S & W Model 617 10 shot Revolver jamming


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stinger 327
April 6, 2011, 05:32 PM
:confused:
After going a few rounds the trigger will not turn the cylinder?
Is this caused by hot .22 LR loads like Stinger and Aguila?:confused:

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Grey Morel
April 6, 2011, 05:35 PM
How many is a "few rounds"?

Can you be a bit more descriptive as to what is actually happening?

Could you show us a picture?

Do you ever clean your gun?

Is there a fragment stuck somewhere?

How old is your gun?

We need more if you want answers.

stinger 327
April 6, 2011, 05:44 PM
How many is a "few rounds"?

Can you be a bit more descriptive as to what is actually happening?

Could you show us a picture?

Do you ever clean your gun?

Is there a fragment stuck somewhere?

How old is your gun?

We need more if you want answers.
It is brand new, cleaned and I would say about after 30 or more rounds it starts to get difficult to pull the trigger to get the cylinder to move It will not turn to the next chamber single action or double action.

earlthegoat2
April 6, 2011, 06:22 PM
2 drops of oil between the firing pin and the cocked hammer. Cycle the action a few times to spread the oil around. Just something to try.

Old Fuff
April 6, 2011, 06:38 PM
After 30 rounds (or whatever) when the cylinder starts to hang up, eject all of the cartridges in the chambers and see if the problem continues. Then check back with your aswer.

Smaug
April 6, 2011, 06:55 PM
I have this problem every time I shoot 22 from a revolver. It seems to be dirt from the cartridges and lead shavings from the bullets that are jamming up the action.

If you shoot better ammo, for example plated Winchester Super-X or CCI MiniMag, this problem will be reduced. The junk ammo, like Remington Thunderbolt and Winchester Xpert really will dirty up the works pretty quickly. Autos last longer before they succumb, but the dirty ammo will jam them up too.

This is the reason I don't shoot my 22 revolver too much.

osteodoc08
April 6, 2011, 08:28 PM
A smith jamming. Say it ain't so, that's what Tauri do! Just kidding. Hope you get it fixed.

stinger 327
April 6, 2011, 11:20 PM
I have this problem every time I shoot 22 from a revolver. It seems to be dirt from the cartridges and lead shavings from the bullets that are jamming up the action.

If you shoot better ammo, for example plated Winchester Super-X or CCI MiniMag, this problem will be reduced. The junk ammo, like Remington Thunderbolt and Winchester Xpert really will dirty up the works pretty quickly. Autos last longer before they succumb, but the dirty ammo will jam them up too.

This is the reason I don't shoot my 22 revolver too much.
This sounds about right. I did notice these rounds left alot of residue and are dirty. The primary ammo I was shooting was Aguila and CCI Stinger.
I thought because maybe it heats up the cyclinder made it jam.

351 WINCHESTER
April 6, 2011, 11:40 PM
If you have a tight b/c gap I would suspect fouling and heat would cause the cylinder to drag on the barrel.

stinger 327
April 6, 2011, 11:54 PM
If you have a tight b/c gap I would suspect fouling and heat would cause the cylinder to drag on the barrel.
It gets so bad that the trigger will not move and the cylinder won't move neither. So then perhaps I may have to clean it while I shoot at the range? Bring a toothbrush to wipe away residue behind cylinder?

788Ham
April 6, 2011, 11:58 PM
Have you cleaned it and oiled as was mentioned earlier? Might be because its new, needs a little lubing!

stinger 327
April 7, 2011, 12:00 AM
Have you cleaned it and oiled as was mentioned earlier? Might be because its new, needs a little lubing!
It's cleaner now so I will give it another try. I thought it was because I was using the hotter rounds like Stinger and Aguila. When I first started to shoot I was shooting the standard Blazer lead points much lower power.

PapaG
April 7, 2011, 12:01 AM
I have had two Smith 63s and brother T has had a Smith 66. Both, and I repeat, both have started hanging up after about eighteen rounds. Both needed a fair cleaning, lubing and in one case, polishing of the cylinder rod to get back into action. My feeling is that the early smiths, and these are both early smith stainless guns, have a tendency to gall up after a small amount of shooting.
I've used every kind of lube, treatment, and magic to get these things to function for more than two or three cylinder fulls and am just resigned to a little drip of oil/clp every two or three loads.
Polishing of moving surfaces, using RIG stainless lube, using antisieze, and even the old Vietnam standby Drislide makes no difference.
My Taurus (ugh) tracker stainless goes boxes of rounds (17 hmr) without a problem. My 624, 686, and some ruger ss revolvers do the same.
Don't tell me it is the tighter tolerances of the smiths....I've compared them all and as a machinist know that that isn't the problem.
Actually....I don't need any advice on this...just venting. I'll keep shooting, enjoying and lubing and polishing till they haul me off to the great range in the sky. Love Smith, even when they suck in stainless.
My 27, 29, and others have no problems in this area.

stinger 327
April 7, 2011, 12:05 AM
I have had two Smith 63s and brother T has had a Smith 66. Both, and I repeat, both have started hanging up after about eighteen rounds. Both needed a fair cleaning, lubing and in one case, polishing of the cylinder rod to get back into action. My feeling is that the early smiths, and these are both early smith stainless guns, have a tendency to gall up after a small amount of shooting.
I've used every kind of lube, treatment, and magic to get these things to function for more than two or three cylinder fulls and am just resigned to a little drip of oil/clp every two or three loads.
Polishing of moving surfaces, using RIG stainless lube, using antisieze, and even the old Vietnam standby Drislide makes no difference.
My Taurus (ugh) tracker stainless goes boxes of rounds (17 hmr) without a problem. My 624, 686, and some ruger ss revolvers do the same.
Don't tell me it is the tighter tolerances of the smiths....I've compared them all and as a machinist know that that isn't the problem.
Actually....I don't need any advice on this...just venting. I'll keep shooting, enjoying and lubing and polishing till they haul me off to the great range in the sky. Love Smith, even when they suck in stainless.
My 27, 29, and others have no problems in this area.
Revolvers are suppose to be reliable especially Smith & Wesson at $675. Rim fire ammo is not the most reliable but I expect the revolver to be so if there is a misfire at least it will go to the next cyclinder and bullet to fire but if the whole cyclinder jams-NOT GOOD.
My Browning Buckmark has none of these problems and is actually more fun to shoot and easier to grip.

Dstoerm
April 7, 2011, 12:12 AM
Something is amiss... I have put alot of every type of crap, and quality, ammo through my 617, no problems.

You have said that it is new, so try this next time it fouls up:

-open the cylinder... does it bind at all when opening?

-eject spent catridges, press the ejector rod ALL the way towards the rear and examine the area under the 'star' shaped ejector, both under the ejector face and on the cylinder face, where the ejector fits.

(1) If there is 'crap' under the ejector, either on the ejector face or on the cylinder this will cause the ejector to be 'proud' of specs and can cause cylinder rotation to become troublesome.

(2) If your cylinder binds upon opening when empty then your ejector rod is not properly tightened and all sorts of things can go wrong. To tighthen the ejector rod you must screw it in 'left-tighty', opposite of normal screws. S&W revolvers do have a habit of walking the ejector rod loose and that is why I use a little Loc-Tite on all my S&W ejector rods.

(3) If neither of these conditions occur, then the next time it malfunctions try this: Remove all shells in the cylinder and then close the cylinder - does it rotate now? (If so, see # 1 and #2 above). BUT, if it doesn't rotate then do this: open the cylinder (empty) and then pull back on the cylinder release all the way (as if openiing the cylinder, although it should already be open). While holding the cylinder release full back , try to pull the trigger to operate in double action mode. Does the trigger now move corrrectly? If so, your revolver is out of time and MUST go back to S&W for a FREE repair.

Revolvers operate on correct timing of both cylinder, sear and trigger.


If this doesn't help, report back.

-D

billybob44
April 7, 2011, 12:13 AM
Be sure to check the ejector rod, and make sure it is tight(Left hand thread)-do this with spent cases in the cyl. to avoid damage to the ejector star.
Take a brush/blow gun to the underside of the ejector star, to be sure no metal shavings/powder dirt between the star+cyl.
Use BreakFree CLP on all contact points of cyl.
Fire CCI Mini-Mags (2-300 rounds) through it+it probably will be good to go..Bill..;)

788Ham
April 7, 2011, 12:16 AM
Stinger, I'll probably get flamed for this......... get a small bottle of Gun Butter, it has a small needle on the tip end. Give the ejector rod ONE drop, one drop inside the cylinder also, then one drop down inside the trigger and firing pin area, then cycle it a few ties, see if this doesn't help. This stuff helped get my old Beretta 1935 going after many years of residing inside a holster. Good luck!

stinger 327
April 7, 2011, 12:23 AM
Something is amiss... I have put alot of every type of crap, and quality, ammo through my 617, no problems.

You have said that it is new, so try this next time it fouls up:

-open the cylinder... does it bind at all when opening?

-eject spent catridges, press the ejector rod ALL the way towards the rear and examine the area under the 'star' shaped ejector, both under the ejector face and on the cylinder face, where the ejector fits.

(1) If there is 'crap' under the ejector, either on the ejector face or on the cylinder this will cause the ejector to be 'proud' of specs and can cause cylinder rotation to become troublesome.

(2) If your cylinder binds upon opening when empty then your ejector rod is not properly tightened and all sorts of things can go wrong. To tighthen the ejector rod you must screw it in 'left-tighty', opposite of normal screws. S&W revolvers do have a habit of walking the ejector rod loose and that is why I use a little Loc-Tite on all my S&W ejector rods.

(3) If neither of these conditions occur, then the next time it malfunctions try this: Remove all shells in the cylinder and then close the cylinder - does it rotate now? (If so, see # 1 and #2 above). BUT, if it doesn't rotate then do this: open the cylinder (empty) and then pull back on the cylinder release all the way (as if openiing the cylinder, although it should already be open). While holding the cylinder release full back , try to pull the trigger to operate in double action mode. Does the trigger now move corrrectly? If so, your revolver is out of time and MUST go back to S&W for a FREE repair.

Revolvers operate on correct timing of both cylinder, sear and trigger.


If this doesn't help, report back.

-D
After I cleaned gun it appears #1 was present. I got lots of stuff that was on the outer rim of cyclinder where the end of the bullet hangs.
I will have to go out to range and try all of the above.

Dstoerm
April 7, 2011, 12:32 AM
Good luck - the 617 is an AMAZING firearm, but .22 ammunition can be very filthy. I prefer CCI, and Stingers are a great round.

I like to clear spent shells from my revolvers with the barrel always pointed UP so that any grime falls to the ground, not back into the cylinder. A good sharp blow of breath onto the ejector and cylinder in between reloads isn't just for western movies either.

Best,

-D

stinger 327
April 7, 2011, 12:36 AM
Good luck - the 617 is an AMAZING firearm, but .22 ammunition can be very filthy. I prefer CCI, and Stingers are a great round.

I like to clear spent shells from my revolvers with the barrel always pointed UP so that any grime falls to the ground, not back into the cylinder. A good sharp blow of breath onto the ejector and cylinder in between reloads isn't just for western movies either.

Best,

-D
The Stingers have nice clear shiny silver shells not of the brass type that stains. The Aguila brass isn't as shiny like the Stinger ammo.
The Segmented Stingers use gold brass.

Dstoerm
April 7, 2011, 01:07 AM
I like the Singers and CCI in general, and the Aguila rounds are good as well, but just a little dirtier in my experience.

Let us know haow the 617 works!

-D

stinger 327
April 7, 2011, 01:37 AM
I like the Singers and CCI in general, and the Aguila rounds are good as well, but just a little dirtier in my experience.

Let us know haow the 617 works!

-D
I agree with you as it seems the Aguila ammo is dirtier. I don't know how they come up with that 1,750 fps figure as well as how CCI Stinger comes up with the 1,645 fps figure.
Aguila has two types a hollow point and a solid point tip or flat nose at 1,750. I don't know if the sight adjustments will be different between the Aguila HP and solid points as they are both rated at 1,750 fps and 30 grains. The Stinger is a 32 grain bullet.

Stainz
April 7, 2011, 10:15 AM
Recall Murphy's Law? The two most insidious hangups I have had were caused by cleaning. On one, a piece of brass wire - from a bore or cylinder brush - was found wrapped around the ejector rod/star juncture. The other one was a cotton thread - from a cotton swipe - same place. I wear reading glasses when I clean now - and check that star junction as a final check. I started this over three years ago - before I ever bought my first S&W .22 revolver.

Odd thing about one's suggestions to others. At least three range-mates bought a new 4" 617 after shooting mine. Two of the three went back to S&W - one was traded upon it's return. I haven't seen the third fellow. Mine, new 9/08, has been fantastic. It handles everything - but 98% of it's shot ammo has been the WallyWorld Federal 36gr HP 550pk. It regularly goes 500+ rounds between cleanings. I reload with a DS-10 - turning the cylinder with my thumb pressing the cartridges home - before closing the cylinder. Never a hiccup - not in the 5" 63 (LNIB 8/09) or the 3" 63 (NIB 11/10), either. They have admittedly seen half a box of both Stingers and Velocitors between them.

I'll bet on the ejector rod/star juncture being fouled - or the LH threaded ejector rod loose. Remember - Murphy was an optimist!

Stainz

robctwo
April 7, 2011, 11:19 AM
When I bought my 4" 10 shot 617 I took it apart for a complete clean and polish and replaced the main spring and rebound spring.

I detail stripped the cylinder. There are those who say to leave it alone. I use a thick chamois cloth around the ejector rod knurl and a small plier to get a good grip and turn the rod Clock-wise to unscrew it. There are a couple springs, one inside, one outside to keep track of. I lay out the pieces left to right in line as I take them apart to keep it straight. Thorough cleaning and check for any burrs is easy.

Reassemble, lube and reinstall. I don't use locktite on my rods, just tighten with the same cloth and plier.

For regular cleaning I take the cylinder and yoke off of the frame, the cylinder out of the yoke, push the rod down on the bench and give the cylinder face under the star and the underside of the star a good scrubbing with the brush, then wipe clean with old t-shirt.

I like the Federal bulk ammo and get a box or two between cleanings with good performance.

stinger 327
April 7, 2011, 01:58 PM
Recall Murphy's Law? The two most insidious hangups I have had were caused by cleaning. On one, a piece of brass wire - from a bore or cylinder brush - was found wrapped around the ejector rod/star juncture. The other one was a cotton thread - from a cotton swipe - same place. I wear reading glasses when I clean now - and check that star junction as a final check. I started this over three years ago - before I ever bought my first S&W .22 revolver.

Odd thing about one's suggestions to others. At least three range-mates bought a new 4" 617 after shooting mine. Two of the three went back to S&W - one was traded upon it's return. I haven't seen the third fellow. Mine, new 9/08, has been fantastic. It handles everything - but 98% of it's shot ammo has been the WallyWorld Federal 36gr HP 550pk. It regularly goes 500+ rounds between cleanings. I reload with a DS-10 - turning the cylinder with my thumb pressing the cartridges home - before closing the cylinder. Never a hiccup - not in the 5" 63 (LNIB 8/09) or the 3" 63 (NIB 11/10), either. They have admittedly seen half a box of both Stingers and Velocitors between them.

I'll bet on the ejector rod/star juncture being fouled - or the LH threaded ejector rod loose. Remember - Murphy was an optimist!

Stainz
I thought this S & W Mod. 617 was suppose to shoot good right out of the box. I haven't heard of any problems before. I don't have any problems with the Browning Buckmark until it comes time to clean (break it down).
Well it's cleaned up and I will see how it shoots. I will start off with the lower velocity .22's blazers for sighting it in.

stinger 327
April 7, 2011, 03:21 PM
There is one more thing I did notice. Before engaging the cyclinder back into gun I had to push all 10 rounds to make sure they were flat even so that the cyclinder would close. So if some residue got in the part that holds the rim got dirty this might cause the trigger and cylinder not to move.

dickttx
April 7, 2011, 04:28 PM
I have a 617-4 I bought last October. Since then I have accumulated a big plastic coffee can of empty .22 brass. Have used all three Walmart 550 box brands. It difinately likes Federal best. I clean it when I think about it. Never have hard extraction, hard loading, or any problems at all. I would think yours would need a trip to S&W. You are right, for what one costs it should work.

MrBorland
April 7, 2011, 04:49 PM
Before engaging the cyclinder back into gun I had to push all 10 rounds to make sure they were flat even so that the cyclinder would close. So if some residue got in the part that holds the rim got dirty this might cause the trigger and cylinder not to move.

After loading my 10-shot 617, I'll often perform a "check spin" to insure the rounds are fully seated. Otherwise, my trigger finger ends up seating any high rounds, which wreaks havoc on accuracy.

If a check spin doesn't help, I'd suspect residue buildup on the forcing cone or front of the cylinder. You might even be getting some lead buildup at or around the forcing cone.

The 617 is a very accurate revolver, and it often has tight chambers, and close tolerances. That said, I don't recommend removing the cylinder and/or sideplate for routine cleaning. You can clean what needs to be clean without disassembling the gun. Anything more can add premature wear to the gun or hurt it's accuracy.

Stainz
April 7, 2011, 05:20 PM
To restate: the two tie ups traced to something under the ejector star were both due to my cleaning - a broken brass wire from a brush once - a cotton thread from a swipe the next time. Both times, it was my 625JM, a .45 ACP N-frame. I learned to check under the star when I clean by the time I bought my first S&W .22 rimfire revolver.

As to the supposed two new 617s bought and sent back to S&W - I was told this by the range operator - who said 'we' sent them back (They have an FFL.). Of course, S&W warranty work is free - including the s/h - and is FEDEX overnited both ways - on their dime - from and to your residential address. So, that makes the stories questionable - and I saw one of the three trade his in on an S&W 41 - a totally different style of .22. His other handguns are bottom-feeders, too.

I have bought a bunch of new S&W's over the years - and have found one fault - that many wouldn't have noticed - a funky feel to the ejector rod spring. The spring's end turn was caught causing a binding - a new spring - gratis - from S&W in 4 days - fixed it. It was over 8 yr ago - my brand new 696-1. Okay, two new 2 5/8" PC627 UDRs last year - both had Eagle boot grips fitted for the old 1999 frame - not the 2001+ frame - had a slight gap - replaced - then I decided they were too small for me anyway. The revolvers were perfect.

Sorry about your troubles - here is hoping it's the crud under the ejector star - or a loose ejector rod - remember, it's LH thread - CW loosens; CCW tightens.

Stainz

Manco
April 7, 2011, 05:29 PM
I've sometimes put hundreds of rounds through mine in between cleanings (mostly Federal and CCI), and while it can get a bit "sticky" after a while, I've never had any issues with pulling the trigger to shoot. Try all of the suggestions in this thread, and if the problem persists, then you'll need to contact S&W--they'll make it right.

stinger 327
April 7, 2011, 05:32 PM
To restate: the two tie ups traced to something under the ejector star were both due to my cleaning - a broken brass wire from a brush once - a cotton thread from a swipe the next time. Both times, it was my 625JM, a .45 ACP N-frame. I learned to check under the star when I clean by the time I bought my first S&W .22 rimfire revolver.

As to the supposed two new 617s bought and sent back to S&W - I was told this by the range operator - who said 'we' sent them back (They have an FFL.). Of course, S&W warranty work is free - including the s/h - and is FEDEX overnited both ways - on their dime - from and to your residential address. So, that makes the stories questionable - and I saw one of the three trade his in on an S&W 41 - a totally different style of .22. His other handguns are bottom-feeders, too.

I have bought a bunch of new S&W's over the years - and have found one fault - that many wouldn't have noticed - a funky feel to the ejector rod spring. The spring's end turn was caught causing a binding - a new spring - gratis - from S&W in 4 days - fixed it. It was over 8 yr ago - my brand new 696-1. Okay, two new 2 5/8" PC627 UDRs last year - both had Eagle boot grips fitted for the old 1999 frame - not the 2001+ frame - had a slight gap - replaced - then I decided they were too small for me anyway. The revolvers were perfect.

Sorry about your troubles - here is hoping it's the crud under the ejector star - or a loose ejector rod - remember, it's LH thread - CW loosens; CCW tightens.

Stainz
remember, it's LH thread - CW loosens; CCW tightens.

Do you have any pics of these parts?
I would have thought S & W ironed out any problems by now on this 617 which has been around now for awhile.

stinger 327
April 7, 2011, 05:34 PM
I've sometimes put hundreds of rounds through mine in between cleanings (mostly Federal and CCI), and while it can get a bit "sticky" after a while, I've never had any issues with pulling the trigger to shoot. Try all of the suggestions in this thread, and if the problem persists, then you'll need to contact S&W--they'll make it right.
I will try all of the above suggestions. I hope I don't have to send it back otherwise I'll just have fun with my Browning Buckmark.
Sell the 617 or put it down towards a Ruger LCR .38 +p snubby.

Stainz
April 7, 2011, 05:53 PM
How many Stingers have you launched from the 617? It could be just really dirty ammo. I know neither Stingers or Velocitors will fit in my near-match grade CZ rifle chambers, clean or not. If they are hard to insert, they may very well be your problem. As I - and others - have related, the 617 is normally like all S&W revolvers - very reliable - and a brick (550rd) of WallyWorld el-cheapo Federals is easily shot before it begins to show a hint of a need for cleaning. If you haven't found obvious signs of fouling, and the ejector rod is tight, perhaps it does need a return trip to S&W. In that case, call their 800# (1-800-331-0852), request a customer service rep, and tell them your problems. They will forward you a pre-paid overnite FEDEX label - and instructions - within a few days. Someone must be home to give the boxed firearm to the driver - packed in an unmarked box (The address label will read to: S A W.). It will be returned in a few days to a few weeks - pre-paid - the same way - and someone needs to sign for it's receipt. Their warranty is top drawer!

Stainz

stinger 327
April 7, 2011, 05:58 PM
How many Stingers have you launched from the 617? It could be just really dirty ammo. I know neither Stingers or Velocitors will fit in my near-match grade CZ rifle chambers, clean or not. If they are hard to insert, they may very well be your problem. As I - and others - have related, the 617 is normally like all S&W revolvers - very reliable - and a brick (550rd) of WallyWorld el-cheapo Federals is easily shot before it begins to show a hint of a need for cleaning. If you haven't found obvious signs of fouling, and the ejector rod is tight, perhaps it does need a return trip to S&W. In that case, call their 800# (1-800-331-0852), request a customer service rep, and tell them your problems. They will forward you a pre-paid overnite FEDEX label - and instructions - within a few days. Someone must be home to give the boxed firearm to the driver - packed in an unmarked box (The address label will read to: S A W.). It will be returned in a few days to a few weeks - pre-paid - the same way - and someone needs to sign for it's receipt. Their warranty is top drawer!

Stainz
Thanks. Well I was using the hotter loads which made me think that might have been part of the reason perhaps the hotter loads (hi velocity) are dirtier than the lower velocity like CCI Blazers.
Not sure how many Stingers went through at least 50?
Same for Aguila. But after I was done it was very dirty. More dirty than the Browning Buckmark which ate both brands of ammo with no problem and was grouping.

NMGonzo
April 7, 2011, 05:58 PM
Send it to Tau ... oh wait!

stinger 327
April 7, 2011, 06:04 PM
Send it to Tau ... oh wait!
????

Stainz
April 7, 2011, 06:19 PM
Of course, a bottom-feeder has but one chamber - it must be more 'loose' than a revolver's chamber - every round it launches must go in - and be pulled from said chamber. As far as your trading it on a Ruger LCR... you'll take a beating - and be even more sick when you consider what you effectively paid for said LCR. If you like the concept of the bottom-feeder better - for a .22 - a la the Buckmark - well, you'll never be happy with the 617. Do what makes you happiest - or least miserable.

http://s171.photobucket.com/albums/u307/Stainz_2007/IMG_3904.jpg

If I lost my 617 - I'd be miserable. It went to the range with me again yesterday. I had a Ruger top of the line MKII, KMK-678GC, for ten years. I sold it, it's eight mags, scope, and HiViz sights to help fund my 617 - and, no, I wouldn't take two of them for the 617 - but everyone is different.

Stainz

PS The 'Tau...' remark was for Taurus. A friend's new Taurus, several years back, would shoot anything in a .22 LR case - but spit and got dirty fast. He owned it for weeks. He sold it - bought a new S&W 5" 63 - which he loved, but didn't get to shoot but once before he passed away. I bought it from his estate - neat revolver.

pharmer
April 7, 2011, 07:47 PM
Make sure the charge holes in the cylinder are bone dry. Lube can sometimes let them slide back, rubbing on the recoil shield. You need to have a .22 bronze brush with you when you shoot, running it through when insertion/extraction gets difficult. Even the "good" .22's are relatively dirty. Joe

rogertc1
April 7, 2011, 08:36 PM
Shoot CCI Mini Mags..clean and consistant

K-22
April 8, 2011, 01:46 AM
:confused:
After going a few rounds the trigger will not turn the cylinder?
Is this caused by hot .22 LR loads like Stinger and Aguila?:confused:
I had the same problem. Send it back to S&W for a repair under warranty.
They never did tell me what was wrong, but they referred to the problem as the cylinder "cramping."
Call S&W and they should mail you a shipping label.

Best,
Gary

stinger 327
April 8, 2011, 02:55 AM
I had the same problem. Send it back to S&W for a repair under warranty.
They never did tell me what was wrong, but they referred to the problem as the cylinder "cramping."
Call S&W and they should mail you a shipping label.

Best,
Gary
If all else fails this is what I will do. You can take it to any FFL dealer as they are all qualified to send it back?

H. Faversham
April 8, 2011, 05:39 AM
"I thought this S&W Mod. 617 was supposed to shoot good right out of the box."

Stinger327, if you fire a lot of Stingers (which are a longer case/shorter bullet combo) and also fire rounds with normal length cases through the same charge holes, you might get problems. A Stinger leaves its residue in a different area of a charge hole than does a normal case length round. That can cause seating problems when you mix them.

The same is true when you try to mix a lot of .38s with .357 mag rounds (longer cases) without first SCRUBBING the charge holes.

Before you do anything else, go out and buy a new brass brush. A .223 size is even better. And then don't do a lot of mixing different case length ammo without scrubbing the charge holes. Hopefully, that will solve your problem. If not, get a free shipping label from S&W because you're right: a 617 should shoot properly right out of the box, without costing you one red cent.

Stingers have never been very accurate in any of the hundred or so revolvers that I've owned over the years. And they are loud and leave a lot of unburned powder. Google problems with Stingers sometime. But if I had to defend myself with a .22 handgun, it would be loaded with Stingers.

Stainz
April 8, 2011, 09:03 AM
Read my post #33 - the one you quoted in #34. You don't need a dealer - S&W will pay for overnite FEDEX to them and back to your address. Most dealers will want a 'handling' charge.

Stainz

stinger 327
April 8, 2011, 12:50 PM
"I thought this S&W Mod. 617 was supposed to shoot good right out of the box."

Stinger327, if you fire a lot of Stingers (which are a longer case/shorter bullet combo) and also fire rounds with normal length cases through the same charge holes, you might get problems. A Stinger leaves its residue in a different area of a charge hole than does a normal case length round. That can cause seating problems when you mix them.

The same is true when you try to mix a lot of .38s with .357 mag rounds (longer cases) without first SCRUBBING the charge holes.

Before you do anything else, go out and buy a new brass brush. A .223 size is even better. And then don't do a lot of mixing different case length ammo without scrubbing the charge holes. Hopefully, that will solve your problem. If not, get a free shipping label from S&W because you're right: a 617 should shoot properly right out of the box, without costing you one red cent.

Stingers have never been very accurate in any of the hundred or so revolvers that I've owned over the years. And they are loud and leave a lot of unburned powder. Google problems with Stingers sometime. But if I had to defend myself with a .22 handgun, it would be loaded with Stingers.
This is very interesting. Charge holes? Is this the part that attaches to the ejector rod star behind at bottom of cylinder? There are small indentions to each of the 10 chambers (rim part) perhaps that gets residue and causes this problem?
Don't forget Aguila is even faster than the Stinger. My Buckmark shoots the stinger acurately.

stinger 327
April 8, 2011, 12:51 PM
Read my post #33 - the one you quoted in #34. You don't need a dealer - S&W will pay for overnite FEDEX to them and back to your address. Most dealers will want a 'handling' charge.

Stainz
Whoops I forgot..

PapaG
April 8, 2011, 01:27 PM
Forgot to mention that I had, and miss, a 617 with the stainless steel cylinder. It was fine and never hung up. There were some early 617s made with aluminum cylinders and I've heard that they had some problems. Could yours be one of these?

youngda9
April 8, 2011, 01:53 PM
There is one more thing I did notice. Before engaging the cyclinder back into gun I had to push all 10 rounds to make sure they were flat even so that the cyclinder would close. So if some residue got in the part that holds the rim got dirty this might cause the trigger and cylinder not to move.
You need to brush out the cylanders with a copper brush every now and then also to get the rounds to go all the way in there. .22 ammo is dirty and has wax on the bullets sometimes...that crap can build up in your cylanders and cause the bullets to drag on the recoil shield.

Manco
April 8, 2011, 02:12 PM
Stinger327, if you fire a lot of Stingers (which are a longer case/shorter bullet combo) and also fire rounds with normal length cases through the same charge holes, you might get problems. A Stinger leaves its residue in a different area of a charge hole than does a normal case length round. That can cause seating problems when you mix them.

The same is true when you try to mix a lot of .38s with .357 mag rounds (longer cases) without first SCRUBBING the charge holes.

I'm not sure whether precisely the same principle applies because .22 LR uses heeled bullets, but it's an interesting theory that's worth checking out. OP, does the problem occur only with Stingers, only with standard cartridges, or both?

For reference:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:.22_LR.jpg

But if I had to defend myself with a .22 handgun, it would be loaded with Stingers.

It's not very effective against humans, in my opinion, because it tends to overexpand and/or fragment (even out of handguns) and underpenetrate. Use Velocitors instead if you want to be sure of getting top performance out of this caliber, although truth be told, out of handguns the Mini-Mag or SGB should be practically equal in performance with less noise and cost.

Charge holes? Is this the part that attaches to the ejector rod star behind at bottom of cylinder?

"Charge hole" is another name for one of the "chambers" in the cylinder (where each cartridge is contained). It's a holdover from the cap & ball days, and I sometimes use the term myself so that there is no confusion with the "chamber" of an autoloader.

Remo223
April 8, 2011, 02:27 PM
9 times out of ten if a cylinder is getting sticky its because...

THERE'S DIRT AND CRUD UNDER THE EJECTOR STAR

stinger 327
April 8, 2011, 02:30 PM
I'm not sure whether precisely the same principle applies because .22 LR uses heeled bullets, but it's an interesting theory that's worth checking out. OP, does the problem occur only with Stingers, only with standard cartridges, or both?

For reference:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:.22_LR.jpg



It's not very effective against humans, in my opinion, because it tends to overexpand and/or fragment (even out of handguns) and underpenetrate. Use Velocitors instead if you want to be sure of getting top performance out of this caliber, although truth be told, out of handguns the Mini-Mag or SGB should be practically equal in performance with less noise and cost.



"Charge hole" is another name for one of the "chambers" in the cylinder (where each cartridge is contained). It's a holdover from the cap & ball days, and I sometimes use the term myself so that there is no confusion with the "chamber" of an autoloader.
Thus far it I have used exclusively Aguila HP and Stinger HP both of which are hot loads. Used a few CCI Blazers. But at this point I can't say as I will have to go out again. These rounds do have lots of wax on them but some of that wax comes out and is left inside a kit made exclusively for the 617 by Ron Perdue I have groups of 7 10 holes with 2 speed loaders. I can see the wax transfer into these holes in kit.

stinger 327
April 8, 2011, 02:31 PM
9 times out of ten if a cylinder is getting sticky its because...

THERE'S DIRT AND CRUD UNDER THE EJECTOR STAR
I am hoping this is the problem.

stinger 327
April 8, 2011, 02:32 PM
Forgot to mention that I had, and miss, a 617 with the stainless steel cylinder. It was fine and never hung up. There were some early 617s made with aluminum cylinders and I've heard that they had some problems. Could yours be one of these?
I am sure this is a newer version as it's stainless steel. They used to make a 617 blue version.
Any way to tell by serial number?

stinger 327
April 8, 2011, 02:36 PM
Originally Posted by H. Faversham
But if I had to defend myself with a .22 handgun, it would be loaded with Stingers.

Why not loaded with Aguila HP which is a hotter load at 30 grains 1750 fps. The Stinger is 32 grains at 1,645 fps

stinger 327
April 8, 2011, 02:38 PM
You need to brush out the cylanders with a copper brush every now and then also to get the rounds to go all the way in there. .22 ammo is dirty and has wax on the bullets sometimes...that crap can build up in your cylanders and cause the bullets to drag on the recoil shield.
I will bring a toothbrush with me next time I get down to the range to keep that star/ejector rod clean.

stinger 327
April 8, 2011, 02:39 PM
Of course, a bottom-feeder has but one chamber - it must be more 'loose' than a revolver's chamber - every round it launches must go in - and be pulled from said chamber. As far as your trading it on a Ruger LCR... you'll take a beating - and be even more sick when you consider what you effectively paid for said LCR. If you like the concept of the bottom-feeder better - for a .22 - a la the Buckmark - well, you'll never be happy with the 617. Do what makes you happiest - or least miserable.

http://s171.photobucket.com/albums/u307/Stainz_2007/IMG_3904.jpg

If I lost my 617 - I'd be miserable. It went to the range with me again yesterday. I had a Ruger top of the line MKII, KMK-678GC, for ten years. I sold it, it's eight mags, scope, and HiViz sights to help fund my 617 - and, no, I wouldn't take two of them for the 617 - but everyone is different.

Stainz

PS The 'Tau...' remark was for Taurus. A friend's new Taurus, several years back, would shoot anything in a .22 LR case - but spit and got dirty fast. He owned it for weeks. He sold it - bought a new S&W 5" 63 - which he loved, but didn't get to shoot but once before he passed away. I bought it from his estate - neat revolver.
I got one of these and the wax rubs off into the holes in case.

Stainz
April 8, 2011, 05:02 PM
I am down to 14 boxes of my el-cheapo's - from 30 at the height of the ammo buying insanity - assuming two boxes for the 63's, that ammo hog 617 digested 12-14 boxes - plus whatever big pill bottles full I had - must be 7,000 + in ~two years - maybe more rounds than that - maybe a lot more - all but a few via that DS-10 and loading base. Some AutoMatch in there - like in the picture - but that's mostly for my wife's 22 (Yeah, she has the bottom feeders - that Walther/S&W 22 and a Seecamp .32... and a 2" 10 for HD!) and the Ruger 10/22 my son bought me (I'm a bolt action guy!). My DS-10 and baseplate are clean. Copper wash ammo is cleaner. Funny - but the el-cheapo Federal 550pk of 36gr copper wash HP is a deal - something good from WallyWorld. I've had one bad round in all of the rounds I've fired - it wouldn't go off even in my CZ rifle - must have had no primer in the rim.

Stainz

PS The AutoMatch have a few less fliers than the 36gr HP - I don't mind them in the el-cheapo's... at my age, it's nice to have something to blame one's less than stellar marksmanship on. I have to admit - the 4" 617 is a lot more fun to shoot with than my slab sided 6 7/8" Govt Comp MKII was - by a large margin.

H. Faversham
April 8, 2011, 05:09 PM
"Why not loaded with Aguila HP which is a hotter load at 30 grains 1750 fps. The Stinger is 32 grains at 1,645 fps "

First, stinger 327, those velocities are higher than you will get with a 4 or 6 inch Model 617.
Second, I would never choose a .22 LR handgun for SD, but if I had to, I would choose Stingers because they tend to either penetrate well (due to failure to expand as a result of clogged hollow point cavities) or expand well/fragment after some penetration, thus dumping all of their energy/damage deep enough into the target. Either way, it's OK with me. Some would choose segmented bullets or 40 grain Mini-Mags or Win. SuperX, etc. and get no argument from me. If we all had the same taste in women there would be big trouble everywhere.;)
Third, velocity is only one of maybe a dozen factors in the effectiveness of a bullet. A light, "too fast" "too soft" bullet will expand without much penetration and merely anger a perp. Stingers have just the right combination of speed, weight and elements of construction to be effective (for a .22). And, remember, a .22 killed Bobby Kennedy and very, very nearly killed Ronald Reagan. I haven't researched it in many years, but I'd bet that .22s kill a lot of folks in street fights, relatively slowly. They are not generally one-shot stoppers unless a person defending him/her self gets lucky or is a confident marksman and knows where to place a bullet. Gruesome business.
Note: if a cartridge can't seat all the way into a dirty charge hole (i.e., chamber) because of built-up residue at the bore end, even if the area under the star is clean, the effect is the same as if that area was dirty--seating problems, which can cause jamming.
Finally, there is no 617 blue version; the blue version is a Model 17, which, in a 4 inch model, looks a lot like a Model 18. The number 6 as the first number in a S&W model number means stainless steel. And if Stainz dosen't stop showing that 4-inch 617 of his, I am going to get very angry at myself for selling the two I've owned. Now he's going to post it again saying, "What, this old thing?"

stinger 327
April 8, 2011, 05:30 PM
I am down to 14 boxes of my el-cheapo's - from 30 at the height of the ammo buying insanity - assuming two boxes for the 63's, that ammo hog 617 digested 12-14 boxes - plus whatever big pill bottles full I had - must be 7,000 + in ~two years - maybe more rounds than that - maybe a lot more - all but a few via that DS-10 and loading base. Some AutoMatch in there - like in the picture - but that's mostly for my wife's 22 (Yeah, she has the bottom feeders - that Walther/S&W 22 and a Seecamp .32... and a 2" 10 for HD!) and the Ruger 10/22 my son bought me (I'm a bolt action guy!). My DS-10 and baseplate are clean. Copper wash ammo is cleaner. Funny - but the el-cheapo Federal 550pk of 36gr copper wash HP is a deal - something good from WallyWorld. I've had one bad round in all of the rounds I've fired - it wouldn't go off even in my CZ rifle - must have had no primer in the rim.

Stainz

PS The AutoMatch have a few less fliers than the 36gr HP - I don't mind them in the el-cheapo's... at my age, it's nice to have something to blame one's less than stellar marksmanship on. I have to admit - the 4" 617 is a lot more fun to shoot with than my slab sided 6 7/8" Govt Comp MKII was - by a large margin.
I find the standard Browning Buckmark more fun to shoot than my new 617-6 inch. It's alot lighter and accurate. If ever misfires on the auto the advantage goes to the 617 as all I do is pull the trigger again to the next chamber on 617 if it doesn't lock up/jam. The 617 also groups well it is just the lock up problem.

Remo223
April 8, 2011, 05:35 PM
yes, 22rimfire kills a surprising large number of people. Partly because there is so many guns that shoot them and partly because they are known to bounce around inside a human ribcage, and partly because people who are shot by them have a tendency to think they are ok.

The typical death of a person shot by a 22rimfire goes something like this:

guy doesn't even know he's shot until later. finds a hole in his belly or side. decides he's fine. it don't hurt or anything. 2 days later he's got a fever and goes to hospital. by then it's too late. sepsis has done it's damage and there's no fixing it. He dies 24 hours after walking into emergency room with a fever.

stinger 327
April 8, 2011, 05:45 PM
"Why not loaded with Aguila HP which is a hotter load at 30 grains 1750 fps. The Stinger is 32 grains at 1,645 fps "

First, stinger 327, those velocities are higher than you will get with a 4 or 6 inch Model 617.
Second, I would never choose a .22 LR handgun for SD, but if I had to, I would choose Stingers because they tend to either penetrate well (due to failure to expand as a result of clogged hollow point cavities) or expand well/fragment after some penetration, thus dumping all of their energy/damage deep enough into the target. Either way, it's OK with me. Some would choose segmented bullets or 40 grain Mini-Mags or Win. SuperX, etc. and get no argument from me. If we all had the same taste in women there would be big trouble everywhere.;)
Third, velocity is only one of maybe a dozen factors in the effectiveness of a bullet. A light, "too fast" "too soft" bullet will expand without much penetration and merely anger a perp. Stingers have just the right combination of speed, weight and elements of construction to be effective (for a .22). And, remember, a .22 killed Bobby Kennedy and very, very nearly killed Ronald Reagan. I haven't researched it in many years, but I'd bet that .22s kill a lot of folks in street fights, relatively slowly. They are not generally one-shot stoppers unless a person defending him/her self gets lucky or is a confident marksman and knows where to place a bullet. Gruesome business.
Note: if a cartridge can't seat all the way into a dirty charge hole (i.e., chamber) because of built-up residue at the bore end, even if the area under the star is clean, the effect is the same as if that area was dirty--seating problems, which can cause jamming.
Finally, there is no 617 blue version; the blue version is a Model 17, which, in a 4 inch model, looks a lot like a Model 18. The number 6 as the first number in a S&W model number means stainless steel. And if Stainz dosen't stop showing that 4-inch 617 of his, I am going to get very angry at myself for selling the two I've owned. Now he's going to post it again saying, "What, this old thing?"
"Finally, there is no 617 blue version; the blue version is a Model 17, which, in a 4 inch model, looks a lot like a Model 18. The number 6 as the first number in a S&W model number means stainless steel." This is true. I remember this now.

I remember it was probably 10 years or so ago when I was trying to decide what to get? A Buckmark or a 17 10 shot blue steel version S&W revolver. The 17 was robust, heavy just like this 617. A very heavy well made handgun. It did cost alot more than the Buckmark.

.22 LR for self-defense? There are choices here from Qwik Shok to the Stinger Segmented HP (this might even be the same bullet now Qwik Shok and segmented stinger as it wasn't 5 or 10 years ago).
.22 LR not recommended for shooting people for protection. Just for rodents, pest control and small game hunting.

Qwik Shok (3 pieces) came in red boxes and the cartridge wasn't as long as the Stingers at that time. Now the Segmented Stingers are the same length as the Stinger HP. Both come in blue boxes. I believe the case/brass on the segmented Stinger is gold in color.

There is Viper, Yellow Jacket, and Aguila which is suppose to be the fastest. Aguila has a 40 grain rated at 1,470.

I don't know where they get these figures in fps. What length barrel? Or in rifle? But I don't expect to get these hyper velocities in these handguns.

For protection the .22 LR isn't reliable enough and may not go bang. If I were to stay with the mouse guns probably the next step up a .25 ACP (centerfire) or .32 ACP both of which are more reliable ignition.

stinger 327
April 8, 2011, 05:46 PM
yes, 22rimfire kills a surprising large number of people. Partly because there is so many guns that shoot them and partly because they are known to bounce around inside a human ribcage, and partly because people who are shot by them have a tendency to think they are ok.

The typical death of a person shot by a 22rimfire goes something like this:

guy doesn't even know he's shot until later. finds a hole in his belly or side. decides he's fine. it don't hurt or anything. 2 days later he's got a fever and goes to hospital. by then it's too late. sepsis has done it's damage and there's no fixing it. He dies 24 hours after walking into emergency room with a fever.
True unless you are lucky and placement is crucial. The person shot with a .22 LR may just keep on fighting you.

stinger 327
April 9, 2011, 02:38 AM
After loading my 10-shot 617, I'll often perform a "check spin" to insure the rounds are fully seated. Otherwise, my trigger finger ends up seating any high rounds, which wreaks havoc on accuracy.

If a check spin doesn't help, I'd suspect residue buildup on the forcing cone or front of the cylinder. You might even be getting some lead buildup at or around the forcing cone.

The 617 is a very accurate revolver, and it often has tight chambers, and close tolerances. That said, I don't recommend removing the cylinder and/or sideplate for routine cleaning. You can clean what needs to be clean without disassembling the gun. Anything more can add premature wear to the gun or hurt it's accuracy.
If you point the gun up you will see that the casings can hang up and jam the cylinder.

JR47
April 10, 2011, 06:00 PM
First, shooting a large number of .22 Stingers, then shifting to another type of .22 is essentially like going from .357 Magnum to .38 Special. The Stinger case is slightly longer than the standard .22 case. If anything, the problem should arise from the opposite action.

I have a Model 17 that was tight after about 40 rounds, or less. I checked everything, and found my problem was a cylinder gap of .001"!!

H. Faversham
April 10, 2011, 09:37 PM
Hey, JR, if you sent your 17 back to S&W to open up the b/c gap, what did it measure after you got it back? Just curious as to what S&W considers ideal. I think .010 is their outside spec.

"If anything, the problem should arise from the opposite action." That's correct, JR, it does arise from the opposite action. I. E., the bullets in normal size cases deposit residue shallower in charge holes than Stinger bullets (which of course are at the end of longer cases). After this shallower-deposited residue from normal size cases starts to build up, during the shooting session it becomes increasingly difficult to insert/push the longer cased Stinger bullets all the way through the built up residue.

A Stinger leaves its residue in a different area of a charge hole (further down towards the bore end of the charge hole) than does a normal case length round. Thus, it's better to shoot Stingers first if you are going to mix a lot of rounds without scrubbing.

The same is true, as you know, when trying to push .357s through built up residue deposited from .38s, which are shorter.

Stinger 327, after a good scrubbing of the charge holes, just as a test try not mixing Stingers and normal size rounds, and keep the area under the star clean. Then let us know if the jamming stops. You should also take JR's advice and stop by an auto parts store for a set of feeler gauges to measure your b/c gap. I would guess that .006 plus/minus .003 is what most .22 revolvers will measure.

stinger 327
April 11, 2011, 04:08 AM
Hey, JR, if you sent your 17 back to S&W to open up the b/c gap, what did it measure after you got it back? Just curious as to what S&W considers ideal. I think .010 is their outside spec.

"If anything, the problem should arise from the opposite action." That's correct, JR, it does arise from the opposite action. I. E., the bullets in normal size cases deposit residue shallower in charge holes than Stinger bullets (which of course are at the end of longer cases). After this shallower-deposited residue from normal size cases starts to build up, during the shooting session it becomes increasingly difficult to insert/push the longer cased Stinger bullets all the way through the built up residue.

A Stinger leaves its residue in a different area of a charge hole (further down towards the bore end of the charge hole) than does a normal case length round. Thus, it's better to shoot Stingers first if you are going to mix a lot of rounds without scrubbing.

The same is true, as you know, when trying to push .357s through built up residue deposited from .38s, which are shorter.

Stinger 327, after a good scrubbing of the charge holes, just as a test try not mixing Stingers and normal size rounds, and keep the area under the star clean. Then let us know if the jamming stops. You should also take JR's advice and stop by an auto parts store for a set of feeler gauges to measure your b/c gap. I would guess that .006 plus/minus .003 is what most .22 revolvers will measure.
I bet if you stick with standard .22 LR loads it will probably shoot better than the hi-velocity .22 LR loads.

H. Faversham
April 11, 2011, 05:03 AM
Almost all of the time, Stinger 327, standard velocity loads are more accurate in a given handgun or rifle than high velocity loads. That's why the expensive target loads are standard velocity. There are rare exceptions of course.

stinger 327
April 11, 2011, 12:55 PM
Almost all of the time, Stinger 327, standard velocity loads are more accurate in a given handgun or rifle than high velocity loads. That's why the expensive target loads are standard velocity. There are rare exceptions of course.
Just like the high end air guns for competition shoot their match pellets in the 500-600 fps. range.

TonyT
April 11, 2011, 04:15 PM
22 revo;lvers can get gummed up pretty quickly with firing and/or lead residue. I would suggest that you shoot either SV ammo or the Fedearl copper plated HV HP ammo. The CCI Stingers and Remington Golden are particularly dirty -0 they are accepatble in semi auto's but are problematic in revolvers.

stinger 327
April 11, 2011, 04:33 PM
22 revo;lvers can get gummed up pretty quickly with firing and/or lead residue. I would suggest that you shoot either SV ammo or the Fedearl copper plated HV HP ammo. The CCI Stingers and Remington Golden are particularly dirty -0 they are accepatble in semi auto's but are problematic in revolvers.
Aguila 30 grain HV HP ammo probably is as dirty as CCI Stingers?
That's probably why my Browing Buckmark performs better.
Cooper wash bullets over lead?
Remington vipers and Yellow Jackets ok?

Remllez
April 11, 2011, 05:53 PM
I tend to agree that the B/C gap is the problem,most times loading a sticky cylinder is indeed caused by gunk built up from shooting. Difficulties in rotation assuming the rounds are seated is usually caused by a tight or closed up B/C gap. Also I have seen many a Smith with the ejector rod loose causing trouble closing the cylinder and difficulty cocking/shooting. If it is a too small B/C gap Send It Back! It won't get better with use.

stinger 327
April 11, 2011, 06:00 PM
I tend to agree that the B/C gap is the problem,most times loading a sticky cylinder is indeed caused by gunk built up from shooting. Difficulties in rotation assuming the rounds are seated is usually caused by a tight or closed up B/C gap. Also I have seen many a Smith with the ejector rod loose causing trouble closing the cylinder and difficulty cocking/shooting. If it is a too small B/C gap Send It Back! It won't get better with use.
Thanks for that info. I will keep an eye on this.

JR47
April 11, 2011, 06:40 PM
It seems to go against conventional wisdom that .22 rounds being dirty is easier to accept in a semi-auto than in a revolver. After all, the crud builds up under the extractor, and on the breech face, as well as in the reciprocating system of a blow-back gun.

Also, the chambers of a semi-auto are normally tighter than those of a revolver, especially with the semi-Bentz, or Bentz, set-ups. :)

stinger 327
April 12, 2011, 12:06 AM
It seems to go against conventional wisdom that .22 rounds being dirty is easier to accept in a semi-auto than in a revolver. After all, the crud builds up under the extractor, and on the breech face, as well as in the reciprocating system of a blow-back gun.

Also, the chambers of a semi-auto are normally tighter than those of a revolver, especially with the semi-Bentz, or Bentz, set-ups. :)
So autos are better in this case?

JR47
April 12, 2011, 01:16 PM
Not really. Semi-auto handguns, or rifles, in rim-fire, can be extremely finicky about ammunition, power, and the physical dimensions of a .22 lr round. As mentioned, some Bentz target chambers will not physically accept the hyper-velocity rounds longer case.

Normally, revolvers are more tolerant of dirty ammo. Dirty, in this case, meaning unburned powder and debris such as carbon.

stinger 327
April 13, 2011, 01:27 AM
Not really. Semi-auto handguns, or rifles, in rim-fire, can be extremely finicky about ammunition, power, and the physical dimensions of a .22 lr round. As mentioned, some Bentz target chambers will not physically accept the hyper-velocity rounds longer case.

Normally, revolvers are more tolerant of dirty ammo. Dirty, in this case, meaning unburned powder and debris such as carbon.
We will see in a few days when I do this again. I'm trying to sight in a .22 LR Browning buck mark and a S & W Model 617. I want to get them sighted in with either .22 LR in Stingers or Aguila which are the highest velocity bullets.

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