says. I've never seen a maintenance schedule of when to change parts. I've also never seen anything that explains to me feed ramps, and other "reliability enhancements". I don't know what is to improve reliability vs. performance vs. accuracy vs. durability vs. historic original vs. the collector customizations.

The 1911 world is a huge and diverse world, and a confusing one....at least to me.

If you're interested in spending some time and learning the platform, it's not that difficult.

Go to the Wilson Combat website and buy the Wilson Combat 1911 Auto Maintenance Manual by Bill Wilson. This will tell you when to replace parts and how to do it with illustrations of how to disassemble the gun.

If you have a DVD player get the Complete Disassembly / Reassembly DVD. You can see a 1911 torn down completely and reassembled with a running commentary by the gunsmith on what he's doing and why.

That will take most of the confusion out of the 1911. If that interests you, then get the Customizing the 1911 DVD set.

As for reliability tune-ups - send the gun to a good 1911 gunsmith and let him or her work it over. Home tweaking feed ramps can easily ruin the entire receiver, or on a ramped barrel the barrel.

The Wilson book will tell you the tweaks you can make on the ejector and extractor. Either of those can be easily replaced if you over-do a tweak and they're not expensive (even the Wilson Bullet Proof stuff is fairly inexpensive).

snakyjake
March 4, 2011, 01:21 PM
Thanks! That's what I'll do. There's a lot I like about the 1911 platform, and if I can get it reliable, I'm going to be very happy.

Damon555
March 4, 2011, 02:59 PM
I agree with the Glock statement. My 1911's are for shooting at the range. Not only is my Glock made for range time but it also sits in my nightstand....just aim and start pulling the trigger. I hope I never need it.

As to not hijack this thread I'll comment on the original post again.

The 1911's that I have shot in 9mm, 10mm and 45 ACP are by far the most enjoyable handguns that I've encountered.

Have you made your purchase Greenscape?

Kingofthehill
March 4, 2011, 07:26 PM
9mm 1911's is just an amazing combo.

I love my STI Trojan 6" 9mm.... its the most accurate gun in my collection and that is some heavy competition.

http://i48.tinypic.com/2w3566r.jpg

ckone
March 4, 2011, 08:57 PM
I guess my take is that IMHO 1911's, especially the ones in 9mm, are more like race cars then commuter cars, if you learn enough about them you can get them to run and what they can do makes up for any extra effort that's needed tuning-wise.

That said, I do not agree with the sentiment that 9mm in a 1911 platform isn't any more high-maintenance or tricky then one in .45ACP, it sure as hell is, the 9mm caliber round is shorter, narrower, and has a totally different recoil impulse than that which the design was built for, and yet the design in 9mm remains very faithful to the original .45 version... it's different and requires some added attention beyond most built-for-9mm designs or the classic .45 configuration, no getting around that.

In a perfect world there would be more changes made to the original .45 1911 design to make function with the 9mm caliber easier/smoother, the laws of physics are laws not opinion (whole other topic...), but with a little effort, what is already in our hands can be made to run pretty darn well.

Shooter57
March 4, 2011, 10:33 PM
What is Benos website?

Rimcrew
March 4, 2011, 10:59 PM
Dan Wesson PM-9

http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o298/kellyfletcher1970/DW/PM-9/PM-9007.jpg?t=1299297453

WC145
March 4, 2011, 11:54 PM
I guess my take is that IMHO 1911's, especially the ones in 9mm, are more like race cars then commuter cars, if you learn enough about them you can get them to run and what they can do makes up for any extra effort that's needed tuning-wise.

That said, I do not agree with the sentiment that 9mm in a 1911 platform isn't any more high-maintenance or tricky then one in .45ACP, it sure as hell is, the 9mm caliber round is shorter, narrower, and has a totally different recoil impulse than that which the design was built for, and yet the design in 9mm remains very faithful to the original .45 version... it's different and requires some added attention beyond most built-for-9mm designs or the classic .45 configuration, no getting around that.

In a perfect world there would be more changes made to the original .45 1911 design to make function with the 9mm caliber easier/smoother, the laws of physics are laws not opinion (whole other topic...), but with a little effort, what is already in our hands can be made to run pretty darn well.

Well, that may be your opinion, but in my experience 1911's run just fine and don't require anymore attention than any other design. If the guns were so finicky and required constant tweaking and care they certainly wouldn't have been so well received and popular in the military, who's guns generally receive very little special care or attention. The 1911 is simple, rugged, and reliable by design and if you've got one that doesn't work you should look to the manufacturer and not blame the platform or the caliber.

I have 1911's in .45, .38 Super, and 9mm from Colt, S&W, Springfield, Para Ordnance, Fusion, Detonics, ODI, and RIA, some are blued, some are parkerized, some are stainless, ALL of them function just fine and are reliable and I'm no gunsmith or mechanic. I don't tune or tweak my guns, I shoot them, clean them, lube them, and use quality mags, that's it.

No one should expect that a 1911 is going to require a special education and skills to own and shoot, they don't. They're just like an other gun - good basic care, quality mags, quality lube - that's should be all you need. Telling people they are "more like race cars then commuter cars, if you learn enough about them you can get them to run" just scares them away from the design. If that's the case then millions upon millions of servicemen must have received quite an education before they were sent out with 1911's on their hips.

snakyjake
March 5, 2011, 12:04 AM
If the guns were so finicky and required constant tweaking and care they certainly wouldn't have been so well received and popular in the military

Military can't use hollow points, which I hear is a cause for jamming in the 1911.

WC145
March 5, 2011, 08:14 AM
Military can't use hollow points, which I hear is a cause for jamming in the 1911.

Bullet design has come a long way since that was a common problem. Any modern 1911 should feed hollow points just fine, some guns may have issues with a particular brand due to the shape of the bullet but that is the exception these days, not the rule. My guns feed just fine and I've used Federal, Winchester, Remington, Hornady, Fiocchi, and MagTech ball and JHP in them. This is my experience with guns that cost $400 and guns that cost $2400 an all points in between.

If you're going to have a problem it'll probably be with mags since they're the weakest link in any auto platform and cheaper guns come with cheaper mags. Use good quality mags and you'll eliminate the majority of potential problems right up front.

NMGonzo
March 5, 2011, 06:59 PM
Dan Wesson PM-9

http://i123.photobucket.com/albums/o298/kellyfletcher1970/DW/PM-9/PM-9007.jpg?t=1299297453

You are going to make me go broke.

Rimcrew
March 5, 2011, 07:24 PM
You are going to make me go broke.

You're welcome! :)

mnrivrat
March 5, 2011, 09:26 PM
No one mention the Taurus PT1911 im 9mm. Worth a look

Shipwreck
March 6, 2011, 08:29 AM
No one mention the Taurus PT1911 im 9mm. Worth a look

Not - there are MUCH better options, like a rock, than a Taurus 1911... But, I don't want to turn this into a Taurus bashing thread...

sideways
March 6, 2011, 09:18 AM
I have the Kimber Aegis this is nice pistol have not had one failure of any type since purchased new. I also have 70s era combat commander in 9mm it has always run flawlees also the commander was the reason for purchase of Ultra Aegis I wanted carry piece that did not have weight of the steel frame commander have not ever been let down by either. And much cheaper to operate than the 45 acp.

mnrivrat
March 6, 2011, 02:54 PM
But, I don't want to turn this into a Taurus bashing thread...

But you just did ! I'll just say that the PT1911 we used as a rental range gun was very accurate, and very reliable, through 1000's of rounds of various loadings . We also get no complaints on the dozens we sell each year.

Have a bad experience with one yourself ? I've had folks get a bad S&W , a bad Colt, a Bad Beretta, etc. Taurus does not have the market on a factory flawed product.

Not - there are MUCH better options

Anyway - I disagree with you - I think they are worth a look, and I personaly consider them at least as good an option as the RI . Just my opinion .

Shipwreck
March 6, 2011, 07:27 PM
I think a RIA is MUCh better than a Taurus. I know a few people PERSONALLY who have had a lot of issues with them. Parts breaking off and such. If you've had good luck with them - fine. But, I would NEVER recommend a Taurus anything. Good god - the customer service nightmares I have read about is enough reason ALONE to avoid the company period, even if someone had NO personally experience with any of their products.

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