[mr_goodbomb]

I'm looking for a shotgun that would be a little more modern than my double barrel, but not tactical in appearance. A 12ga would be great (so I could use the same rounds for both of em), pump, wooden stock, 3-5 capacity, 18" or so (flexible, just not a full 30" or anything), reliable and not too expensive. I've looked at Mossberg 500s, which might be a good option, though many are either 30" or slug guns, or they're tactical/synthetic stocks and parts. A NEF might be a decent choice, too, as I have a Pardner break open and it seems incredibly reliable. I don't mind buying used, generally prefer it. Basically, I'd want something to have around for defense and survival situations. Maybe I watch too many 70s and 80s exploitation films, but between horror films, Mad Max, and the way the economy and talk of government shutdown is going... I'd love to have something with a bit more capacity than the breakopen, but I love the appearance of guns from the 60s, 70s, and older.

[Nar]

just get a used pump action shotgun, I got a Moss 500 for 150 and a friend got a rem 870 for about the same.

[btz]

If its for survival reasons, you should get a cheap used pump, get a mag tube extension for it and a buttstock shell holder

[armoredman]

Mossy 500, Big 5 Sporting Goods runs sales on them all the time, good solid shotgun.

[FLNT4EVR]

Pardner protector a good ,solid, reliable,pump shotgun. 18in barrel ,cilinder bore, 3in chamber. Brand new under $200.

[InkEd]

Get a nice 870HD.

[Fred Fuller]

Well, you didn't say "SHTF" at least. And I hope no one else does either...

To paraphrase one Mel Tappan*, from his 1977 book Survival Guns (yeah, the question has been around that long - and so have some of us :neener:), "What do you expect to survive, and how do you expect a gun to help you?" Think carefully AND REALISTICALLY about that question. Shotguns offer about as many disadvantages as advantages, and you need to go into this question without a burden of movie and TV fantasy to deal with in seeking an answer.

Tappan, may he rest in peace, seemed to me to take more or less a "one of everything" approach to answering his own very good question. While it's fun to think about it isn't very realistic. Unless you were married to the daughter of the man who made Mack trucks, anyway.

So, to analyze things in a little more detail:

You want:

-durability. It has to last for a long time even under less than perfect conditions without breaking or needing excessive maintenance.

-reliability. It has to work properly, every time, in spite of less than perfect maintenance, less than perfect ammo, etc.

-maintainability/simplicity. It needs to be easy to use, easy to train new shooters on, easy to clean, easy to field strip, easy to fix if something minor breaks, and have few if any major vulnerabilities that are not owner repairable under austere conditions.

-commonality. Duplicates, in other words. What you choose needs to be inexpensive enough for you to be able to have more than one of the same make/model, for the use of other individuals in a pinch, storage/use at other locations or in case something unrecoverable happens to the primary. The same ammo needs to fit every gun. The same spare parts need to fit every gun. The same accessories need to be useful for every gun. And so on.

-modularity. These need to be 'Lego' guns. And the quickest fix to a broken part is a complete spare subassembly- a complete spare bolt assembly, a complete spare trigger plate assembly and a spare action bar assembly will pretty much fix most 'oopses' in mere minutes. Stocks need to be easy to change to fit different shooters' needs. And so on.

-versatility. A strong point of shotguns- the ability to do multiple jobs reasonably well.

Understand from the outset that no choice is going to be perfect. The best you will be able to do is 'good enough.' No matter how hard you look, no matter how much you spend, 'good enough' will have to do. And it will, if you do your part.

Given the constraints above I settled on pumpguns. Semiautos were much more expensive and sometimes more picky about ammo. Reliability in general isn't so much of an issue for me with semiautos as those two issues. Of course, YMMV.

Long ago I settled on Remington 870s. They meet most of the above criteria admirably. About the only real weak point in the 870 design is the magazine tube, which is pretty much a depot level (if you're military) or factory authorized repair station (if you're not military) replacement job. Dings and dents in the mag tube can be lifted given the appropriate tools, but the need for a mag tube replacement is apt to be a game ender for that particular gun. Other than that, the ejector can occasionally be an issue, but with proper tools and parts that can be fixed. Likewise other small parts, or even major parts.

Not much really goes wrong with 870s, as long as the owner/shooter resists the urge to take things to bits that don't need to be detail stripped, keeps obstructions out of the bore, doesn't immediately pump and shoot again after a weak sounding 'blooper' load, etc. Receivers generally run for a quarter million rounds or so before giving up the ghost. Some other things might need replacing from time to time, but with proper care it won't be much. Most 870 spare parts boxes are shoebox size or smaller.

Sure, you can choose other designs if you want. Back when I got started the only Mossberg pumpgun was the 500, and I didn't (and still don't) like the idea that the mag tube isn't an easily field strippable, pull-through cleanout design. Maintenance on a Mossberg 500 mag tube and its contents requires removing the tube from the receiver. Now I know this sounds like a contradiction, and you (and all the other diehard Mossberg 500 fans here) are welcome to treat it as such. I don't mind.

But ... and it's a BIG but ... once upon a time Mossberg decided they wanted to sell pump shotguns to Uncle Sam, and lo and behold the military purchasing contract specifications called for a cleanout design magazine tube. So Mossberg came up with the 590, which offers that design, is reasonably easy to field strip - as well as offering a relatively easy owner replaceable magazine tube. If I were starting over today, I'd have to look pretty hard at the Mossberg 590. But I cast my lot with the 870 decades ago, and it's late in the game for me to be changing things around. I have all these tools, and spare parts, you see...

You like classic designs? The 870 is a 1950s design, and the Mossberg is a 1960s design. That ought to do. Both have been improved over the decades, both have sold lots of units (about 10 million 870s, I don't know how many Mossbergs) and been tested by time. Yes, there are others out there.

Yes, you can look around some more. But I wouldn't bother, myself...

Hope all this helps,

lpl
===

*Tappan biography - http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mel_Tappan

[mr_goodbomb]

I appreciate the Tappan post. While it is unrealistic and very fictional in premise, as I said, I do make films, and in making low-budget films where a designated, hired armorer isn't usually something that can be afforded, we often end up using personal weapons and only bring blanks to set. So, to say that it "seems more like something from a movie" or that it's a survival weapon "only from a movie" would... well, suit my needs, in part.

[chrome_austex]

Rem 870 Police fit the bill for me. 18" w/ a 6 shot tube in a classy (70s lookin) wood stock. This one is going to stay in the family for a while.

http://www.remingtonle.com/shotguns/870standard.htm

Then you can run it bone stock and light weight, or with a flashlight and/or some shell carriers. The LE models are a bit more (worth it for me), but I wouldn't hesitate to get a similar 870 express with an aftermarket 2 shot mag tube extension.

[matty-vb]

My vote goes to the Moss. 500 for the same reason Lee chose the 870. years of use, spare parts, etc. that being said, I wouldn't hesitate to pick up an 870. both are fine guns with countless options and accessories.

[mr_goodbomb]

For a current 870, would a NEF Pardner Pump Compact do well? I've heard I could snag one new for under $200. Wondering if that's true, and if WalMart can order in something from a company they carry.

[jmr40]

This http://remington.com/products/firearms/shotguns/model-870/model-870-express-turkey.aspx

A 21" 870 with interchangeable tubes. I see these on used gun racks a lot for around $200. They come with a turkey tube, but you can use any tube you want making them a very versatile shotgun. With a skeet tube you have a short barreled self defense shotgun. With IC, Modified, or full chokes you have a viable hunting shotgun where most short barreled SD guns have no choke at all.

It would not be an ideal hunting gun for passing shots at waterfowl, but useable for a lot of things.

[Fred Fuller]

The Pardner Pump is a mechanical clone of the 870, but its receiver profile is different - it has a sort of Browning-esque 'humpback' as opposed to the more streamlined 870. Works the same, looks a bit different. Anyone who knows pumpguns will know the difference, John Q. Public probably won't know or care.

The Pardner Pumps seem to be pretty good shotguns on first impression, how they'll hold up over a couple of decades of hard use remains to be seen though. I went over one with my gunsmith part by part in comparison with an 870 over a year ago, file testing the metal components - in that comparison the Pardner definitely held its own and then some. Some 870 parts will interchange, some won't.

fwiw,

lpl

[SHR970]

Rem 870....Moss 500

Ford......Chevy


Choose.

[B yond]

sounds to me like you want a mossbery with a wooden stock.

[waidmann]

If you wish to have a non-HD appearing yet effective shotgun, I'd consider the 870 with a 21" turkey barrel. Then I'd replace the turkey choke with what compliments your desired range. I think the local "big" stores still carry them, about now (turkey season).

[Averageman]

Bought this at a pawn shop for $150 bucks.
Purchased a spare barrel and some few extras. it's my second 870.
http://i146.photobucket.com/albums/r263/Averageman1/new870andmy336001-1.jpg
BTW I paid $150 for the Marlin too!
You can do a lot with the internet and some elbow grease to build a cheap battery of vesitile guns

[Mr. T]

You can get a brand new Maverick pump action at Wally World for $177. It has a full choke barrel, so you could shoot foster slugs out of it or bird shot without having to dink around with choke tubes or switching barrels to fire slugs or bird shot out of it. They have reconfigured the pump fore end on it and it looks a lot better than it used to. They had 12 and 20 gauge models. NEF also had a pump action Pardner 12 gauge there with a full choke barrel for $159. I almost bought it. Both guns had Black synthetic furniture on them, but they were stock setups without any Tactical Tommy stuff on them. I would think that they would fit the bill of what you are looking for....maybe check it out.