Good 500 yard .308 rifle


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JakeBZ
April 7, 2011, 02:43 AM
I would like to find a good rifle that can go 500 yards in .308. My budget is around $300 so I have been looking at the Stevens model 200. Is that a good choice or does anyone know of a better one. I have read that it is better than the Savage Axis, which is supposed to be a cheaper version. Thanks for your help.

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JDMorris
April 7, 2011, 02:46 AM
So you're going to just shoot the gun at the target without a scope?
Mounts? 20-30 bucks, Rings, 15-60 bucks...Scope? at least 150 bucks for a Nikon prostaff..
Saving up a bit will help you, but a Stevens 200 will be your best bet for a cheap rifle.

Mags
April 7, 2011, 03:40 AM
I would reccomend a Savage Edge or Axis scoped combo for your budget.

http://www.budsgunshop.com/catalog/product_info.php/products_id/70970

kalashnikov74
April 7, 2011, 10:57 AM
I own a stevens m200, great rifle out to 500 yds on torso targets. However it isn't much good past that.

TonyAngel
April 7, 2011, 02:51 PM
The Stevens 200 should be a good rifle, considering your price range. The ones I've seen shot as well as the shooter was capable. The beauty of the Savage is that it has a nice upgrade path. It is essentially a Savage without the Accutrigger, so putting a new barrel on it will be pretty easy, when you're ready.

aubie515
April 7, 2011, 03:02 PM
Get the Stevens 200 since you can upgrade down the road...the Edge/Axis you cannot upgrade...which is why they are cheaper.

06
April 7, 2011, 03:50 PM
Most any 30 cal will outshoot the trigger puller at any range. My 77 Ruger will easily hit a torso sized target at 500 if I do my part and it is a light weight barrel deer hunter. Gave my son my 700 and it would shoot smaller groups out there. He shoots with his sniper buds with it and does well. Prior to that he was using hunter grade rifles at 500. Develop good shooting habits and skills and you will master your rifles abilities. Practice practice practice. I used to burn hundreds of rounds weekly and every time almost I would learn something.

JakeBZ
April 7, 2011, 10:01 PM
The $300 dollar budget is for the rifle. I will decide on a scope later. Do I need the heavy barrel to be accurate to 500 yards? Can upgrade to it later with the stevens?

JDMorris
April 7, 2011, 10:10 PM
If this is going to be a target shooting rifle a heavy barrel will help alot, I would advise saving until you can afford a Howa M-1500 or a Remington 700 SPS Tactical.

230therapy
April 7, 2011, 10:11 PM
Get a used Winchester Model 70...or any standard hunting rifle. If you have a decent hunting rifle sitting in the closet, just use that. A buddy of mine put a PFI scope on his (caliber was 30-06) and had no trouble hitting at 1,000 yards. You certainly do not need a $4,000 precision rifle. The money is better spent on a decent scope with BDC, some Federal Gold Medal Match ammunition and a training course. Only consider a high end rifle when you have the skill to use it properly. Otherwise, you're just spending money to have "the best" with no way to take advantage of its performance.

You don't need a heavy barrel, tactical anything, synthetic stock, or bedding. What you do need is something that will group reasonably well...preferably one inch or less at 100 yards (doesn't mean it will group equivalently at longer distances, but it's a good rule of thumb). A good trigger helps. It does need a scope mount and sling. A bipod is nice, but you can shoot off a backpack instead. Make or buy a sand sock. Then get to work.

Once you train up, shooting steel will be easy at 500 yards. The challenge will be to get the smallest groups possible...but hitting steel will get boring. Then you'll get into reloading precision ammunition, which is another fun hobby.

Most of all...just have fun. Go to the range and find some NRA long range shooters. Ask questions...they'll talk your ear off. Take notes, buy some books, and so forth.

Geckgo
April 7, 2011, 10:13 PM
We talking sub MOA and shooting five hundred yard pie-plates or we talking silouettes?

dnthmn
April 8, 2011, 07:27 AM
The $300 dollar budget is for the rifle. I will decide on a scope later. Do I need the heavy barrel to be accurate to 500 yards? Can upgrade to it later with the stevens?
You don't NEED a heavy barrel to shoot that range and, yes, you can upgrade the Stevens later if you decide you want one. Also if you're going to be using the rifle as a field gun at all, it might be nice not be packing the weight of a heavy barrel.

Bubba613
April 8, 2011, 09:16 AM
Get a used Winchester Model 70...or any standard hunting rifle. If you have a decent hunting rifle sitting in the closet, just use that. A buddy of mine put a PFI scope on his (caliber was 30-06) and had no trouble hitting at 1,000 yards. You certainly do not need a $4,000 precision rifle. The money is better spent on a decent scope with BDC, some Federal Gold Medal Match ammunition and a training course. Only consider a high end rifle when you have the skill to use it properly. Otherwise, you're just spending money to have "the best" with no way to take advantage of its performance.

You don't need a heavy barrel, tactical anything, synthetic stock, or bedding. What you do need is something that will group reasonably well...preferably one inch or less at 100 yards (doesn't mean it will group equivalently at longer distances, but it's a good rule of thumb). A good trigger helps. It does need a scope mount and sling. A bipod is nice, but you can shoot off a backpack instead. Make or buy a sand sock. Then get to work.

Once you train up, shooting steel will be easy at 500 yards. The challenge will be to get the smallest groups possible...but hitting steel will get boring. Then you'll get into reloading precision ammunition, which is another fun hobby.

Most of all...just have fun. Go to the range and find some NRA long range shooters. Ask questions...they'll talk your ear off. Take notes, buy some books, and so forth.

Best advice seen on a gun board.
The weak link of any rifle is the shooter. Today almost anything off the shelf will shoot 1MOA with good ammo. Most people don't have the skill to take advantage of minute improvements. Those that do generally get their equipment and ammo supplied by Uncle.

LubeckTech
April 8, 2011, 09:34 AM
I would watch Gunbroker, Auction Arms or Guns America for a Savage 110 with AccuTrigger and original scope in the $350 - $400 range. That is a little more than you want to spend but is probably the most bang for the buck IMHO. These rifles were usually sold with a Simmons scope which is adequate but not great - It would get you started. I have one in 30-06 and love it.

I have been seeing the Howa rifles at great prices - how are they??

mljdeckard
April 8, 2011, 09:44 AM
I would cruise the pawn shops, and look for pretty much any lightly used bolt rifle. My preference is Remington 700s, but for 500 yards, anything will work.

Hangingrock
April 8, 2011, 11:52 AM
I canít afford cheap nor an unlimited budget so there for I compromise. The problem with compromising is at some point if I make too many compromises Iím compromised.

Iím not of the opinion that you canít procure an accurate rifle at the stipulated price but Iím also of the opinion that its better to wait until oneís budget is less constraining. As an example if I bought $1500.00 optics I wouldnít be acquiring a rifle for a long-long-long time.

If it were I and it is not my budget for the rifle and optics (not buying used) would be at or under the $1000.00. I believe in that price range youíll have an acceptable rifle and optics package.

You canít buy competence but al least your rifle and optics combination should not be problematic.

snakeman
April 8, 2011, 12:37 PM
stevens 200 with redfield accu range scope. If you are not going to use it for deer hunting also consider a 223. It will shoot 500 yards and its cheaper.

JDMorris
April 8, 2011, 02:55 PM
Howas are excellent rifles, my (M-1500 Medium barrel .308) will shoot sub MOA to 300 yards and I'd bet further but 300 is the farthest I've shot it, I love that rifle, I'd reccomend it over the Stevens any day, for about 500 bucks you get a solid rifle with a Hogue stock that fully floats the barrel and most of them shoot sub MOA.

JakeBZ
April 9, 2011, 12:45 AM
Geckgo, I will be shooting silhouettes and round targets and eventually be going out to 700 or more yards. I would like to achieve the best MOA possible and from what I have read, here and elsewhere, the shooter has a lot to do with it. I am trying to practice as much as possible but I need some basic training in long range shooting.

JDMorris
April 9, 2011, 12:56 AM
If you want a long range rig save your money instead of getting something that you will not be satisfied with. Trust me, I know that you think the Stevens will fair well, but that sporter barrel will need cooling, ALOT, and it would be so much easier to save a couple hundred more for a Heavy barreled Savage, Remington, or Howa.

aubie515
April 9, 2011, 01:17 AM
You can rebarrel the Savage/Stevens 200 in under 20 minutes and it requires tools that will cost you around $100. You can get a prefit Savage barrel for roughly $300...and those barrels will out shoot the factory Savage barrels. Down the line if/when the OP wants to or has the extra funds to upgrade. The factory sporter contour barrel from Savage/Stevens should be fine til the OP can master his rifle.

Howas are nice, but that Hogue stock isn't the best...issue with Howa and Tikka is that they use metric threads...many gun smiths don't work with metric threads if you want to swap barrels.

JDMorris
April 9, 2011, 01:20 AM
OK, So the Hogue stock on my Howa that allows the gun to shoot .75" groups at 100 yards with factory ammo isn't the best.. but it works..
As far as the Metric threads, I'm not concerned about rebarreling a Howa, and if you get the Heavy barreled model right off the bat you won't need it, and if you're going to talk about the Hogue stock, how about telling us about the cheapo piece of plastic on the Stevens?

kis2
April 9, 2011, 01:34 AM
I'm a big subscriber to 'buy once, cry once'. It'll be cheaper to save up some more money, buy the good gear once and be done with it. And for your goals I'm proposing maybe $150 more in a rifle, and then another $450ish in a scope.

But if that's all the budget you can muster, as already suggested, look for something lightly used to get you started. A LOT of used firearms are in perfect condition for a good deal.

Good luck and have fun!

JakeBZ
April 9, 2011, 03:47 PM
I was also wondering if something in a .270 would be a good choice for 500-800 yard shooting or would that be too expensive.

onebigelf
April 9, 2011, 06:22 PM
If this is going to be a target shooting rifle a heavy barrel will help alot, I would advise saving until you can afford a Howa M-1500 or a Remington 700 SPS Tactical.
Absolutely. The Remington 700 SPS will run you $500-$550 unless you can find one used, and not many people will sell one once they've got it. Mine will put 3 rounds into less than 2 1/2 inches regularly of a sandbag rest at 400 yards!!! The only things I added were a good set of rings, a Nikon scope, and a magazine extension that lets me load 7 rounds. The trigger, out of the box, is absolutely the sweetest thing ever created that doesn't have boobs.

John

kludge
April 10, 2011, 02:19 AM
Marlin > Stevens > Axis/Edge

LubeckTech
April 10, 2011, 10:37 AM
Jake asked about .270 which leads me to ask just about the same question that being: How much difference is there in .270 and .308 (in practice not theory) at long distances?? Form the limited amount of table reading I have done there is not a tremendous difference but .270 tends to be flatter. I would opt for the .308 because of the greater variety and availability of ammunition. But good buys can be often had on .270 guns as it is an extremely popular caliber depending on your area.

JakeBZ
April 10, 2011, 11:49 PM
Absolutely. The Remington 700 SPS will run you $500-$550 unless you can find one used, and not many people will sell one once they've got it. Mine will put 3 rounds into less than 2 1/2 inches regularly of a sandbag rest at 400 yards!!! The only things I added were a good set of rings, a Nikon scope, and a magazine extension that lets me load 7 rounds. The trigger, out of the box, is absolutely the sweetest thing ever created that doesn't have boobs.

John
I have been hearing some really goods things about the Howa M-1500 varmint heavy barrel. Someone on another thread said you could get it with a 24" heavy barrel for $399 at CDNN. Does that sound right and where is CDNN.

LubeckTech
April 11, 2011, 12:16 AM
www.cdnninvestments.com

They have a downloadable catalog. I have done business with them several times and have been well satisified.

JakeBZ
April 11, 2011, 02:03 AM
I looked on the CDNN website and downloaded the catalog but I did not see anywhere to look for rifles to order.

Friendly, Don't Fire!
April 11, 2011, 02:38 AM
I am convinced that one can build just about ANY Rifle into a tack-driving long-distance shooter by accurizing the rifle, adjusting the trigger or installing a new adjustable trigger (Timney comes to mind) and working up accurate loads for the gun - loads that both serve your purposes for having that long-range shooter and particular bullets (pills) that will deliver a humane deadly-blow to the quarry -- whether for the freezer, to eliminate certain varmint(s) and/or keeping a certain predator population down.

With a bit of ingenuity, knowledge of how a gun is transformed into a tack-driver, and the tools to make it happen, I am convinced that anyone who is good at working with their hands and good at figuring things out (one who sees just how things work - how things go-together) and who can envision just how the completed-shooter will look and function after it is finally completed, in my opinion, can be done by just about anyone!

Once the rifle is complete, then the accurate loads worked up, a lot of range-time, using both a chronograph and trajectory charts (information) for the given bullet, the rifleman will learn proper hold at certain distances to place the bullet exactly where intended.

This does not all come overnight and many times, it literally requires a lifetime of learning and wanting to learn just what is necessary to shoot accurately.

Anything that is worth doing, is worth doing WELL! -- whether it be mastering a musical instrument, building a high performance car engine from parts, building a super-fast computer from parts, etc., us humans have been created in a unique way -- allowing us to have a goal and achieving that goal that we have set before ourselves!

Skyshot
April 12, 2011, 10:27 PM
Get the Stevens, you can make a tack driver out of it. I have one that I replaced the trigger with a timney and bedded the recoil lug and an inch above the lug, make sure the action mates to the pillars, some of the stevens stocks need to be cleaned up around the pillar posts. You can usually sand that area to get the good contact. Some rifles have good contact without having to sand away any stock material, mine wasn't one of those. You can do these mods yourself. The rifle has a bushnell elite 3x9 power scope. It will shoot sub MOA with handloads. I can't say what it will do with factory rounds because I never shoot any. It's nice lightweight package thats not gonna break the bank.

H2oPumper
April 13, 2011, 04:48 PM
Jake, another one to maybe consider would be a Marlin XL7 or XS7 series. I picked up a 30-06 for 275 since I already had a .270 in a Ruger The store had both 30-06 and .270 that they were closing out because Marlin will be focusing their sales at gun stores, rather than big box stores. The one I found was in southern Minnesota. Nice groupings and a great trigger, I'm hoping the good reviews hold true to this model. My local gun shop is selling XS for 319 for the 308, 7mm-o8, and 243 in the blued barrel and black synthetic stock, I would suspect the XL in the 30-06, .270, and 25-06 would be the same. I ended up putting on a Nikon ProStaff BDC 3-9x40 scope for 169. The 270 is a very flat shooting rifle, but cartridge selection is limited. The 308 and 30-06 have a good variety of cartridges, although once you sight in and are satisfied with one manufacturer and weight, you'll probably stick to it, so cartridge variety may not be as big of an issue.

Zak Smith
April 13, 2011, 08:31 PM
I recommend against the Howa/Axiom

http://demigodllc.com/photo/HowaAxiom/icon/D461_6925_img_b.jpg
article | The Howa Axiom Rifle http://demigodllc.com/icon/extwh3.png (http://demigodllc.com/articles/howa-axiom-burris-xtr)

Accuracy was terrible in both guns, and they knew these were going to be reviewed.

SSgt0313
April 13, 2011, 08:49 PM
Howa from Legacy arms is a good place to start for less expensive but I would bet that you have found out that you also need a good scope and that alone is your budget. I have found that Howa for about 600 will get you a nice start with scope. http://www.howa1500.com/item/55814_Howa_Rifles_Shotguns_Howa_HWR66304+_Hogue_Bolt.aspx I have done some research and this is your best start on the low end out of the box, might consider the Remington 700 or the Browning X or A bolt as well.

USMC Wounded Warrior
Semper Fi

jpwilly
April 14, 2011, 02:16 AM
Get the Stevens 200 its a good rifle for only $300 and upgradeable down the road with Savage drop in barrels and triggers and stocks etc.

JakeBZ
April 14, 2011, 02:55 AM
I have found what looks great for only $389 at budsgunshop.com. It is a Howa HWR93202+ 1500 varmint with 24" heavy barrel in .308. I have been told that a heavy barrel is what you need to shoot accurate long range 500 to 800 yards. Does this sound like a good deal?

Zak Smith
April 14, 2011, 03:00 AM
A quality barrel is more important than a heavy barrel.

JakeBZ
April 14, 2011, 03:36 AM
Jake, another one to maybe consider would be a Marlin XL7 or XS7 series. I picked up a 30-06 for 275 since I already had a .270 in a Ruger The store had both 30-06 and .270 that they were closing out because Marlin will be focusing their sales at gun stores, rather than big box stores. The one I found was in southern Minnesota. Nice groupings and a great trigger, I'm hoping the good reviews hold true to this model. My local gun shop is selling XS for 319 for the 308, 7mm-o8, and 243 in the blued barrel and black synthetic stock, I would suspect the XL in the 30-06, .270, and 25-06 would be the same. I ended up putting on a Nikon ProStaff BDC 3-9x40 scope for 169. The 270 is a very flat shooting rifle, but cartridge selection is limited. The 308 and 30-06 have a good variety of cartridges, although once you sight in and are satisfied with one manufacturer and weight, you'll probably stick to it, so cartridge variety may not be as big of an issue.
I have seen a Marlin X7 varmint 24" heavy barrel for $332 at thegunsource.com. I now have so many choices if all these are good deals I just need to look for the best rifle for the money.

JakeBZ
April 14, 2011, 03:38 AM
A quality barrel is more important than a heavy barrel.
How can you tell if it is a quality barrel from the online description? Thanks for all the info.

Zak Smith
April 14, 2011, 03:41 AM
Indeed.

Serious answer: maker, description, guarantee.

Zak Smith
April 14, 2011, 01:39 PM
"Building your way up" or incrementally changing the rifle configuration has two big disadvantages: 1 it usually costs more in the long run than simply buying something better off the bat, and 2 every time you change the rifle setup you have to re-validate/check a bunch of things on your LR rifle, which wastes time and ammo you could be using for actual practice.

If you need to go real cheap, your best bet is to buy some rifle (yes, with a moderate to heavy barrel), find some ammo that it'll shoot 1 MOA. Chances are good this will work. If you can't get it to shoot 1 MOA by changing ammo, sell it off and try something better.

Averageman
April 14, 2011, 04:03 PM
Zak I would say you could be right, except...
In the $300 price range he could get a very good used rifle in a private sale.
I recently purchased a Savage Model 10 in .308 used for $200. Other than the dust in the barrel it is in pristine condition.
Now add a Decent scope. I reccomend a Burris 3X9 Balistic plex thats another $200
a very nice steel base, $90
Rings,..Arms Q.D. Rings, a gift from a friend.
Glass bedding kit. $25
Auminium Pillars $11
Thats a hair over $500 and the education along the way is priceless.
When I shoot that sporter barrel out I can take that stock back out to the shop and work that wood and drop a high price "Tacticool" barrel in.

Zak Smith
April 14, 2011, 04:11 PM
I didn't say "more expensive" off the bat, I said "better" off the bat. Certainly a used Remington PSS/SPS or Savage would be a great idea if one could be found.

Averageman
April 14, 2011, 04:16 PM
I find some great deals in estate sales and off the beaten track pawn shops. I do enjoy looking for deals almost as much as building the gun up afterwards.

xfyrfiter
April 14, 2011, 06:17 PM
I have the Howa 1500 tactical, with the 20" barrel and a lower end 6-24x50 scope, and this rifle will, with the right trigger puller, shoot with anything other than the customs, and this is with factory ammo.

JakeBZ
April 15, 2011, 02:58 AM
I have the Howa 1500 tactical, with the 20" barrel and a lower end 6-24x50 scope, and this rifle will, with the right trigger puller, shoot with anything other than the customs, and this is with factory ammo.
That sounds good. I was kind of leaning towards the Howa HWR93202+ 1500 varmint with 24" heavy barrel that I saw online. A nice 6-24X50 scope from ebay would go nicely. I got a 6-24X40 Tasco for my 30-30 and it works good.

kittyhawk
April 15, 2011, 05:31 PM
2x on the Savage 110 with Accu Trigger. I have mine outfitted with Leaupold rings and base and a simmons 6.5x20x50 scope and can make hits at 500 yards all day long.
The Savage 110 is a GREAT gun for the $$$$..$325 for gun,$75 for rings and base and $100 for scope from Midway USA. All told Just a Tad over $500 for a Great shooting rifle I don't mind beating up.

Dave

kmcintosh78
April 17, 2011, 03:26 PM
Stevens is your friend.
Had a used Stevens in 224 and loved it and it shot wonderfully.

JakeBZ
April 17, 2011, 04:00 PM
2x on the Savage 110 with Accu Trigger. I have mine outfitted with Leaupold rings and base and a simmons 6.5x20x50 scope and can make hits at 500 yards all day long.
The Savage 110 is a GREAT gun for the $$$$..$325 for gun,$75 for rings and base and $100 for scope from Midway USA. All told Just a Tad over $500 for a Great shooting rifle I don't mind beating up.

Dave
That would be great if I could get it all together, money wise, but where can I get a Savage 110 for $325. I have checked online and they seem to go for around $550.

LubeckTech
April 18, 2011, 08:09 PM
If you can find them look in what I would call trading papers. For instance I live in Parkersburg, WV and we have a paper published once a week called "The Bulliten Board" which on average lists 60 - 100 firearms. There may not be one in your community but I am sure there is something like this in a surrounding community which you might be able to find. I see 110s in the $325 to $400 range commonly mostly in 30-06 and .270 with and without accutrigger. If you keep looking I believe you will find what you are looking for. If nothing else I think it is a lot of fun to embark on a quest like yours and eventually fulfill it. There is not much more satisifying than to have a fine shooting gun that performs well that did not cost a fortune - THAT takes skill anyone can throw lots of money at something. Don't forget to ask around many times things can be found when and where you least expexct them. Watch estate sales and check with estate liquidators/auctioneers you have nothing to lose.

brentonraymoore
May 4, 2011, 03:40 PM
I have a 77 ruger in 7mm.baught it used for $350.00 it shoots great and is a very accurate long distance shooter I also have a 1905 gew 98 mauser in 8mm. and it shoots as good as the ruger for $150.00 but the ruger is based on the mauser frame.

rozziboy18
May 4, 2011, 06:25 PM
right here!


http://i659.photobucket.com/albums/uu314/ROZZIBOY18/2011-03-22_13-40-04_589.jpg

230therapy
May 7, 2011, 07:01 PM
Bill Carns reported from his long range rifle course that a Saiga in 308 Winchester worked just fine for most distances. It was doing around 2 MOA with Federal Gold Medal Match 175's. The student had a SWFA Super Sniper 10x scope on it.

This is something to think about for a lower cost semi-auto rifle.

LubeckTech
May 8, 2011, 10:57 AM
Here is something to consider;

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewItem.aspx?Item=228231966

This may be the ticket!
The only downside is ...... I was considering one of these but at the time I read some bad things about it's accuracy so I went with the Savage 110 instead. If I were looking in Jake's price range I would check this and other forums for current and past actual OWNERS of these and get their opinion. Plenty of people are willing to advise you on things they don't own (or ever have), don't know anyone who owns or has owned and have never seen or shot. The current guns may also be better than they were a few years ago and if you reload I think it is very likley the gun could be quite accurate with a load it likes. A good bedding job may help also. Bottom line is I'm not saying buy one or don't buy one but it is worth researching and considering. Remember it WILL kill a deer at 100 yards which means you can always sell it if you don't like it and very likley get all your money back out of it.

JakeBZ
May 10, 2011, 01:27 AM
I'm sorry, I'm new to this and can't recognize this by sight. What is it and how much does it cost?

JakeBZ
May 10, 2011, 01:31 AM
I have been trying to locate the Howa 1500 varmint 308 but am having a hard time locating one so I may lean back towards the Stevens 200 and upgrade the barrel later.

JakeBZ
May 14, 2011, 12:35 AM
I have found the one I am going to order. It is a Marlin X7 in .308 with a 26" heavy barrel. It also has an adjustable trigger. I will get a scope for it later.

dldbrandon
May 14, 2011, 01:49 AM
I have a Marlin XL7 in .270, it's a good choice. Take a look at the Vortex line of scopes. Stay away from there crossfire lineup and you should be ok. I went through and looked at Nikon, Leupold, Redfield, and the like but eventually settled on the Vortex Diamondback. My buddy got a Leupold VX1 and we both like the diamondback more.

LubeckTech
May 14, 2011, 11:08 AM
Outstanding!!
How much will it set you back??

sarduy
May 14, 2011, 05:16 PM
Just get a mosin nagant, scope mount and a lot of ammo

JakeBZ
May 26, 2011, 01:38 AM
Outstanding!!
How much will it set you back??
It is the new Marlin X7VH in .308 with 26" heavy barrel and I got it for $425 plus tax. I am now wanting to put some kind of open sights on it so I can use it until I can afford a good long range scope. Does anyone know what the proper magnification would be for 500 to 800 yard shooting?

DIM
May 26, 2011, 03:29 AM
here's deal for you ;-) for 200 bucks get H&R single shot 308 survivor
http://www.hr1871.com/Firearms/ShotgunsAndRifles/survivor.asp

http://www.kygunco.com/prodimages/25875-DEFAULT-L.jpg

it comes with scope rail, then for another 100 get a scope and rings, Simmons should work just fine

RugerMcMarlin
May 26, 2011, 04:19 AM
I haven't heard it mentioned yet, and I maybe I'm a fogey for prefering wood . But how bout a Good used, Remington 788 in .308? or .223?

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