Has anyone tried Triple 7 in handguns?


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registrar
April 23, 2011, 03:59 PM
Say, in a 44 cap and ball revolver, of real strength, like the Ruger Old Army, does the Hodgdon product offer higher velocity than Pyrodex?

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ClemBert
April 23, 2011, 04:13 PM
FWIW, you can use 777 in any of the cap-n-ball revolvers. Just reduce your charge by 15% for the equivalent of BP. Don't compress beyond 1/16" or just so the ball fits with little pressure against the powder.

I shoot 777 in my ROA. 35 grains is a pretty good charge. I prefer real black powder although 777 is a great substitute if you can't get real BP.

BHP FAN
April 23, 2011, 04:53 PM
I use it in my NAA Super Companion. Plenty barky!

BlackPowderSmoke
April 23, 2011, 05:06 PM
Has anyone ever had or heard of any problems from over compressing 777?

I have read many warnings and a few accounts of guys saying they had always compressed it hard with no problems.

45-70 Ranger
April 23, 2011, 05:15 PM
Real BP is hard to find within 65 miles of me, but T7 is less than 20 miles away. It is a super clean powder and as the others have stated, HOTTER than BP or Pyrodex. Do cut your load until you find just where you need to be. All my BP pistols are loaded with T7. I love the stuff! (And this is comming from an old time BP shooter from the 60's:))

Give it a try, you'll be impressed I'm sure. But like ClemBurt said, do not over compress it. This powder is VERY sensitive to being compressed in the chamber. Not a real danger so to speak, but it will give you fits with your group size if you are not consistant in keeping it light when ramming that ball home!:uhoh:

Wade

ClemBert
April 23, 2011, 05:36 PM
I'm also of the belief that compressing 777 will not create a dangerous condition. However, I have spoken with the technical support staff at Hodgdon and they indicated that compression will likely result in inconsistent ignition. Therefore the consistency of your accuracy will be affected negatively. The question then becomes: Why would you want to compress 777 if you know it will have a negative effect on consistency? This is actually one reason why I prefer real BP over 777. If you are in a hurry or I should say if you don't want to make the extra effort to precisely load 777 then your accuracy suffers. I'd rather use a product that is much less sensitive to that issue. Although, I do think it's a great product.

AbitNutz
April 23, 2011, 05:42 PM
I use T7 all the time. At first, I didn't know that you weren't supposed to compress it much. I have an ROA with deepened cylinders and use both 150 and 210 gr BigLube bullets sized to .454. I use no wads nor lube other than what the sizer puts in the lube groove. I was compressing it quite a bit using a D/D loader....I mean a lot.

While I didn't notice great variation in group size....It could well be true. The power was certainly there....recoil was not mild when I loaded to the max.

Now I pay more attention to how much I compress T7. There's no reason not to do what the manufacturer says.

One of these days I'll use my CED chronograph and see what it says.

Zerstoerer
April 23, 2011, 11:15 PM
I was thinking to use it in a .45LC.
Any concerns for cartridge powder?

ClemBert
April 23, 2011, 11:20 PM
No problem with 777 in cartridges. For cartridges use FF instead of FFF. Same rules apply....no air gap....1/16" compression max.

kbbailey
April 24, 2011, 10:37 AM
I'm officially DONE with Pyrodex since I tried 777. Soooo much cleaner, I can shoot cyl after cyl with no issues. 777 doesn't seem as corrosive either.

AbitNutz
April 24, 2011, 04:44 PM
I don't know if this is an advantage or not but all of the BP substitutes seem to be more difficult ignite. That's bad but also I would think it would be less likely to chain fire.

Anyone ever had a chain fire with BP subs?

robhof
April 24, 2011, 05:26 PM
I've used T7 since my B/p sources seem to have dried up in central Ky. I experienced inconsistent ignition in my 31 pistol til I got more careful with light compression, in my ROA it really barks with 35gr and round ball or conicals.

45-70 Ranger
April 24, 2011, 10:37 PM
Ditto on what ClemBert said!

I use T7 in my 45-70 and it is fantastic. Even with large pistol primers it goes off with a nice bang and hit with a close group. I lube with LLA and have never had an issue in over a year.

Wade

Carl N. Brown
April 24, 2011, 10:53 PM
Triple 7 works fine in BP cartridge pistol for me; do not allow an airgap and do not compress the charge for consistent grouping. I have found consistent crimp aids accuracy.

ElvinWarrior
April 25, 2011, 02:04 AM
You guys seem to spend alot more time out at the range than I do, I tend to spend more time out in the hills, chasing down rabbits, mountain goats, and the occassional and rare antelope and deer that still live in the California hillsides near to Los Angeles.

I have used both in my guns, 777 and BP. Overall I prefer the BP, but the 777 is adequate. It does give a bang, and it is easier to clean up, I just prefer the old stuff, the clouds of smoke, the smell, the mess of it...

I bag rabbits with the stuff most of the time, since, that is the most plentiful game in them thar hills, and so far, one buck. As far as my experiances go, I don't think the rabbits and the buck cared one way or the other that they were shot with 777 as opposed to old time BP one lil bit... Dead is dead...

Which reminds me, I need to bag me a mountain goat pretty soon, wild goat stew sure is tasty, I love the intense "in your face" flavor of wild goat !!!

Sincerely,

ElvinWarrior... aka... David, "EW"

GENTLEMAN OF THE CHARCOAL
April 25, 2011, 04:49 PM
" Has anyone ever tried 777 in handguns"?...Hee hee hee! Chuckle! Haw haw! Laugh laugh!! Giggle Giggle!! Whoooiiee!!....

Sam Cade
April 25, 2011, 05:05 PM
Which reminds me, I need to bag me a mountain goat pretty soon, wild goat stew sure is tasty, I love the intense "in your face" flavor of wild goat !!!

Ya really don't strike me as the mountain goat type.

http://www.myspace.com/davidleefrater/videos/video/42418576

Erich
April 27, 2011, 12:16 AM
I've been very happy with it in the ROA - it throws the bullets quite fast and provides an easy clean-up.

andrewstorm
May 1, 2011, 02:59 PM
777 3 f is the most powerful propellant you can use in a bp arm,cleans with water ,i spoke to Richard at 10 x cartridges,and he said that he uses a specialty version of 777 for his specialty line of cowboy action remanufactured ammo,he says its the cleanest substitute.:D

Oyeboten
May 2, 2011, 08:29 AM
I have used '777' in re-loading .38 Special and .45 Colt, for old Guns as well as modern ones, and, it is a very nice Powder.

Gatofeo
May 3, 2011, 10:51 PM
The last I checked, Hodgdon did NOT recommend that its 777 be used in brass-framed revolvers.
It's powerful stuff and not intended to be loaded volume-for-volume with black powder, like Pyrodex was designed.
For the best information on this topic, go to the Hodgdon website and read about 777. After all, they're the folks who invented the stuff, and who have the ballistic labs that can measure pressure. They have the most scientific experience with it. Anyone who lacks a ballistics lab that can measure pressure is just guessing.

ClemBert
May 3, 2011, 10:58 PM
I didn't realize there are unconverted brass framed cartridge revolvers around. In other words, revolvers mass produced for shooting cartridges with brass frames. If not, the point is moot since modern converter cylinders are not recommended for brass framed revolvers.

Oyeboten
May 4, 2011, 06:54 AM
But there's a lot of Brass Frame Cap & Ball Revolvers out there, for which '777' would tend to be too strong ( or Frame-Stretching anyway ) if used in too heavy of Charges.

Or, I guess '777' would be fine for Brass Framed Cap & Ball Revolvers, as long as one held the Charges to a limit which would be easy for the Revolver to live with, and, used filler to take up the extra space for the Ball to sit nicely, just below the opening of the Cylinder.

ClemBert
May 4, 2011, 08:51 AM
Never mind what I said...I think I fried too many brain cells inhaling BP fumes. :D

I thought I was posting on another thread I'm a party to on reloading cartridges with 777. :banghead: Or maybe I've banged my head too much.

Howdy Doody
May 4, 2011, 01:56 PM
I am getting to like the 777 in my ROAs. I use a 25gr flask and .015 thin wad and a bullet sized to .454. Recoil not bad at all. Smoke factor is up there and I think more than Swiss or Goex. Good results with CAS as the wheelweight cast bullets ding on steel and spotters can actually hear the hits (another story). The only drawback would be I have to use a special press to load cylinders and of course have to remove the cylinders to do that every 5 shots from each ROA, but with practice it goes quickly. The plus side has been the light fouling and that I can travel off to a match and not have to clean my guns at all for the entire match, including plainsman. That would be around 80 rounds in each revolver. Only maintenance is a drop once in a while of Breakfree on the pin in front of cylinder.
Ten X uses a cartridge load of a reduced type of 777. They get that powder in drums and and it is not available to the public until Hogden gets the OK to put it in 1 lb containers. I have shot the stuff in .38spl and 45lc cartridges and it shoots really well. Having the reduced power powder would make it easier for C&Bers to get more volume in a chamber and be able to ram the ball down to touch the powder with out a filler or wads.
So, I never thought I would like the 777 so much. I had been a true powder kind of guy before, but the reduced fouling is working out for me and if you shoot a projectile instead of ball, you can shoot one with smokeless lube also.

Skinny 1950
May 5, 2011, 01:39 AM
I had an opportunity to compare Goex BP and 777 in my 1851 Uberti. A fellow had a chrono set up next to me at the range and he let me use it. With a round ball and 15 grains of Goex it clocked in at 753 FPS, The same amount of 777 came in at 915 FPS. For real knock down power I tried 20 grains 777 with a conical bullet, there was a significant increase in recoil.:D

gordy
May 6, 2011, 10:15 PM
I shot 777 in my 1851 and have shot over a crony, Using 21 grains of fff
coming in right at 980 fps.
Not smoking, but very pleasing to shot. and very accurate.

Dellbert
May 12, 2011, 08:27 PM
For the Walker, you would follow along the same loads as the ROA? If I load 40grs 777 I should be in it ball park of 55grs of Goex, or Pyrodex P. dose that sound about right. Only have one can of trip 7 left. Pyrodex is the only thing you can get around here. Have to drive a 140 mile round trip to get Goex. Dell. :)

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