Taurus Raging Bull: Crap or Not?


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Shmackey
March 7, 2011, 09:05 PM
Never been a Taurus guy but wondering if these particular ones are ok. Specifically I'm looking at the blue 6" one in .44 mag: 444B6.

Thanks for your opinions in advance.

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woad_yurt
March 7, 2011, 09:52 PM
Please, I'm curious. If you're not a Taurus guy, why a Raging Bull?

Hondo 60
March 7, 2011, 10:02 PM
Not something I would buy.

I looked at a Judge about a month ago.
When I closed the cylinder, it closed too far & wouldn't latch.
If you played with it a bit it would close & latch.
And it didn't lock-up tight, either.

I realize that I wasn't looking at a Raging Bull, but I'm guessing the quality is the same.

If I'm buying a new gun, I want something more like a Ruger.
When you close the cylinder it snaps into place & there is no extra play.

klcmschlesinger
March 7, 2011, 10:35 PM
I don't know much about the Taurus, other than they look pretty cool. I like the Ruger revolvers. I have a Super Redhawk in 44mag and love it. The Redhawk is also a fantastic revolver.
Didn't answer your question about the Taurus, but from my experience on these forums, most people will push you toward Ruger or Smith when it comes to revolvers. Based on Taurus's past, rightfully so. I have heard Taurus is better than it used to be, but I have no experience to back that up.
I would suggest buy a Ruger AND a Smith just to cover your basis.

InkEd
March 7, 2011, 10:55 PM
The Ruger Redhawk and Super Redhawk are the strongest .44magnums on the market. The price difference is minimal. Buy a Ruger Redhawk with the 5.5" barrel.

460Kodiak
March 7, 2011, 10:59 PM
I know two people who bought Taurus revolvers, and both had horrible timing issues. Both guns were new from the factory, and have been returned or traded in.

One was a .357 6" barreled gun. Some chambers would lock up super tight, and some had major slop in them (wiggled around, wide breach gap).

The other guy had a Judge Public Defender. The timing was so bad one of the chambers wouldn't even fire in double action. Not good on a self defense gun. That one really scarred the crap out of me. It scarred me enough to decide never to buy a Taurus product.

This is just my experience, decision, and opinion. Take it as you will, but I personally would never depend on a Taurus.

No I do not own any Taurus guns. No it was not a Raging Bull, so consider that if you will. And yes, the gun shop exchanged the Judge for a brand new one. So I can't comment on Taurus's customer service.

mlkx4
March 7, 2011, 11:15 PM
I do own taurus revolvers, and my favorite is my blued m44. Locks up extremely tight and never had an issue. I shoot nothing but magnum loads out of it, and a lot of them. Taurus makes fine guns, but get alot of flack from people who only buy more expensive ones. If you dont own or havent played with them, who are you to bash them?

NMGonzo
March 7, 2011, 11:31 PM
I do own taurus revolvers, and my favorite is my blued m44. Locks up extremely tight and never had an issue. I shoot nothing but magnum loads out of it, and a lot of them. Taurus makes fine guns, but get alot of flack from people who only buy more expensive ones. If you dont own or havent played with them, who are you to bash them?

3 inch + porting?

mlkx4
March 7, 2011, 11:47 PM
6" ported

HelterSkelter
March 8, 2011, 01:14 AM
ruger would be like buying a zippo and taurus would be like buying one of those cheap imitation zippos at the gas station. sure it might work, but it ain't no zippo. they are knock offs of better guns. if you want a gun and can't wait long enough to save up for the one you want, taurus makes an imitation of it with lower price and quality. sure you might get a good one, but the chances of getting a bad one are many times greater than if you were to get, say, a ruger.

winchester1886
March 8, 2011, 01:37 AM
I have a 7 shot Mod 66 357 Mag W/6" bbl.I shoot 158gr HP behind 15.6grs H-110 and have never had a problem of any kind.It's not as accurate as my S&W 686 but it doesn't cost as much ether. Taurus is a good buy for the money.

weregunner
March 8, 2011, 04:14 AM
Anecdotal evidence from those who have not shot one,owned one, or have any experience with a Taurus Raging Bull, say they saw them at a guns hop only, or that a "buddy" which is hearsay, cannot comment with any authority on one.

Let's here from the actual owners besides the real owners from here.
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=27819.0
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=40398.0
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=44615.0
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=41859.0
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=47433.0
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=44919.0
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=30577.0
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=4786.0
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=16850.0
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=26607.0
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=12765.0
http://www.taurusarmed.net/forums/index.php?topic=18622.0

Gun Tests magazine gave the Raging Bull high marks all the way across the board.
Accuracy was 1.1 and 1.2inches in the test for the best shots at 25 yards. Average accuracy was 1.5 inches.

The test gun ran some 300 grain rounds in some of the testing. The gun ate them with aplomb. March 2008 issue.

Mr.454
March 8, 2011, 05:05 AM
The lock up and b/c gap on mine are tighter than my s&w 627pc. The double action trigger is crap but it's a single action hunting gun for me so....whatever. Very very accurate, good single action pull. I have had to send it in to get fixed took 9 days total. Before the bashing can start, all but my Sig and my Henry rifle have had trips to the factory. You roll the dice no matter who makes the gun.

reuben mishler
March 8, 2011, 08:54 AM
I can't say that I have had a good experience with the lock up of the cylinder as Mr.454 described. And to say that it is tighter then a S&W...makes me question that statement even more.

I like the cartridge, and like my 454 raging bull, however, I have had the cylinder lock brake on me before, and this isn't the first instance I have seen this happen. The gun store I work at, has a steady flow of Taurus handguns such as the Judge. Two of the Judges we have received from factory new, have both come with broken cylinder locking mechanisms. In my experience with Taurus, they don't have the best cylinder locking mechanisms, especially if they are sending us brand new guns that are already broken.

This is the biggest thing I would look out for. I believe their design is flawed for locking the cylinder, seen too many with this one issue. Other then that, they shoot great...until the cylinder doesn't lock up anymore....

lobo9er
March 8, 2011, 09:27 AM
Had a Taurus TCP 380 sent it back to Taurus because extractor wasnt catching spent casings, came back from Taurus with light hammer strike syndrom. Traded it. Different gun I know but my story seems on par with alot of Taurus stories. Really want to like taurus because they have some cool guns and they are affordable. If I were to be buying a 44 mag revolver it would be for hunting so I would spend the extra dollar for piece of mind. I've heard recoil knock sights loose on the taurus 44mag but thats just hear say.

ruger redhawk $700 ruger blackhawk $500 raging bull $500

Heres a question for you would you rather own a ruger or a taurus?

jimmyraythomason
March 8, 2011, 09:33 AM
they are knock offs of better guns. I have a Taurus M44 and a Smith and Wesson Model 29-2. Both have identical rubber grips. If you closed your eyes and I handed you one you would NOT be able to tell me which one you were holding. Dry fire,open/close the cylinder,you can't tell them apart. The S&W is slightly more accurate. I have no experience with the Raging Bull but based on my experience with other Taurus revolvers,I would have no problem buying one.

dnovo
March 8, 2011, 10:07 AM
Crap shoot would be an apt description of Taurus. Some arrive and function quite well. I have a 17 HMR DA that came just fine and has functioned very well for several years. I bought a 9mm snubbie that arrived non-functional, and their response was so bad the dealer bought it back. The replacement worked for two weeks and died.

Too hit and miss, with lousy QC and poor service. Buy a Ruger. Dave

reuben mishler
March 8, 2011, 10:11 AM
Although my first post described a poor insight to Taurus...I believe Taurus does have some good qualities to bring to the table. It is true, that you roll the dice no matter who makes the gun. I've seen issues regarding brand new smith & wessons from the factory before. So not faulting Taurus.

The one thing I like about Taurus is they have a lifetime warranty. Not all of the gun manufacturers have this. I sent my 454 back, and they fixed it for free, and promptly sent it back. Customer service is just as important as a quality firearm for me.

And lastly, I must say I like my raging bull in 454. I have not hunted with it yet, but I've mounted a 4x Leupold on it, and hope to shoot some deer with it this fall. And as others have said, to each their own.

8emem
March 8, 2011, 10:33 AM
I have posted this experience elsewhere in this forum:

I have a Raging Bull in .45 colt (only), 8 3/8" blue. It is large and very heavy. The grips are comfortable and the backstrap is covered, which causes a rather long reach to the trigger. My hands are average size, so it is no problem. Due to the weight I shoot most rounds from a seated position behind a benchrest. The front lockup latch does not hold the crane tight against the frame, there is some play, but not bad. The trigger is smooth, timing is good, overall I would say an acceptable action, but nothing special. The barrel is bored out into a non-rifled chamber underneath the 4 ports on either side of the front sight, so the rifling ends before the ports. Interestingly, the last 1/8 inch of the chamber at the muzzle is reduced back down to near .45 diameter. I don't reload .45 colt very strong, so recoil reduction is a non-factor for me. The larger diameter ported chamber is a pain in the rear to clean, lead collects fast and thick here. I've resolved to shoot only jacketed bullets in the future, it's that bad. Accuracy is average, about 2" 5-shot groups off the bench at 25 yards. Overall, I'm middle-of-the-road about it, but I don't intend to get rid of the one I have.

PapaG
March 8, 2011, 11:17 AM
The Raging Bull is the best of the Taurus revolvers from a "factory fresh" standpoint. We have not had to send one back and have even had several used ones come through the shop, all tight, crisp and well timed. A nice feature is the double lockup, rear and front, somewhat like the old Smith triplelock. Downside is that it takes two hands to open it up.

Customer reports, I know, anecdotal, proclaim good accuracy but none have compared them to S&W or Ruger firsthand.

I'd take a Redhawk in 454, or 44 as first choice. My old 29-2 is getting a little loose..not really loose but looser than when I got it twenty years ago. My Super Blackhawk 3-screw is still tight as when little brother got it in the very early seventies.

JR47
March 8, 2011, 04:16 PM
ruger would be like buying a zippo and taurus would be like buying one of those cheap imitation zippos at the gas station. sure it might work, but it ain't no zippo. they are knock offs of better guns. if you want a gun and can't wait long enough to save up for the one you want, taurus makes an imitation of it with lower price and quality. sure you might get a good one, but the chances of getting a bad one are many times greater than if you were to get, say, a ruger.

So, that would mean that S&W, Sig, Wilson, Baer, and Brown are cheap imitations of Colt's 1911?

Here, and the S&W fanboys often accuse Ruger of "copying" S&W. Then, of course, there's the cheap knock-off of the Judge by S&W, right?

Whats really funny is that Taurus consistently, year after year, outsells Ruger and S&W in handgun production. You cannot continue to blame stupidity for that, either. Face it, they make a LOT of guns that have not a single problem. Otherwise, they'd have left the market decades ago.

BTW, Ruger, Taurus, and Zippo are all capitalized for a reason.

huntershooter
March 8, 2011, 04:33 PM
Since you asked for an opinion, crap.

evan price
March 9, 2011, 01:47 AM
@jr47: Price sells, in lots of cases.
I own a couple Taurus products and so far haven't had any trouble. I shot a Raging Bull 44 mag a couple years ago- only about 100 rounds or so- and it shot well. The extra button to open the cylinder didn't thrill me and the porting tended to spit lead fragments sometimes. Shot very well. I personally prefer the Ruger Super Redhawk and that's what I bought.

jtwodogs
March 9, 2011, 08:53 AM
I have been a gun owner and shooter since I was 12 years old. I am now 50, and the list of Taurus gun I have owned is to long to list. Over all they are not a terrible gun, but over the years I have come to realization that if I am going to spend my hard earned money on a gun its going to be one I can put a 100% confidence in.
I would especially shy away from any of the magnums. Their metallurgy is just not what it should be to handle multiple rounds of magnum loads. Three revolvers I have owned come to mind. A titainium .41 mag. snubbie. A quite large raging bull in .454. A .44 mag 4 inch barrel. All without exception shot loose after about 200 rounds of full house loads.
Rugers on the other hand, well after that many rounds of magnum loads you could use them for an anvil. They just last, plain and simple the natural years of use have proven this to me, this is just one mans opinion.

JR47
March 9, 2011, 05:14 PM
Their metallurgy is just not what it should be to handle multiple rounds of magnum loads.

I would expect you to have some lab reports to back that up? After all, such a claim requires real testing, not assumption presented as fact.

Odd, my old 3" Model 66 has had literally thousands of 125gr. .357 Magnum loads through it, and is still tight and in time.

I have you by over a decade, and have in my possession 14 Taurus hand-guns, many approaching 30 years old.

By "shooting loose in 200 rounds", are you sure that you aren't mixing up the original Model 29s with the Taurus?

All in all, you pay your money, and take your pick. Then again, unlike Ruger and S&W, I've never shot my barrel down-range.

mlkx4
March 9, 2011, 05:24 PM
Wow, now we have people saying that the metallurgy in taurus handguns is poor? I personally know of only one gun that ever had a real catastrophic malfunction and it wasnt a taurus. I also have several pictures of blown up rugers and others, yet I dont feel the need to post that they are crap. I personally enjoy my taurus firearms over any other make I own. Especially my 44 mag, it is rock solid and I shoot it alot.

Friendly, Don't Fire!
March 9, 2011, 05:53 PM
When they first came out, the gun store salesman handed it to me, the price looked good. Then I got to scrutinizing the way it was made and I was very unimpressed.

When I saw where it was made I just shook my head and told him sorrry, I don't need another .357 (as I already had a decent S&W 686 6" Stainless that was a tack driver with my handloads)!

I guess for the price they are fine. I think you can get a new Jennings Semi-Auto pocket pistol for about $50. For that price, throw it under the car tire if you are stuck! Unloaded, of course, then pick it up once the car is back onto pavement. Then send it in and tell them something is wrong, it doesn't shoot!

MCgunner
March 9, 2011, 05:54 PM
Seems people with crap on just about any brand that comes up on these ying, yang BBSs anymore. :rolleyes: I have been thinkin' of a .454 Raging Bull lately. I know folks that love theres and the thing is very accurate and affordable. I'd like a Freedom Arms, but I ain't Bill Gates. :rolleyes: I don't need a .454, though, as I don't live in Alaska. We don't have many griz in south Texas, ya know. But, I've got 25 handguns, 3 of 'em fantastic Taurus revolvers, and have kinda run out of handguns I think I "need". :D And, yeah, I've got .357 M66 Taurus revolvers in 3" and 4" and have owned Smith and Ruger .357s. I sold the Smith and the Rugers and kept the Tauri. It's a better shooter and a stronger gun than a K frame, though the Security Six was a stronger gun as frames go. I'll never likely wear out those two 66s, though. I carry the 3" quite a bit with my M85SSUL as a back up in a pocket.

Friendly, Don't Fire!
March 9, 2011, 06:00 PM
Seems people with crap on just about any brand that comes up on these ying, yang BBSs anymore.

Well, I take it that people tell it the way they see it.:rolleyes: If I had that many pistols, I would save double for the good one.

MCgunner
March 9, 2011, 06:01 PM
The Ruger Redhawk and Super Redhawk are the strongest .44magnums on the market.

My vote would go to the Super Blackhawk (no crane at all) or Freedom Arms if they make one in .44 mag. Why bother, though, when you have a .454. :rolleyes: The Raging Bull is strong enough to handle .454 in five shot cylinders. It's plenty strong enough for the puny little .44 mag pop gun.

MCgunner
March 9, 2011, 06:03 PM
Well, I take it that people tell it the way they see it.

Ever notice that everyone on the net is a know-it-all, whether they've owned one or not? :rolleyes: You're entitled to an opinion...they're like...well, everyone has one.

Friendly, Don't Fire!
March 9, 2011, 06:04 PM
Yes, and if you save some more $$$ you can have a Freedom Arms gun!

I guess if you need it now it can be a Taurus.:uhoh:

As for the Taurus, I just was not impressed, especially when the salesman made it a point to TELL ME IT IS A COPY OF A S&W~!

I wouldn't drive one of those fake Jaguars and I wouldn't want to buy a gun because it was supposed to look like a gun that is much better. I would rather save my money and have what I really want!

MCgunner
March 9, 2011, 06:06 PM
Like your Smith? Here's how Chuck Hawks sees it. I didn't say I agreed with everything he says, but the point is made, check the revolver over thoroughly before you buy no matter who made it.

http://www.chuckhawks.com/smith-wesson_dark.htm

And, the Raging Bull is a copy of WHAT Smith?

Oh, BTW, what did Smith and Wesson copy when they came up with the "Governor"? :rolleyes:

Friendly, Don't Fire!
March 9, 2011, 06:08 PM
Yup, even after that, I still like my THREE Smiths!:)

MCgunner
March 9, 2011, 06:13 PM
I like my M10, too, but I also like my M66 Tauri and my M85SSUL gets carried a LOT.

You'll also notice in that article that Hawks talks about Smith's ripping off Glock. Hell, Ruger does it, too, the LCP not exactly being dis-similar in concept or function to the Kel Tec P3AT and now SMITH has a baby .380. :rolleyes: Don't tell ME about copy!

Friendly, Don't Fire!
March 9, 2011, 06:21 PM
I'm not telling you anything, I was telling what the gun salesman had to say about the new Taurus that was in my hand. I'm not the one who came up with one company copying another, it was told to me apparently as some kind of selling point, but that flopped.:rolleyes:

weregunner
March 9, 2011, 11:12 PM
Notice that those who have no real experience with the Judge focus on what is not true.

rhoggman
March 9, 2011, 11:51 PM
I have owned several Tauri, and never had a single issue with my examples; however...... just recommended a Taurus to friend on a limited budget and it came broke from the factory. It was not a revolver, but needless to say it would not fire in single action. You actually had to de-cock the gun to get the hammer to fall. I felt real bad. I even stated to him before he ordered it that the odds of him getting a bad gun were minimal.... go figure. To the credit of Taurus, they shipped it back on their dime.

I always like to keep my new guns rather than mail them off for repair. I was not impressed:(

LouCap
March 10, 2011, 12:18 AM
I can't comment on all Taurus guns, but the Poly Public Defender I got today was perfect from the factory. Tight fit, perfect timing, no issues and it shoots well to boot. Likewise, my buddy got beautiful Taurus 1911 style piece and it looked and shot great, near perfect balance too. So, in my limited experience with ACTUAL Taurus guns on the range...not crap.

Sent from my Samsung Galaxy Tablet using Tapatalk Pro.

Palehorseman
March 10, 2011, 12:31 AM
The wife has had her 3" cylinder Judge a bit over a year. All I can say she has shot it enough to the point, that I am tired of loading for it since she stopped reloading. Never a problem with it.

41 Mag
March 10, 2011, 07:01 AM
As opinions are, here is mine. If our looking for a good carrying, sweet pointing, all around 44 magnum, it's hard to beat the standard Ruger Redhawk. They are very well balanced, to me anyway, and you can change out the sights if you want.

As for the Tarus, all I have one in is a 454 RB with the 8 3/8" barrel. I have run it up to top end loads, but much prefer to shoot the middle ground stuff. After 4 years of pounding away with it I have not found much if anything to complain about other than I would like to be able to change out the sights if I wanted. I do admit the RB is a load to tote after an hour or so, but when I pull down on a hog with it out to 100yds I know for a fact it is going to get meat.

Having others pick your firearm is like having them decide which type of underware you should wear. In the end it will come down to which one fits you the best, and how comfortable you are wearing it.

ArchAngelCD
March 10, 2011, 07:42 AM
Since you asked, I wouldn't spend my money on a Taurus revolver. (Yes, I did in the past, that's why)

woad_yurt
March 10, 2011, 09:52 AM
Taurus Raging Bull: Crap or Not?

That was a rhetorical question, right? :D

tinygnat219
March 10, 2011, 12:44 PM
Shmacky,

Opinion: Methinks the Taurus Raging Judge Magnum is fairly silly. However, I also thought that about the Judge (still do), so take it with a grain of salt. If it's what you are looking for and fits you well then by all means purchase it.

MCgunner
March 10, 2011, 01:16 PM
Well, it ain't silly as a hunting handgun, like, for hogs, not that a .454 is necessary and it's a might big and beefy in .44 mag. I sorta prefer my .45 Colt Blackhawk, but I ain't gonna say the RB is "silly" nor the X frame Smith. Some folks even have a "need" for one. Now, OTOH, the Judge and Governor......:rolleyes: But, hey, if YOU think they're fun, what's "need" got to do with it? /tinaturner

Taurus_9mm
March 10, 2011, 11:21 PM
The Raging Bulls are extremely rugged and sturdy revolvers. I owned one in 500 Magnum but ended up selling it to a guy who had been wanting one for awhile and searched without success. While it was in my possession however (I was the original owner) it locked up tight, had no timing issues and was accurate with the fodder I that was used in it. The other non-Raging Taurus revolvers I've owned, past and present, have all been reliable as well.

JR47
March 11, 2011, 01:28 PM
Knowing the range of knowledge and experience that most counter help in gun stores of today possesses, I'd be hesitant to accept the opinion that anything was a copy of Smith & Wesson

Then again, what gun hasn't been a "copy" of the features present on several others? Even the new Rhino is a "copy" of a Mateba.

Certain features are required, and they all look much the same. How different are the clones of the Colt 1911, or bolt-actions like the Mauser?

MCgunner
March 11, 2011, 01:53 PM
Yeah, the Mauser 98 has to be the most cloned action on God's green earth. :D

One thing I sorta prefer a Redhawk over the RB for is that dual latch thing the Taurus has for opening. The Redhawk just has one latch in the Ruger tradition, push to open. But, then again, I prefer my Blackhawks and they're a bigger pain to reload than either DA. LOL

Steve 48
March 12, 2011, 01:06 PM
I have a Taurus Raging bull in 454 , 8 inch, scoped, and never been a problem especially for such a powerful handgun. I think its their best gun.

k_randomfactor
March 12, 2011, 01:49 PM
Having fixed a fair number of both, I can say with first-hand knowledge that the early Taurus guns were an almost exact copy of their S&W couterparts. Taurus changed some parts and redesigned a few things, but the Taurus M66 is an almost identical clone of the S&W Mod66 for example. Not exact by a long stretch, and parts don't necessarly interchange however.

On the topic of Tauri in general, as has been said, it's a crap shoot. Some of their guns are well-made and will give years of good service, while others come from the factory broke, or will break soon after. Yes, any manufacturer can and will send a lemon out the door, but Taurus sends out more proportionally, in my experience, than other well known makers.

Just one gunsmiths opinion.

JR47
March 12, 2011, 05:51 PM
Oh, my, a gunsmith that works on Taurus? You'll be hounded mercilessly by all of the experts who brag that they're so bad that nobody will work on them.

I've had MUCH worse luck with S&W. I have a new 617 that just decided to refuse to allow the chamber to open. This after less than 50 rounds. I have a Model 625-3 that broke the hand assembly on the first shot. I also have a Model 19 that would refuse to eject .357 cases until the factory honed the charge-holes to spec. Then, there's the original Model 29 that shot itself loose with less than 250 240gr. Federal JHP loads. S&W has been a pen-pal to me for decades.

BrocLuno
March 12, 2011, 06:17 PM
I own three S&Ws and one Rossi (built by Taurus Parent Co). I have handled quite a few Taurus's and the only reason I don't own some is that I don't care for ported barrels.

That aside, I'll be buying a 66ss6 this year and putting a Red Dot on it. I'll try them at various dealers until I find one I like D/A. I guess that explains my position :)

jimmyraythomason
March 12, 2011, 07:08 PM
I don't care for ported barrels. I don't blame you for that. My M44 is VERY loud(but recoil is greatly reduced)!

k_randomfactor
March 13, 2011, 10:59 AM
Well, not anymore. I don't work retail 'smithing anymore, and when I did, I got tired of us sending back 2-3 Tauri a week. :D

I've seen far more Tauri with problems out the box. I've seen WAY more come back busted within a month/first range trip. I, and my shop (custom shop, not retail), will not work on Taurus. Period dot. I think they may viable blaster for someone that is on a budget, but ALWAYS recommend that someone save a bit more and buy a gun with a better reputation.

Would I trust my life to a Taurus? Oh. Hell. No. WAY to much variablilty in QC. I am not a particular fan of Taurus, but do think they fill a niche in the gun industry.

Jim NE
March 13, 2011, 11:36 AM
Wow, I guess I'm a little surprised at many of the responses. I had the impression that Taurus revolvers were like Honda cars - a very cheap import 30 years ago, but they kept improving and improving their quality until they were considered one of the best. That doesn't seem to be quite the case, though.

I don't have a lot of experience to either verify or dispute Taurus' quality. I've owned and shot only one - in .32 caliber. It was an older one. It was an EXTREMELY attractive gun, with a great feel and decent craftsmanship, but I had problems with the cylinder and it wasn't all that accurate (though I've definitely seen worse.)

25 years ago Taurus was what I thought of as a "pawn shop" type brand - one of the cheaper imports that pawn shops would sell new. Pawn shops around here don't seem to sell new guns anymore, let alone guns at all. Back then, though, pawn shops were the main distributors of saturday night specials, but I never really saw Taurus as one of those...they seemed to be one of the better quality less expensive brands, but not something that real gun shops were proud of.

Now they get lots of write ups in magazines and have big assortment of models and seem very popular...but it sounds like they maybe haven't changed much in quality since the old days, based on what this thread is telling me.

(I should mention, I have a Brazillian made Rossi revolver, and it's an excellent gun. Better than some American higher quality brands of the same caliber and config. Though I prefer American made stuff, I'll never get rid of it.)

JR47
March 13, 2011, 12:24 PM
Well, not anymore. I don't work retail 'smithing anymore, and when I did, I got tired of us sending back 2-3 Tauri a week.

Out of how many sold?

As for working on them, that's up to you. Honestly, I think that a LOT of the reasons that they aren't loved has to do with the simple fact that gunsmiths cannot charge as much for repairs as they do on more expensive revolvers and semi-autos. Trying to get $100 for a trigger job on a $250 gun is going to be hard to do. After all, according to some, there's no difference in the mechanics between a Taurus and a S&W.

Now, just for the retail experience, why would any ethical shop sell guns that are recognizably defective? It seems as though that is a common, everyday, occurrence today. With ANY brand of gun, scope, and so on. As it's fairly obvious that all too many people are incapable of inspecting a prospective purchase, or they wouldn't "get home" to discover pitted barrels, tilted sights, and cosmetic defects. Or even the famous "lousy trigger".

Guillermo
March 13, 2011, 12:32 PM
sadly most new revolvers are "crap shoots"

Smith has gone to hell. Taurus got better and are still iffy. (Ruger is pretty consistent)

People that love them...LOVE them.

People that hate them...HATE them

I am ambiguously.
I have owned 3. One was garbage, two were fine.

BigN
March 13, 2011, 12:38 PM
IMNSHO, if it says Taurus on it, it's crap. I have a 44 mag tracker here (brand new) that I could use if I wanted to pistol-whip someone with it

k_randomfactor
March 13, 2011, 10:16 PM
Out of how many sold?

No clue. It was a big box store, and we sold more than a couple.

gunsmiths cannot charge as much for repairs as they do on more expensive Customrevolvers and semi-autos...

Sadly, that is why it is getting harder and harder to find general gunsmiths around, and why there are more and more 'gunschimdts' doing crappy work out of their kitchens. It is extremely difficult to make money as a general purpose guy, which is why more and more good 'smiths are specializing. There is a saying that gets tossed around the shop from time to time: 'Gunsmithing is a great way to take a large fortune and turn it into a small one'.

Now, just for the retail experience, why would any ethical shop sell guns that are recognizably defective? It seems as though that is a common, everyday, occurrence today. With ANY brand of gun, scope, and so on.

Just my opinion, but part of it sales. A company is in business for one reason. To make money. Therefore, they carry what sells. Simple as that.

On a related (and again opinion based) note, most 'ethical' gun shops don't carry pure crap. You see a **** ton of Tauri, but don't see a lot of Jennings, Ravens, or Hi-Points. Taurus is, generally, just high enough quality that the average person that takes their gun to the indoor range once a year will not see any problem, even with their 'iffy' guns that made it through QC. Most folks don't shoot enough for any problems to really develop. If a person shoots enough, problems that may have been hidden will crop up. That goes for any maker.

Guillermo, I couldn't agree more.

armsmaster270
March 14, 2011, 03:46 AM
I have a bunch of Smiths a Colt and a Taurus M-44 and have nothing bad to say about my M-44

http://i239.photobucket.com/albums/ff207/armsmaster270/Guns/PICT0101.jpg

H. Faversham
March 14, 2011, 06:13 AM
Q:
"Now, just for the retail experience, why would any ethical shop sell guns that are recognizably defective?" JR47

A:
"Just my opinion, but part of it sales. A company is in business for one reason. To make money. Therefore, they carry what sells. Simple as that." k randomfactor

This week, because of all the debate about Taurus on this board, I asked two gunsmiths I knew at two different stores why the stores sell Taurus. Their answer was the same as your's, k randomfactor: Their stores obviously sell what people will buy.
As to whether they will work on a Taurus, in the words of the one who always has a long waiting list, "We don't touch 'em; just box 'em up and send them back to Taurus." The other guy, who was not all that busy, said Taurus has that effect on gunsmiths because Taurus will not sell some parts, often sends the wrong parts, and "the girls" are difficult to work with. He did say there were circumstances where he would agree to work on a Taurus for something simple if the defective part was available or if it was not covered by the warranty, e.g., grips and sights.

Caveat emptor. Nobody makes perfect guns all the time, and everybody knows you get what you pay for in quality and customer service. Vive la difference.

There is nothing to debate here, just hurt feelings.

weregunner
March 14, 2011, 08:09 AM
That is anecdotal evidence second or third party or worse...... at best.

That means there is no credibility to it.
I can claim to have talked to plenty of gunsmiths who will touch Taurus and do a good job.

Actually, when I was in the Hampton Roads area a decade or more ago there were gunsmiths in the area who did work on Taurus products.

Problem is that they have retired so who's claim is anyone supposed to believe? Your claims or mine?

Neither would be the answer.

Though what I said is true there is little or no way to prove it at this date and time, yet I can claim that there were a lot of them who did. Could be true ir not.

This kind of "claim" has no merit and has been tried before when there is nothing to hang the hat on. Not unless there are ghost hat racks.

Fantasy raises it's ugly head again.

H. Faversham
March 14, 2011, 08:52 PM
"Not unless there are ghost hat racks.":D

But there are ghost hat racks. They are in the shops of the ghost gunsmiths who like to work on Tauri.

Just kidding, weregunner. Of course there are gunsmiths who will work on Taurus guns. Nobody denies that. In fact, a few years ago I lived in Texas where two different gunsmiths agreed to work on Taurus revolvers for me. One of them looked at a revolver I could have picked up for a song a few tables away from him at a gun show. It needed "a little work" according to the seller. This gunsmith told me he probably could repair it, but that "It would still be a Taurus." That discouraged me from buying it. The other gunsmith worked out of his home and tried like heck to fix an older Taurus Model 94 I had purchased second hand for a "good" price. It was one of those early S&W Model 63 knock offs--a really good looking 4-inch, no-underlug 94 with a greater capacity than the no-longer made and expensive S&W. He finally gave up trying and Taurus quit making them. Traded it in for a S&W Model 63 5-inch. The piper will be paid.

I have had luck, however, with a Taurus Model 431 44 Spl, and a Model 44 mag Tracker. A gunsmith friend told me the old Model 85 .38s were pretty reliable, too, but shouldn't be dry fired.

The point is I don't make up ghost stories about Taurus.

k_randomfactor
March 15, 2011, 01:58 AM
It's funny.

People hear a person say something they believe in or agree with, it's cold hard fact, and they are spreading the Gospel.

People hear a person say something they disagree with, and it's anecdotal or a specious argument, and just full of horse hockey.

This is not, strictly, about Taurus, or this thread. It just kinda jumped out at me. We all do it, myself included. Just a random observation.

Funny, huh?

JR47
March 15, 2011, 02:05 PM
This week, because of all the debate about Taurus on this board, I asked two gunsmiths I knew at two different stores why the stores sell Taurus. Their answer was the same as your's, k randomfactor: Their stores obviously sell what people will buy.
As to whether they will work on a Taurus, in the words of the one who always has a long waiting list, "We don't touch 'em; just box 'em up and send them back to Taurus." The other guy, who was not all that busy, said Taurus has that effect on gunsmiths because Taurus will not sell some parts, often sends the wrong parts, and "the girls" are difficult to work with. He did say there were circumstances where he would agree to work on a Taurus for something simple if the defective part was available or if it was not covered by the warranty, e.g., grips and sights.

That certainly sounds less like design or material problems, and more like protocols of the company. Makes the "we won't touch them" a little more understandable.

"Just my opinion, but part of it sales. A company is in business for one reason. To make money. Therefore, they carry what sells. Simple as that." k randomfactor

What, exactly, did that have to do with the question?

Let me repeat: Why would a gun-shop knowingly sell defective products? As mentioned, I'm talking about tilted sights, terrible triggers, cosmetic defects, and other, easily visible problems. Yet, they certainly do, and it's obvious that too many people trust the shop to sell them viable products. If an automobile dealership were to try to sell a vehicle that arrived with a knocking engine, they would be crucified. However, we read in these threads about guns that should never have left the shop, in the hands of obviously clueless buyers.

So, where are the ethical problems of knowingly selling defective products answered?

waldron
March 15, 2011, 07:08 PM
I bought a 4" Taurus Tracker in 44Mag for my wife. The Ribber grips soak up recoil better than any grip I've used. I own 2 Colt revolvers and two Smith. The Tracker stands right in there with all of them. Good gun. Light weight, 5 shots, good trigger. What's to complain about? Nada.

My next gun, if I get one, would be a Raging Bull in 454 with a 4 or 5 inch bbl.

I just bought a PT1911AR. So, I think Tauruses are OK.

I've been shooting revolvers and autos for over 30 years.

I wonder how many forum experts have even fired a handgun??????

mlkx4
March 15, 2011, 07:26 PM
I own and have shot a little bit of everything. I love my taurus pistols and revolvers.

bayhawk2
March 15, 2011, 07:44 PM
It does and always has amazed me at how many people give reviews
on something they have only"read" about.Never had or experienced
it in living color.Just heard from a cousins friends uncle that this
is the way it is,so it "has" to be TRUE.I don't give reviews unless I've lived it.
Hearsay is hearsay.Nothing more.I have a Taurus Tracker .44 Mag.,
a Taurus Judge,and a Taurus Millinium PRO PT-111.I own them,I shoot
them,and I know "from shooting them",that They are some mighty fine
shootin pistols.I can't give a review on the Raging Bull,because I've never
shot one.I won't give you hearsay,because I think you deserve an
honest answer from someone that owns and operates one.My opinion.

OrangePwrx9
March 16, 2011, 12:00 AM
Can't vouch for the reliability, but the 8" Raging Bull in .454 Casull is a nice shooter. Someone let me shoot theirs at the range one day when I was shooting my Redhawk. I thought it shot softer than the .44 mag. RH and just as accurate. Surprised me as I wasn't expecting much.

alienbogey
March 17, 2011, 01:42 AM
Regardless or whether it's crap or not wouldn't care if the Raging Bull was made by Ruger, Smith & Wesson or Tiffany's for that matter, the name is so stupidly juvenile I couldn't stand to own it.

Each time I hear it I think, "Really? Do you have 13 year old paintball players running your company that you'd give a firearm that name?"

jimmyraythomason
March 17, 2011, 09:34 AM
name is so stupidly juvenile Yeah,it's not manly like,say...Ma Deuce.

markb5446
October 27, 2012, 01:29 PM
The Taurus bashers are generally wrong and don't understand the guns they own. Some have gotten a bad Taurus, others are snobs. I can tell you that Smith and Wesson has been getting more and more sloppy on barrel to cylinder gap. They used to specify .006" to .008, then .006 to .010, now its up to .012. Geeeez, that is sloppy. I had to go through 3 slab side 686 5" models to find ONE that had a reasonable .007 barrel cylinder gap and good lockup. First two were not particularly accurate and had BC gap OVER .010". Smith said on the phone that that is "in spec?". Meanwhile I have checked numerous Taurus 66's and they all are under .006", and all had good lockup. My 66 7-shot Taurus out shoots most Smiths I have tried, but I think it is a little more likely to have a part break at some point than a Smith. My Raging Bulls are PHENOMENAL. Accurate as a laser and bank vault tight lockup, perfectly timed. The best Raging Bulls were pre-2001 as Taurus is not making them bank vault tight anymore, but still good. The cylinder stops and cylinder slots are larger on the RBs than any Ruger or Smith. Triggers are generally not quite as nice on Tauri. Also Tauri's may need some stoning here and there to prevent binding with powder residue. But if you learn how your gun works and know where to stone and polish, you will wind up with a reliable Taurus with a tighter BC gap than a Smith. Ruger BCs seem to still be very good, and Ruger has generally improved quality since 2005. I have seen barrel cylinder mis alingnment on prior to 2005 Rugers (Sec Six/GP100s), but most are made well. You may have to ream your cylinder throats on some Rugers GPs/Sec Sixes to get really good accuracy though, as many were TOO tight for even jacketed bullets.

MCgunner
October 27, 2012, 03:44 PM
One thing about my Taurus revolvers, especially my two 66s, SUPERB accuracy, better, more consistent fine accuracy than any comparable gun of another brand of .357 I've owned. My 4" will put its favorite .38 or .357 into a 1" group at 25 yards. That's as good as I can shoot with iron sights. My Security Six was sad, sad with .38s, though it shot the .357s well. The M19 wasn't as bad as the Security Six with .38s, shot a little looser with .357s, though. The Taurus is the one I've kept. I sold the Smith (slight profit, wish I had it now) and traded the Security Six for a great shooting 6.5" Blackhawk.

I have no real use for a revolver the size of the Raging Bull, but I've heard from owners on www.taurusarmed.net that it's a tack driver.

Plastikosmd
October 28, 2012, 12:13 AM
I had a 454 raging bull, I let it go in trade for a rifle I needed. I have always regretted that trade. It was a great pistol. I have many custom revolvers, Fred schmidt/ Glenn custom S&Ws , other PPC guns, couple Freedom arms, only one colt ATM, (a king cobra) list goes on and I still miss that RB. Some people get way too hung up on brand loyalty and bashing to be of any help. If u want it, buy it.

ljnowell
October 28, 2012, 12:28 AM
The Taurus bashers are generally wrong and don't understand the guns they own

Yeah, ok. Those jennings bashers are the same way, right?

So those of us who have owned guns our entire lives, lots of them, and have owned multiple Taurii only to have problems with most of them are stupid people that just dont know enough to know that we had objects d'art the whole time? Like my pt1911 that literally started falling apart in my hands while being shot? How about the 38 revolver that locked up on its second cylinder of ammo?

Nope, we are all just too stupid to know thats how guns are designed, its a safety feature to make sure I dont hurt someone. I mean, if it can only fire 10 rounds in its whole lifespan, it greatly reduces the odds of there being an accident right?

MCgunner
October 28, 2012, 12:32 AM
Your guns are all crap.

My guns are great!

weregunner
October 28, 2012, 06:15 AM
And those who claim that Taurus just fall apart or have major problems seem to not do any of this.Can't or things would have been caught BEFORE they bought the gun.
Having over 40 Tauri says that they are a quality item.

If the checklists are followed in what to look for prior to buying one cannot get into trouble.
Revolver Checkout Procedure (http://thefiringline.com/Misc/library/Revolver-check.html)
How to check the condition of a used revolver - YouTube (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WMOGVWB-QHw)
Buying a Used Handgun (http://www.chuckhawks.com/used_handgun.htm)
Buying A Handgun (http://www.craigcentral.com/handguns.asp)
http://cheaperthandirt.com/blog/?p=1180
http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=57816

41 Mag
October 28, 2012, 04:54 PM
Well a LOT of folks I know told me my IAI Javelina 10mm was a piece of junk when I got it, as a few did with my Raging Bull, but after seeing what either of them can and would do on the targets with boring repeatability most of the trash talking went away.

While I cannot personally say that there aren't some hunks of junk out there, in my experience with the one I own, I can hardly call it anything closely resembling junk. With a Lee 300gr RF at 25yds off hand it does this as regular as I can hold it, http://i49.photobucket.com/albums/f285/41nag/Shooting/Cast%20Boolit%20Loading%20and%20Shooting/P1010249.jpg

As far as fit and function, I have never found any issues with it since I received it new. If there is anything at all I would gripe about, well two things rally, the first would be the lack of interchangeable sights, and the other is the double lock that makes it a REAL pain to reload in a hurry, before the piggies all get gone.

huntershooter
October 28, 2012, 05:46 PM
Crap.

Jaymo
October 28, 2012, 06:11 PM
All my work perfectly, even after the internet commandos started decrying them as junk.
Guess they didn't get the memo.

All my Thermold mags still work perfectly, even after the mall ninjas declared them junk, as a result of Magpul mags coming onto the scene. (Funny how popular Orlite and Thermold were before Magpul came along, and what junk they supposedly are now)

My Fobus holsters still work perfectly, even though the online SWAT teams have declared Blackhawk to be the be-all, end-all of rent-a-cop holsters.

Fanboyism is a funny thing.
There are a lot of people online who post about guns, yet know nothing about them.
They should go back to playing RPGs and posting about ComiCon (things they actually know something about), and leave the gun talk to us adults.

Haywood
October 28, 2012, 06:47 PM
I have worked in Gun Shops for about 20 years. I have seen all makes of Guns go back for repairs. ALL MAKES. If you find a Gun Manufacture that never had a breakdown it's news to me. Taurus was never the leader in returns of any of the Shops I worked at.

cherzog
October 28, 2012, 11:10 PM
I'm would imagine you have made the decision... I didn't read through every post. However, I thought I would share information as so many others have with me in my questions.

I purchased a used blued 6" 454 Raging Bull a couple years ago. Funny enough I had watched the Youtube linked above (by weregunner: how to check a revolver on youtube). Great info with one exception; this is one case where, regardless of what AmEx says... you SHOULD leave home without it. When I checked a couple of my credit cards they were around 30 thousandths in thickness.

Back on topic- the Bull I picked us has cylinder gap of 3 thousandths and shoots great. The prior owner did, however, send it back to Taurus in June of 2002. I was told that they replaced the barrel at that time. Maybe they did other work as well, I don't know.
For the price of the Taurus it is real tough to beat on this one. That said... I would still take a Super Redhawk if price wasn't a concern.

ljnowell
October 28, 2012, 11:31 PM
And those who claim that Taurus just fall apart or have major problems seem to not do any of this.Can't or things would have been caught BEFORE they bought the gun.
Having over 40 Tauri says that they are a quality item.


Really? Bet you are wrong. The guns that I had bought were perfectly fine the gunshop. Passed all the tests that they should. The pt1911 that literally fell apart took about 200 rounds or so to start falling apart. Started with the Ambi safety and then just went downhill from there.

The revolver I mentioned passed all timing tests. It was an internal failure. Of course Taurus wouldnt give a specific on it.

Why is it that if I were to come here and post that I had these two awesome Taurus handguns then the taurus fan boys would be like "yeah, those are awesome, great......" but if you have the nerve to say something bad, then you are a liar, a fool, etc?

OP, buy with caution. No matter what the people will say Taurus has QC issues, always has, and have not fixed it. Just the simple fact that the people so rabidly defend them is reason enough for you to suspect.

Jaymo
October 29, 2012, 12:25 AM
They've all made crap, just like car makers.
I've been lucky, I guess. I've had about ten Tauri with no problems. Mine must all be defective, because they work perfectly.

ljnowell
October 29, 2012, 12:30 AM
They've all made crap, just like car makers.
I've been lucky, I guess. I've had about ten Tauri with no problems. Mine must all be defective, because they work perfectly

Its all in the luck of the draw really. You can get really good ones or really bad ones with Taurus, I just choose not to take my chance again. I had bought two different revolvers and both had major issues.

Jaymo
October 29, 2012, 12:44 AM
Mine are all crap, so, don't steal them. :)

weregunner
October 29, 2012, 10:24 AM
No working the action and following the data and a CLOSE detailed inpsection woul have shown things were or were not right with the gun.

Loose things are a part of that.

weregunner
October 29, 2012, 10:26 AM
Besides. This is about the Raging Bull and nothing else. SO why hijack the thread. What counts is the actual owners' use.

22-rimfire
October 29, 2012, 10:46 AM
I hear so many bad comments about Taurus revolvers. I would have bought a Raging Bull in 480 Ruger when they came out if I hadn't already purchased a Ruger SRH in the caliber. Don't know if I would regret that purchase or not.... But in hindsight, I am glad I didn't wait for Taurus to come out with their 480 as they had problems even though they "looked" like a tank. So, even though I don't particularly like my SRH, I shoot it. But I certainly don't fondle it and look with awl at the mechanical perfection.

So, my answer is buy what you can afford and live with the consequences. I would suggest you go with a BFR, S&W, or Ruger and skip Taurus.

Jim NE
October 29, 2012, 12:06 PM
Anytime a new Smith and Wesson or Kahr or Kimber gets sent back to the factory, it's because of an "anomalous" problem. Anytime a new Taurus gets sent back to the factory, it's because it's "junk".

I have no problem at all admitting that Taurus isn't at the quality range of some high end guns. But saying that they're junk is EXACTLY like saying a Chevy, Ford or Buick is junk simply because it isn't a Mercedes.

It's interesting, when someone on one of these forums asks for an opinions on Sig or Glock or Tikka, I DON'T give my opinion because I DON'T OWN ONE!!! Apparently, there's a different set of logic skills that are used when it comes to opinions on Taurus.

50 Shooter
October 29, 2012, 02:17 PM
I've owned my Raging Bull for over 10 years, never had a problem and put some stout loads through it.

Sadly though I want to sell it as I want to step up to the 500 S&W. If anyone is looking for a .454 Raging Bull PM me. I have A LOT of extras for it, you won't be disappointed.

460Kodiak
October 29, 2012, 03:19 PM
I've seen three out of three Taurus revolvers be total garbage. One of them had the cylinder fall off the gun, another had such bad timing that one of the chambers wouldn't fire, and the third had screwed up timing and inconsistant cylinder lock up.

Personally, I refuse to buy any Taurus product or product from one of their other companies. I just don't trust them. Just my experience.

Other people love them and have real shooters.

ljnowell
October 29, 2012, 03:53 PM
No working the action and following the data and a CLOSE detailed inpsection woul have shown things were or were not right with the gun.

Loose things are a part of that.


Its amazing that your clairvoyance allows you to know what was wrong with those guns. Your rabid fanboyism totally negates anything you say here. Someone provides a factual incident and your solution is: its your fault taurus made a crappy gun because you didnt check it out first!

OP, pay real close attention to these posts, its all you need to know.

Dnaltrop
October 29, 2012, 05:15 PM
My Old man's 9 shot Tracker .22 passed all tests in the gun shop. He's the Nephew of a gunsmith, an "Old gun" guy, he's been shooting since the 50's, and he's the sort who asks for a chair and sits down with the gun for a good while before laying his money down.

I've seen him purchase exactly Three guns "new" ever. A Bersa .380, A Chief's Special in the 80's, and this very Taurus Tracker. 3 trips back to Taurus and It still can't function in DA reliably without locking up between cylinders.

Less than 200 rounds lifetime, each time returned from Taurus Service with a note saying they tuned and function tested it. This last time it managed the first cylinder, then froze 3 shots in on the second.

Not to take the wind out of the position that "It should have been caught in the Shop...Buyer failed to inspect" the ONLY way this gun would have exhibited it's Issues, would have been a Firing range on the premises, and precious few shops in Oregon have those.

Some are Junk, Some work amazingly well, but you won't know for sure till you put a few hundred rounds downrange to separate the two. For myself, I'd buy my buddy's Belly-carry ,rusted .357 in a heartbeat, I've shot it enough times that I'd trust it as a CCW. I don't know that I'd ever trust a NIB Taurus without an extended range session first.

Good luck though, I tend to mentally place the odds on them at 50/50, I'm just not a gambling man.

blue32
October 29, 2012, 05:45 PM
I bought a Taurus 850 SS brand new back in 2008. I thought the trigger was decent, but I didn't have anything to compare it to at the time. This was my first revolver. After about 1k or so rounds the cylinder would either bind up or the gun would give me light primer strikes every other round.

I sent it back to Taurus on their dime and it came back 3 months later. Experienced the same problems less than 100 rounds after the repair. I traded it in for $190 off a new Glock 17 two years ago. I gave the guys at the shop I traded it to full disclosure of the problems. They said they would just send it to Taurus to be fixed... "yeah, have fun with that..."

I now own a 642 and 686 and both of those have been back for repairs, although the 686 was more for wear and tear.

To give you a comparison on triggers; a new Smith beats a Taurus with 1k rounds no contest. The 642 that went in for repairs did so because the barrel progressively unscrewed itself from the frame. The cylinder would not fully lock into the frame, but darnit that gun still fired! The clear coat finish on my 642 is nasty but I can bet my life on it (the gun, not the finish). My 686-6 is a magnum gulping dragon with a sweet trigger (6k+ rounds didn't hurt either), good looks, and the reliability of a hammer.

Problems can happen with any gun and my experience shows that. You're not going to beat the potential for problems by buying a S&W. The big difference was S&W made it right in a timely manner whereas Taurus put my 850 on a 3 month, round trip cruise to Brazil.

coop2564
October 29, 2012, 06:19 PM
The raging bull is a fine handgun. I've had mine for like 12 yrs no problems.

Ky Larry
October 29, 2012, 06:47 PM
Buying any mechanical device is a crap shoot. You have to pay your money and take your chances. I bought a 6" nickle Model-29 from Bud's many years ago. On the first range trip, all the plating came off the front of the cylinder, the crane, the forcing cone area, and about 1/4 of the barrel. The point I'm trying to make is there are no guarantees. A high dollar gun can be a P.O.S. just like a budget gun.

ozo
October 29, 2012, 06:48 PM
The 'Taurus' thing never ends....
no matter where you go.
Those that know....know.
I see it all the time.
I have never seen so many experts as I do
these days....not in seventy years, and
could never, ever have predicted it. Who woulda thunk ?
As history shows, and repeats itself, I fear we are close
to another chapter of ruling civilization......because we
have become so intelligent !

coebam
October 29, 2012, 08:41 PM
I inherited a Raging Bull 454 Casul from my father, 2" ported barrel. The gun feels tight, it's accurate, and in my opinion a quality firearm. I won't disagree Taurus has HAD some quality issues in the past. I do, however, now feel they have stepped up their quality and are making the best guns they have ever made. I still am a bit apprehensive on the auto loaders but the wheel guns are a great value in my opinion.

spoonman72
October 29, 2012, 09:08 PM
lol this forum is a bit old but i figure i'd chim in with my 2 cents I've owned and still own many different revolvers from rugers to smiths to colts to taurus and some old truck gun charters and rossi's and in all honesty I would put my taurus 669 up against my 686 smith any day of the week, I would put my raging bull in .454 up against my blackhawk any day of the week as well. There is no luck of the draw they make quality firearms at a decent price,and for those that over pay for the "Bigger brand" get upset because they spent more for a gun that performs the same or slighty worse or slightly better.My point being I would challenge anybody in the area to stand at 50 yards and let me pop some shots from the taurus's at em ;)

Jim NE
October 30, 2012, 12:39 AM
Everyone can explain why a problematic Taurus they know of either second or third hand is a worthless pile of metal...

...but nobody can explain to me why my $1100 Colt Single Action Army in perfect condition couldn't hit the broadside of a barn at 15 paces (while my cheaper guns could), or my brother's Colt SA .22 couldn't either, or why my Ruger Single six with the 8 inch barrel wasn't any better, or why EVEN my Ruger 10/22 rifle wasn't a whole lot better, or why my brand new Smith & Wesson semi-auto failed on me completely in the middle of my CCW qualifying, or why my instructors S&W .38 broke in the middle of the same training session, or why the guy next to me had his P-85 Ruger go into jam-o-matic mode, as did the Glock that was being shot by the guy next to him.

Or why my current PT-145 can reliably put holes in a little circle while my current Ruger Sp101 can't.

460Kodiak
October 31, 2012, 04:29 PM
The 'Taurus' thing never ends....
no matter where you go.
Those that know....know.
I see it all the time.
I have never seen so many experts as I do
these days....not in seventy years, and
could never, ever have predicted it. Who woulda thunk ?
As history shows, and repeats itself, I fear we are close
to another chapter of ruling civilization......because we
have become so intelligent !


The ozo manifesto......

markb5446
November 1, 2012, 06:01 PM
Yes the Colt SA's have been getting a reputation, and not a good one... I had a couple Uberti's that were excellent. Sold because I wanted to spend my trigger time and practice with a 5.5 inch Blackhawk that could be used for hunting also (with higher pressure loads). But I actually miss those, but not quite enough to get another one (debating). Some of the best 25 yd groups I have ever shot were with a Uberti Regulator 45 with 4.75 barrel.

I read a recent review that concluded that the best Colt style SA's are US Firearms (I think that is the name, never had one), then Cimmarron and Uberti(same gun but different tuning), last was the Colt (sad). But if someone had a Colt worked over by a custom shop, it could be the nicest of the bunch (maybe).

Regarding Taurus revolvers, I have a little less confidence in material quality (but not by much), based on rare but occasional comments of parts breaking. But have seen pictures of rare but occasional Ruger part breakage too. But the design strength of the Raging Bull (by physical part size), and lockup (especially pre-2001), is higher. But, Ruger has no side plate, though, which is a plus for frame rigidity and strength. A Redhawk/Super Redhawk has a weight advantage (lighter), and you can't make a Raging Bull that light easily. Most custom shops won't touch a Taurus because Taurus won't supply them spare parts if needed. So a long barreled Raging Bull in 454 makes a lot of sense, as does a 44 mag or 45 Colt Redhawk with shorter barrel. Nothing wrong with a 7.5 Super Redhawk in .454 either, but if I was going to make atomic heavy hand loads, I put them in long barreled Raging Bull (if they fit that is, as cylinder length could be an issue), because my joints will be damaged less, and the cylinder is thicker.

Dlowe167
November 1, 2012, 06:15 PM
I own a Raging Judge in .45LC/.410 2 1/2. Great gun,and fun to shoot. Great quality,excellent grip. I also own a P745 pro. Its a compact .45 millenium pro. Taurus is a great brand,ten years ago not so much though. But id like to try the raging bull series

MisterNoisy
November 1, 2012, 09:01 PM
My pops has had a Raging Bull in .454 Casull (5" SS) for quite a while now, and it's a sweet shooter - super nice trigger and it does an admirable job of taming the .454 cartridge. I'm not a 'big bore' guy, but if I had to buy a hand howitzer, the Raging Bull would be on the short list. He's also got a 991SS6 (.22 Mag) and I've got a 990SS6 (.22LR), both of which are outstanding plinkers, with sweet triggers and reliable, accurate operation.

I'd have no qualms recommending one of their handguns to anyone.

markb5446
November 4, 2012, 02:29 PM
Ok so I jumped in and voted for the Raging Bull 454, but now I am on the fence. I have a SRH in 454 and 2 Raging Bulls. One big advantage of the Ruger is that not only is the cylinder is made from a better alloy (than typical stainless steel used in revolvers (416 I think)), but ALSO the barrel is made from a hand picked stainless alloy that resists erosion better than the typical stainless used in handguns. I found this out when I was looking into a 454 conversion of my 45 Colt Redhawk to 454.

Some 44 mag shooters have seen fast throat erosion on forcing cones on 44 magnum Ruger Super Redhawks, which are made from the typical (416 I think) stainless steel. The use of Lil' Gun is particulary hard on the forcing cones due to the heat that powder burns at. Ruger uses cast steel rather than forged, and that could be part of the problem, but this erosion seems to happen when very heavy loads are made with Lil Gun.

So Ruger may have a better material in the forcing cone than Taurus or Smith or Magnum Research. I think Freedom Arms also uses a special stainless alloy for this reason also. So the barrel material could be a plus for Ruger, but I think that Smith and Wesson is using the normal 416 stainless even on the 460 Smith Revolvers which are a hot rodded (even more) 454 Casull.

So the use of 416 is not "bad", but Ruger's stainless could be better... Or it could have been necessary to use that alloy because Ruger likes to cast parts rather than forge them. So the Raging Bull is not bad because it uses 416 either, but the Ruger could be better in the area of throat erosion.

At this point the debate (which I am playing both sides in) usually winds up getting opinions from metallurgists, who don't always yield the same "correct" answer. I don't see erosion in my RBs or my SRH, but I never use Lil Gun, and the slowest powder I use is Win296/H110.

So I think they are both great 454's, and I have no idea which is more durable.

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