Kids and Guns.


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Unknown777
February 25, 2011, 05:36 PM
I was wondering what you guys think about this. First of all, according to the law, I am a "minor." I feel it is stupid kids have no right to own guns. Do the idiots who made this law think kids magically have a forcefield around them that blocks bullets? Kids are just as likely to need a gun as an adult. I have been mugged twice, and I was almost mugged 2 days ago. My dad is an anti, my mom is neutral. I have to fight with my dad for him even to let me buy folding knives. I don't know about you, but I consider a gun to be a necessity. You wouldn't buy a car without a windshield, or a bumper, would you? It just seems weird to me my parents spend all their money on iphones, clothes, ect. yet they don;t even have a way to protect themselves, and their beloved iphones as well. Your thoughts?

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TexasKid
February 25, 2011, 05:56 PM
Well im fairly young myself (19) I would love to be ale to purchase handguns and really dont understand that restriction. With that bein said I think that age should not be the factor. Rather it should be based on knowledge, responsability, and skill. I know 35 year olds who just the thought of them havin guns doesnt sit well with me, while there are 15 year old kids who are completely capable of handleing guns in a safe manner but the law restricts them. Just my opinion.

Cal-gun Fan
February 25, 2011, 06:02 PM
Well im fairly young myself (19) I would love to be ale to purchase handguns and really dont understand that restriction. With that bein said I think that age should not be the factor. Rather it should be based on knowledge, responsability, and skill. I know 35 year olds who just the thought of them havin guns doesnt sit well with me, while there are 15 year old kids who are completely capable of handleing guns in a safe manner but the law restricts them. Just my opinion.
Ehmm...

First off, I am 14. Guns are my hobby and have always been.

But you are stupid if you think minors should be allowed to have them. There is a REASON they cannot have them. The majority of minors are not responsible enough to own their own firearms. Look at how many teenage drunk drivers, pregnancies, and drug abuses there are! There are already teen related firearm incidents, but now you want to let them own their own? That doesn't make any sense at all!
Maybe we should just legalize drinking and smoking for minors too? Jesus christ! (Sorry to blasphemy)

Seriously...CONSIDER what you are asking first, please.

sprice
February 25, 2011, 06:05 PM
cal as in california?

And as you said look at all the things that happen, teen drunk driving, pregnancies, drug abuse... wait, arn't those all against the law for minors too!?!?

But back to the op, I think it would be ok as long as the person had a parent or close relative buy it for them and/or they had to go through a test first.

Nico Testosteros
February 25, 2011, 06:07 PM
I disagree with the OP.

Unknown777
February 25, 2011, 06:08 PM
I agree, but the MAJORITY of gun owners do not ever protect themselves with their guns. Maybe we should outlaw those too?

Skinsanity
February 25, 2011, 06:11 PM
No, I dont think Minors should be able to have them. Same reason I dont think they should drink, or have sex...Because most can't do it responsibly. My kids have guns, I have a 12 year old girl who has 2 rifles and a semi-auto pistol. She knows they are "hers" but I dont let her touch them unless I am right with her. in my opinion minors have not yet had the real world experience necessary to responsibly own a weapon capable of killing another human being..Then we get the hormone factor and I wont even go there....

TexasKid
February 25, 2011, 06:14 PM
Maybe you didnt read my post well enough. I dont base it on age, age is just a number. I mentioned responsibility. I too have had and been around guns all my life. I am a RESPONSIBLE individual.

I am a teen and I have no kids, i dont drink or smoke, and i dont use drugs. I dont see where that deals with guns though?

Unknown777
February 25, 2011, 06:15 PM
@skinsanity
What you have just made is a stereotype. Note you did not say some, a few, or maybe even MANY. It is bullcrap to say ALL minors are not mature enough to own guns. Nothing personal, but what if I was to say "People over 18 are boring and do not have the "real world experience" to do fun things?

Cal-gun Fan
February 25, 2011, 06:17 PM
Maybe you didnt read my post well enough. I dont base it on age, age is just a number. I mentioned responsability. I too have had and been around guns all my life. I am RESPONSABLE individual.

I am a teen and I have no kids, i dont drink or smoke, and i dont use drugs. I dont see where that deals with guns though?
You can't arbitrate responsibility on a level like that. Its just impractical, and would never work, simple as that. If everyone was responsible, we wouldn't need so many laws.

@Sprice: Yep, Cal as in the Communist Republic of California :)

Skinsanity
February 25, 2011, 06:18 PM
Texas, as I said MOST, if you have stayed away from all of that, great, keep it up. And keep up the interest in guns....And I did read your post, thats why I mentioned my daughter. Some minors are responsible enough to own a gun..but many, and I will venture MOST are not. I have 4 children, 3 of them were not allowed the same priveleges my youngest daughter is, simply because they did not posess the maturity....

Cal-gun Fan
February 25, 2011, 06:19 PM
@skinsanity
What you have just made is a stereotype. Note you did not say some, a few, or maybe even MANY. It is bullcrap to say ALL minors are not mature enough to own guns. Nothing personal, but what if I was to say "People over 18 are boring and do not have the "real world experience" to do fun things?
But thats just the thing-is it better to be safe than sorry? I think it is.
What reason do minors really have to be CARRYING guns in public? Concealed carry. Why? And don't say self defense...for the love of god.
There really is no reason, hell there is hardly any reason for adults to be carrying most of the time unless they are LEO or some other type of proffession where it is a necessity.

Skinsanity
February 25, 2011, 06:22 PM
@ unknown777...

Perhaps you need to settle down and read...as a matter of fact, I put most in bold letters.

...Because most can't do it responsibly

you are proving my point for me...

tarosean
February 25, 2011, 06:22 PM
I agree, but the MAJORITY of gun owners do not ever protect themselves with their guns. Maybe we should outlaw those too?


So are hunters only allowed to throw sticks and stones?

Cal-gun Fan
February 25, 2011, 06:24 PM
@ unknown777...

Perhaps you need to settle down and read...as a matter of fact, I put most in bold letters.



you are proving my point for me...
BTW, skinsanity, you had a very good point with your earlier post. Much better put than my...argumentative replies :)

TexasKid
February 25, 2011, 06:25 PM
Skinsanity: I think that i agree with you. Maturity and responsibility are key. If the individuals maturity or responsibilty is even questionable the answer should be NO! But if the individual is capable and interested i see no reason for restriction.

Cal: I guess im just nothing like you. Im headstrong. I know full and well that even at the age of 14 i was mature enough to own and handle my own guns. Im independent and strong willed... and RESPONSIBLE. :D

sprice
February 25, 2011, 06:25 PM
The necessity is that it's a human right (www.a-human-right.com), protected (not given by, {God gave it to me by granting me life}) the Constitution of the United States of America. There needs to be an equal balance of power between the government and the people.

Unknown777
February 25, 2011, 06:25 PM
To protect themselves. Kids are no less likely to be kidnapped, mugged, raped than any adult.

sprice
February 25, 2011, 06:28 PM
@unknown777

Probably even more likely.

Skinsanity
February 25, 2011, 06:29 PM
Thank you Cal, although, I appreciate that and think you have a mture outlook. Ido have to admit I disagree with you on most adults not needing to carry...to a point.

I am not a LEO, but I carry...and I hope I never NEED to carry. But I do in case it ever becomes a need in a hurry. I think responsible adults who have the ability and mindset to carry responsibly should do so.

Cal-gun Fan
February 25, 2011, 06:31 PM
The necessity is that it's a human right (www.a-human-right.com), protected (not given by, {God gave it to me by granting me life}) the Constitution of the United States of America. There needs to be an equal balance of power between the government and the people.
Actually...the right to keep and bear arms is a CIVIL right, not a HUMAN right. Get it straight.

@Texaskid: I think we're alike in more ways than you think. I'm extremely headstrong, as you can probably see by my argumentative nature. I'm very independent and strong willed, and I am too responsible. My point is that NOT everybody is. Not everybody drinks responsibly either. Unfortunately, laws don't work that way.

sprice
February 25, 2011, 06:32 PM
Oh so freedom of speech and such are just civil too? I don't know about you but I am nobody's slave...

Cal-gun Fan
February 25, 2011, 06:33 PM
Thank you Cal, although, I appreciate that and think you have a mture outlook. Ido have to admit I disagree with you on most adults not needing to carry...to a point.

I am not a LEO, but I carry...and I hope I never NEED to carry. But I do in case it ever becomes a need in a hurry. I think responsible adults who have the ability and mindset to carry responsibly should do so.
I think that adults should have the right to carry. However, I think that people misunderstand the purpose of concealed carry sometimes. It gives people a feeling of empowerment that they really do not need or deserve. There have been incidents where people w/CC permits have almost shot police officers or have almost been shot in turn when they stupidly try to intervene during a police-involved incident. Those guys are just as bad as the cop-watch hippies who film the police.
As long as adults recognize a CC permit for what it is and what it means, its fine. However, the chances of a significant amount of minors understanding that is...extremely low.

Cal-gun Fan
February 25, 2011, 06:35 PM
Oh so freedom of speech and such are just civil too? I don't know about you but I am nobody's slave...
No sprice, you are nobody's slave, but you're an idiot.

In the Universal Declaration of HUMAN Rights, there is NO right that says you can carry a gun or own one.

In the BILL OF RIGHTS of the UNITED STATES OF AMERICA's constitution we do. They are not the same thing. BOTH have freedom of speech as a right.

Civil and Human rights are not the same thing. Go get out a book and read. Its people like you who make my views about concealed carry and such.

EDIT: Woops, sorry for double post, but doesnt really matter

TexasKid
February 25, 2011, 06:36 PM
I not once mentioned every minor being able to have guns.

Cal-gun Fan
February 25, 2011, 06:39 PM
I not once mentioned every minor being able to have guns.
Yes you did, but it doesn't work like that really. Or at least, it wouldn't.

sprice
February 25, 2011, 06:40 PM
I don't care what the UN thinks my human rights are. I am alive, so I have the right to defend myself, my way of life, and the lives of those in my family.

And there is no need to name call here, if you can't control yourself online I don't think you're very mature. That's my opinion. Would I give you a gun? No? Do I think you have the right to defend what you hold dearest to you? Whether it be with a firearm or any other use of lethal force? Yes.

I don't care what a group of politicians from europe think my human rights are. They are just men. They are human, and so imperfect. Look how well their countries are doing without guns, in relation to crime. I only care what I, my neighbors, and my God think.

Unknown777
February 25, 2011, 06:43 PM
@TexasKid
"But you are stupid if you think minors should be allowed to have them. There is a REASON they cannot have them. The majority of minors are not responsible enough to own their own firearms. Look at how many teenage drunk drivers, pregnancies, and drug abuses there are! There are already teen related firearm incidents, but now you want to let them own their own? That doesn't make any sense at all!
Maybe we should just legalize drinking and smoking for minors too? Jesus christ! (Sorry to blasphemy)"

Sorry, I notice you wrote majority of minors in the beginning...however you did say that i was "stupid if I thought minors should be allowed to have them." This implies that ALL minors should not be able to own guns. You kind of contradicted yourself. In any case, sorry.

Cal-gun Fan
February 25, 2011, 06:43 PM
I don't care what the UN thinks my human rights are. I am alive, so I have the right to defend myself, my way of life, and the lives of those in my family.

And there is no need to name call here, if you can't control yourself online I don't think you're very mature. That's my opinion. Would I give you a gun? No? Do I think you have the right to defend what you hold dearest to you? Whether it be with a firearm or any other use of lethal force? Yes.

I don't care what a group of men over sea's think my human rights are. I only care what I, my neighbors, and my God think.
Ehmm...
Actually...it does matter what the UN thinks your human rights are...
You don't...actually think that your human rights are...determined by you...right??
Human rights, believe it or not, aren't an "opinion"...

As for namecalling? When a 14 year old understands a complex international system such as this, I think that namecalling is just a little justified...

Skinsanity
February 25, 2011, 06:44 PM
I agree Cal, I dont think EVERY adult has the mindset to responsably carry a gun either. But I think, as you have pointed out, that adults are more likely to be able to do so with proper judgement.

The thing is, we cant apply laws to individuals, they have to be applied as a generality. SOME people,can drive 100 mph safely, but MOST people cannot, so thus, it is illegal.

I was in the same position you were in years ago. I had a definate interest in firearms but couldnt purchase my own due to my age. So I know its frustrating...The best thing you can do is what I did. Find some people that share your interest, and glean as much knowledge and hands on experience as you can.

Have a great day guys

Cal-gun Fan
February 25, 2011, 06:44 PM
@TexasKid
"But you are stupid if you think minors should be allowed to have them. There is a REASON they cannot have them. The majority of minors are not responsible enough to own their own firearms. Look at how many teenage drunk drivers, pregnancies, and drug abuses there are! There are already teen related firearm incidents, but now you want to let them own their own? That doesn't make any sense at all!
Maybe we should just legalize drinking and smoking for minors too? Jesus christ! (Sorry to blasphemy)"

Sorry, I notice you wrote majority of minors in the beginning...however you did say that i was "stupid if I thought minors should be allowed to have them." This implies that ALL minors should not be able to own guns. You kind of contradicted yourself. In any case, sorry.
I did not contradict myself-I was speaking if a law was made to legalize weapons for minors.

sprice
February 25, 2011, 06:47 PM
Well I'm glad you think so much of yourself cal

Cal-gun Fan
February 25, 2011, 06:51 PM
Well I'm glad you think so much of yourself cal
Ehmm...
Do you mind if I ask...how old you are?

I don't particularly think that highly of myself. I do however think very lowly of people who own firearms and do not understand the laws that allow them to own them. People who think they have some god given right to own them. People who don't understand the political aspect of their hobby, and what it could possibly mean for them and others who partake in it.

Unknown777
February 25, 2011, 06:52 PM
@sprice
He doesn't think highly of himself, he just has his own point of view, which I praise him for.

Robert
February 25, 2011, 06:52 PM
way to protect themselves
Protection has very little to do with a firearm. A gun is only a tool. And only one tool in the box. If you are only relaying on that one tool for your protection then you have already failed.

Unknown777
February 25, 2011, 06:53 PM
@Cal-gun fan
Your username is a contradiction, as you "...think very lowly of people who own firearms.."

Cal-gun Fan
February 25, 2011, 06:54 PM
@sprice
He doesn't think highly of himself, he just has his own point of view, which I praise him for.
Well, if we want to get technical, human rights aren't an opinion they're a fact :D

JK, I know what you meant, I'm just having fun today...

Cal-gun Fan
February 25, 2011, 06:55 PM
@Cal-gun fan
Your username is a contradiction, as you "...think very lowly of people who own firearms.."
No, read the sentence. I think very lowly of people who own firearms, yet do not understand the laws that allow them to.

EDIT: Changed the original post to reflect that

Unknown777
February 25, 2011, 06:56 PM
Protection has very little to do with a firearm. A gun is only a tool. And only one tool in the box. If you are only relaying on that one tool for your protection then you have already failed.
Good point, however as you said, a gun is another tool in the box. The most important tool is your mind, and secondarily your body. However, a gun could be considered, maybe, a hammer. Does your tool box include a hammer?

sprice
February 25, 2011, 06:56 PM
Firearms are not just a hobby. They are the right of the people, for a well regulated militia. Because they are necessary to the security of a free state. That right should not be infringed.

How can you think lowly of others? You and I are no better than anyone else who has ever lived.

N003k
February 25, 2011, 06:58 PM
Personally, I'm against this idea, being just 18 days away from 21 myself. I always thought I was responsible enough to own guns while I was younger too, and, while I would support lowering the age to carry to 18, I don't think it's reasonable to lower it further.

That said, I've had access to guns since being 15, and my father started taking me shooting when I was 8, so I know what I was like around them before. I also know what the majority of my classmates were like at those ages, and, like it or not, the vast majority of teenagers are NOT responsible enough to own a gun.

Keep in mind, while YOU might be responsible enough, how would you feel if every single one of your classmates could go out to a gunshop on monday, and buy and carry a gun? All of the ones that go out and get drunk every chance they get? All the ones that seem to think it's hilarious to joke about shooting people? How many kids in your school do drugs you figure?

Obviously, these aren't ONLY teenage problems, but, keep in mind that most of your peers are pressured to try to be cool and fit in. Does that end at the age of 18? Of course not, but face it, there's ALWAYS going to be an arbitrary age. Would you support letting a 6 year old buy a gun? 8? 10? There's always going to be an arbitrary number, right now that's 18 for long guns, 21 for handguns (Federally anyways).

Maybe there is some room to lower the age slightly, but, right now I don't know I could personally support it at this time.

Unknown777
February 25, 2011, 06:58 PM
No, read the sentence. I think very lowly of people who own firearms, yet do not understand the laws that allow them to.

EDIT: Changed the original post to reflect that
So basically, you are anti gun and don't get laws? Could you explain more clearly, please? I don't really understand why you would have that point of view.

Cal-gun Fan
February 25, 2011, 06:59 PM
Firearms are not just a hobby. They are the right of the people, for a well regulated militia. Because they are necessary to the security of a free state. That right should not be infringed.

How can you think lowly of others? You and I are no better than anyone else who has ever lived.
Oh my god, Sprice, just stop talking :P

Do you understand the concept of a well regulated militia? In what way are they necessary to the security of a free state?

Look-I love guns. I grew up with them. My dad is a cop, and he loves them too. We go shooting all the time. However, like tobacco and alcohol, guns tend to draw a bad group of people to them. And with guns, ignorance can be just as harmful as evil intent.

Unknown777
February 25, 2011, 06:59 PM
Personally, I'm against this idea, being just 18 days away from 21 myself. I always thought I was responsible enough to own guns while I was younger too, and, while I would support lowering the age to carry to 18, I don't think it's reasonable to lower it further.

That said, I've had access to guns since being 15, and my father started taking me shooting when I was 8, so I know what I was like around them before. I also know what the majority of my classmates were like at those ages, and, like it or not, the vast majority of teenagers are NOT responsible enough to own a gun.

Keep in mind, while YOU might be responsible enough, how would you feel if every single one of your classmates could go out to a gunshop on monday, and buy and carry a gun? All of the ones that go out and get drunk every chance they get? All the ones that seem to think it's hilarious to joke about shooting people? How many kids in your school do drugs you figure?

Obviously, these aren't ONLY teenage problems, but, keep in mind that most of your peers are pressured to try to be cool and fit in. Does that end at the age of 18? Of course not, but face it, there's ALWAYS going to be an arbitrary age. Would you support letting a 6 year old buy a gun? 8? 10? There's always going to be an arbitrary number, right now that's 18 for long guns, 21 for handguns (Federally anyways).

Maybe there is some room to lower the age slightly, but, right now I don't know I could personally support it at this time.
Yeah, if that 6/8/10 year old was MATURE enough.

Robert
February 25, 2011, 07:01 PM
I carry every day. But my firearm is not my first line of defense. And thinking that simply having a firearm will solve all your problems is silly. In addition I carry my knife as well. I mean where do you live, Mogadishu? I have worked with adolescents for a number of years. In all those years I only met a handful, less than half a dozen, that I would trust with a firearm. Most are just not mature enough to handle a firearm. They lack the fundamental decision making skills.

And the child like bickering needs to stop right now or this thread will be locked.

Cal-gun Fan
February 25, 2011, 07:01 PM
Yeah, if that 6/8/10 year old was MATURE enough.
Ok, Unknown, you need to start paying attention here.

There HAS to be an arbitrary age. You wouldn't say that a 6/8/10 year old could go smoke and drink because he is mature enough. Firearms don't work that way either.

Justin
February 25, 2011, 07:07 PM
Regardless of your feelings about the laws governing what age you're allowed to exercise a right, the political landscape is such that an actual lowering of the age limit to own or carry a firearm is not going to happen any time soon.

As much as you may think it sucks, the reality of the situation is what it is. If you're truly interested in firearms and learning to shoot, there are plenty of places where you can do that, including the Boy Scouts, 4H, Hunter Safety, and the local branches of various competitive shooting organizations.

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