Waterbox Setup


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Talin342
March 18, 2011, 11:22 AM
So I was checking out the Box of Truth website the other day and I got to thinking about his water jug setup to test expansion.

Typically the setup is to shoot at 1-gallon water jugs and replace the plastic as necessary. It's great, but honestly I really don't want to buy 10 gallons of water when I want to test one load. I read, in passing, someting about zip-lock bags. It got me thinking, would using water filled zip-locks be a viable alternative to 1-gallon jugs?

I was thinking that you could use quart or gallon zip-lock bags filled with water and hung from dowels (or 1x2 lumber) using binder clips. The bags would hang uniformly and you could design something that would hold the bags so they were consistently spaced and achive a uniform cross section. Though it might take two or three bags of water to equal the thickness of a milk jug, you would only pay for the bag since you could use tap water.

I was also thinking that you could fill the bags with a non-newtonian fluid (like cornstarch and water) it would for sure stop the bullet quicker and make one heck of a splash.

Has anyone ever done this before? Does the idea have any merit? Any suggestions?

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chevyman097
March 18, 2011, 11:26 AM
Do you not use anything that is stored in plastic jugs?

Buying gallons of water to just shoot at would deff get expensive.

I just save milk jugs and anything else i have around the house. (bleach jugs, milk, laundry soap..etc)

Talin342
March 18, 2011, 11:28 AM
Fair enough, my wife drinks a lot of milk. I guess I was really more interested in something that was a bit easier to carry than 1-gallon jugs of water.

Vern Humphrey
March 18, 2011, 11:45 AM
Typically the setup is to shoot at 1-gallon water jugs and replace the plastic as necessary. It's great, but honestly I really don't want to buy 10 gallons of water when I want to test one load. I read, in passing, someting about zip-lock bags. It got me thinking, would using water filled zip-locks be a viable alternative to 1-gallon jugs?
What you're talking about is a Fackler Box. Mine is a trough, open at both ends, and filled with one-gallon zip-lock bags. Measure penetration by the number of bags penetrated (I usually assume penetration to have stopped in the middle of the last punctured bag.) Divide the results by 1.8 to get the equivallent penetration in ordnance gelatin.

esheato
March 18, 2011, 11:46 AM
There is such a thing called a Fackler box which is exactly what the OP mentioned. I made one about 10 years ago...gallon zip lock bags filled with water lined up in a rectangular plywood box. Worked pretty good. Got lots of data but the interpolation between that and gelatin, compared to real humans with bones, organs and a survival mentality is, IMHO, extremely difficult to predict. What you can do is see how a bullet comes apart: where it breaks, how much wait it retains, etc...

And if you didn't know, Dr. Martin Fackler (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Martin_Fackler) is fairly renowned in the wound ballistics world.

esheato
March 18, 2011, 11:47 AM
Nice Vern..beat me to it....

Titanium Wolverine
March 18, 2011, 11:48 AM
If you do this quite often, make one similar to mine. Make a wooden box with plywood mine is 12" x 12" x 8' long (because the boards were that long). the sides have double layer 2x12's just incase a bullet wants to make a quick left or right hand turn.........:D

In the front cut a hole 6" and staple some screen door screen over it from the inside then line the entire box with cheap 3 mil plastic from lowes.

Where the hole is in the front of the box, take some thin double stick tape and go around the hole on the inside of the box, stick a 8" round piece of the plastic to it, fill with water.

put your box cover on, and cover with some sand bags for safety and fire away for years to come.

With that setup I have fired .50 cal BMG AP High pressure ammo from 200 yards with NO PROBLEMS.

I will dig around to see if I can find a picture to show you.

EDIT LOL: If you want Reality,,,throw a bunch of cute fuzzy bunnies in infront of the ziplocks to see what it does!

Talin342
March 18, 2011, 03:30 PM
Thanks guys, I got to thinking about it without researching about the Fackler box. Kinda dissapointed someone beat me to it.

Has anyone shot into the cornstarch/water mixture before? The non-newtonian fluid that kids use in science experiments.

thorn726
March 18, 2011, 03:33 PM
small difference a bag not being solid will not provide the same exact pressure/ resistance as a jug would. (plywood around them would probably do the trcik, but then it would be more stiff than jugs if that matters/// Titanium, that is an awesome set up!

gamestalker
March 18, 2011, 09:01 PM
I use a cardboard box lined with a trash bag. I bring a couple of 5 gal jugs of water with me and then I fill the box with water and place rolled up denim in the water, packed tightly. I've tested all my SD rounds this way and it is very efective. I started using a second box behind the first one because some of my SD rounds will expand and yet still blow right on through the first box.

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